Botswana - Help me pick 2 camps!!!
 

Hi -

We're finally booking our trip!! I've been much more of an "observer" on the board than a poster, but am begging for your help now.

We have 6 nights to spend in Botswana. We are traveling with another couple and only wish to do 2 camps.

We are much more interested in all the big cats...not so much into birding.

We will be going the within the first 2 weeks of June 2007 (we don't have much flexibility on the time of year)

(Mombo is out of the question due to cost)

<b>Chief's</b> - I was told by a travel agent on a first phone call that they would not book people at Chief's due to the management. Has anyone heard anything of this? All I hear about Chief's are glowing reviews.

<b>Duma Tau</b>

<b>Kwetsani</b> - I understand this is mostly a water camp, and we should experience at least one water camp in Botswana. My only concern is perhaps the lack of predators at this camp?

<b>Chitabe</b>

Hi! You are in the right place for advice on Botswana travel.

For 6 nights, my first recommendation for the predators is Kwando safaris. 3 nights each at Lebala and Kwara camps. If you can squeeze in an additional 4th night into Lebala, would be desirable. There are several trip reports of fodorites recent visits to Kwando camps. Just do a search. Couple more fodorites (including me) visiting their camps on repeat visits over the next three months.

If you pre-pone your trip to the last week of May, you may get a more favourable rate for the above camps. As Kwando policy is high season pricing from June 1 until end of Oct.

I dont know why your travel agent doesnt recommend Chief's camp.......seems to me, that they are comitted to Wilderness safaris. If you want to do wilderness camps, i would recommend Selinda and Chitabe (as a two camp combo) for predators. In case, you are not willing to spend on Mombo. Wilderness shoulder season pricing runs thru Mid-june, 2007 after which it is high season.

Perhaps, Johan and others on these boards can add their suggestions!!!

Hari

Of your listed choices I think Chitabe is a very good choice and would include it for sure.

There will be lots of opinions on a second camp.

If you want some water and do a mokoro ride but still have a predator experience I would consider Duba Plains. It is exceptional for lion viewing, particularly for daytime buffalo kills and at your time of year there should be lots of water. The lions are so dominate though that seeing other cats here is rare it is very lion focused but you will be thrilled if you want to emphasize lions.

A more diverse choice would be to combine a Linyanti area camp -- Duma Tau, Selinda, Zib or Savuti Camp. You can do water activities at Duma Tau but it will be river/lagoon boating not a delta experience.

The other predator option would be to use the Kwando Camps instead of Wilderness Safaris and split time at Kwara Camp which has water activities and good predators and Lebala Camp which is exceptional (like Chitabe) for predators.

Any of these options should provide an outstanding trip and put you in good places for big cats.

Hari: you posted while I was typing. Looks like we were thinking along the same lines.

Pred,

Hi! Yeah, we gave similar feedback.

The only reason i didnt say Duba Plains, is......only two camps and duba is not diverse with it's predators. Lions only. The rare glimpse of leopard or hyenas. No cheetah or dogs.
That why, i gave the delta option of Chitabe.....

Hari

Wow, talk about fast replies.

I'm starting to think the one agent we called isn't a fan of anything except WS. I recall them saying they wouldn't book Kwando camps too for reasons like the bookings are difficult. Maybe it's time I started calling other operators...

I'll check out Lebala.

I understand the discount for staying at one brand of camps kicks in at 7 nights. Since we're staying 6 nights, is there any disadvantage from hopping from Lebala to Chitabe?

Are we missing much by not doing the delta?

Chitabe is a delta camp. Lebala and Chitabe would be a good predator combo. You just wont get great pricing. However, Kwara is a huge concession and lots of predators. You can also do both land and water activities there.....the Kwara concession is much much bigger than Chitabe.

Hello,

While it's unfortunate that your agent hasn't offered a wider range of options, I wouldn't dismiss Wilderness out of hand -- Wilderness's Botswana camps offer some of the best cat viewing I've ever had. For a six-night cat-focused stay, I'd recommend one of the following (depending on your emphasis):

Savuti/Duma Tau/Selinda x3 ((excellent cat viewing -- I've had great leopard sightings here)

Chitabe x3 (excellent diverse cat viewing in a different environment)

OR, as PB has suggested:

Duba Plains x3 (very good lion vieiwng)

Chitabe x3 (excellent diverse cat viewing)

If you want the option of water activities, you could substitute Kwetsani for Duba Plains or Savuti. Kwara, as others have mentioned, is another option here.

If you could stretch to one more night, you'd get a nice discount from Wilderness (or whatever company you go with).

Cheers,
Julian

parkertraveler,

A minimum of a 5 night stay at Kwando will qualify you for a long stay discount at Kwando's camps.

Parkertravel,

If i were you, and given 6 or 7 nights two camps, and cat viewing was my focus....i would do (sticking to particular companies to take advantage of the pricing)

Choice 1: Lebala/Kwara
Choice 2: Selinda/Chitabe

If you just wanted any two camps, with only cat viewing as a focus....

Choice 1: Lebala/selinda
Choice 2: Lebala/chitabe

This would be your best bet options for June. The flood levels in the delta vary every year.......so....

Hari

Hello,

At that time of year, I would recommend the following options in no particular order:

1) Selinda/Chitabe or Chitabe trails;
2) Lebala/Chitabe or Chitabe trails.

I'll be in Selinda and Chitabe in June 2007 and I was at Lebala in May 2006 and the gameviewing was fabulous (I stayed 8 nights and saw lots of predator action).

Although Duba Plains is one of my favorite camps - I wouldn't recommend to go to this camp because of the difficult drivin' due to flood levels that time of year. It can be extremely good (if not the best) in terms of lion-buffalo interaction or a bit disappointing because the buffalo just crossed a floodplain (because the pressure on them was too high) and you couldn't follow them because of the flood levels.

I have mixed up feelings about Duma Tau and Savuti that time of year. Gameviewing was reasonably good but couldn't compete with Lebala or Chitabe at that time of year.

Greetings,

Johan

There you go....

Hari

Parkertraveler

Such excellent advice. Nothing for me to add in the way of suggestions.

So the magic number for Kwando discounts is only 5 nights? That's useful info.

To read about animal viewing at different Wilderness camps during the year, you can click on News at this website
http://www.wilderness-safaris.com/
You may already have been there.

I have seen nothing negative about Chief's Camp and management.

Johan just had great luck at Lebala in Kwando. Here is the report.
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34818383

Please post your final choices.

atravelynn,

That is correct...it is a mere 5 nights to qualify for a long stay discount at Kwando. Also, I think people would be shocked at how affordable a &quot;Secret Season&quot; safari is to Kwando (December - March). I have seen some Fodorites reports from December/January reporting excellent gameviewing at Kwando during these time periods.

However, despite the beneficial pricing, this does not mean that travelers should not plan well in advance, as Kwando definitely does seem to fill up, even in Secret Season, well in advance...February 2007 is already proving tight, for example.

Rocco,

It fully depends on the rains on a given year. For example, end Nov-early Dec last year.......i spent a week between Lebala and lagoon. It rained every single day without exception and the lions hid themselves deep in the mopane or wherever. Not a single lion sighting......however, i was treated to spectacular cheetah sightings. It could've just been rotten luck!!! Two days prior to my arrival at lagoon, they had a looooooong night watching the lagoon pride kill hippo.

Went to kwara and had amazing moments with their lions.......

But, yes, i concur that their green season is great value for money.....

Hari

I can't speak to the other camps, but I was recently at Jao which shares the same concession as Kwetsani so game viewing is identical. This is not a camp where you will see a lot of game as it is primarily water based. They do have land drive activities but if you spend time there I would encourage you to focus on the water based activities instead. While there we did two female lions and two male lions (all sleeping), a mother leopard with a young cub, a male leopard in a tree and assorted warthog and wildebeest. What there is lots of his Red Lechwe (large herds spread out across the floodplains), and many types of beautiful birds. The concession is really beautiful, the way the light hits the water at sunrise and sunset made for some memorable moments. The mekoro and power boat rides through the channels were also a lot of fun. However if you want to focus on predators and are not interested in birds, I would skip this option.

This is a great thread for me, as we also are planning a trip for June 2007. Although my dates are flexible I am waiting to get my FF airline tickets before we book. Is this advisable or should we book our choices and then revise dates if necessary. We have been looking at a trip with http://www.naturexp.com/ because the iteniary looks good and the camps are Stanley's Chiefs and Kings Pool which all look really good. We were told that pricing does not increas until July 1, is that correct? Open to suggestions. We want a varied animal experience with the focus on predators and elephants, land and water based camps and at least one that does night drives. We have about 14 days and that is with Cape Town and Victoria falls. Help I am getting to deadline.

spiegel, were you looking at the deluxe botswana package? that is only 7 nights in the bush and 3 in Vic Falls. For that price, you should be in the bush more nights than 7.

It is the Africa and DAys Gone By, Deluxe package . You may be right but it looks to me like it is only 1 1/2 days in VF. 2 nights at two of the camps and 3 nights at the last one. The problem we have is we have 17 days and that is including travel. If we take two days from LA and one home, and we want to spend about 2-3 in Capetown, how do we change this? This is why I am asking for help. We do not need to do a tour either, I was just told that that would be cheaper. At this point there are only two of us going

Hi! You dont need to book with a tour group.......

In anycase, Wilderness high season begins mid-june, 2007. For Kwando camps it is June 1, 2007.

For Cape Town, i suggest atleast 3 nights.

Hari

spiegel, you might check with Rocco or Julian from this board for some ideas. Another option is check with Mark at tagasafaris.com. I'm sure all of them will get you more time in the bush at a lower cost.

Hi! Dennis....i guess the time difference between Hawaii and India, makes just the two of us on the msg boards at the moment........

Hari

seems that way Hari! what time is it there? it's around 6:00 p.m. here

goodmorning ! Sunday , 6.00 am here

Hi! Dennis, it's 10:30 AM sunday morning. Time difference is 9:30 hrs ahead of east coast time.

Hari

Thanks so much for all the advice so far!

1)How about feedback of those who have been to Lagoon and Lebala? Since they are so close to each other, is the viewing the same?

2)How would you rate Kwara vs. Chitabe in late May/ early June?

3)What is the main difference between WS and Kwando camps?

Wait... Selinda doesn't look part of WS, is that right?

Parkertraveler,

Hi! Selinda is marketed by Wilderness.

I have been to both Lagoon and Lebala. On my upcoming August trip, i am going to both camps. The Kwando concession is huge. The northern section is Lagoon and to the South is Lebala. Both are a little varied in terrain, Lebala being more open.....giving you better predator action and a place where it is relatively easier to follow the dogs, should they be hunting. Lebala is a bit more luxurious in terms of accomodation.(both are priced the same)

Lagoon area may hv better elephant action later in the dry season and a better chance of roan and sable antelope.

Kwando vs Wilderness.....i hv been to camps of both companies....like them both. Kwando markets itself with a stong emphasis on guiding and quality game-viewing. I have had several 10 hr drive days at Kwando. Very good guides and camp staff (My experiences)

At Wilderness, i've had good game drives also. They hv better food/accomodation. However, Kwando is very good also. They dont focus on the gourmet crowd. Some Wilderness camps like Mombo have spectacular food!!! Kwando has simpler but, adequate menus. However, on all safaris i find myself eating too much.

Your other question, for late May/early June.......for predator action, Kwara vs Chitabe......perhaps Chitabe wins by a fraction....By the time, your trip rolls around Kwara's new camp, Little Kwara will be in business. Only 4tents and more luxurious. The old Kwara tents are very average....in all honesty.

Sure this either helps or confuses you even further!!!

Hari

Parkertraveler,

Here's an update of my Kodakgallery where i hv pics from both Wilderness and Kwando.http://www.kodakgallery.com/I.jsp?c=...&amp;y=-lasqq8

: santharamhari

I have clicked on the slide show but can't get them to advance. What am I doing wrong?

What's the worst case scenario with Chief's in late May? I've been reading that sometimes with the floods, you won't be able to reach all of the driveable areas? Would the areas left that you can drive on still be incredible?

spigel,

Just click play, when the frame comes on with the first picture. Just did a test on the link, it does work.....

Hari

Hari -

Do you think the location of the new Little Kwara camp will be near the main Kwara and have the same access to game viewing?

Hi! It's no more than 5 mins from the main camp. They were originally scheduled to be located one hr away....but, had to re-locate due to the new location actually being in the moremi game reserve. This is why there is some delay in opening the camp. Recently, couple of fodorites were at Kwara and had to stay at main camp. It should be ready for action shortly.

Yes, the game viewing areas will be the same........

Hari

Parkertraveler,

Sorry......i missed your question on Chief's camp.....IMO, you'd be better off going there during either late in the dry season or during the green season. Green season would allow you to get incredible rates for stay combined with fantastic game viewing. If i were to return to Botswana in the green season, i would spend a week at Chief's camp.....(Nov-Mar)

Hari

OK everyone please help me tighten this up. 1.June 07 websites still show that June is &quot;shoulder season&quot; and pricing is slightly less than in July. Is this correct? 2. Do I spend more time in the delta or the Savuti/Linyanti area? 3. camp choices in the delta for June Chiefs, Chitabe, Stanley's or Duba Plaines? 4. Savuti /Linyant - Kings Pool or Selinda. 5. Any other suggestions are welcome. We will have a total of 18 days including flying. So take off 3 days for travel leaves 15 days to do Capetown, Botswana, and Victoria Falls. How would you break this up? Also considered one day in Johannsburg to go to Soweto.

If shoulder season ends in June what would the game viewing be like in May or should we just bite the bullet and wait until July/August. One of the reasons for going in June was to cut the cost somewhat.

Hi! Shoulder season for Wilderness camps ends Mid june i.e., High season starts June 15, 07. If you really want to cut some costs, you need to complete your trip prior to these dates. You will still see some top-notch game viewing.

However, later in the dry season August and onwards you will encounter some spectacular sightings......more notably the huge herds of buffalo and elephants.

Your question, of linyanti vs delta (time duration)......depends on what you are looking for....

Hari

Hari, where do you live? You are either far away or up late like I am in California. Regarding what we are looking for is excellent game viewing, good lodging but not as high end as Mombo, but no plain tents, some city and culture also. This is our first to Africa, and possibly the only one. We are both a young 60 but have so many other places we still want to see. This is the reason for adding Cape Town and the falls. Am I trying to squeeze to much into 18 days with 3 days for traveling. Also this trip is so expensive for us. I am thinking it is going to be about $20K US without air as we are using FF miles. I wish I could figure out how to do it for less but I do not want to stay in lodges, because I want the camp experience.

Hi Spiegeljcs,

I live in India......yep, far away from CA...

Ok, to answer ur question, if i were in your shoes..... would do 3 nights minimum cape Town, 2 nights Falls, Would try to do Chitabe and Selinda to maximize my time in Botswana and enjoy some very good game-viewing. You should get some discounts if you stay atleast a combined 7 nights between the two camps. I would do 4 selinda and 3 Chitabe. Also try to fit this in, prior to mid-june.

Hope this helps. Did you try to have a look into the Kodak gallery earlier in the thread?

Hari

Adding up....3 days to travel, 3 days CT, 2 days VF......u also need couple nights in Joburg to transit? you may be left with an extra day to add to either Selinda or Chitabe. The longer you stay in a camp, the more likely you r to see something interesting. Also, you dont rush thru sightings.

Hope this helps.

Hari