I Bleeping HATE Bangkok
 

Who the hell can love a city where at every turn people are trying to rip you off. It's like a city of con artist devoid of any morals. Can I just get in the cab, have the driver turn the damn meter on like he is supposed to do. Why do I have to be told B500 for a ride that actually cost B69 when I finally find a cabbie with a sense of decency.

Ok to be honest, outside of these disgusting excuses for humans called Tuk Tuk and Taxi drivers I love the Thai people. When I'm not trying to fight the scammers off me I'm actually having a good time and eating well.

Here is an example. I'm not going into full detail but my little brother and sister went out for the day, encountered a Tuk Tuk Driver who took them to what they thought was Somboom Seafood Restaurant and came back $400 (US) poorer. So the crazy NYorker in me went right back to the restaurant with the cops and stood at the gates and warned off all the innocent tourist on their way to being ripped off. The owners got so pissed they came running out screaming waving wood pieces but we stood our ground. I know that as I write this post that some other innocent tourist is being ripped off but I'm glad I did my part to save a few people.

I'm sure it did not help that we are African American as we were stared at like we had four heads almost everywhere we went. Entire group of patrons in restaurants would turn their heads in mass as we walked through the doors. We had tourist stamped on our foreheads because of our color and that made it even more difficult to get a straight answer from anyone. I have traveled all over the world and I have to say that BKK was extreme, even Eastern Europe was better.

Bangkok is a great city that I think everyone should at least visit once, as their is a very unique way of living here that I find interesting and it's what fuels my obsession with travel...exploring all corners of the world to see how other people go about their daily lives, but it is exhausting and emotionally draining if you are just looking for a few days of peace and exploration.

I'm glad I came to Bangkok, but if I had to do it all over again, I would have spent my two weeks in Siem Reap instead of coming here. I absolutely LOVED Cambodia. I leave for Bali on Tuesday for 5 days and I'm hoping my experience there will be closer to the bliss I had in Siem Reap instead of Bangkok.

So....what happened at Somboon Seafood? Was it really Somboon Seafood? When did you realize you were at a "fake" Somboon? Please tell all!

We love Bangkok. Yes, the taxi and tuk tuk drivers as well as the touts try their hardest to fleece tourists, but as you said, almost everyone else is unbelievably kind. The energy of the city is addictive.

I would also like to hear the details of the Somboon story. The image of irate farangs warning others is fascinating.

Oh dear....$400 for exactly what?
I love Bangkok.......in small doses, and you do need to be 'on the ball', if you are not to be ripped off, but if it was your first visit, I can see how this could happen.
Please don't judge it on this experience. Bangkok is a unique city.

Sorry to hear about your troubles but I would like to hear more detail of what happened.

1/. What was the name of the restaurant that your brother ended up at? You must know since you return there with the police.

2/. Did you file a complaint with the police? What police station, or precint, was it?

3/. What did your brother ordered that was worth $400 for 2 people? Was the menu in Thai and did it have prices on it?

"Here is an example. I'm not going into full detail but my little brother and sister went out for the day, encountered a Tuk Tuk Driver who took them to what they thought was Somboom Seafood Restaurant and came back $400 (US) poorer."


So, I take it that your brother and sister had someone in the restaurant hold a gun or some other threatening instrument to their heads and forcibly separated $400 from their wallets?? Is that right?

Or, did they stupidly not ask about the price of a meal, or did they order willy nilly without any care for the final price?

Are your brother and sister mentally challenged in some way? Otherwise I see that if no one stole their money by force they just made stupidly bad decisions!

Tuk-tuk drivers. Just read a post from this forum, or the TripAdvisor, Thai Visa, Virtual Tourist Forums, etc. and they will tell you to take a meter taxi and only pay the meter fare!

Meter taxi. When you wave a moving taxi over (avoid parked taxi cabs they will want to bargain, especially near bus stations and expensive hotels) tell the driver - BEFORE YOU HOP IN - meter only! If he wants to bargain - say NO thanks and get another one of the thousands of taxi cabs prowling the streets!

Ripped off by a taxi? I guess you never used a taxi in New York City! When you are unfamiliar with the city the NEW YORK TAXI CABS rip off the tourists too! Guess we should all cross NYC off our "must see" travel destination list!

I rarely have a "moving taxi" ever turn down a meter fare! Don't be lazy - go out to the curb and wave a moving taxi down!

Don't use tuk-tuks! Meter taxi rides are cheaper and air conditioned! If any tuk-tuk driver offers you a deal - run a way! Just like a guy on the street in NYC with a TV that "accidentally fell off a truck" and he is selling it cheap! Yeah, open the box and it is just a picture tube or a TV that doesn't work!

When you routinely make stupid decisions you can screwed any where in the world - even in New York!

I'm going to try and answer everyone's questions all at once. I brought my college age brother, sister and cousin with me to Bangkok. I was coming down with a cold but of course they wanted to go out so we made a plan of places for them to visit and I had the concierge map out a plan of action for them. Their first stop was the National Museum. Upon arriving there, they were told by some guy in a tour guide uniform that it was closed because of the Buddhist holiday...we all now the story of the scam...they were taken on a tour of some irrelevant Buddhas and then to a jewelry store and then asked if they wanted to go Somboon Seafood restaurant. The driver took them to a restaurant and they order lunch from a menu that had B300 or lower per item. At the end of the meal their bill was over B12,000 and when they asked why they were told that it was B300 per gram and not per dish. At the end of the day, they were foolish and naive but it in no way excuses what these people do.

When I went back to the place today, I knew right away that it was bullshit. The name of the place was SOMBOOMDEE and it was in a crappy area of town and was not some place that I would ever set foot in. This fact further compounded how the kids could have been so dumb to fall for the scam. They just kept telling me how nice the Tuk Tuk driver was. I walked up to all the patrons currently in the restaurant and proceeded to tell them all they were being scammed and to get up and leave. During this time, a family of 7 was in a heated debate with the manager about why their bill was so high if the dishes were only B300 or less. So basically, they were having the same experience as the kids. We then went out to the entrance area and yelled at all of the Tuk Tuks/Taxis filled with unsuspecting victims that they were about to be scammed. One after one, they all got out and walked away. The Tuk Tuk and Taxi drivers were now enraged and a huge argument ensued between myself and the management, I told them I was going to call the cops and that is exactly what I did. At one point, the manager tried to come after us with a large piece plywood with nails. It was all very funny and a total NY moment. I know it realy did not mean anything but it just made me feel better. Like I said before, there are probably a few unsuspecting tourists about to have a meal right now that will give them the shock of their lives.

SirHalberd, I think you are being a little harsh. They did a stupid thing. One that I still can't believe as they are rather well traveled kids. I had so many questions for them but at the end of the day, they had honorably paid the bill and there was nothing to be said but "lesson learned". I would have just paid what I knew i owed and left but they were not that bold. I don't know if you have ever been to BKK but the number of people trying to rip you off is EXTREME. I live in NYC and we all know that there are taxi drivers who will try to rip the tourist off but the problem is not nearly as prolific as it is in BKK. Unfortunately, the Tuk Tuks and the Taxis are a small part of a greater problem in BKK. As for the taxi situation, today alone we flagged approximately 7 taxis down and they all tried to get a ridiculousy HIGH fare instead of using the meter. We finally gave up and found a Tuk Tuk who agreed to my price. Below are a few links to sites that discuss the BKK scams in detail.

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel...nmen-BR-1.html

http://www.bangkokscams.com/

http://www.thai-blogs.com/index.php?...;tb=1&pb=1

I forgot to add that I actually have pics of the restaurant and the manager running after us. Can someone please tell me how to post pics. Thanks

Indeed, it is easy to be "taken for a ride" in Bangkok. When we were there, we had to be careful, and ask for the fares befoprehand. One tuktuk driver wanted 200 BHT for a trip, but we found one that took us where we wanted to go for 70. Even getting out of the airport was a challenge not to get ripped off.

And we are white!!

Since you 'have traveled all over the world', you should know taxi ripoffs happen in many places. We had that experience in Prague and other cities. ((*))

I have found scam artists who prey on tourists in virtually every country that 1) has a large tourist population; 2) poverty. And that includes NYC, Rome etc. I'm pretty successful at avoiding it but that may be because I lived in Manhattan for 30 years and learned first hand how to avoid being a victim (even when not a tourist). :-)

Is there a country that doesn't have 'poverty'? Do only 'poor' people scam? ((*))

Well, one thing when you get "ripped off" in Bangkok for a taxi ride it is only for a few dollars! When you get ripped off in New York it is quite a bit more money!

Sorry your family members got ripped off. Maybe this is a good lesson for them to learn now!

In around 11 years in and out of SouthEastAsia I haven't found any reason to spend more than 300 baht on a single meal. (The 300 baht meal was in a U.S. style steak house near Patpong many years ago.) Most of the time the price I pay for meals is under 150 baht! But I am on a tight budget! I do love my buffets though (real cheap in Pattaya!) Foodland, Sukhumvit Soi 5, has a pretty good restaurant open 24 hours. If you spend 300 baht there it is because you bought 2 meals!

Good luck

FYI - http://www.somboonseafood.com/index_en.html

Notice the warning at the bottome of the page.

I'm sorry this happened to your family members.

I am always amazed when people don't read or don't heed routine warnings about well-known scams. For instance every Thai guidebook in existence as well as every travel message board warns about the scam at the Grand Palace/Emerald Buddha... and yet people continue to fall for it. When I was in Bangkok in November we were headed from the water taxi to the Reclining Buddha when a man approached us and said it was closed. I burst out laughing and he fled. Another man approached us and apologized for the man trying to scam us. "He makes the Thai people look bad."

I've gone to Bangkok almost every year for 20+ years. I've never had a taxi driver rip me off. I did have a taxi driver last trip who got lost and took us to the wrong hotel... the doorman give him directions to my hotel and we ended up paying about US$3 for a full hour of riding around in his taxi. A scam? No, just a lost taxi driver. I do insist that drivers turn on the meter. Only once have I gotten out of a taxi after getting in, and that was when a driver said he wanted to take me to a jewelry store. I don't take tuk-tuks. The worst taxi scam I've ever run into was in Washington DC.

So, no doubt your family members got hit up for a much more expensive scam than most people do... the price was almost as much as the tea ceremony scams in Beijing. An my ex got hit on a similar scam in Rome, I believe it was. It cost him $300-400 and it was a valuable lesson.

So, you're doing some useful things in the aftermath of the scam: you reported the place to the police, you warned people eating there and generally made a fuss, and you are posting on a oft-read travel board for others to learn from your family members experience.

I hope that your family members learn something useful from this awful experience: there are people who will take advantage of you all over the world if you let them; take your critical thinking with you when you are on vacation; read about your destination before going there.

Jed-- there are probably more RICH scanners world wide than poor ones -- look at the predatory lenders, consumer scammers and EXON in the US as 3 examples. But I think the majority of the "petty" scams perpetrated on tourists in cities like Bangkok and NYC are done by people for whom an extra dollar actually makes a difference.

Trust me, the kids learned a valuable lesson. They feel foolish and we have lots of laughs over their "moment".

I'm not saying taxi scams are exclusive to BKK but it is so constant here that it is alarming. I feel like I'm being cheated at every turn. I don't even care about the extra Baht, at the end of the day it's a few bucks. I just went to the airport to pick up my other little cousin and both ways the taxi tried to rip me off and after the day I've had, I just wanted to scream. I'm a big tipper and I never follow local rules about tipping. I tip 20-30% regardless. What they don't realize is that by being dishonest they actually cheat themselves...as I'm less motivated to give them a tip.

To all you BKK lovers, happy travels!

wow! taxi scammers... i thought only las vegas, nyc,and dc had them. it appears to be a universal phenomenon.

i hope at least the food was good at that somboon place.

Taxi scammers are definitely not confined to las vegas, nyc,and dc! I think the worst I've encountered have been in Istanbul and India - never had a problem in Bangkok, I used to bargain with the tuk-tuks, now I just insist on taxis using the meter. Sorry about the bad experience, though.

tennisbum-I am with you. My husband & I were in Thailand and Bali for 1 month in October. There is nothing to like about Bangkok. It is just a BIG city. Our timeshare was by the old airport-none of the taxi cab drivers could find it with a map. Thank God I had booked Tong for 2 days and she picked us up. The next week was in Bali and it is to die for. The people are friendly-we had 2 hour massages for 28$.The weather was perfect. Next we went to Pattaya for a week-Yuk-Luckily we got a boat to a Coral |Island and spent some times on a nice beach and water that wasn't brown. Our last 5 days were in Northern Thailand.Now this is it. The people are friendly-the traffic is not so hectic-Our tour guide Sgt. Kai was wonderful.I guess I am not a Big City person-
Chris

Sorry to hear about your problem. I know Bangkok has many scams but I have never heard abou any restaurant charging $400 for a meal.

If the restaurant was in an unkown part of town how did you find it again.

Confronting the restaurant people and telling people to leave was very dangerous on your part. Never get a Thai angry or you might end up in the hospital. You were lucky.

What police did you call regular or the tourist police and what did they do. If it was the regular cops and you continued to yell at people you could have been arrested.

And why take Tuk Tuks. Everone who has done some research knows the scams they try on you. Were you not near a skytrain or subway station that you could use. As for taxis using their metre I have only had that problem on a couple of occasions and just got out and found another taxi.

Tennis,
I think your color or rather the color of your relations DID play a role in their being targeted. I have a Singaporean friend of mixed race who has told me of ill-treatment based upon the color of his skin by Chinese (and he's half Chinese). Unfortunately, very pale skin is sought after by Asian women & I have to believe that Asian men would be particularly racist towards black people (African or American).

I would encourage you call the Thai embassy in NYC & DC and write a letter of complaint to the ambassador, to the Thai Tourist board & challenge the charge on the credit card. If the menu said 3000 BHT next to the names of dishes, then they CAN'T legally be charged 'per gram' as the menu did not state it was 'per gram'.

Then go onto Trip Advisor & post a warning there too.

The sad aspect of all this is it makes me dread getting a cab to/from the BKK airport to our hotel. It's not that we're not capable of saying: METER... but why do we tourists have to go through the stress/hassle of demanding the meter be turned on by a series of taxi drivers?

Why don't the Thai tourist police ENFORCE THE LAW?

Singapore doesn't have this problem... all these ripoff artists succeed in doing is pushing tourists to take expensive shuttle services.

You have my empathy... and no one has a right to blame your unsuspecting relatives for being ripped off. If they were beaten, mugged & raped, would it be their fault too?

Bravo for going back & giving the slimy owners a bit of Big Apple Justice!

We need more people like you who are willing not to allow others to be victimized.

Tennisbum-I encourage you yo write a letter to various officials and make sure you cc the restaurant and TAT, and have your siblings challenge the credit card charge. While your impromptu protest conjures up a great image, the official communications may have a more lasting effect. You might also write a letter to Fodors, Frommers, Lonely Planet etc. with cc's to the restaurant.

I don't know whether the color of Tennis's skin had anything to do with how he was treated or not, but I would leave it to the expertise of the African-American travelers on the board who have spent time in Bangkok to give their experience, Guenmai and Femi for instance.

Oksana, there is no need for you to demand that taxi drivers use the meter, ask nicely. And you question of why don't the Thai tourist police enforce the law? - well, ask that question of every city in the world where someone has run into a taxi scam. As many of us have stated we've run into the biggest taxi scams in the US.

"Bravo for going back & giving the slimy owners a bit of Big Apple Justice. We need more people like you who are willing not to allow others to be victimized".

Oksana are you suggesting that others should confront the restaurant owner and tuk tuk drivers like he did. Very dangerous to do on your own and he was luky to walk away. Always take your complaints to the Tourist police, not the regular ones.

All you Bangkok experts should know how Thais can become very aggressive when they deemed to have lost face.

And I have doubts that this is the complete story. Scams do happen but not to this magnitude unless it involves jewerry. Yes I have seen warnings about tuk tuk and taxi drivers taking people to restaurants with a similar name and being overcharges but not to the tune of $400

I thought I'd just quickly jump on the forum and post my travel report and jump on the skytrain. Didn't know I'd come into all of this.

Anyhow, it's unfortunate of the poster's experiences. I'm Black American, have been coming to Bangkok, for extended vacations, up to 3 weeks, and almost annually for almost a decade....1-2 times a year. I haven't experienced any real big problems. I'm even thinking of part-time residence in this city.

Last year there was some crazy guy, as I was walking down the street, who, out of the blue, said "F" you to me as a Thai friend and I were walking down the street. I ignored him. Two Thai women walking behind me were VERY upset about it and walked over to me and apologized for the ---hole's behavior. My Thai friend was upset,too. I let it totally roll off my back and actually kind of laughed in his face which shocked him. I've heard far worse, at home, and also in Europe throughout the decades. One has to choose one's battles and that wasn't one that was worth even wasting my time over.

As for people staring, that hasn't really been a big problem with me here. Of course if one looks different there'll be curiosity stares. I got that A LOT for 2-plus decades in Scandinavia... FAR more than here.
When I was here in August/September I noticed a Black American couple on the skytrain. So I started talking to them. They were in their 30s and will be here for 3 years and had already been here for almost 6 months. I asked how they liked living here and they both said that they liked it.
I've just noticed that during this trip, people on the skytrain and other places have been asking me more...in a curious way...where I'm from and I tell them L.A. and then they smile. Yesterday, when my substitute Thai instructor came to my apartment to give me my Thai lesson, she asked where I was from and when I said L.A. she also smiled and then asked me if I knew that there were 79(?) provinces in Thailand....and then went on to comment...78(?) in Thailand...plus L.A. and then she cracked up laughing. So maybe that's where the common bond is.
I thought that maybe they were asking more about where I'm from because recently in the Bangkok Post there was an article on a big African drug bust around Suk, soi 3 or 4. Thais were interviewed about it and had their opinions on the situation....basically on just being against unlawfulness going on in the soi. Some Thais are upset because now supposedly many of the law-abiding African population has left the area and thus business is down.

As for scams...scams are everywhere in the world. I've been traveling the world, alone almost annually, since I was 17...1973... and I'm female. Have hit all of the continents and several many times over... and there are a LOT of places that I've been to where the scams were WAY worse. Many of them can be avoided by either reading a good guidebook, or now that we have forums...unlike in the "Old" days,keep current on the forums. And it also helps to read one of the Culture Shock guidebook series. Well, I've got to go. I need to get back to my trip report. Again, sorry to hear of your unfortunate experience. Happy Travels!

Tennisbum

did you ever wonder just WHERE and from WHOM those peopple learned to do this?

I hope all the mirrored glass in Bangkok was clean enough for you.

Sorry to the OP for the terrible experiences. Hope the rest of your vacation gets better. I find that knowledge and the right attitude carry you a long way in a successful and happy holiday.

Merry Christmas everyone!!

I've found that in many places people stare because I'm foreign looking first, then stare harder because of my skin color.

I figure fair is fair and I'm allowed to stare back as much as I want. Except I forgot that it's not acceptable to stare so hard in the States, and when I got back people here where staring, because I was staring @-)

In Cambodia at the border check the women pushed forward a little girl, saying that I must be her long lost relative because we had the same skin color (joking of course).

It may be helpful to remember that people in other cultures do not share the same history as America, and thus view race from a different perspective.

Two thumbs up, Femi! Happy Travels!

Two thumbs up, Hawaiiantraveler! Happy Travels!

Guen,

Pop quiz - how do you say thumb in Thai?

What these scammers need to figure out is that they aren't doing themselves any favors by stealing things and scamming tourists. Because they stole a dollar or 3 from the tourists, those people aren't going to come back, and they are also going to tell all of their friends not to come, costing the country hundreds or thousands of dollars in missed out revenue from tourism.

However, if some vendor or driver was exceptionally honest and didn't pester you, you are far more likely to tip them, and also will come back and tell your friends to come back.

This short sighted ignorance on their part is very frusterating and their scamming can easily ruin your trip.

All of my great times in Cambodia came from outside of the tourist circle, out amongst the villiagers and children at the orphanage. All of the vendors at the Russian market just pissed me off after a few minutes and I could barely deal with them. I couldn't make my way back to the orphan kids fast enough.

You know, the other countries where we encountered a lot of scammers was the Czech Republic and Spain. It seems as though there were millions of pick pockets and scammers. My friend ended up paying 30 dollars for a hot dog in Prague... I paid about 10 dollars. They simply give you the wrong amount of change and hope you don't notice.

It's dishonest, it's lying and it makes you hate the people.... for every person they scam, you'll tell 50 people... how can they not look past the moment and see how damaging this is?

In conclusion... I sympathise with your frustration ;)

Hi

Sorry to hear about your bad experience. I have been to Bangkok a few times and I have learned to deal with the tuk-tuk drivers, the people that tell you that a temple is closed etc. I have always been fasinated by Bangkok and I think it is an adventure to walk around looking at everyday life :d

Regards
Gard
http://gardkarlsen.com - trip reports and pictures

Hanuman: LOL!

So how much should a seafood dinner at Somboom for 4 people with, say, 1 beer of wine per person, cost?

How do you know how much taxi fare should be to places, do you ask the concierge at the hotel?

How about a short tuktuk ride?

Thanks,

Lynnie

It will depend on what you order. The most popular dish are the curry crab and the price will depend on the crab size(the bigger the more expensive per gramme). Basically just read the menu but be aware that most of the time the price for the crab will be per 100g.

Just use common sense and if you don't understand the menu or if the menu is in Thai only(not in this case since Somboon's menu will be bilingual) just ask the waiter.

Taxi, make sure the meter is running and you'll get a fare price. Your hotel can probably guess as to how much the fare should cost. Tuk Tuk, negotiate the price before you get in.

Somboon does have a web site: http://www.somboonseafood.com/index_en.html

If the price is not listed call the restaurant before you go and ask for the price.

Lynnie, if you order wine, know that wine prices in Thailand are very high, since there is a 400% duty on wine. Beer prices are quite reasonable.

As Hanuman says, always ask the taxi driver to use the meter - I've never had one refuse. If you use the expressway, there are tolls, 40-65 baht, depending on where you are going, and as the passenger, you are required to pay the tolls (the driver will likely add it to your bill at the end). Drivers almost always ask if you want them to use the expressway, and will tell you the toll. The "right" answer is always use the expressway if the driver is recommending it. It will save you lots of time.

Thanks for the info. Glad I know about the wine prices. I hate beer. What about gin. (I will want a cocktail at some point I'm sure).

Liquor prices other than wine are ok, not cheap but not a shock.

tennisbum: I am sorry that you had such almost "incredible" experience in Bangkok. Last week friends of mine travelled from Central America to NY and while I offered to have a car pick-up for them, the taxi cost them $75.00 and to the wrong hotel..Guess what? They found Xmas in NY an extraordinary experience and if possible they would like to do it again. How about giving one of my favorite cities in the world another chance...