narrow down destinations, Japan 2 weeks in April
 

First time in Japan for two relatively seasoned travelers in early 30s.

Flying direct into Haneda airport return. Will be spending some time in Kyoto, Tokyo obviously. Want to see Moya-san.

Thinking of adding one more side-trip: Nara, Takayama/Alps region, Hiroshima

Are main interests are food, culture. Would also like to visit an onsen but not essential. Like hiking and mountains etc but not sure if Japan's alps are as unique to the tourists as food/culture is?

Which one of those destinations would you add the our trip? Or are the first 3 'enough'?

It really depends on your interests, as all are well worth seeing IMO.

Nara is easily visited as a day trip from Kyoto (although I was glad to spend a couple of nights there), so you can easily include it by ensuring that your time in Kyoto is sufficient. I think many of us found about 6 days right for the two (Kyoto plus Nara).
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2165.html

If you are going to go to Takayama, you might want to consider including Kanazawa, too. As a rough guide, I'd suggest that those two cities together are best seen with about 4 or 5 days. BTW, I didn't think of my time there as a chance to see the Japanese Alps, though I greatly appreciated seeing them in the distance.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e5900.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e5950.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2167.html

Hiroshima is an incredibly powerful place that I am very glad to have visited. Only you can decide if that is something you want to experience. If you do go, consider pairing it with Miyajima and perhaps staying there. As a rule, one or two nights should be sufficient, depending on how you time the travel.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e2160.html
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e3401.html

BTW, can we assume that you mean Koya-san? From what I've read, the actual temple one selects can make a huge difference to the experience. I thoroughly enjoyed my night at Shojoshin-in:
http://www.japaneseguesthouses.com/r...n=Shojoshin-in

And I'm not sure I understand your flights. If you haven't already booked, consider flying into Tokyo and out of Kansai or vice versa.

Hope that helps!

When in April and for how long?

Yes Koya-san sorry.

Was looking at the open jaw but it just ended up giving me long connections and a more expensive ticket. The direct Vancouver--> Haneda airport seemed to make more sense (already booked)

It is the first two weeks of April (14 days)

Sounds like they will all be interesting in their own way. I will have to take another look at them all and sort it out.

We were planning on getting a rail pass. I almost always rent cars on vacation to speed things up. So we don't want to try and do too much this time.

I think you will find the Japanese rails <U>extremely</U> efficient.

I think knowing how long you've got (how many nights) and which airport(s) you're flying in/ out of would help...

If you're considering Kanazawa, the logistics of getting there will be a lot easier when your trip comes around. In March, Shinkansen (bullet train) service will begin between Tokyo and Kanazawa -- the trip that now takes at least 4 hours and 1 connection will be cut to 2-1/2 hours, with no connection.

Just saw Haneda airport, sorry, missed that.
How many nights do you have on the ground?

For a first trip, I found the hardest was to narrow down to a realistic itinerary, so I didn't rush the places we did see, and try to pack to much in. There's so much I wanted to do!

For our first trip (17 nights) we settled on 6 nights in Tokyo (split between start/ end of trip), 2 nights Takayama, 1 night Nara, 5 nights Kyoto, 1 night Osaka, 1 night Koya-san and 1 night Miyiajima (after a morning spent in Hiroshima).

On the second trip we spent another week in Kyoto area and 8 days in Kyushu, plus a couple in Tokyo as our airmile flights had us in and out of Narita. Kansai would have been easier.

Kyushu is a great option for onsen, and lovely for self-drive too but many visitors use public transport if driving doesn't appeal.

Kansai region has so much to offer, you could spend 2-3 weeks just in that area and not feel short-changed.

For an early April trip you can scratch Takayama because of weather. Spring will have arrived at lower altitudes and further south. IME, early April would not be one of the better times to visit Takayama/Alps.

There is unique food/culture/onsen in that region and if your trip was late April I would have a hard time knocking it.

You have received some great advice so far, and from the same Fodorites that advised us on our first Japan trip, so I would trust it. We went last May and our itinerary was as follows:

4 nights Tokyo (with a day trip to Nikko)
1 night Hakone
2 nights Takayama
1 night Nara (you can do as a day trip from Kyoto)
1 night Koya-san (Followed kja's advice for temple-stay. It was perfection...best 24 hours of the trip!)
4 nights Kyoto

I was very happy with our itinerary for the amount of time allotted. We loved Takayama and were very happy we went there, and I don't think it would have been terribly diminished if we had gone in April, so long as you are prepared for the colder temps. See my trip report for more details.

We are going back again this April, the same dates you will be there. Our itinerary this time will include Tokyo and Kyoto again, but picking up Miyajima, Kanazawa, Yudanaka (monkeys and onsen...not at the same time) and Matsumoto (and points along the way) that we had to cut out the first time.

Depending on your interests, and your tolerance for long train rides (I find them relaxing), some mix of Tokyo, Kyoto, Koya-san and one more of the suggested destinations and you can't go very wrong. Have fun!

@ russ_in_LA -- thanks! :-)

IMO for a first time visit I'd ditch the idea of renting a car and stick with the trains which are amazing. Flying in and out of the same airport allows you to get good value from a JR pass and really, from Tokyo to Kyoto or vv is only a couple of hours so hardly a huge timesaver.

The itineraries mentioned above sound great and you can't go wrong with anything really. From both Kyoto and Tokyo you can easily do day trips - I even did a day trip from Kyoto to Okayama once just to visit the castle and garden, also saw Kuroshiki and was back in Kyoto for dinner. I believe in getting value from a JR pass, love riding the trains and seeing much of Japan through the window. And the feet get a rest from walking, walking,
walking.

You could visit Nara to/from Koya-san though it takes the best part of a day getting there and the same again coming back.

My suggestions, assuming you're not following sakura would be three days Tokyo (Yokohama and Kamakura for day trips if you like), Kyoto for about five nights. Many options for day trips but plenty in Kyoto to fill the time. Keep it flexible depending on weather, energy levels, that "temple-out" feeling.

Your night in Koya san (one night plenty IMO). You could fit in a couple of nights in Hakone for your onsen experience. The rest of the time in Tokyo with possible day trip to Nikko.

Whatever you do, chances are high you'll be back to see more.

It certainly possible to visit all 6 of the destinations in the OP in 10 days. I don't recommend it. A couple of fodorites have enjoyed visiting Hiroshima as a day trip from Kyoto.

The only opportunity to drive given the itinerary options in the OP would be out and about around Takayama. Not for sightseeing in Takayama but for going to nearby places like Shirakawago or Gokayama or Hirayu Onsen which otherwise would be by bus.

so after running it by wife, leaning towards adding Hiroshima + Miyajima, doing Nara as a side trip from Kyoto, saving Alpine region for another trip.

So it would look something like this
Tokyo 3 nights
Kyoto 5 nights (including day trip to Nara)
Koya-San 1 night
Miyajima + Hiroshima 1 night
Tokyo 2 nights

3 nights missing still...

for onsen should we do Hakone, or take a trip up to Kinosaki for 1 night from Kyoto? Not sure which would be better in early April?

Can you put all of your time in Tokyo in one block to save on a change of hotels? Also, although it really depends on one interests, you might want to shift one day from Tokyo to Kyoto. OR plan on a night in Nikko.

Would you recommend doing Tokyo in 1 block even though we are flying into + out of there?

As in will we be comfortable taking train from Kyoto or Hiroshima area and straight to airport for flight home?

I was going to answer your previous post....but as far as going to Haneda I guess it depends on your flight departure time...personally I do like to spend my last night, at least, in Tokyo, or Hakone would work as that is fairly close....

Concerning your latest itinerary, the trip to and from Hiroshima is about four hours and that is using the Nozomi train which you can't use with a JR pass....I don't think you are giving yourselves enough time in Hiroshima and Miyajima. You could consider an inn in Miyajima for at least one night imo.

I did the trip from Miyajima to Koyasan and then Koyasan to Tokyo so I know from experience how long it takes. ;-)

And btw, at that time of year Kyoto is very crowded so you should start reserving hotels soon, very soon....

If you are flying into and out of Tokyo, I would put all my time in Tokyo at the END if possible. You're likely to be tired when you get there no matter what you do, so consider going straight on to a first non-Tokyo destination and then getting a good rest. But maybe that wouldn't work for you. It's just a thought.

I agree with kja....

If you are on the ANA flight that comes in at 1:45 pm, then you will have loads of time to go to Kyoto, for example.

I have gone straight to Kyoto from NRT a few times and my flight from JFK is longer.... ;-)

On our first trip we had 2 nights in Tokyo at the beginning and 4 at the end and we simply stayed in different areas of Tokyo for both, so it didn't feel like a particularly onerous extra change of hotels... I think staying in two areas of Tokyo was a positive thing for us.

I can see the logic in getting straight onto a shinkansen to Kyoto since one is tired, but for me, I have been desperate to sleep both times, just utterly useless until I do, but I don't travel well, I find it exhausting, so I need to recoup my sleep before I do anything much at all. Of course, having been, I realise that the train system is so painless, and one could sleep on the train I guess, but I find that bad for my neck and shoulders, so it wouldn't really be ideal for me. I would probably not have felt comfortable doing that on my first visit to Japan though.

I do agree that if you have extra nights, add one or two to Kyoto (there's SO much to see plus you can do trips to Osaka, Yamazaki, Uji, Kobe etc nearby in the unlikely situation you bore of Kyoto early).

Our flight from Vancouver lands at 1900. I was thinking going on to Kyoto via train at that time would be a bit much?

Flight home leaves in the evening (2155) so I guess train travel on that day is possible. My logic is we'd be nervous about getting back to Tokyo on time and hence probably waste more time at airport than the extra hotel check in. But I guess if the trains are truly as painless as everyone says maybe this isn't the case? As Kavey had suggested we were going to do 2 different areas of Tokyo.

I will add the extra time to Kyoto.

Mara were you suggesting that 1 night Miyajima (with a few hours in Hiroshima beforehand) is not enough? OR did you think i was doing it just as a day trip from Kyoto?

Oh! This is 15 nights in Japan?!

so now schedule is

tokyo 3 nights
kyoto 7 nights
koya-san 1 night
Miyajima + Hiroshima 1 night
Tokyo 2 nights

OR
Tokyo 3 nights
Kyoto 7 nights
Koya-san 1 night
Miyajima + Hiroshima 1 night
Kinosaki 1 night
Tokyo 1 night (with 2200 departure following day)

I hope I'm not throwing a wrench in here, but I think the Koya-san to Miyajima link could be a bit problematic, depending on what you want to see and experience. Once you check into your temple on Koya-san -- usually around 4 or 5 at the latest, I think -- you will have time to visit Okunoin, but not much else as the temples that you might want to visit for sightseeing will typically be closed by the time you could get to them. So, if you want to do any sightseeing (other than Okunoin), you'll have to do that the next day. But even if you don't leave Koya-san until (say) noon (which would give VERY little time to see other things on Koya-san), then I don't think you wouldn't get to Miyajima in time to check into a ryokan there.

What about: Tokyo --> Hiroshima, night in Miyajima --> Kyoto --> Koya-san --> Tokyo? I trust others will have even better ideas.

Yes I was hoping for feedback about the placement of the 1 night stays. That seems to make more sense.

Now to get on the hotel reservations in Kyoto, 60% reserved already I see. Will need to book the better restaurants I wanted to try soon too (hopefully not too late!)

Going to Kyoto after a 1900 arrival at HND is almost impossible, so scratch that....

No, I didn't think you were doing a day trip to Hiroshima and Miyajima.

I have done my share of one night stays although in recent trips have pretty much ended them, but a one night stay with four hours of traveling before and after imo is not going to give you much time off the train.

kja's idea of going from Tokyo to Hiroshima is interesting but that also is a long trip - you could stay one or two nights in Miyajima or one in Miyajima and one is Hiroshima to cut down on the traveling.

Also the trip from Hiroshima to Kinosaki Onsen is also four + hours....

When you are ready to think about meals, this thread had some GREAT info:
http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...s-anywhere.cfm

I was in Japan in November, 5 nights all spent in Kyoto. On our departure day we had a 5:00pm flight from Narita. We left Kyoto around noon, brought a bento to eat on the train. Even with a train change to the NEX, we timed it to arrive NRT 2 hours before the flight. it went flawlessly.

As we passed Himeji, I saw out the window of the train that the scaffolding was down. You might try to have a few hour stop there to see the caste on your way to/from Hiroshima. Another overlooked stop is Kurashiki, near Okayama. Well wort ha few hours.

So i booked the Sakura terrace in Kyoto (one of the last decent looking hotels under <$200/night) for the week. have made a booking at Koya-san and inquiry into Miyajami. The later seems quite expensive and full, in my rushed schedule (1 day Miyajami + Hiroshima + following morning) would we still be better off on the island vs staying in Hiroshima?

going to do it as kra suggested, early am train from tokyo --> hiroshima/mayajami --> kyoto --> moya-san --> tokyo

While in Miyajima, I stayed at what was, at least at that time, a relatively inexpensive, not very fancy, ryokan that I thoroughly enjoyed: Momiji-so.
https://www.japaneseguesthouses.com/...yokan=Momijiso

It depends on what YOU want to see and experience, but FWIW, I thought several hours (3 or 4) sufficient for my priorities in Hiroshima. I think I spent about 6 hours exploring Miyajima on the day after my overnight, but that could be off. I urge you to check your guidebooks (or spend some time with a few in your local library), identify the things you most want to see in each location, note their opening/closing times, and then plan accordingly.

And just to make sure you understand -- I'm no expert!

http://www.gambo-ad.com/english/area.php?ar=1
I used this site years ago - they have a few places in Miyajima.

The inn I stayed at, not listed above, is government run and now seems only to take reservations through Japanican:
http://www.morinoyado.jp/english/index.html

Personally I would prefer to stay on Miyajima - great atmosphere in the evening after the day trippers leave.. ;-)

I agree with Mara about the evenings on Miyajima -- and the mornings, too -- before the day trippers get there. Magical!

Momijiso is the Ryokan I had inquired about, I will see if they have any availability left.

Thanks for the site, led me to a few more good options if the above doesn't work out. Looks like I will be staying on Miyajima.

Booked hotels in Tokyo and started getting restaurant reservations in Kyoto so was a productive day, thanks for the help!

Great progress!

If you haven't already noted my comment about it, give some thought to a dinner of French kaiseki at Misoguigawa in Kyoto -- if your experience is anything like mine was, it will be a very memorable meal, indeed!
http://www.misogui.jp/eng/

We stayed in a ryokan called Auberge Watanabe, on Miyajima, which we liked very much. Family run, traditional, but note that meals are served downstairs rather than in the bedrooms. We actually preferred this.

I think your revised itinerary going straight from Tokyo to Hiroshima works, especially if you get an early train, spend your few hours in Hiroshima (like kja we spent a few hours, and then were ready to go over to Miyajima), you'll still enjoy late afternoon and evening in Miyajima.

If you book a ryokan, do factor in their meal time into your itinerary, ryokans often serve dinner a touch earlier than you might like.

Tokyo station to Miyajimaguchi is about 5.5 to 6 hours of travel. Add in a subway/train trip to get to Tokyo station and then the short walk, wait, and ferry to get to Miyajima.

I suggest adding a night in Hiroshima before Miyajima (or after).

For an onsen consider Spa World in Osaka or Arima Onsen. You could visit either from Kyoto.

Are you a baseball fan?

not much of a baseball fan. would like to check out a sumo wresting match out of curiosity

was thinking about Hiroshima for a night but think we will just suck up the long travel night after finally getting some of these hotels booked

a couple of the resto's I wanted are fully booked already but finding alternatives

"a couple of the resto's I wanted are fully booked already but finding alternatives"

Are they already fully booked, or just not yet accepting reservations for April? If there are any that are particularly high priorities for you, you might want to keep an eye on them....

Sumo tournaments are in odd-numbered months. Not April.