12 days The Hague, Amsterdam, Belgium, Paris Itinerary Advice
 

Hello everyone,

My husband will be in The Hague on business and we're planning to do a little touring/sightseeing. Would really appreciate your advice on our tentative itinerary, as follows:

13-16th (4 days stationed for business) in The Hague--possible day trips to Utrecth, Delft, Den Bosch, or Maastricht
16th take train to Amsterdam in the evening
17-18 (2 full days) Amsterdam
Night of 18th or morning of 19th (?) take train to Antwerp
19-22 (4 days) based out of Antwerp day trips to Gent, Brugge, possibly Brussels (I've read mixed things. worth seeing?)
take Thalys from Antwerp to Ru de Nord statin in Paris night of 22nd (safe?)
23-24 and until 4pm on 25th (2.5 days)-- Paris
25th- fly out of Paris

Any advice on what to see or not see or where to stay longer/what to cut short would be appreciated. We are traveling in November and I have been advised that it rains a good deal in Holland and Belgium and it might be cold. The cold doesn't bother me and neither does the rain, unless it is pouring. Hopefully that won't be the case.

As far as touring, we are mostly interested in walking the cities, architecture, churches, nature, and of course plan to visit some museums (Van Gogh in Amsterdam, the Louvre in Paris).

I really wish we did have more than 2 days in Paris...do you guys think we should cut a day off of Belgium and spend 3 days in Paris instead?

Also, I've been researching getting from Antwerp to Paris' Nord station and have read some horrific things about pickpockets, thieves, and tourists being harassed on the Thayls by people who were not ticket agents but were demanding to see travel documents in order to extort money.

We are careful but do not look imposing. Our plan was to take an evening train out of Antwerp on Saturday night so we could have 2 full days on Sunday and Monday in Paris but now I'm not sure this is the safest thing.

I traveled through Spain for 3 weeks with my friend a few years back and didn't have much trouble. I felt a little harassed when I was in the metro in Naples (albeit with a group of friends) but we were able to handle it.

Thanks so much in advance!

Yup I'd take a day out of Belgium if never been to Paris before - and I'd base in gorgeous Bruges as most do (maybe that is a drawback to you but this town, to me one of the most medieval looking ones in its historic core north of the Alps) but it is especially a gem after the daytime bus groups have left and the ancient city, once one of the most prosperous in the city and

the city's ancient quays lined by stately Flemish facades of old warehouses attests to this one-time important (until the port silted up gradually leaving it far inland as is it todya and the hectic port activities moved to Antwerp, still today one of the world's busiest ports).

Brgues is a great base for trips to Antwerp - one day there enough for most though this is a fascinating city with some neat sites like Osylei Cogl (sp?) a street lovingly lined by art nouveau facades and Middleheim Statue part, also in the outer area.

And with the Thalys ABS fare you can take any train from Bruges and Antwerp to Brussels, spend the day there and then take the Thalys to Paris - with little or not extra fare over the Thalys fare - which you should book ASAP because there are deep discounts but they are sold in limited numbers and sell out quick.

For lots of great info on Thalys and trains in Benelux and France I always spotlight these IMO superb sites: www.budgeteuropetravel.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.seat62.com - www.thlays.com of course for Thalys booking - very easy to do IME.

https://www.google.com/search?q=coge...w=1455&bih=952

I would add at least 2 days to Paris. It's November and you can expect weather similar to NYC or Philly - chilly but not very cold (40s) and some rain is always possible - in 12 days at lest a couple of days of rain is likely.

Make sure you have a sturdy folding umbrella, waterproofed comfy walking shoes and either a lined raincoat or a mid weight coat that won;t be ruined by the weather. (A friend took a new suede jacket on a similar trip and it was never the same.)

Thanks for the advice guys! I'll take away a day from Belgium and tack it on to Paris.

PalenQ, in Belgium was thinking of being based out of Antwerp because it's more convenient to get to Paris from there and also because we don't want to have to schlep our suitcases from hotel to hotel every day.

So far I think I've narrowed it down to:

4 days in The Hague (day trips to Delft, Utrecht, maybe Den Bosch, Maastricht would be nice but probably too far)
2 days in Amsterdam (maybe small day trip to Haarlem or Zannse Schanse to see the windmills if the weather is good)
3 days in Belgium (Antwerp, Ghent, Brugge, Brussels if there's time but probably not)
3.5 days in Paris

For Belgium: basing in Antwerp is indeed more convenient to get to Paris. That being said, basing in Brussels might even be better because Brussels is more centrally located for visiting Bruges. Bruges definitely is NOT a good base for a trip to Antwerp (one and a half hours, whereas Brussels-Antwerp is only 40 mins.).

Antwerp: the art nouveau street mentioned by PalenQ is called Cogels-Osylei. It is really worth seeing, but with only one short day I would stick to the historical part of the city.

Gent may be the best base from a centrally located basis and is also a neat old town with bits of Bruges-like quaitness and canals - an old-world flare rather lacking in a bustling more modern and more commercial center Antwerp -

smaller cities or a larger town - pluses and minuses to each.

Thanks Myriam! Will definitely check out Cogels-Osylei and the historical part of Antwerp. The reason I chose Antwerp over Brussels is that I heard it was more "worth seeing" and that Brussels had a pretty town square but not much else (even though it is the capital). What was your opinion of Brussels?

I agree about Antwerp. But then, I may be a bit biased ... being Antwerpian. ;-)

Hey olgap,

I was in these countries in 2012 and loved it very much. I much preferred Antwerp over Brussels. Brussels was a major letdown for me. I even had my wrist sprained due to a car backing into me hand while I was crossing through the pedestrian zone with a green light to go. The guy didn't even check to see if I was okay, just sped off. Delft is amazing, be sure to buy some delft china. Instead of going to Zannnse Schanse I would go to Kinderdijk. It has 19 windmills and you can enter a working one for a price of course. Bruges and Ghent are amazing. Have a great trip!

Actually timewise Bruges is a tad closer to Paris by train then from Antwerp - though from Antwerp you can get a direct Thalys train - but if you go Bruges-Lille-Paris you may find that a bit quicker than Antwerp-Brussels-Paris and if you do not score a very cheap Thalys ticket then that other route, with a fairly flat fare structure could be much cheaper on a walk up basis and you can get discounts on the Lille-Flandres to Paris-Nord train too.

But if you get one of the cheaper Thalys tickets that route could be cheaper and more convenient as it is direct.

I would consider stopping in Brussels for a half day or so en route to Paris - the ABS (All-Belgian-Stations) fare lets you go on any train within 24 hours (maybe 48?) of your Brussels to Paris train at no extra cost - put you bags in a locker at Gare du Midi in Brussels (AKA Brussels-Zuid or South Station) and hop a train to nearby Brussels Centrale station (not the main station in Brussels but a secondary mainly commuter one but a short walk from the fantastic Grand' Place, one of Europe's classiest town squares and the Mannequin pis - statue of a little boy peeing - the two major sights in the town center - you may even have time to take in one of Brussels touted art museums though you will have had your fill perhaps of those in Antwerp, Gent and Bruges!

Brendonb29, that's terrible!

Thanks for all the advice, guys! It has been a big help.

Actually timewise Bruges is a tad closer to Paris by train then from Antwerp - though from Antwerp you can get a direct Thalys train - but if you go Bruges-Lille-Paris you may find that a bit quicker than Antwerp-Brussels-Paris>

Let me correct myself for a brain malfunction - Antwerp is closer timewise from Paris by train than in Bruges - I was thinking from Bruges it is just as quick to go via Lille as to go via Brussels. Sorry about that rather stupid mixing up of things.

No problem PalenQ. Thanks!

Hi. We just got back from a somewhat similar itinerary (no work in The Hague, though).

I will work on starting a trip report. And, even though I am very fond of Belgium, if you have never been to Paris, add time to there.

We discovered on this trip (thanks to a helpful ticket agent in Gent) that there is a direct Thalys train from Brugge to Paris - 2.5 hours.

We were in Amsterdam, took the train to the Hague, then to Gent, then to Brugge (stowed our luggage for the day) and a 7pm Thayls train to Paris.

We were warned about pickpockets, too. We had no issues - husband wore a money belt and I wore a small cross-the-shoulder bag. We thought the Thayls train was very civilized - we had no problems on there.

We just couldn't fit in Delft - that's super easy from the Hague - a 20 min or so train ride.

I really liked den Bosch b/c I love the painter Bosch. There is an amazing cathedral there.

Belgium has amazing chocolate - and extremely reasonably priced compared to similar stuff in the US.

I was underwhelemed with Brussels overall, but I love art and their art museum is excellent. I also thought the Grand Place was one of the, well, grandest, squares in Europe.

I have fond memories of Antwerp b/c I was hanging out there when my husband was on a business trip, and it's so convenient to get to places from there.

Brugge is your Belgium priority, IMO, but it's not that big and with a day you can see a lot.

Also, I would spent all your 2 days in Amsterdam.

We had a wonderful trip through Belgium last year and loved it all, though didn't go into Brussels. I only mention one fly in the ointment because you brought it up: we had one shoulder bag of my husband's stolen from him while we were near the ticket window in the Antwerp train station. We didn't let it spoil our view of Anwtwerp or the great trip.

Thanks, PhillyFan. Yeah, that's what I hear about Brussels too (beautiful square, good museums). We'll try to do a few hours there if we can but if it's tight I'd rather spend time in Bruges. We're spending an extra day in Paris and might be able to tack on another one. Can I ask you what day you traveled to Paris? We're planning to leave Antwerp for PAris on a Friday (also around 7 pm). I read somewhere that you're more likely to encounter problems on the weekend because people are either going out to party or coming back. Comforting to know that you felt safe on the train though. Was definitely planning to see Den Bosch (Den Bosch over Maastricht I decided, primarily because of the cathedral) from The Hague when my husband is working.

m34aggie: good to know! We'll definitely keep our wits about us, everywhere.

Also, where did you stay while you were in Paris? I found a cheap hotel close to the Gare de Norde train station but it's in the 10th arrondissement and I hear it maybe a little seedy? Far from the center of Paris as well but we dont mind taking trains, though we do slightly prefer walking. I also found a cheap hotel in the 8th arrondissement close to a bus that would take us to CDG airport on our flight back to NY. How easy is it to get a taxi from the train station?

The Gare du Nord area is not that seedy but not the prettiest or most convivial section of Paris IME - kind of lacks a neighborhood feeling you often like - like boulangeries and ordinary cafes but instead full of establishments catering to the hoards of folks traveling via the Gare du Nord or nearby Gare de l'Est.

And it is a little more remote but if into walking a bit about a mile or so from the Pompidou Center, Notre Dame even the Louvre area or maybe a tad farther - I've always found walking through unfamiliar neighborhoods to get to say the Louvre from your hotel was often more enjoyable than what I found in my famous destination place - all the little shops, cafes, street markets, etc.

But the Gare du Nord area to me is rather sterile but OK - safe enough it seems - rooms fronting the main roads could be loud due to incessant loud traffic coming and going to the stations.

We just returned from three weeks in Belgium and The Netherlands and we have been to Paris on many occasions.

Here some general impressions. Paris is one of the most glorious cities in the world and deserves as much time as one can muster.

Delft was unqiue in that is a charming cities without the multitude of people like us-tourists.

Brussels is an almost interesting city. The pastries, breads and chocolates are spectacular, however.

Brugge is a beautiful but a town overwhelmed by tourists during the day but the city has done an elegant job of lighting the canals for night viewing. Gent is more interesting, more layered. Antwerp has many worthwhile sights including a most clever and aesthetically pleasing renovation to its central train station.

Amsterdam is a fabulous walking city with world class museums and disappointing restaurants.

Thus, it all depends what is important to you.

Brussels is not terrible, but as someone once said here on Fodor's, it takes longer to give up its charms. If you were there for a week, eating and drinking locally and seeing its museums, you might have a different view of it. But by all means make a flying visit - drop your belongings in a locker at Central Station, and see the Grand Place. Most people are underwhelmed with the Manneken Pis because he is really so tiny. He also only takes moments to see. I would possibly add on (or substitute) a visit to the Grand Sablon's chocolate shops (there are numerous ones clustered here), or to the Dandoy tea room at Rue Charles Buls 14 for a waffle. Even better, if you can squeeze it in, a visit to a nice restaurant for lunch. If you have more time, the Horta Museum in St.-Gilles is a remarkable, intact Art Nouveau house designed by Victor Horta, who was responsible for much of the Art Nouveau in Brussels. It is really spectacular - no detail has been forgotten.

Lavandula

We did the Bruges to Paris train on a Sunday night. We thought it was a nice ride. The train was nicer than the regular trains we took from the Hague to Ghent, which looked a little worn down and did not have Wi-Fi. Thayls did, and so did our train from Amsterdam to The Hague.

We stayed in the 6th arr. at the best Western Trianon Rive Gauche. It was really convenient to a lot of different things. Paris is very walkable, but the sites can be exhausting. (The Louvre is huge!)

I love the 7th in Paris. It's not overly touristy with many Parisians actually living there. Hotel Muguet is my favourite in Paris.

I would choose Antwerp over Bruges any day. Bruges is fine, but it's Tourist Central these days. And I would definitely visit Brussels, which has the best food in all of Europe, IMO. I'd add a day onto Paris for sure. And I wouldn't stay right near the Gare du Nord - it's not unsafe, but it's sure not pretty. A short cab or métro ride will get you to any number of more attractive places.

We were just in brugge, on a weekend, and while there were tourists there, it wasn't so packed you couldn't move. No lines for the museums or waits to eat lunch.

Paris is even more tourist central, but I wouldn't recommend Antwerp over Paris, either.

Thanks everyone! We're going to be traveling in November so I'm not too worried about it being overrun with tourists. Will take not staying near Gare du Nord under advice. Right now, it looks like we'll have 3 full days in Paris and maybe a half day on day of departure. Hope that's enough!

The any Belgain Stations fare talked about above I guess is not free but you pay 5 euros or so - anyway much much cheaper than buying a regular ticket say Antwerp to Bruges.

And the time period in which you have to take your ABS fare train is I guess 48 hours, not 24 as I said. So in theory one could stay in Antwerp two days and then use the ABS fare to go onto any other Belgian station within 48 hours of their Thalys arrival time.

Thanks PalenQ!

https://www.thalys.com/be/en/offers-...elgian-station

all the dope on ABS fares!

Just spend some time playing around on www.thaly.com for fares both in ner future and about two months out - and yes savings are immense if you can lock yourself in stone that far out.

Ten days out from today there were some 78 euro fares but most trains were more - up to 168 on some - two months out there were lots of 50 euro ticket and even 79 euros in 1st class

(This was for Amsterdam to Paris) - so by booking way ahead you can get a first-class ticket cheaper than if you don't book that far ahead - and first-class besides having larger seats also gives I believe a full meal with lots of wine, etc at your seat.)

So be flexible on the times you want to travel - by going a few hours later than you'd like you may find a lot lower fares - be flexible and search thoroughly - maybe even put the cart in front of the horse and see which days you can get the cheapest tickets and then plan your itinerary around that!

We just returned from Europe a month ago. We have a friend that we stayed with in Place Flagy right outside of Brussels. Of course having a native to take you around is always wonderful. We enjoyed it. We also took the bus to Paris for half the cost of the train. 3 hours trip and views of more of the countryside than on the train. Very easy, comfortable trip. The bus station connects with the Metro, Paris has the best Metro system. I would also recommend the Hop on Hop off tours bus to get an overview of all of Paris. The cost is 32 euros per person for a 2 day pass. It will take you to most of the favorite sites. And a history lesson of the city. We enjoyed it very much.

Thanks PalenQ, definitely will do.

Debragartin, do you remember what the bus is called from Brussels to Paris? I remember looking up buses between Belgium and Paris but the travel time was somewhere between 5 and 6 hours and the cost was only about 4 euros less than Thalys.

<i> 12 days The Hague, Amsterdam, Belgium, Paris Itinerary Advice
Posted by: olgap on Jul 9, 14 at 2:12pm</i>

I've been to all those places but it's difficult to give itinerary advice. My favorites are Paris (where I lived for a while) and Amsterdam (I lived in Haarlem).

Yup, the weather can be raw in November. It will probably be in the 40s and 50s with a constant drizzle and a now and then hard blow. You can deal with it. Dress in layers with a good waterproof shell and some wool under it. When you get a chill stop in any of the cozy cafes for a beverage. You'll probably have new friends in minutes. Cafes are ubiquitous in Holland.

While your husband is struggling to comprehend the Dutch way of doing business, you can have a great time riding a bicycle around town. The Hague is much more bicycle friendly than Amsterdam, where I wouldn't consider pedaling. Also, make sure you see Madurodam.

Brussels is a turn off, except for the food. It is home to the European Commission and snoots. Antwerp mussels are also excellent, and it is a more interesting and friendlier city. The tourist season should be over in Brugge, unless you happen to hit a weekend with a holiday in any adjoining country. Otherwise be ready to stand in line.

Pickpockets are everywhere in Europe, especially where travelers pass. Keep your passport, money, and credit cards on your person in an inner pocket. Only put stuff in your purse or luggage that you want to have stolen. Amsterdam is one of the worse cities in northern Europe for pickpockets, luggage thieves, and panhandlers. Ignore anybody who approaches you for any reason in Paris, Amsterdam, etc. The Gare du Nord in Paris has a colony of gypsies outside. Centraal Station in Amsterdam is often patrolled by a platoon of uniformed police. If you lose something it is gone, period.

For an illustrated introduction to trains in Holland and Europe see http://tinyurl.com/eym5b. Unfortunately the NS Dutch Railways has changed their ticketing system. The new design appears to have been created by a xenophobic idiot. In other words, it ain't easy for foreigners, even Belgians. To get the official story on how to buy a train ticket see http://www.ns.nl/en/travellers/home. For an attempt at explaining it all see this blog, http://tinyurl.com/kf7sdxn, apparently written by a Romanian visitor.

It seems like you haven't tried the Fodor's search box above for a hotel in Paris. Just type in 'paris hotel' and you'll get hundreds of links to zillions of places to stay. As cautioned by others, the Gare du Nord area is not where you want to be. When your train arrives get on a Metro and get yourself over to the 5th or 6th. I really advise against lolling about in Antwerp until 19h00 to go to Paris. I suggest that you be in Paris and checked in by 18h00. Then go out for a great meal. Remember, this is Paris and you are going to spend some serious money. You might make another post here and ask for restaurant suggestions.

Have fun.

Thanks spaarne! Tat last website you linked to is great.

I agree that traveling earlier in the day is better than traveling later BUT am a little loathe to cut my time in Amsterdam or Belgium short. Figure if it gets dark around 16:00/16:30 in November, we can retrieve our bags from the hotel, be on a train by 17:00/17:30 (I booked hotels close to the central train stations in Amsterdam and Antwerp) and arrive in the new city around 18:30/19:00. Our hotel in Antwerp is literally two steps from the train, which gives us a little more flexibility in terms of arrival.

I definitely don't feel comfortable traveling at night in a city I've never been in before. Generally, I'll shoot to arrive by 19:00.

There were a lot of gypsies in Rome when I was there but they didn't give us any trouble. Our plan is to just b-line out of the station. All this talk about thieves and pick-pockets makes me a little nervous though. We plan to travel light but will have 1 small and 1 bigger suitcase with us. My main concern is getting from Gare du Norde to our hotel in Paris. It's in the 9th arr. about a 15 minute walk from the station but if we feel unsafe, maybe we will cab it?

there is no unusual security problems in the Gare du Nord area - I have walked around there many many times even at night - do not worry about that - broad well-lit streets.

Thanks, PalenQ! That is definitely good to hear.

there are pickpockets inside the station however I believe - so just be wary of anyone coming up to you - don't accept help trying to use automatic metro ticketing machines, etc or folks who ask you questions, often working in paris - these things are rare but can happen in crowded stations and metro stations, etc.

We'll keep an eye out. As long as no one tries to grab our suitcases out of our hands and run, I think we should be OK.

I would add another day to Paris. Take a day or two from The Hague.

Two days in Amsterdam is barely enough, and I'd stay in town to explore it, rather than day-trip. We liked the Hotel Residence le Coin there.

In Paris, try the Hotel St Jacques, in the Latin Quarter. It's a young, lively, friendly part of Paris, and you can easily walk from there to many sites.

Unfortunately, my husband will be in The Hague on business so time there isn't negotiable. It looks like 3.5 days in Paris and 2 days in Amsterdam will have to do.