Planning 1st trip to japan. Ideas?
 

We have decided to book a flight to japan for next September using miles before uniteds mileage increase kicks in. This will be our first trip to Asia.
We can be gone as long as 3 weeks. We have no preconception of what to see or where to go.
Hoping you fodorites will be able to suggest an itinerary that will give us a blend of traditional and modern, large and small...etc. in other words, if you were planning a trip for some newbie friends, what would it look like?
we are active 60's and no strangers to independent travel. We tend to be 3* and 4* travelers for accommodations . Thanks

You'll find a wealth of information at japan-guide.com

Also browse this site for destination information, trip reports, planning threads, and so forth.

thanks. will do

Click on my screen name and read a few of my trip reports on Japan to get a few ideas. I can answer in more detail when we return from vacation next week.

Aloha!

HT is quite right, by using the search function and following his and other trip reports you can get an idea of possible itinerary options.
As a rule a first trip would take in Kanto (Tokyo) area , Kansai (Kyoto/ Nara) area with a side trip or two to Nikko or Hiroshima/Miyajima. With three weeks you could add another destination.
Kanazawa, Nagano or a Onsen destination.
A rail pass gives you the freedom to travel the length of the country in relative ease and comfort.
Accommodations range from budget economy chains ( Toyoko Inns) to Onsen ryokans with gourmet meal packages.
These web sites can give you an idea of areas and attractions that might interest you.
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/engli.../archives.html
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/nhkworld/engli.../archives.html
http://www.jnto.go.jp/eng/

Use these with the Japan Guide

Also lately there have been posts of budget in country airfares that might be of use if you wanted to see Hokkaido or Kyushu.
Hope you have a great trip

Thanks to those who responded. And a big Aloha back to Hawaiiantraveler as we plan to visit our Hawaiian niece who is working in Japan at the Jet program.
We have now decided that our trip will be 2-3 weeks (depending on when we can book a mileage trip back home). Arriving Tokyo on or about 10/22/14 as we plan to book tomorrow.
Anyone making plans for a Japan trip in late October to early November? It would be fun to meet up with someone
Next comes the real planning :-)

I suspect you'll want closer to 3 weeks!

The more time the better I agree. Consider flying into Tokyo and out of elsewhere as an open jaw to save time/expense of trains back to Tokyo and maximize the ground you can cover. Do your calculations for JR Pass carefully and keep in mind that sometimes it isn't worthwhile; consider that although a pass allows you to travel "free" during its validity it also may compel you to move more than you otherwise would or should to "get your money's worth."

For hotels, it's easier to recommend based on an amount of money rather than star rating. Even business hotels are almost always clean.

KimJapan raises a valuable point. What variable are you willing to vary - the quality of accommodation or the cost of your trip? If cost is fixed, would you prefer 14 days at the comfort level of your choice, or 21 days but with compromise on comfort to some degree?

Bear in mind that as for real estate in general, the number one determinant of hotel price is location, location, location. Hotels in Osaka, for example, are significantly less on average than hotels in Kyoto, and some people do indeed daytrip into Kyoto from Osaka - but I'd cheerfully stay in a 2 star in Kyoto than a 3 star in Osaka.

So convenience, not just room quality, is a very personal choice, but it will affect a lot of your purchase decisions.

I don't know where you are based, but if you usually connect through Washington Dulles or Chicago O'Hare, also check availability on United's Star Alliance partner ANA. We had to call but we were able to use miles and include a free connecting flight from Osaka to Tokyo as part of our itinerary.

We are flying out of Portland . We have star alliance miles for united and ANA. We also have Alaska miles that allow us to fly delta or American . Based on responses we will do 3 weeks. Last week of October and 1st 2 weeks in November . Some of the flights fly to DFW or O'Hare before heading to japan but all seem to be Tokyo . We are open to what works best as long as we can snag business class for 100k miles R/T
When you say free connecting flight do you mean on a leg in or leg out or an extra flight mid trip?

This will be a big bucket list trip so convenience will be more important than cost
If we fly in to Tokyo and out of somewhere else, what do you recommend?
Last rail pass I had was 1973 eurail pass so it's been awhile but I understand the idea of mapping out the trains vs time in terms of cost effectiveness. My wife prefers more time in fewer places ( more home base locations) but we are experienced travelers in the 2-3-4 kind of overnight trips.

We went last week of October and first week of November this year as you probably already know from reading my trip report. With your 3rd week, you should catch a bit more foliage than we did. Starting in Tokyo and ending in Kyoto might also be a good strategy for you, especially because Kyoto's foliage was the best, even when we were there. If you end in Kyoto, you can fly out of Osaka on ANA and connect with either ANA or perhaps United in Tokyo. Our connecting flight was in economy but it was short - about an hour. There may also be direct flights from KIX, I don't know. If you arrive and depart on Star Alliance flights, you can get a reduced rate on any internal ANA flights you may need.

Thanks. I just checked and we can book an open jaw return from Osaka (ITM) to Tokyo back to west coast on ANA via Star Alliance miles. So maybe we will plan the trip top end in Kyoto. HOw does 5 nights Kyoto sound?

We had just over two weeks and spent 6 nights in Kyoto. There was a lot we didn't see - we didn't make it to Nara, for instance. If I had three weeks, I'd spend at least 7 nights in Kyoto. Kyoto has so much to see and do.

We had 5 nights in Kyoto and found it sufficient for a first trip. As you know, we did the day trip to Nara. I think our pace was reasonable - out by 9 AM give or take, in by 5 PM at the latest. You have 3 weeks, which will allow you to explore more than central Japan...

I spent 4 nights/ 4 full days in Kyoto and 2 nights / 2 full days in Nara. I could easily have spent more time in the area.

>>When you say free connecting flight do you mean on a leg in or leg out or an extra flight mid trip?

It means not mid-trip, i.e. no Japan stopover on a trip to Japan. You can add to the leg in AND/OR the leg out. But, booking a one-way domestic Japan flight costs only 6,000 miles and no taxes.

For example, PDX-SFO-NRT-CTS (Sapporo) outbound. KMQ-NRT-SFO-PDX (KMQ is Komatsu, use for visiting Kanazawa) inbound. Or reverse either of those.

Another option is to fly via Seoul (ICN) on Asiana. Asiana is wonderful in first class and their new business class (Quadra Smartium) looks really nice.

United has nonstops KIX<->SFO.

I avoided that and flew Asiana in F to Seoul then biz class to Osaka (KIX). Leaving from LAX to Osaka made a connection necessary, so choosing Asiana was easy for me. Using Asiana to KIX would add a stop for you (ICN) vs using United SFO-KIX, but Asiana first class is so much better than United Global First that it is well worth considering.

My return was Toyama-ICN-LAX, biz class then first. I would have enjoyed ICN-LAX more if it had been longer, the service, food, seat was that good.

Asiana does not have daily service to some cities in Japan (like Toyama). But daily to Tokyo and Osaka, for sure. I think they have good connections from Hiroshima (HIJ).

I will end my love-fest-with-Asiana post now.

And ANA has that Seattle-Tokyo nonstop which might work for you assuming you mean Portland OR and not ME.

I was the Japan newbie ahead of our first trip last year. We loved it so very much we went back again this year. And we'll certainly go back again, that much is certain.

Our first trip, last year was as follows: We flew into and out of Tokyo and had 17 nights on the ground. Our itinerary was 2 nights Tokyo, 2 nights Takayama (coinciding with the autumn festival), 1 night Nara, 5 nights Kyoto, 1 night Koyasan, 1 night Osaka, 1 night Miyajima and then 4 nights back in Tokyo. This trip was in October.

This worked very well for us.

This year we returned for 19 nights, in late October/ early November. We did a single night in Tokyo, then 6 nights Kyoto, 2 nights Osaka, 2 nights Kumamoto, 2 nights Kurokawa Onsen, 2 nights Yufuin, 2 nights Fukuoka and then a last 2 nights in Tokyo. We had a rental car in Kyushu which we picked up on leaving Kumamoto and returned on arrival into Fukuoka. Driving in Kyushu was one of the biggest pleasures of our time there.

As others have said, don't underestimate how much time Kyoto merits on its own. The same goes for Tokyo too, actually. I think it's better to give yourself plenty of time in these two cities as there is just so very much to see and do.

In Kyoto particularly, I'd suggest 5 nights for Kyoto itself and then additional nights for either day trips or overnights in places like Nara, Koya-san, Osaka... and you can easily do an overnight to Hiroshima/ Miyajima too.

If I were planning a trip for friends who didn't have time to do all the reading and research themselves, I'd suggest an itinerary similar to my first one, perhaps skipping Takayama if their trip didn't coincide with the festival, though it's wonderful place to visit nonetheless, just a bit out of the way from the rest. Then again, train travel is wonderful and the views are one of the pleasures of the holiday.

It's really tempting to squeeze down on time in the two main cities in exchange for fitting in more places but personally I think it's best to give these places their full due and come back for another trip, once they hook you in!

PS Instead of Takayama, I'd suggest trip from Tokyo to either Hakone or Nikko, neither of which I've done yet but will do next time!

Just a quick note for you, feibleman...while in Kyoto, think about visiting the I.M. Pei, Miho Museum...an experience to savor. It's 15-minutes by train to a connecting bus for a forty minute drive through the countryside, to a mind-boggling location, surrounded by forests. You can be back in Kyoto by 3-4.(See pics below)

stu tower

https://picasaweb.google.com/stuartt...ihoMuseumIMPei


You will find plenty to see and do in Kyoto during a 5-6 day stay. Most enjoyable.

Just booked the flight over. Used Alaska airline miles to fly American. They had a 50,000 mile one way in First class...so why not. So arriving on Thursday 10/23/14. Part 1 is done. Yay

Now have to make ther big decision of 2 vs 3 weeks. Can't book return yet anyway so there is time to review all of what y'all have said. But everyone keeps telling me that I do not know "expensive" until I get to Japan. Is it comparable to Manhatten?

Thanks for all the thoughts. Keep them coming.
PS. anyone planning a trip around the same time?

Thanks Kavey - your sample itinerary gives us some great thoughts about places and timing. Seems like we would not regret 6-7 days Kyoto

IME, there are ways to keep the costs of traveling in Japan down. Stay in inexpensive accommodations, with maybe just one or two "splurge" nights to experience a ryokan or temple stay. One can certainly eat affordably. (There again, you might plan a splurge or two so you can experience kaiseki cuisine.) I thought it much easier to keep the costs affordable than a trip to Manhattan (or Switzerland, for that matter!)

Kja - Having been to Zermatt 4 times, that is a good reference that I can relate to. How does one judge accommodations? Is trip advisor a good resource?

As to budget, I think I have just discovered that I will be spending for some nicer accomodations as I just realized that we will be there on my wife's 65th birthday. NOw I know what my gift is :-)

Tower - Thanks I will write that down

We will fly in to Tokyo but out of Kyoto so Whatever time we have in Tokyo will be in the beginning (in October) and Kyoto time will be at the end (in November).

On the rail pass, is it only 7-14-21 days or is there midway number? If we started with 4 nights in Tokyo, then began train time and ended up with 6 nights in Kyoto it would seem like a 10 day ticket would be just right. But if only 7-14-21 then I guess 14 day?

People talk about Nara. Should that be before Kyoto or in the middle? Depending on how long it takes to get somewhere on a day trip from Kyoto, My wife prefers to not have to repack her bags if it can be helped so the more I have a number of home bases along the way the better. But I also hear Kyoto is very expensive in NOvember so maybe a few nights elsewhere before we end there is best. I figure we might do a Ryokan for 2 nights (advice- same or different ones is best?). Any suggestions as to where we should schedule those? I have been told that some of the nicer ones book a year in advance for NOvember.

Anyway, enough questions for this post

The other thing I have heard from my Japanese neighbor is that the

For hotels, I find trip advisor useful (especially when themes are repeated) and I also use booking.com Just remember not to believe everything you read!

For a ryokan, check out japaneseguesthouses.com The only ryokan I stayed at was one of the most affordable ones -- Momiji-so on lovely Miyajima.

I also did a temple stay on Koyasan and highly recommend Shojoshin-in.

I was glad to spend 2 nights in Nara, as I found a great deal to do there that I enjoyed. That said, many people visit it as a day trip from Kyoto.

For information about transportation, rail passes, and basically anything you want to know, I will again send you to japan-guide.com Seriously -- please check it out. :-)

For our trip the rail pass was not cost effective, so do add up what your rail costs will be without the pass and compare to the price of the pass.

Also, if you have any hotel points, Japan is the place to use them. We got the Hyatt credit cards with gave us 2 free nights anywhere in the world and I had a bunch of Hyatt points, so our 6 night stay in Kyoto was free. It's hard to beat free!

we are going to get two hyatt cards and use them for either Tokyo or Kyoto based on comments here.

NOw that there is a start date, I am seriously reading up and have tentative plan for 20 nights in Japan starting with 4 in Tokyo and ending with 6 in Kyoto plus possibly 2 pre-Kyoto nights for Nara. Pretty sweet that by mere luck I will be in Kyoto for my Wife's 65th so those will defineitly be the upscale Ryokan nights

>>But if only 7-14-21 then I guess 14 day?

That is a good guess, at this point, for budgeting. It depends on what you do with the rest of your time in Japan. There are other rail passes and discounts (or no pass) that might work better for you, as well as special domestic air fares for foreign tourists.

The Kyushu Basho, the grand sumo tournament in Fukuoka, is scheduled for November 9 to 23, 2014. You would be in Kyoto at that time with your current plan.

Thanks for the Sumo tip. I see That is on the Island south of Hiroshima so it would require some rethinking but time for seeing if I can make that happen. I suppose I could break Kyoto in to two parts to make that work. Let's see, take my wife to Sumo for her 65th or take her to Kyoto for her 65th hmmm? Sumo probably a better story:-)

You could move up your Kyoto stay, tho having it at the end is a good idea.

The Sanyo Area Pass is an option as it gets you to Fukuoka, Hiroshima & Miyajima, Himeji, Okayama, etc:
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2361_04.html

Like kja, I also enjoyed Momijiso ryokan as a ryokan experience without a huge price.

That splurge ryokan does not, of course, have to be in Kyoto. There are many options elsewhere. I have read about a very highly regarded ryokan in/near Yufuin, for example.

Another pass option is: http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2361_07.html

So you could by a shinkansen ticket Tokyo-Kyoto for about 13,000. Visit Kyoto, then use one of those passes. Visit Himeji (if the castle is open by then) then stay in Hiroshima/Miyajima, go on to Fukuoka. Day trip to Beppu or overnight in Yufuin. Fly home from Fukuoka.

Regarding the JR Pass, you don't really need it while you're IN Tokyo unless you're taking day trips on trains to other destinations (such as Nikka or Hakone).

You can get a SUICA card to load money onto and use for local subway and local trains (and it works for Tokyo, Kyoto and elsewhere in Japan as well).

Use Hyperdia.com to work out costs of your main train journeys on various dates and then see if you can work out the 7 or 14 or 21 day pass to bring cost down.

On our first trip the pass was very worthwhile, on the second trip not at all given the reduction in number of train journeys and how far apart the main two were in days.

In Kyoto, for a special ryokan stay, I can recommend Shiraume - http://www.kaveyeats.com/2013/03/her...n-me-into.html which I booked directly via their website. In Nara, we loved Kankaso, which I booked with Japaneseguesthouses.com http://www.kaveyeats.com/2013/01/kai...o-in-nara.html

I think 6 nights in Kyoto is great - you have plenty to do in the city itself and there are lots of day trips you can take too, if you want to do even more.

I would say that Koya-san is probably not worthwhile as a day trip, but that's just my feeling. We did that as an overnight ourselves, so haven't experienced it as a day trip. But the point for us was the temple stay as part of the experience.

Mr. Wunrful..thanks for the mere mention of BEPPU..always brings a flood of memories for me as a rifle-toting 17-18 year-old back in 1946...a bombed out former kamikaze base back then...now one of the most popular onsen destinations in the country (I re-visited amidst local fanfare in 2007).
stu

gfeibleman - I'd nail down your itinerary a little further before considering what JR pass to get. You may find a combination of pass and separate tickets work best.

I'll give you our itinerary, although you have more time than us overall:
Kyoto - 5 nights (could easily have done 6 nights, and that is without Nara.) We passed on Nara our first trip - it sounds worthwhile, but we didn't want to 'temple out.'
Takayama - 2 nights;
Nagoya - 2 nights (great science museum, nearby hike)
Okayama - 2 nights (base for a cycling trip, or we could have daytripped to Hiroshima if it poured)
Tokyo - 3 nights plus a late night flight out made it virtually 4 nights. Could still have added a night easily.

Also worthwhile - Kanazawa - sounded lovely, but we had but 14 nights and didn't want to lose time in the other places.

Point being, had we expanded our trip to include Kanazawa and more time in Tokyo, we'd be up to 18 or 19 nights easily. So 21 nights gives you maybe one more destination - perhaps Hakone?

Sorry for the silence this weekend. Booked the return flight for 11/10/14 so now the dates and time are set. Arrive Tokyo at 4:15 pm on 10/23 and depart Osaka on 11/10 at 2:30pm so neither day is much of a tour day. 20 days gone but only 18 nights and 17 full days in Japan. So that is what I will be working with in planning this trip.

I was looking at Sue's sample itinerary in reverse but realized that we really want to spend time in Hiroshima as part of our trip.

Does any one have a preference of day trip to Hiroshima but stay in Miyajama or the reverse?

Our first itinerary (above) was 17 nights, and did include Hiroshima though we were only there a few hours, with a wonderful overnight in Miyajima. That was perfect for us.

Stay in Miyajima!

I stayed in Hotel Granvia in Hiroshima and made day-trip to Miyajima, and felt just as happy. Hotel Granvia (booked via booking.com) was not only convenient but also mighty comfortable. I know Shelleyk commented that her room at Hotel Granvia was small, but I don't recall feeling my double room was small at all.

Although i felt my room was small, I would stay at the Granvia again. I agree with Reading54's comment about the convenience of the hotel if one wants to visit Hiroshima and Miyajima as a day trip, as we did.

I was a walk-in at the Hiroshima Granvia and negotiated the rate down a bit. Very basic room, extremely convenient to the shinkansen side of the station.

The Sheraton Hiroshima was a great deal on SPG cash&points. Nice, large, corner room with a bird's eye view of the station. Only 3 minutes less convenient than Granvia.

The Rihga Royal is a good choice for staying in the city. Both times had nice views over the park and Hiroshiima castle (which I did not visit those times). Terrific rates using their translated Japanese webpage. Short walk to the baseball park, Genbaku Dome, and the covered shopping street. From the station take a streetcar and then walk a couple of blocks (above ground or via an underground mall). Or taxi.

One fodors poster had a good plan which involved taking a boat (nnt the ferry) back, late afternoon, from Miyajima and then a short walk to a Hiroshima hotel. IIRC, the boat stopped there before going to the main port, and the location was convenient to a streetcar for getting to the station. Would have liked to have seen a trip report on that. You might be able to figure out the details of such a plan using the Hiroshima & Miyajima guide here: www.jnto.go.jp/eng/location/rtg/