Well said golf guy. And BTW "professional ladies" were noted prominently in beautiful downtown Honolulu.

Hanging out in my home in Mandeville, or my cousins apartment in Kingston or families homes in Spanish Town, or my brother's house in Portmore or visiting the site where my mothers house is being built in St. Elizabeth in I feel perfectly safe. Thats all the statistic I need.

Jacketwatch and golfguy: thanks very much. That is exactly what I was hoping for in terms of finding a flaw in my reasoning (that Jamaica must be dangerous for tourists if it has a murder rate, even taking Kingston out, four times higher than the U.S.). Namely, I'm sure we WOULD hear about it if tourists were murdered, in any numbers at all (e.g., the poor women who was killed in Anguilla a year or two ago). It must indeed be that the majority of even these non-Kingston murders are associated with the drug trade.

I don't mean to join either "camp" -- I'm intereted in a rational consideration of these safety issues; I don't think I've come across a single one of those in any of these threads, and I hope we can differentiate this one from those others in that way. To that end, I must say that how safe one might or might not "feel" is of little persuasive value. Feeling safe, it needn't even be said, does not mean that one is actually safe.

However, because it must be (or else we'd hear about it) that actual violent crime against tourists is exceedingly rare, I am sufficiently reassured.

I am not sure about statisitcs nor about living there. However, I, along with a group of family and friends, stopped in Jamaica back in January while on a cruise and we all vowed that while we loved the cruise and loved the trip, we would not go back to Jamaica. It is a shme, because the resorts and scenery are beautiful. However, I did not enjoy the street vendors in Ocho Rios and surrounding areas and the locals. They yelled at our bus when we were traveling and cursed us when we passed by their booths without stopping to look at Dunns River Falls. We did a river rafting trip and there were locals squatting on the shores yelling at our guide to come ashore and buy things. Even the guides themselves hounded us and told us about their large family and low paying jobs to get us to buy a carved calabash. There are so many other places that are not so poverty stricken and sad that I would rather visit while on vacation. My idea of a good experience isn't Jamaica. I think that it is a great place to stay on the resort and a great place for the right person who is open to seeing new things just for the experience even if they are not necessarily pleasing. We gave Jamaica a second chance when we returned for the wedding of a friend and only ventured outside the gates of the resort once...

To truckgoddess: (quite a handle BTW!) You gave your opinion and stated why and that is fine. Too bad it happened for you like that but we are all entitled to our opinions. The trouble comes when one has a hidden agenda (smelled out pretty good here BTW) and gives FALSE and skewed reasons to have that opinion prevail. Personally I too was hustled by street vendors in OR tho never cursed and for me it was no big deal. I just said "no thanks," and kept on going. Always seemed to work for me. Of greater concern are the conditions the natives have to endure and the crime that springs from it. For that I can only pray.

Running the gauntlet of higglers in Ochee has never been particularly pleasant -- even more so, now that the new Disneylandesque shopping village at the cruiseship docks has sapped away business from the main craft area intown. Judging Jamaica by this experience however would be like judging the US by a visit to Fort Launderdale, Key West, Myrtleville,S.C. or Vegas...