Photography Trip to Vietnam
 

I'm planning a trip for my husband and myself (65) to focus on cultural experiences and mostly photography. I'm reading lots of reports and still at a loss as to how best to organize our days and how many days to take. (We are saving $ to take our granddaughter and possibly daughter, etc., on an African safari next year, so want to keep our costs low on this one.) I know for sure we want to visit Hanoi, Sapa and the Bac Ha Market, maybe Mai Chau, Halong Bay, Hoi An, Siem Riep..... Not as sure about Hue and Saigon. I am thinking I could talk my husband into 14 days (we both still work). Does that sound reasonable for time? How to allocate days the best? I will probably work through Tonkin Travel.

No, that sounds like too much. You need at least three days (four nights) for Siem Reap, and I would say at least the same for Hanoi. Sapa takes a minimum of three nights, since you take a night train in each direction, and really four makes more sense. Equally, you need at least one night on the boat on Halong Bay. Either stick to Vietnam, or northern Vietnam (Hanoi plus Sapa and Halong Bay) plus Siem Reap.

I worked with Tonkin Travel for my last visit to Vietnam, since I was booking for Sapa from the road, but aside perhaps for Sapa it is very easy to travel in Vietnam on your own.

Thanks, Thursdaysd! So how much time would you allow for all of that? And did you book your hotels yourself ahead of time?

Maybe I could add a couple of days. I don't have the tickets yet.

I've been to Vietnam three times. The first two times I mostly booked a day or two ahead, or on arrival, the third time Tonkin Travel booked for me, but I only went to Sapa and Hanoi.

My first trip to SEA was three months (http://wilhelmswords.com/asia2002/ ), doesn't sound like you have that kind of time. With only two weeks you're better off sticking to one country (don't forget you'll need to recover from jet lag at the begining).

No, thursdaysd, we don't have that kind of time! :-( I'm working on what would work and my husband did agree that we could take a couple of extra days. We have had great luck (for 25 years) with the anti-jet lag diet, so that helps also. I'll post a better idea in a day or two.

I agree with thursdays, this is way too much to pack in. I would suggest sticking to vietnam, mostly the North which is rich in photographic material both urban and rural. Hanoi, and Sapa are great and worth combining these two into a week. If you are feeling adventurous, then return to Hanoi via the Dien Bien Phu loop and the Mai Chau valley ( a truly magical place for a photographer!)

After that, a round trip to Siem Reap would take at least 4 days to make it worthwhile. I have to say that it was a photographers dream the first time i visited in 2002 the sites were uncrowded and peaceful. Getting to Angkor at dawn was special with only 20 people there. In 2007 there were closer to 500 and photography was very difficult with people just jumping in front of others to get the best shot as dawn broke. That said, we found a great tuk tuk driver who was adept at getting us to temple at the right time.

We stayed at http://www.peaceofangkor.com/ in SR and the owner runs photographic tours. We didn't use him but he seemed knowledgeable and he had some great shots to show us.

Thanks Crellston! You are making me give very serious thought to eliminating Siem Riep. As soon as I get a few hours free, I will try to plan this out a bit better and then post those ideas. I'll check your link, too!

Please do reconsider SR. The first time I went I had three nights - sunset and two full days. It just wasn't enough, and I had to go back for another five nights. There are people who get templed out, but if you have any real interest in the temples, if you pace yourselves, and if you visit some of the less well-known places you shouldn't be among them.

Then (as you'll know if you've read my 2002 screed), there is a lot more to Cambodia than SR, and it's a real shame people just fly in and out and skip the rest of the country. As SR has gotten more and more crowded (so I hear, haven't been back since 2004), all the more reason to go elsewhere as well.

So thursdaysd, I am assuming you would vote to eliminate going to Hoi An and add some days for Cambodia?

While hoi an is picturesque and fun to spend a few days in, if you don't have time to include hue, which is perhaps even more interesting, I would skip it and go directly from Hanoi to siem reap. Besides the temples, be sure to take a boat tour out to tonle sap lake where you will see the Vietnamese boat people living. We spent a 1/2 day wandering around the outskirts of town where we got terrific pictures of the people living along the river. Whatever you do will be wonderful.

I still think you should stick to one country, but if you're going to do SR do try to spend more time in Cambodia. I thought Hoi An was over-hyped and over-touristed (and that was nearly ten years ago). The ruins at My Son are worth seeing if you're in that area, and there are some nice buildings in Hoi An, but unless you really need some new clothes made I would skip it on a short trip.

I agree with thursday on Hoi An. It was our least favorite city of our trip to Southeast Asia.

Wow, okay, that is pretty confirmation. And would save time to focus north and I definitely think we could get to Siem Riep. Maybe we will have to add even more time? I need to lay it out day by day.

I need to lay it out day to day. Exactly. Print off the right month from one of the free online calendars, write in where you plan to sleep each day. Then look into how long it takes to get from A to B and add that.

Sometimes the simplest things help the most. Just got home from work, read this and printed out a calendar that I can make guesses on! Thanks thursday. And thanks Marija, dgunbug, and crellston!!

crellston, So I am looking in my lonely planet and am not quite sure. "If you are feeling adventurous, then return to Hanoi via the Dien Bien Phu loop and the Mai Chau valley ( a truly magical place for a photographer!)" How would we do this? The logistics? So I can figure out the timing etc.

When we went to Mai Chau, it was one of the rare occasions we used a tour operator as we were short on time. We used Topas , a Scandinavian - Vietnamese operation who booked it all for us. We got the night train from Hanoi to Sapa, spent a couple of days trekking there and picked up our driver guide who drove us for the next 5 days around the "Dien Bien Phu Loop" following pretty much this route :
http://www.travelfish.org/trip_plann...-bien-phu-loop

The scenery is spectacular along the way and not many travel this route which is nice. Some nice villages and towns to vist along the way.

Mai Chau we hadn't planned to visit but for some reason we changed our plans and were really glad we did. The valley was so peaceful and staying in a local homestay was great fun ( although sleeping on a mattress on the floor is not everyone's cup of tea! Walking along the valley in the dawn mist through to the next village and beingbinvited in for tea with the family was an experience that still sticks in my mind even now. That was 7 years ago and I think there are probably a few more accomodation options now.

Mai Chau is only a half days drive from Hanoi so it is easy to do a side trip of an overnight or a couple of days if you weren't interested in Sapa. This could easily be sorted out on arrival in one of the agencies in the old quarter. Here is a link to some unedited photos on our blog which may give a flavour of the loop, Sapa and Mai Chau.

http://blog.travelpod.com/travel-blo...ai/3/tpod.html

I think we did Sapa, the DBP loop and Mai Chau in about 8 days although you could do it in less. Don't stint on Hanoi though as it is a very photo rich environment. So many places so little time.......

Thank you crellston! I so appreciate your description. This weekend I plan to lay out the trip we have time for. Also very much appreciated your links to your photos. Helps give a good idea of what to expect.

So this weekend I made some changes and got more information. Now my husband says maybe even 18 days is ok! Yay! I'm going to try to redeem miles for tickets tomorrow and whatever is available in Sept.-October will determine a lot. But now I am thinking of something like this:
Hanoi 3 nights
Sapa 4 nights
Hanoi to Ha Long Bay (long day or maybe overnight on a boat)
Hanoi to Siem Riep 3-4 nights?
Siem Riep to Danang for Hoi An 2 nights
Hanoi for the rest of the time.

I will post some hotel ideas I have gleaned from the trip reports here and LP--later on. Plan to work with Tonkin after we have airline tickets.

I'm guessing most of you will say that is too much? But I want to see it all! What do you think? Doesn't have to be in that order. I will just have to work around Sapa for the Sunday market at Bac Ha.
I'm open! Thanks in advance.

And we are in pretty good shape-good energy--work out a lot and are both still working, so should be able to handle the pace.

No point in the long trip to/from Halong Bay unless you overight, preferably on the water. You do realize you will need a multiple entry visa for Vietnam with that itinerary? Thought you were skipping Hoi An?

How about going to Luang Prabang instead of Hoi An? Direct flight from Siem Reap. Handsome, colorful monks make for great photos.

Oh wow! Had not thought of these options. thursdaysd I just talked to a friend who went to V last year and just did a 4 hour private boat deal at Halong Bay and loved it, then drove back. And no, I did not think about a multiple entry visa for Vietnam. This is why I love this forum!!! Thank you so much for that alert. I was skipping Hoi An, but actually I really want to go there if possible.
Marija, I will check into that. Would love to visit Laos. Didn't even think about a very short trip. THANKS!!!

If you are going to Siem Reap, rather than just staying in Viet Nam, then Luang Prabang makes sense. And I say this as a Hoi An booster. LP is a good place to chill after intense templing, and will, as Marija says, provide great photo fodder. It will also give you a good sense of the diversity of the region. But this plays against your idea of keeping costs down--sticking to Viet Nam would be cheaper!

I still think sticking to one country, even with 18 days, makes more sense in terms of cost, both monetary and time lost on planes\ airports etc. a day moving from one place to another is more or less a day lost. This can be mitigated in some places by exciting means of travel. E.g the train ride from Danang to Hue ( for Hoi An) is one onpf the most scenic I have experienced.

Luang Prabang is great as is Siem Reap but both are now, understandably, very busy with other tourists. If photography is the main purpose of your trip then both places offer endless opps but you will have to work hard to avoid the crowds, particularly at SR.

I don't really want to add to your options, but here is a link to a group tour operator with loads of experience in the region

Pressed too soon!!

http://www.intrepidtravel.com/search/trip/Vietnam%2520 they have a wide variety of different trips in the region with tried and tested itineraries. If you click on a trip then that will bring up more detail and the options on the right hand side to look at detailed itneraries and very detailed trip notes. These will provide some insight into the logistics of getting around. NB I am not suggesting you use them, although some friends raved over them when they booked a private tour with them. Tonkin may have something similar but it always helps to go pre armed with specific ideas.

One final thought, have you considered an "open jaw" ticket say into Hanoi and out of perhaps Saigon or Bangkok - could reduce the cost of internal flights? Just a thought!

Thanks crellston and Friendship_Bay. I have a lot to think about. I'm so afraid we won't be back to this area, so want to get variety and LP is an interesting idea. (We haven't been here since Myanmar in 2011 and India in 2010.) I'll read up on LP and the Intrepid site looks like it will give me some ideas also. And so today as I look into tickets, I'll think about an open jaw ticket. A lot depends on what is available for miles and I am guessing it is pretty limited this close to the depart date. I'm off to the gym now.

Again thanks crellston! I am trying right now to book award tickets and found them to Hanoi from LAX and from Cambodia back to LAX which will save some hassle and time and money! Unfortunately I needed to transfer a few thousand miles from my husband's account and that is taking some time. Looks like we would fly both Thai Air and Asiana, going economy and returning business. Hopefully!

You are very welcome pattyroth. I hope you get it sorted!

Yay! I got the tickets late last night. Unfortunately we arrive in Hanoi on a Friday night which means we'll have to catch the train the following day to Sapa to make the Sunday market. But that will work. Flying out of Phnom Penh sets part of the rest of the itinerary for us, but also simplifies things (thanks again crellston) Anyone ever hear of the Angel Palace Hotel? Young friends of ours stayed there in Hanoi and said it was nice and cheap. Can't wait to find time to work out the rest of the details.

So far it looks like Hanoi for one night, then the train to Sapa for two nights there and the train back, then possibly Halong Bay (still not sure if this is worth it--but think it is), then fly to Danang for Hoi An two days and then fly to Siem Riep for the rest of the time. Still up in the air how much time to spend in Siem Riep and whether to take a day or two to drive and trek from Hanoi. Or if we should venture out from Siem Riep (probably) to another part of Cambodia. What are your thoughts on the importance of Halong Bay????

Great result pattyroth!

Re the importance of Ha long Bay. It is purely my subjective view, but for me, it was not worth the time and effort of getting there. Undoubtedly nice seascapes if you are into that but with limited time, I would be prioritising other places in preference to Ha long. Maybe it is just me as other have loved it. It was a long time ago, but even then, the pestering by touts got to be a real pain, maybe you would be insulated from this on an upmarket tour? There is quieter alternative to Ha long nearby, but the name escapes me. Maybe if you google 'alternative to Halong,' you will find something.

I would definitely take some time to trek from Hanoi in the Mai Chau valley and, if you have the time, there is a great day trek around the Sapa valley.

How much time to spend in SR really depends upon how much you are into temples. Most people just visit in the mornings ( with maybe a return trip late pm) because of the heat and so it take around 3 full days to see the major sites and another if you want to venture further afield to the outlying sites. A trip out to Tonle Sap lake will take a half day, perhaps after the temples.

I agree that whether Halong Bay is worth the time depends on how keen you are on scenery. I had no trouble with touts there in 2004, although I did encounter them at an alternative venue nearby - Tam Coc. Since you are captive on a small boat at Tam Coc, it's very annoying.

WRT Angkor, the first time I was there for three nights - a sunset and two full days, and that wasn't enough for me. I went back later for another four nights. Reading Dawn Rooney's guide should give you a good idea of what's there and how interested you are.

While I enjoyed Halong Bay I was on a pretty leisurely trip, and if I were pressed for time I would rate Angkor, and Hanoi itself, above Halong Bay.

My contribution isn't meaningful but I will make it anyway. I was glad to have seen Halong Bay last winter as part of a cruise from HK to Singapore. It was one of the highlights, even on a grey January day (maybe that added to the atmosphere). But because we were on the coast, and on water anyway, it was no effort. I don't need to go back, and wouldn't trade it off against Hanoi or villages along the Mekong.

Thanks thursdaysd, Friendship _Bay and crellston. Right now I am leaning towards an itinerary like this:
Arrive Hanoi, 1 night
Overnight to Sapa and see Bac Ha Market in the morning
2 nights Sapa
Overnight train back to Hanoi
Hanoi 2-4 nights, possibly including some trekking 1-2 days by Mai Chau
Fly to Danang for Hoi An for two nights
Danang to Siem Riep for 4 nights and then home.

That cuts out Halong Bay, but allows for flexibility to trek if we want to and thus see villages. Obviously if we go to Mai Chau, we'd have the 4 nights in Hanoi. We probably will get templed out in Siem Riep but like the idea of venturing into the countryside if we do. (we have been to Bagan in Myanmar.)
This isn't anything like my original plans, but seems reasonable? I am open!

Looking good pattyroth! My only concern is jumping on the train the day after arriving in Hanoi. The train is a great experience but we found it very difficult to sleep, mainly because the ride was jolting us around all night. That said, if you are arriving from the US, you will probably be tired enough to sleep through anything!!

Travelfish has some good info on less visited sites around Tonle Sap - I think this is the place we spent a morning at http://www.travelfish.org/sight_prof.../siem_reap/795

Thanks again crellston! I had never used travelfish before. This village area sounds interesting. As you can see, you have influenced our plans!! Love this forum.

The reason we are going so quickly to Sapa after arrival has to do with the best dates we could get award mile tickets. Not ideal, but I think we'll be able to sleep at least some. Don't want to miss the Bac Ha Market.

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