A week in Wengen hiking the Bernese Oberland
 

We have joined the converted. We had our first trip to Switzerland last week and thoroughly enjoyed our week in Wengen hiking in the Alps. I'll come back with the typical TR info, but for now enjoy the photos:

http://ukfrey.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07...en-hiking.html

Next time try to fit in a stay at the Hotel Faulhorn. It's unique in many ways. You can hike the route you did or from First or from Grindelwald.

From the hotel a great hike is then down the other side to the Hotel Giessbach where you can get the ferry to Interlaken.

Meiringen just up the valley from Interlaken is the home of Reichenbach Falls where Sherlock Holmes and Moriarty fell to their deaths and you can walk to the falls from the Meiringen train station quite easily. While in Meiringen try some of the meringue you will see in the bakeries. It originated there. http://www.isyours.com/e/guide/berne.../meringue.html

You should also look at a day visiting Ballenberg open air museum. http://ballenberg.ch/en/Welcome

After dozens of trips to Switzerland totally perhaps more than a year of time, I still haven't seen all there is to see in that small country. Makes you wonder when you read about people trying to 'do Europe in 2 weeks'.

Meant to include: http://www.myswitzerland.com/en/moun...-faulhorn.html

Great report. Where did you get the map images and hike profiles?

Welcome to the club! :-d

Some further info for those interested:

First of all, a special thanks to KimSanJose for her 40-page document on the area (Wengen in particular). The information was extremely helpful and her patience with follow up questions was admirable.

You can contact Kim via TA:
http://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/members-forums/kimsanjose

<b>Who:</b> Family of 4 (daughter 14, son 11), American ex-pats living in Derby, UK.

<b>When:</b> July 6th - 13th

<b>Where:</b> Wengen

<b>How:</b> Slightly easier than from the State but still most of a day to get there. Flights from Birmingham (UK) to Zurich via CDG. (&pound;150pp). 4 trains to Wengen (Zurich Airport/Bern/Interlaken Ost/Lauterbrunnen/Wengen). I opted for first class to increase the odds of siting together. (144.60 CHF per adult, return, with Half Fare Card (120 CHF))

The train connections are very tight (by design) which can be a little intimidating to a first timer but it is really straightforward once you get there. Ask for a "timetable" when you buy your tickets.

<b>Lodging:</b>

Given that we are a family of 4 we opted for a chalet for the week. Could not have been happier. Loved the space, the quiet and the facilities (kitchen, washer AND dryer, etc.). We went with Chalet Service who were excellent to work with.

http://www.chalet-service.ch/en/chalets/search.html

We started listed out our preferences (2BR, 2BA, wi-fi, washer/dryer/dishwasher, short walk to town, etc.) and gravitated to the "5*" listings. We settled on the <b>Steingartli</b> chalet and were very happy with our choice.

It was 1917 CHF for the week (looks like it is 1950 CHF now).

More on the hikes and costs in a future post.

twk asked: "Where did you get the map images and hike profiles?"

see if this works:
http://www.swissholidayco.com/page/M...N_HIKING_POPUP

Kim's document had descriptions of various walks as well. The timings, length and altitude in my blog are what we actually did (I have a GPS).

More specifics on the walks to come.

Waiting with bated breath...

WOW! I am impressed with all the hikes-EXTREME to this open-heights Switzerland-ophile!
I have been to many of the same towns, but only partaking of 'baby' hikes!
Beautiful photos of the scenery.

Wow! Great report and stunning pictures. Makes me want to go back to this beautiful part of the world! Beautiful family. I'm impressed with all the hiking your kids did. Well done!

Anxiously awaiting your report as I am scheduled to leave for Wengen in September. Never having been to the region, I am a bit nervous as I have read so many things about costs. Also, a friend of mine just came back from Basel and she said that she paid almost $7 USD for a bottle of water. I plan on going to the Coop in Interlaken upon arrival and getting supplies for breakfast, lunch, snacks, drinks, etc. Hopefully only eating out once a day for dinner.

For those that don’t want to slog through the blog (and that’s understandable), here’s what we ended up doing:

Day 1: Wengen to Kleine Scheidegg + swimming
Day 2: Grutschalp to Murren (Mountain View Trail) + Almendhubel to Murren (North Face trail)
Day 3: Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg + family fun around Grindelwald
Day 4: Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg + Trummelbach Falls + swimming
Day 5: Schynige Platte to First
Day 6: First to Gross Platte via Schilt

We had planned to go up the Schilthorn but it was clouded in (Day 2). Never planned on going up to the Jungfraujoch.

On day 3, we split up to do the Family Fun Package at First. DD and I took the gondola from Grindelwald to First, took the zipline down to Schreckfield, and then the gondola to Bort. DW & DS had been enjoying the playground there while waiting for us.

http://www.jungfrau.ch/en//tourism/e...un-activities/

From Bort, all four of us took the Trottibikes down. What fun! But, as we found out, a little extreme for us. It is easy to pick up speed and without careful concentration, it’s easy to wipe out. I’m afraid DW, DD and DS separately left some skin outside Grindelwald. I guess we are more of a low impact family. :) Still fun – too bad about the scrapes though.

The zipline was fun though not as amazing (or as fast) as I had imagined. I’d give the nod to the Trottibikes if you had to choose.

We had planned to try the toboggan run out of Pfingstegg as well on the last day but that was one time I blanched at the cost. The gondola was privately run and therefore our Half Fare and Family Cards were not accepted. It would have been about 50 CHF to go up/down the gondola plus another 30 CHF for the kids to get half a dozen runs. I didn’t feel it was worth it. Perhaps it was more out of (false) principle. Oh well.

Hike descriptions next . . .

indy, loved your pics - looked like a grand trip.

Another wonderful indy-dad and family adventure. I'm in awe of your collective stamina. Also love the cow photos. Is it my imagination or are Swiss cows more beautiful than most?

Thanks for again letting us tag along.

Great photos and beautiful family!

Catherinehaas, don't let one price throw you off. Switzerland is no more expensive in my opinion than the UK for example.

While it is possible to pay $7USD for a bottle of water, it is also possible to pay that much in the USA. A price out of context tells you nothing. They did NOT pay $7USD in a supermarket. Look here: http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living...nd&city=Zurich

It shows you the median price for a 1.5L bottle of water in a supermarket is 1 CHF which is $1.06 US at today's exchange rate. That's a long way from $7.

People often compare what it costs a tourist with what they spend when living at HOME. Compare what it will cost if you travel in your home country as a tourist, not what you spend living at home. While Switzerland is no doubt more expensive than the USA, don't get carried away worrying you can't afford anything.

Perhaps Indy can take a minute to address your concern and give you some prices they paid. I think it is a pretty safe bet they didn't buy any $7 bottles of water.

Phew!!! Thank you!

Just checked out the website and that is fantastic and really eased my mind. Stocking up at the Coop for sure and then inexpensive meals out at night (< 50CHF for 1 person). Should be manageable; however, I won't be shopping for Levi's or Nike's over there. WOW!

Cost comparisons coming later, but first a bit about the hikes . . .

We are not a particularly active family by UK standards (no cycling to work or 10-20 mile walks) but we do try to get out on the weekends if we can (life gets in the way sometime). We’ve worked up from 4-5 miles walks to 7-9 mile walks in the Peak District. DW14 and I have also climbed Snowdon and Kinder Scout but DW & DS11 haven’t.

With that background in mind, I would classify the walks as such:

<b>Easy</b>
Grutschalp to Murren (Mountain View Trail)
Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg
Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg

<b>Medium</b>
Almendhubel to Murren (North Face trail)
First to Gross Platte via Schilt

<b>Hard</b>
Wengen to Kleine Scheidegg
Schynige Platte to First

I’m not interested in climbing just for the sake of climbing. I like a good view/effort ratio. This area makes it easy with all trains, funiculars, gondolas, lifts, etc. I wouldn’t suggest climbing in/out of the valleys but rather save your effort for more rewarding endeavors. Remember: going down is actually harder (on knees, feet, etc.) than going up.

Distances and times are from my experience (and handheld GPS). First, the easy walks:

<b>Grutschalp to Murren (Mountain View Trail)</b>
Train from Wengen to Lauterbrunnen. Walk through the station to the gondola to Grutschalp (well signed posted). Then walk to Murren.

You get great (and varied) views of the mountains (Jungfrau, Monch, Eiger and others). It is fairly flat/level.

Posted time (trail 52) was 1:10 and we did it in just over that. 3.1 miles. Highly recommended. The views in the other direction wouldn’t be as inspiring IMO.

Note: the gondola to the Schilthorn is on the opposite side of Murren so you would need to walk through town.

<b>Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg </b>
This is the standard and popular route. We went first thing so didn’t encounter much of a crowd but it was more crowded than others. To get to Mannlichen you simply take the gondola up from Wengen. At Kleine Scheidegg, you can take the train back to Wengen or carry on to Jungfroujach or Grindelwald (our option for the day).

Posted time of 1:20 which we did in about 90 minutes. Slightly downhill (500’ over 3.3 miles).

Excellent views as promised. This really is a must-do and is easy enough that most everyone can (hence the crowds).

<b>Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg </b>
Train from Wengen to Lauterbrunnen. You can take the gondola to Gimmelwald/Murren or take the bus back to Lauterbrunnen (our choice). Save this for a cooler day if possible. Push comes to shove, you could also do this one on a rainier day as well.

The walk in total is about 4 miles (completely flat). You get a different perspective being in the valley and slowly walking towards the mountains. The big draw is the waterfalls coming down the cliffs. Staubbach Falls is a large one towards Lauterbrunnen but there are many more (supposedly 72).

We found the detour to Trummelbach Falls to be fascinating. It was one of our more memorable experiences and is highly recommended.

In hindsight, and partly due to the increasing heat, the walk after Trummelbach was anticlimactic for us. If pushed for time (and not heading to Murren), one could simply turn around (walk or bus) after that IMO.

Medium and Hard walks next . . .

oops -- Gross Platte should of course be Gross Scheidegg

Medium walks

<b>Almendhubel to Murren (North Face trail)</b>
This is on the easy side of medium and is really a great walk. You get to walk amongst the wildflowers, have great views (natch), walk around the “Schilthorn” valley (not sure what it is actually called) and then view Murren from above. This walk makes you want to run through the fields singing like Julie Andrews.

We combined this with the Grutschalp to Murren walk with a picnic break in between. We had also planned to go up the Schilthorn in between but it was clouded in. Kinda glad we didn’t as it would have made for a long day. From Murren, you take the funicular (?) up to Almendhubel and then follow the blue North Face trail signs.

The route was 4.1 miles with a total descent of 1000’ or so. It took us 2:40 (with about 40 minutes of non-moving time). I was probably the pacing family member on this one as my knee started acting up and this was before I bought the knee brace. I don’t think a normal person would have issues though. Again, highly recommended.

<b>First to Gross Scheidegg via Schilt</b>
This was our bonus day hike. I had the first 5 days somewhat mapped out and I left things open the last day. DW was a little disappointed in the lack of animals we had seen so we saw the blurb about this being the “Marmot Trail” and decided to give it a go (knowing that chances were slim). We were also going to throw the kids a bone and do some toboggan runs in Pfingstegg but I got cheap (and took the bone back I guess).

Not the easiest to get to from Wengen: train from Wengen to Lauterbrunnen to Zweilutschinen to Grindelwald. Walk through town to the First gondola and take the gondola to First. We took the bus from Gross Platte back to Grindelwald and then the train on return.

Posted time (#17) of 2:30. We did it in 2:50 including a picnic lunch. There are some ups and downs but nothing too major (one 800’ climb and a 1000’ descent). I appreciated the different views (though we had previously been to First) of looking into the Grindelwald valley and walking towards the Wetterhorn. It was also interesting to see the valley and string of mountains past Gross Scheidegg.

Hey, and we did see one (1) marmot.

We enjoyed the walk but it was properly placed as 7th on my to-do list. Our other options were to spend some time around Lake Brienz or even go to the Ballenberg Museum which I’m sure would have been enjoyable as well (and maybe even more so). We didn’t want a full day’s activity so we opted for this walk instead.

Hard walks next . . .

Am heading there in September and looking forward to the trails that you've recommended. Thanks!

I just came away from the BO and in fact we were there at the same time as the OP...you do NOT have to pay $7 for a bottle of water. You will find a LOT depends on where you choose to buy that bottle of water and a lot of other things in Switzerland, especially in the BO which is about as purely tourist-oriented as it gets in Switzerland which has few natural resources other than visitors and the fabulous scenery.

Indy,

Thank you for the trip report. I just started reading it and can't wait to finish the rest.

Thanks for the trip report. We will be staying in Wengen in September.
Looking forward to the next instalment.

aussie_10: See you there in September. I am there from the 20th - 27th.

Great report and wonderful pictures! I am now really excited as I have booked for my family (also American ex-pats in UK) to spend 4 nights in Wengen and 4 nights in Vevey at the end of this month. If you don't mind, a few questions:

- We have a 5 and 3.5 year old - they are pretty active and we do a fair amount of walking. I'm wondering about taking them on the Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg walk. I know its hard to judge with other people's kids but do you think your kids could have managed the Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg walk at those ages? Alternatively, the Grutschalp to Murren (Mountain View Trail) walk looks quite mild and last time we went, the kids loved the playground on top of Almendhubel (they were too young to hike).

- Was the pool you used a public access pool that you can pay to visit? We are staying at Hotel Schoenegg but it has no pool.

Thanks!

NorCal_Jo,
I know you didn't ask me but IMO, your kids will absolutely love the walk from Mannlichen to KS. It is extremely easy and if they do a fair amount of walking already, it will be a breeze for them. There is a great area along the way, that is like a large pullover area so you can all sit and take in the view and have a little snack and rest. There were schoolchildren all over the walk when we went and even one of those mobile wheelchairs on the trail. Take them, you will not regret it.
Michele

Thanks Michele! We are taking Grandma as well so will be a good excuse for us to take some breaks for the views!

Thank you. Great photos and information. I'm going to referring to this often!

Thanks for the comments. It's nice to see the TR work is appreciated.

@NorCal_Jo -- as Michele said, your kids will do fine on the Mannlichen to KS walk (as well as the Grutschalp to Murren walk). There will be places were you want to hold their hand, if I recall but other than that, it should be no problem.

The pool was a community pool. It's somewhat on the opposite side of Wengen from the Hotel Schoenegg but nothing is too far away in Wengen. The price per adult is 4 CHF (3 CHF w/ activity card -- ask the hotel). Kids are free. They have a little snack bar too.

The pool has a teeny, tiny TV that I used to watch the last game of the Andy Murray Wimbledon victory too. :D

We really enjoyed our one meal at the Hotel Schoenegg but it was rather leisurely. Might be tough for your young kids every night -- not sure what your plans are for meals.

Hard walks

<b>Wengen to Kleine Scheidegg</b>

I chose this walk for a number of reasons. Kim’s guide had it rated fairly well and it was judged to be a good barometer of her “medium” walks (we have a different scale!). And, it starts right from Wengen so why not?

The walk was 6.6 miles with a consistent, 3000’ climb. It took us 3:40 with factoring in a few breaks. We took trail 43 out of Wengen (it splits away from the tracks at Allmend). At the upper fork we opted to walk towards Wengernalp (42) and then on to Kleine Scheidegg.

I won’t lie. That was a pretty crisp climb for us. DS broke down at the end (too tired). The last bit (from Wengernalp to KS) seemed particularly difficult and we would have been better taking the train the rest of the way. I didn’t want to cave in on the first walk though. Oh well.

We had some excellent Rosti at the restaurant at the train station for a late lunch. Two servings were big enough for 4 of us. It was so good, we ate there again later in the week.

Spent for the day, we took the train back to Wengen and then jumped in the pool

Tough climb and a worthy challenge and hike. Glad we did it but this also solidified the fact that we don’t need to climb that much every day (and we didn’t).

<b>Schynige Platte to First</b>

The big boy. 10.3 miles in total. 3500' up (and 2900' down) with a max of 8600' (we didn't climb the peak at Faulhorn due to fog and exhaustion). The posted time (#62) was 6 hours and it took us 7.5 hours (partly due the conditions and my knee).

This is an all day affair. It took about 2 hours to get there (Wengen to Lauterbrunnen to Wilderswil and then the climb on the cog train to Schynige Platte). Added pressure in that there aren’t really any off ramps and you need to make it to First in time to get the last gondola to Grindelwald. (I can’t imagine walking down 3000’ under any conditions but certainly not at the end of this walk).

To hedge our bets and not feel rushed, we got an early start and caught the 7:03 train out of Wengen and that put us in SP around 9. After looking around and making a pit stop, we were off at 9:15 (so arrived in First at 4:45 with plenty of time to spare). Getting home required the gondola, walking through Grindelwald and the train through the valley to Wengen (GW to Zweilutschinen to Lauterbrunnen to Wengen).

This is a challenging walk. The climbing isn’t as difficult as it is stretched out over a longer period. The views are great and varied (I must sound like I’m repeating myself). Unfortunately for us, we did get some low clouds towards Faulhorn which hindered our views in the second half of the walk.

The biggest issue for us was the remaining snow cover. Perhaps foolishly, but I assumed since the trail was open it would be safe. We also saw others coming and going so knew it would be passable. However, there were a handful (half dozen?) stretches that involved walking across a narrow, snow/ice covered path with steep drop-offs to the side. There were also snow/ice stretches that weren’t as dangerous but still a little tedious, particularly for someone with a sore knee. (DS loved them though).

It felt good to complete the walk though afterwards it did give me a bit of the willies thinking about what could have happened. It’s not a dangerous walk per se though I guess my recommendation would be to do it later in the summer once the snow has presumably melted.

As promised, <b>now a word on costs . . . </b>

This is our 3rd year in the UK. I didn’t really consider Switzerland at first because I was intimidated by the costs. I had heard they were outrageous. But does a Swiss vacation have to break the bank?

To hopefully help ease some of those concerns I’m going to share exactly what we spent. You can spend more and you can spend less but here’s at least one concrete data point for you. Since I got to “cheat” and fly from the UK, I’ll focus on the costs once arriving in Switzerland (i.e. air-fare not included).

Remember: family of 4 with kids 14 & 11 for a one week stay in Wengen

<b>Total cost: 4073 CHF</b>

Chalet rental: 1917 CHF
Transportation: 858 CHF (2 Half Fare Cards, 1st class round trip from Zurich to Wengen, etc.)
Dinner’s out (3): 410 CHF
Lunches out (2 @ KS + Zurich Airport): 153 CHF
Snacks out: 24 CHF
Groceries: 337 CHF
Entertainment (Grindelwald + Trummelbach Falls): 168 CHF
Souvenirs: 108 CHF
Misc (knee brace): 79 CHF

So roughly 50% lodging, 25% transportation and 25% food.

I was surprised at how reasonable it was. I didn't feel like we were skimping in any way. We stayed in a really nice place and ate out in nice restaurants when we did.

We took advantage of the chalet and ate in more than I thought we would. That was as much out of laziness (not wanted to go back out) as cost but it did help. Groceries were more expensive than the US (not necessarily the UK). We covered breakfast (& coffee), most lunches (picnics) and 4 eat in dinners and snacks from the store. We generally do well by buying what we want at the store (local treats, etc.) and not succumbing to additional purchases during the day save the occasional ice cream.

Another big savings was having our pre-dinner drinks at home and generally forgoing additional alcohol at the restaurants (on 2 of the 3 nights). Some people may not find that acceptable. Drinks in general are expensive at the restaurants. Not much way around this as some places even charge for tap water (criminal in my view).

We didn’t have any $7/bottle of water but we did get stuck on the inbound train. I had purchased a large water in Birmingham and security nicked it in Paris. We wanted to immediately jump on the train in Zurich so we were empty handed. Dying of thirst, I purchased 2 waters from the trolley for 10 CHF. Supply and demand. Much cheaper in the store. We simply filled our Camelbaks from the tap for the hikes though.

The vast majority of our grocery purchases were in Wengen at the Coop. Not sure if they would be cheaper in Interlaken but I have no interest in schlepping groceries + luggage on 2 trains to save a few francs.

Plan out your potential itinerary and price out your rail card/pass options. (The Half Fare card should be the starting point.) Make your decision and carve out some budget and then stop thinking about it. It’s the price for the views. It was much easier for me mentally to not think how much each trip was costing. Yes, we were going to spend close to $1000 on trains for the week, but I had planned for that so it was okay.

Finally, to put that in perspective I will compare that to our other trips from the UK that required a flight to reach (i.e. excluding driving vacations to Scotland, Cornwall, and Normandy). Number of nights in ( ).

Berlin/Prague (9): 78%
Rome (7): 97%
<b>Switzerland (7): 100%</b>
Paris (6): 104%
Ireland (8): 106%
Bruges/Amsterdam (8): 108%

So, compared to big city holidays, it’s right in the mix (other than our cheaper Berlin/Prague trip).

One of our favorite trips and worth every franc!

Indy_dad, so glad you & your family had such a wonderful time in BO with good hiking weather! You hiked several of the trails I did in '07. Those views pictured in your photos never grow old. Can't wait to return. You are also very fortunate to live in Derbyshire. I simply love the countryside around Hathersage, and also Haddon Hall and Bakewell, and plan to return next year.

Indy_dad - thanks for the input on the walks and pool. We do have dinners built into our price at Hotel Schoenegg so thanks for the warning as I may ask them to do something more quick for the kids. We are also renting their "Jungfrau Suite" that has a kitchen so we can opt for the kids to eat earlier if needed or skip out on the dinner worst case...

Great report!

Indy_dad - Thank you for the insight on the costs. Having done several trips abroad to some of the more expensive locations on your comparison, I feel much more at ease with my budget. It is just me traveling and plan to spend 10 days (9 nights) 7 of which will be in Wengen and 2 in Zurich. I plan to buy the Swiss Pass for 8 days (393CHF - no discounts). I am staying at the Hotel Edelweiss for around 600CHF. I have already paid for my hotels in Zurich using points. My total budget, without airfare, is about 400CHF per day after hotels and Swiss Pass. I am thinking after your posting that I will be ok sticking with the plan to buy breakfast, lunch, and snack items at the Coop and eat an inexpensive meal out at night.

Thanks again!!!

Another fine story and wonderful pics! I have enjoyed watching your kids "grow up". I notice that Alex no longer has that "they're making me smile" grimace that he used to have in photos. I caught it in one or two shots, but in most of them he looked quite grown up. But glad to see that he still enjoys being a kid in so many places (on the seesaw, climbing the snow bank, etc.) I spent most of my teaching career with that (8-11 year old) age group and really loved their zest, growing interest in the wider world, and zany humor. Some of my friends tell me that is why I have never progressed beyond 11 in my stage of development.

Thanks once again for sharing your family adventures!

Cathereinehaas, have you compared the 8 day pass with the half-fare card and the flexipass? I usually get a flexipass for 3 or 5 days depending on how long I will be there.

The flexipass combines the 'full' pass and the half-fare card. You can travel for 3 'full' pass days and 27 half-fare days on a 3 day flexipass. So what you do is use the 'full'days when you are making a major move with a high ordinary ticket cost and use the half-fare discount for the rest of the time.
http://www.myswitzerland.com/en/swis...n.html#details

If you are only really moving twice, the 3 day might be enough. The 3 day flexi will cost you 260CHF vs. the 393CHF of a full 8 day pass.

Where you do take a bus for example to start a hike or visit a place, paying half the fare may not add up to the differnce in the pass price if you see what I mean. For example suppose you wanted to take the train from Interlaken to Meiringen to visit the Sherlock Holmes museum and walk to Reichenbach Falls where Holmes and Moriarty fell to their deaths. The fare is 6.40CHF of which you would pay 3.20. This example should indicate how many times you would have to use a train/bus at half-fare to make up the 133CHF difference in the full pass vs. the flexipass.

If you hope to to up Jungfraujoch (most visitors to the area want to but it must be a day without cloud) no pass gets you up for free. Any pass gets you the 25% discount. So all are equal in that regard.

If you get a half-fare card it is 120CHF. The thing to look at with it is how much will your long journeys ie. to/from Zurich cost. For the 8 day card to be worth while you need to add those plus a fudge number for the half fare trips you would make. Zurich to/from Wengen will cost 30-40CHF one way.

So look at 393CHF compared to say 40CHF x2 for Zurich/Wengen return plus say another what 100CHF during your stay for short train/bus trips, all at half fare. That would be 393 for your full pass vs. 120 + 90 (half-fare you paid)= 210 CHF. Or just about half the price.

A full pass generally only makes economic sense if you are going to make a lot of major moves during the time period it covers.

Indy, I don't understand your 858 CHF rail cost.

Your 2 half-fare cards cost 240CHF which means you paid 618CHF for return tickets Zurich/Wengen plus various short bus/lift rides to hiking starts, as I understand what you have written.

Was it that those short half-fare rides X 4 people added up to quite a bit? I'd put the Zurich/Wengen return at 320CHF max for 4 people. That leaves 300CHF spent on short rides.

Ah, of course, you said 'first class' Zurich/Wengen which would change it so maybe now that I am writing this, it is starting to make sense to me. Which brings up a good point I think. There is no need to travel first class on Swiss trains. Second class is more than adequate for anyone.

The other question would be why did you buy the Zurich/Wengen separately and not use the half-fare card on them? If that is what you did.

Improviser - This is GREAT information on the passes. Here is the rough estimated travel.

Arrive on 9/20 = Train to Wengen from Zurich. Arrive early afternoon and check into the hotel. Travel back into Interlaken for a few sites and groceries. Back to Wengen and turn in early.

9/21 - Travel to Bern. The markets in Old Town. Travel back to Wengen.

9/22 - Travel to Mannlichen from Wengen and hike to KS and then hike down to Wengen.

9/23 - Travel to Grindelwald. Is Gstaad worth a trip?

9/24 - Travel to Luzern. Markets in Luzern and sites.

9/25 - Travel to Gutscalp. Hike to Wengen. Long day of hiking here.

9/26 - Travel to Speiz and Thun via river boat.

9/27 - Travel back to Zurich.

9/28 - Sites in Zurich (plan for a day pass here).

9/29 - Home.

Was not really going to go up to Jungfrau. Too risky with the weather. I did that once in Berchtesgaden and the Eagle's Nest. Clear day down below, cloudy and could not see a thing once we got up there. I know there are webcams that let you know how it looks up there but too worried that could change between the time we left KS and when I got up there.

I have tried to look at the passes and determine which one was best and it can be a daunting task. However, I completely understand what you are saying.

Question: If you buy the flexipass for 3 days, it really allows you to travel for 27 days at half fare???