LUANG PRABANG, continued

As you know, La Residence PV is located a few minutes out of town but shuttle transfer into town is available on demand during the day. In the evening, shuttles are available on an hourly basis, leaving the hotel at 40 minutes past the hour, and returning from town (post office) on the hour until 10 pm. If the shuttles aren't convenient to your schedule, it is easy to get tuk tuks, which we did many times. Tuks tuks come in different sizes. The little ones have a tough time making it up the Phou Vao hill if they have more than one passenger though.

We found old LP to be, as promised, very walkable. Because it is a small peninsula bounded by the Mekong and Nam Khan Rivers, there are pleasingly abundant river views. We loved sitting in a few of the many outdoor cafes on the Mekong side, such as Saffron and The Big Tree (or some such name -- you'll know). The Mekong is broad and fast moving; the view of a less settled far shore is very restful. We also liked strolling on the Nam Khan side and looking over to the less densely developed shore where we often saw children jumping out of trees into the river. Because it was so very hot during our stay (30 July-5 August), cafe breaks were crucial.

As sacreligious as it is to say so in relation to a place like LP, I need to pick up the pace, so I'll reluctantly just skim some highlights. Nothing that we did was so recherche that you cannot read about it elsewhere; do ask any specific questions though and I'll try to be reflective about activities and logistics that interest you.

Note: Current admission fees are at 20,000 to 30,000 kip per entrance; they are inexpensive by western standards, but up from the 5,000 to 10,000 kip of a couple of years ago. A few times, I stood behind groups of young backpackers who were taken aback by the upped fees and who then regrouped off to the side to plan out what was worth doing and what should be skipped. Out of date guidebooks perhaps misled them.

Wat Xieng Thang is a glorious "must." Allow plenty of time to drift, stop, and savor the sim and other buildings, inside and out. Ah, the combination of mosaics and stenciled designs in that black/gold/burgundy palette that some of us find so bewitching... Don't neglect the Funerary Carriage Hall out back.

The Royal Palace Museum should also be on your list. There is so much to say about the phenomenon of "extinguishing" (Rough Guide's word) your monarchy and then opening the palace as a profitable museum, no? It is LP's history as a royal capital that makes it special though so go visit and wrestle with the implications of all this. Note that posted hours are 8:30-11:30 am and 1:30-3:30 pm, but the day we visited, they closed earlier than 11:30, leaving some newly paid-up folks disgruntled. Also, you must check your bag and camera in a locker. No photos are allowed anywhere inside. Persist though: the throne room is dazzlingly spectacular and the personal effects offer some insight into how the royal family lived up until everything changed in 1975.

WHOA...here is the rest of what was in my "preview my reply" window that did not show up in the final posting:

It's an obvious choice, and everyone does it, but I would recommend climbing Mt. Phou Si for the lovely views that you only otherwise get from your airplane window on arrival and departure. We were too lazy to go at sunrise as originally planned. We decided to go after the peak heat of the afternoon and before actual sunset. That way, we enjoyed the view without much company. I was happy to head down again as folks were setting up their tripods to film the setting sun. The available surface area isn't too large so go a bit early if you are committed to staying through sunset. As reported, the climb up is 300+ stairs, much of it in lovely shade.

Wats, wats, wats...about 20 of them. Wander through as you see them open and hospitable.

After you have meandered about on land, the delights of river travel await you.

Next -- you guessed it -- a Mekong River ride up to Pak Ou Caves.

But, out of respect for those who are suffering from the current terrible flooding of the Mekong, I am going to delay this. It is not the time for a light-hearted account of Mekong River travel.

My very first encounter with tamarind (the fruit, not the restaurant)was at the Phou Vao in LP. Once I finally figured out what to do with it, I was hooked. I came back home to find that (without my realising it) tamarind pods have been available at my Whole Foods store all along. The taste dosen't really come close to the PV's but it still brings back fond memories.

Yes, we have the little mud-brown tamarind pods at our Whole Foods as well (a store my husband not so fondly calls "Whole Wallet").

You can also buy tamarind paste there. It keeps for a long time which is good, since I haven't really been sure what to do with it since buying it for an Indian recipe.

I am big on refrigerator atmospherics though -- I keep certain things like Mongolian Fire Oil on hand even though I never use them. It is cheering to open the door and see such exotic foodstuffs on display. Almost as good as planning one's next trip... but not quite.

The Phou Vao currently serves small glasses of iced tamarind juice to guests who are relaxing by the pool.

Marya,
Am still eagerly awaiting the primer on how to buy jade, what to look for etc. Not that jade is on my wish list, but I like to know all the same.

Nywoman,

That will be someone else's pleasure because I alas know nothing about buying jade. I too recall another poster's recent reference to it, but cannot remember whose it was. Perhaps do a search here... Sorry!

LUANG PRABANG, continued

While La Residence PV will arrange a trip to Pak Ou Caves or another outlying area, the price schedule is so out of synch with the local economy that we were not tempted to use their services. Following more good advice from Fodor's, we went down to the Mekong, bargained for a few minutes, walked away, made a connection with four charming young adults from Taiwan also on holiday, and booked a boat together.

It is, as promised, very easy to do. We paid about $10 per person (@ 7 people). The captain and we were all happy with that rate for a good 3 1/2 hours on the river.

I will be blunt. I am not a big fan of the Pak Ou Caves. While not quite prepared to shout that "The Emperor has no Clothes!" I am indeed inclined to murmur that he is in an advanced stage of undress. The experience was nothing like the account of years ago that used hushed, reverential tones. No, no, no. More recent reports intimated that the site had not held up particularly well over the years but still recommended the visit, if only for the boat ride. Amen.

The Buddhas are an even more forlorn looking, dusty lot than I expected. There was nothing spiritual or moving about the experience. Furthermore, three aspects of the visit to the second/upper cave surprised me. Know first that there is a long climb in between the caves which can be an issue in summer heat. Second, there were many people asking for money along that route: children selling small birds (trapped in frightfully small cages) that could be released in order to make merit, and also women with small children begging. Third, although flashlights (5,000 kip or 65 cents)are available to rent on the upper level if you forgot your the past when they were an out-of-the-way curiosity that raised questions about Buddhist devotional practices, but now that they are thronged with tourists and hidden under ever-deeper layers of dust, I'd recommend setting your expectations at a fairly low level. Additional note: ticket-takers charge admission but there is no other tourism infrastructure on-site.

What is so worthy about a trip to the Pak Ou Caves, and may be the secret of that locale's ongoing success, is that it provides a wonderful midpoint around which to organize a boat trip. Let me balance out the cranky grumbling above with unabashed rhapsody about our ride past miles and miles of lush green, undeveloped Mekong riverbank. It was a postcard pretty day yet there were almost no other craft on the river. Heaven. Pure happiness.

We did stop briefly at the lao-lao village where textiles are also sold, but there was nothing to hold our interest. We slipped into an easy rapport with our boatman who worked alone -- nobody else to coax along a cranky engine! -- and who didn't push shopping. It may be my imagination but he seemed to take pleasure not only from the income generated by our trip, but also from how much enthusiasm we felt for that beautiful stretch of his river. That is what I choose to believe.

I would have delightedly returned to the Mekong the next day for a second river journey to the waterfalls but my husband had to balance touring with some work, so we scuttled those plans. Besides, staying on land offered the perfect opportunity to check out the hotel spa.

We met with the young spa director over ginger tea to choose our treatments. My husband was drawn to a traditional 90-minute oil based massage. I was curious about the traditional Lao massage but allowed the director to persuade me that it was of more historic interest than sensual appeal. "For history and tradition, pick Lao; for care of body pick ***," a Hmong-inspired treatment that combined hot compresses with long- and short-stroke massage techniques. (The two treatments were the same price and were both 90 minutes.) We in turn talked my uncertain son into trying a 60-minute facial and shoulders massage designed for men.

Can you hear me sighing? Another heavenly experience, it was. We were both elated and refreshed by the treatments. During the short periods of time that our eyes were open, we marveled at the pampering loveliness of the jewel-box individual pavilions in which treatments are offered.

The paragraph above beginning "The Buddhas..." shed some text on the way to being posted. A version with restored text follows:


The Buddhas are an even more forlorn looking, dusty lot than I expected. There was nothing spiritual or moving about the experience. Furthermore, three aspects of the visit to the second/upper cave surprised me. Know first that there is a long climb in between the caves which can be an issue in summer heat. Second, there were many people asking for money along that route: children selling small birds (trapped in frightfully small cages) that could be released in order to make merit, and also women with small children begging. Third, although flashlights (5,000 kip or 65 cents)are available to rent from enterprising children on the upper level if you forgot your "torch," there isn't much to see on that level. The Caves may have been an intriguing destination in the past when they were an out-of-the-way curiosity that raised questions about Buddhist devotional practices, but now that they are thronged with tourists and hidden under ever-deeper layers of dust, I'd recommend setting your expectations at a fairly low level. Additional note: ticket-takers charge admission but there is no other tourism infrastructure on-site.

Oh, marya, how sad! I loved the Pak Ou caves. A Buddhist pilgrimage site for hundreds of years, there were few other people there when we visited. We had time alone with the silent Budhas in each cave. No beggars, only a lone woman at the upper cave with a table of old flashlights. It was quiet and lovely, and I felt had a brief glimpse of what the trip was like for so many generations of Buddhist pilgrims.

While things are always changing, I feel a real sense of loss when such a spiritual place becomes so degraded.

Even back in '02 I thought the river trip outshone the dusty Buddhas, but there was none of the tourist hassle marya describes. It is so sad to read this report on LP - while I'm glad I got in two visits before it was so fully "discovered", I guess I'll have to move it well down the revisit list.

We were in LP in 2006 in high season and there were no beggars or any other tourist hassles at the Pak Ou Caves. I am not surprised that things have changed so much after hearing stories about tourists' disrespect for the monks during the morning processions.

The purpose of our 2006 trip which also included a visit to Angkor Wat was to get to these places before they became over-touristed. Sounds like we did the right thing. I'm thinking though that we are late to the party for our upcoming trip to northern Vietnam.

now i know my refusal to go to the caves was spot on...K still wants to go...have a nice ride!!

LUANG PRABANG, concluded

I regret providing some disappointing updates about how tourism is escalating in LP. Thanks for not shooting the messenger, a natural human tendency.

This seems to be one of those times that the pace of change is so rapid that you can almost see and feel the flux. I am reminded of how, after spending a couple of weeks in Beijing in the summer of 2004, then returning in the summer of 2005, we were astounded at how much had changed in one year... The pace of change only accelerated in the last stages of the run up to the Olympics, of course.

With only one visit to LP, I cannot authentically comment on change there so even I think you should consider everything I write with the heartiest skepticism. I do feel the gap though between what many of you wrote about years ago and what we experienced in summer 2008. Second, there is a frenzy around many of the sights and activities that suggests a period of economic transition even if one has never sampled what came before.

I still loved visiting LP and would happily have stayed longer. If you have not yet gone, please do. Perhaps they will sort themselves out and learn to be capable stewards of a town so rich in local history.


I would be delighted to go back. The challenge that I would like to better meet on a return visit would be to find more opportunities to transfer our tourism dollars to local people rather than the international investors in upscale properties. I especially enjoyed the connection that we made with our boat captain and the sublimely beautiful few hours that we spent with him on the Mekong. More such experiences would be the goal.

Now, to wrap up comments on this visit...

As you now know, I am no guide to shopping opportunities. We browsed in Caruso’s and Ock Pop Tok for “taste formation.” An Australian woman whom I met on the road had advised a peek into the back room at Caruso’s to see the bed coverings and pillows. Sumptuous indeed but $100 small throw pillows are out of my price range so we just feasted our eyes and moved on. In another smart but less expensive shop we bought (seemingly) lovely silk scarves for all the women in the family not on the trip. They were allegedly woven by local people -- I hope so. On a return visit, I would love to take some of the classes offered by Ock Pop Tok so I could learn more about dying, weaving, fabric quality, and anything that would begin to make me more knowledgeable about textiles. (OPT is foreign run but reportedly works supportively with local weavers.)

The night market is also worth a visit although no special effort is required -- you are unlikely to miss it in such a small town. Wandering through for the first time, we were flabbergasted at how peaceful the ambiance was in comparison to like markets in China and Vietnam. My son bought a number of T-shirts that he is enjoying; the Lao lettering provides a good conversation starter among the teen-aged set.

Since our departure was scheduled on a 2:20 pm flight, I savored my last morning in LP by eating an early breakfast, then heading to my mid-morning Lao steam bath appointment. Note: use of the spa steam bath is complimentary to hotel guests; you just have to book your appointment in advance. In addition to the steam bath, there is a large stroll-around-sized footbath with sandy bottom and a delightful plunge pool. I lazed away the morning there, then readied for our noon checkout.

Our hotel reminded us of the $10 per person departure tax to be collected at the airport, but there was no such tax collected. Our efforts to find the window and pay the tax led to some inadvertent comedy. As there was nobody interested in collecting such a tax, we settled into the little Bangkok Air waiting room and waited for the non-stop, 1 hour and 45-minute flight that would take us to Bangkok in time for dinner.

After our pleasant flight landed in Bangkok, we headed to the AOT desk to secure ground transport since that seemed to be the latest Fodor's advice. The fare for a spacious SUV that easily accomodated the 3 of us and too much luggage was 1150 THB. Since I had been aiming for a fare around 1,000 THB, that seemed ok. I inquired about a discount if we were prepared to book the return trip but was told no RT discounts were available.

Note to first timers: I was briefly disoriented by some touts who interfered with our transferring out to our car. The AOT personnel were complict so that is what threw me off. Here is roughly what happened so that you can sail through such an incident.

We paid at the desk inside and were told to bring our paperwork to AOT personnel just outside the airport door. "Just look for the people wearing the same bright color-shirt we are wearing." We did so, handed over paperwork, got some paper back and proceeded down the sidewalk with our AOT porters. They stopped in front of a woman carrying a clipboard and wearing a plastic name badge on a lanyard around her neck... They handed her some paper and she asked for our receipt. She launched into a spiel about how we "qualified" (early warning sign) for 4 hours of free transportation the next day, etc., etc. I was taken off balance at first and answered her initial questions and engaged in conversation with her. You know what it is like when you are arriving at an airport and negotiating an unfamiliar transfer, watching your luggage, watching to see that your teenager wearing his headphones was keeping up, and so on?...Plus, our two porters were standing at attention waiting for her.

After a couple of minutes, I realized that we were be hitting up. She persisted in her spiel. I interrupted and asked, "Who do you work for?" "I work with him (nodding to the porter)." "Do you work for AOT?" "Yes, we work together." Oh, yeah... I looked at her namebadge and figured out that this was not a legitimate processing out of our AOT reservation. We moved on to our car.

The driver was excellent, the car new and spacious. I was annoyed at the inappropriate detention though. Touts all over the place competing vigorously for your attention are fine; being detained under false pretenses in the middle of executing a transaction with a supposedly reputable vendor is not such a good thing. Just a heads up.

We arrived at the Bangkok Marriott Resort & Spa, a hotel that had been recommended to us by Bob and others on this board three years ago. We spent a very lovely week there in summer 2005, so my husband wanted to go back. We booked a junior suite with club privileges which worked well for the three of us. The first day, after a week at La Residence Phou Vao, the hotel culture felt a bit brash and commercial, but many places would after a small elegant hotel such as La Residence PV. The Marriott's public areas and grounds are exceptionally pretty. I also love the down time on the boat going to and from Saphan Taksin boat pier/Skytrain stop so any criticisms of the hotel's location do not resonate with me since a relaxing 15-minute ride up to the hotels pier puts all of Bangkok at your disposal.

The Marriott was essentially as we remembered it, although the Chinese Restaurant, the Rice Mill, has been replaced by a new Italian restaurant, Brio. Buffet breakfast is still served indoors and out at the Market. Dinner with a show is also served there. Parts of the riverfront terrace are still cordoned off periodically for weddings but, rather than bemoaning that state of affairs, I tend to enjoy seeing the elaborate preparations, particularly the spectacular floral arrangements. There is a Starbucks in the shopping mall out back. Finally, having access to the club room this time enhanced our enjoyment of the hotel.

Some highlights of this last 8 days of our summer trip follow.

how is brio??? it was not yet open when we departed on june 27....we think it will be a big hit....but only if the prices are not outrageous...

marya, I'm glad you had a good experience in LP, sorry it is inevitably changing, but that was beginning even when we were there in 2002.

A couple of (very biased) comments about shopping in LP. Ock Pop Tok was there when we were there. It is run by an American woman who contracts with local weavers to produce fabrics in "colors that Americans and Europeans" would like. I find that a bit offensive, and opted instead to buy hand woven silks from the weavers themselves. Not far outside of LP is a small weaving village with a co-op. Here you could buy hand woven silks from the women who weave them. They are (or were) woven in traditional colors and patterns. The prices were about US$15 for large weavings, the same sizes at Ock Pop Tok were $90-$110. Ock Pop Tok was the only upscale shopping in LP when we were there.

at kathie's suggestion we sought out this out of town co-op and were very glad we did...

while my wife loves things that go with american fashion and home decor, we found many of the things, while accurate to lao standards, would not work for us...no problem...we found many items which were just fine for the american taste and still did not compromise the lao standard...

so we feel that we bought traditional lao things but without some of the bright colors that we did not desire....

marya_ do you still have the email for tamarind cafe?


kathie -- do you happen to remember the name of the co-op village?

thanks!

ared2879:

Caroline Gaylard and Joy Ngueamboupha
[email protected]

more later.