12 Days in Italy
 

My wife and I will be traveling to Italy for our 20th anniversary. We'll have 12 days on the ground, arriving in Rome and flying back from Venice. (Leaving June 1st. Coming home June 14th).

I started out with an extremely aggressive itinerary based on "Rick Steves Italy" book. But after reading through forums, I realized that we needed to trim down. So I've narrowed it down to two general itineraries:

Either:

4 Days in Rome
4 Days in Florence
4 Days in Venice

Or:

3 Days in Rome
3 Days in Florence
3 Days in Cinque Terre
3 Days in Venice

Two questions:

1. If I were to include Cinque Terre, would that be too much travel. I realize that's a subjective question. But I'm curious if anyone out there has done it and what their experience was.

2. Is there enough to do in Rome, Florence, and Venice to justify 4 days each?

You need to consider travel times between points. In the first option, you'd have more like 3.5 days in Florence and 3.5 days in Venice. You could take a late afternoon or early evening train to salvage more sightseeing time, but that would probably mean having a less than memorable dinner those days. In the second option, only 2.5 days in Florence, 2.5 days in CT and a bit less than 2.5 days in Venice. Is that enough time to see/do the things on your sightseeing list? Will things in each city be open on the days you'd be there? (FYI, June 2nd is a national holiday.)

"Is there enough to do in Rome, Florence, and Venice to justify 4 days each?"

Well, that depends on what you want to see/do. You could spend the entire 12 days in any one of these cities and still not see everything.

With travel time, time getting to and from hotels, etc., you won't actually have four days in each place.

June 2, arrive Rome, (arrival time? Get luggage, get into city and to hotel. Orientation walk around. Eat. Relax
June 3, Rome - whole day
June 4, Rome - whole day
June 5, Rome - whole day
June 6, Rome - whole day
June 7, train to Florence. Arrive mid-morning to late morning. 3/4 day sightseeing.
June 8, Florence - whole day
June 9, Florence (day trip.)
June 10, Florence - whole day
June 11, travel to Venice (allow at least a half day) 1/2 day Venice
June 12, Venice - whole day
June 13, Venice - whole day
June 14, depart for home

So, even with just the big three, you have
Rome, 4 & 1/2 days
Florence, 3 & 3/4 days
Venice, 2 & 1/2 days

You can change the days a bit, depending on what you want to see in each place.

There are beautiful and interesting places for day trips very near Rome, Florence and Venice, that would be very short train trips. They would give you a lot of great sight seeing without using up time.
Therefore, IMHO, it would be better to stick with Rome, Florence and Venice and, if you find you have seen everything you want, do a short day trip from those, rather than add a longish trip to the CT.

Rome might need the most time because you may be jet lagged and Rome is a fairly large city with a lot to see.

Are you big into the art Florence has to offer? If not, there are easy and fantastic day trips to Siena, Lucca, Pisa, etc.

If you are tired of Rome by the fourth day, you could visit Orvieto or Ostia Antica.

Near Venice is Padua, Vicenza and the beaches on Lido.

Look at how much time you actually have in your chosen cities and then decide for yourself how much you are willing to give up to spend hours traveling to the CT.

You really how to decide what you want to see in each place and how long it will take - not just divide the number of days equally by the number of places. Some (Rome) have 10 times as much to see as others (CT) unless your primary goal is hiking cliff paths - versus seeing ancient sights, world class museums, gorgeous piazzas splashed by fountains, historic churches, and lots of places to just sit and enjoy watching the world walk by.

Congratulations on 20 years. That's wonderful ! We did essentially the same trip for our 20th. I can tell you we had almost 3 full days in Venice, and Tuscany and Rome and it wasn't nearly enough. I would stick to only 3 destinations, maybe even 2, but I know how hard it is to cut anything out. The best advice really is to see which locations hold the most interest for the two of you and split the time that way. If you could spend days at museums, maybe more time in Florence. If you're more fascinated with the history of Ancient Rome, perhaps that's your ticket. If you're both incurable romantics, maybe Venice holds a stronger pull. Anything you decide on will be perfect. Just keep in mind it does take time to get from point a to point b and make sure you have time to enjoy the trip.

I would say you could probably cut 1-2, days off Cinque Terre. Assuming you like hiking, you could probably do quite a few trails in 2 days. We spent a day in Cinque Terre last July (2015). Unfortunately, the coastal path was mostly closed, so we hiked the path from Levanto to Monterosso - which took us about half a day. It was a really neat hike - fairly quiet, beautiful coastal views, somewhat challenging for a family with young hikers. But a good challenge, not a bad one. You could certainly relax in any of the villages for dinner and do another hike the next day or do another one right after lunch. I would suggest checking to make sure the hikes you want to do in Cinque Terre are open, and try to decide how much hiking you'd like to do, before deciding how long to stay. We stayed just one day, and felt it was sufficient,given the closed trails, and very crowded trains/beach/train stations.

If possible, I would add days to Rome - there is so much to do and see in Rome. It was my second trip there, and I feel like I could go back and spend another week, or year there. Less busy attractions are Ostia Antica (ancient Roman port covered in river silt), Appia Antica (ancient Roman Road), Aquaduct Park (remains of thousand year old plus aquaducts,), Basilica San Clemente (church with 4 layers of history) and Baths of Diocletian (Rome's largest ancient Baths now houses a church designed by Michelangelo in a small portion of its structure). Feel free to check out my trip report:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...rip-report.cfm

Happy Anniversary and Happy Exploring!

In Rome I would plan at least 4 days, especially for your anniversary. It's so romantic and so scenic. But as already written beforehand, you can shorten the stay at other places. 3 days in Florence, 2 days in Venice and 2 days (1 night) in Cinque Terre should be fine. And don't forget the travel time - you got quite some distances to cover.

If you are still looking for a nice hotel in Rome, I can highly recommend the Adagio Rome ( http://www.apartment-hotels-europe.c...-rome-vatican/ ). Spent last summer with my family there and we really liked it both in terms of location and service.

Happy Anniversary!

Just too subjective to get anything other than subjective responses. So far you haven't heard from the frequent posters on Fodor's who regularly post that le Cinque Terre was the highlight of their trip to Italy, and they were happy to spend half a day or 3 days there. And some of the answers you get for Florence or Venice or Rome will be governed mainly by people having a huge attachment to Florence, or a huge attachment to Venice, or likewise Rome, which causes them to always push people to spend more time in their favorite city. Finally, for some people, switching hotels is a big deal, and they don't like it, so what they are really telling you is not to spend more time on one place so you get to know it better but just to stick to one hotel longer and do "day trips" -- which actually adds to the time you end up on trains and buses rather than seeing Florence, or visiting le Cinque Terre.

If you do end up deciding to include le Cinque Terre in your trip, either start in Venice, go to Florence, then le Cinque Terre for 2 nights, then Rome -- or consider going there right after Rome, by train, so that you arrive around 6pm. Unless you are very avid hikers, most people find the sunsets and quiet nights of le Cinque Terre enchanting in contrast to the many tourists who visit the small towns during the day. You can get up early in the morning and go hiking. From le Cinque Terre go to Florence and from there to Venice. That way, you can probably have a satisfying visit to le Cinque Terre with just 2 nights, and add the extra day to another place.

Umm. I think we lost him. ��

You didn't lose me! :)

I really appreciate all of the feedback! I'm a slow thinker, and have been processing all of the great recommendations.

Here's the deal. As I read through blogs, I keep reading the importance of not trying to fit too much in, and to check out the other spots on your next trip. Quite frankly, I don't travel internationally as often as I'd like. My "next trip" to Italy probably won't be for another 20 years. My wife and I are both healthy and active. So I'm leaning toward what Sandralist said and keeping Cinque Terre on the itinerary. With that said, my wife and are digging deeper into what we want to do at each location to solidify. But the hiking that I've read about at Cinque Terre sounds awesome.

Another concern I have with the recommendation to spend more time in Rome is that, despite the fact that I LOVE history and architecture, I'm nervous about how crowded I've read Rome is. I'm a little claustrophobic in large and dense crowds.

Would you cry if you went to Rome and saw tremendous sights that were NOT the Sistine Chapel and the Vatican Museums? Because other than that, it is hard to feel claustrophobic in Rome. Places like the Forum, the Colosseo and the baths of Caracalla are very capacious. You can time a visit to the Pantheon when it isn't crowded -- and if a tour group walks in, you can duck out, have a coffee, and stick your head back in. The Galleria Borghese controls admissions so it is never too crowded. St Peter's Basilica can hold a small army, and as long as you skip climbing the narrow stairs up into the Dome, your unlikely to feel overwhelmed.

But Vatican museum tours, underground spaces and the Sistine Chapel? That is sardine-can time. And some of the most popular piazza are no so much crowded as they feel like tourist zoos at peak hours -- but there are always much more charming quieter piazze easy to walk to, or a courtyard restaurant.

I'm not sure limiting your time in Rome is the right strategy because it almost dooms you to non-stop 5-star sightseeing, which is always the most crowded places.

I will warn you that Florence and Venice also have their sardine-can spots and not-for-claustrophics tours (the Doge's Palace "secret itinerary" in Venice being one that most claustrophobics avoid. So you will want to do some planning. The streets of Rome are much wider and more open to the sky and distant vistas than the extremely narrow and crowded alleys of Venice, or some of the center of Florence. Not trying to discourage you from going, but just so you can prepare to mix it up as you plan your day.

I totally understand feeling claustrophobic. That's why we didn't see as many villages in Cinque Terre as we did - way to crowded. I had a similar issue with Venice - very narrow, crowded alley- sized walking paths. Awesome when you had a view of the water, but a lot of the time we spent there, we were walking in alley sized walking paths. But totally worth it for us - where else would we get to tour an old living city that is built on stilts in the Adriatic Sea? or walk coastal foot paths to go from one town to another?

The Colosseum and Forum were busy - didn't feel it as much in the Forum - as it was open air, but felt it in the Colosseum.
The Vatican Museum (including Sistine Chapel)- I heard was really busy, described as shoulder to shoulder- during the day, but we had a good time during a Friday Night visit. We bought tickets online, and though busy even at night, not as busy compared to the pictures I had seen for daytime visits. Would I do it again? Definitely!

Also in Rome, there are less traveled sights that we enjoyed very much where we could stretch out and enjoy the moment. Try to see if these will fit into your itinerary - it really helped relax us when we were in Rome.

The first one.

OP - with a little planning you don't have to butt your head against large crowds in Rome. It is possible to avoid them.

You can do an early entry tour to the Vatican Museums, getting you inside before everyone else. I was in the Sistine Chapel recently on one such tour. There were about 15 others inside the Chapel - you could freely walk around, sit on the benches and admire the artwork. Here are some links - the first is the official site for the Vatican Museums - there is early entry/breakfast
http://biglietteriamusei.vatican.va/...action=booking

This is a link for a privately run early entry tour
https://www.walksofitaly.com/vatican...ne-chapel-tour

This link shows the Museum's calendar. If you are in Rome on a Friday night, the Museums are open late from 7-11pm - and you will have the place to yourselves

http://mv.vatican.va/3_EN/pages/z-In...dario2016.html

Same with Venice - you don't have to squeeze past loads of people, in fact take a left or right turn off the path between Rialto and San Marco and it will be just you and the pigeons. Get out early - on first light. You will see no one but the porters with their little carts bringing produce from the markets and fresh linen to the hotels. There is no one around and it is a great time for photos.
The little calles (alleyways) are narrow but as budgettravelwithkids says, where else is there on earth that is built on a series of marshy islands? Venice has its open spaces and piazzas. The seldom visited Jewish Ghetto is a big space with benches and hardly any people, even in the middle of the day. It just takes some research and planning. If you can get a hold of DK Eyewitness' Guide Book 'Top 10 Venice' it will help you locate the open spaces and has some good sightseeing ideas.

Excellent! We'll definitely plan on the early tours.

What are your thoughts on a day trip to Pompeii from Rome? I'd love to see Pompeii.

It's an easy trip to do. You just take the high speed rail to Naples (takes 1 hr 10 minutes). Then after you arrive in Naples, follow the blue signs that say 'Circumvesuviana' - this is the local train to Pompeii. From your high speed train to this local train it is a walk of about three minutes and you don't even leave the building - you walk down some stairs and along a concourse past shops and cafes.
The trip to Pompeii on the CV takes about 50 minutes. It is a local train which can get busy but it very cheap - only 4 euro from Naples to Pompeii.

However - given your aversion to crowds I would suggest another option if you can afford it. Take the same high speed rail to Naples and then have a car/driver service take you to Pompeii and back to Naples. You avoid the crowds on the little local train and it is much more comfortable. The round trip with a two hour wait at Pompeii is around 90 euro.

A way to avoid crowds on the Circumvesuviana train is to travel as early as possible. Try to be at Pompeii on gate opening which is 9am. It takes a bit of planning to co-ordinate the two journeys but it definitely is possible and far preferable to the awful bus tours out of Rome that have you going to coral/cameo factories and awful lunch stops - and take 15 hours out of your day.

Here is the link for Trenitalia to book the high speed rail. As you can see, if you book far enough ahead (120 days) you can get fares for as low as 19 euro one way

http://www.trenitalia.com/tcom-en

Here is the link for the Circumvesuviana local train to Pompeii

http://www.eavsrl.it/web/sites/defau...to_New2015.pdf

Your boarding station is Napoli Garibaldi. You get off at Pompeii S. Villa Misteri. If you can manage the 8.13 express service you'll be in Pompeii by 8.36 - enough time to take the short walk to the ticket office and even have a coffee.

There is another service called the Campania Express which only started running last year but their services are limited. It is an air conditioned train that only stops in Ercolano, Pompeii and Sorrento, is comfortable and uncrowded. It is seasonal and there are no schedules up yet but last year's service only ran three times a day and cost 15 euro for a round trip ticket. Some information is here
http://www.napoliunplugged.com/campa...i-and-sorrento

Thanks so much for everyone's feedback. After discussing with my wife, she pushed for leaving Cinque Terre out for fear of too much travel. So here is my itinerary so far. Please let me know what you think.

• Day 1: Wednesday: Travel
• Day 2: Thursday: Arrive in Rome 8:30
○ Pantheon
○ Heart of Rome Walk
○ East Rome
• Day 3: Friday: Rome
○ Vatican City
§ St. Peter's Cathedral
§ Vatican Museum
○ North Rome
• Day 4: Saturday: Rome
○ Ancient Rome
• Day 5: Sunday: Rome
○ Day trip to Pompeii
• Day 6: Monday: Travel to Florence
○ Duomo & Museum
○ Renaissance Walk
○ Brancacci Chapel
○ Santa Croce Church
○ Santa Maria Novella Church
• Day 7: Tuesday: Florence
○ Uffizi Gallery
○ Bargello
○ Cooking Class
• Day 8: Wednesday: Florence
○ Accademia
○ Fiesole Day Trip
• Day 9: Thursday Florence
○ Tuscany All Day Bike Ride
• Day 10: Friday: Florence
○ Sienna Day Trip
• Day 11: Saturday: Travel to Venice
○ Grand Canal Tour
○ St. Mark's Square and Basilica
○ Baroque Concert
• Day 12: Sunday: Venice
○ Doge's Palace
○ Get Lost
○ Gandola Ride & Evening at St. Mark's Square
• Day 13: Monday: Venice
○ Frari Church
○ Musica a Palazzo
• Day 14: Tuesday: Travel Home

There as some very popular attractions for which you really must reserve well in advance in June or else face long lines trying to see them. So make sure you know which those are.

Otherwise, there is always the possibility of rain in June or just a miserable day of heat wave, either of which might mean that you'd rather be indoors on a day you planned to be outdoors.

I'm not sure you need to plan to "get lost" in Venice. You probably will no matter what. If you enjoy guided tours you might find one for the history of Venice interesting. Many people go and leave without gaining much idea about the peculiar city, and what threats it faces to its survival. It looks like yuo have time to add that to your list of things to do in Venice, so you might consider it.