Calling all Capetonians!!!
Jun 16th, 2006, 04:27 AM
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Calling all Capetonians!!!
I'll be spending a week in Cape Town with my fiance at the end of September. We already have accommodation booked (staying at Davids B&B - thanks to Selwyn's recommendation on a previous thread). I'm in the process of writing an itinerary which crams in as many of the main attractions as possible, but I would appreciate some advice on part of the itinerary. Can anybody suggest a two day excursion (we'll have our own car, but will be returning back to Cape Town each night as Davids is booked for the full week) which would allow us to see the main view points and fishing villages along the Cape Point coastline, to go kayaking with the penguins (sorry but I can't help picturing a double kayak with me at the back and a penguin sat in the front!!!) around Simonstown, to take the boat out to Seal Island and do to the baboon matters walk (which I believe is only available as an early morning or early evening tour) without double backing on ourselves too much? Can anybody also recommend a reputable tour company to conduct a township tour?
Thank You
Thank You
Jun 16th, 2006, 06:00 AM
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Hylton Ross is a popular tour company and they arrange a cultural township tour with dinner. http://hyltonross.com/
www.visiting-capetown.com also offers some ideas on what to do in and around Cape Town.
You should definitely go and visit the Cape Winelands and make a stop at www.spier.co.za or/and www.zevenwacht.co.za for a lunch or picknick.
www.visiting-capetown.com also offers some ideas on what to do in and around Cape Town.
You should definitely go and visit the Cape Winelands and make a stop at www.spier.co.za or/and www.zevenwacht.co.za for a lunch or picknick.
Mar 1st, 2007, 06:26 PM
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dmjapril,
As an opener I must tell you that you could be trying to cram to much into 2 days. Furthermore by trying to do what you have mentioned you will be losing out rather badly in that you will be missing out on so much else that you could do in Cape Town.
By staying at Davids everything can be done in one day outings so don’t worry about staying anywhere else as Davids will suit your needs to the full.
Here’s a fair warning kayaking with the penguins will not get you very close to them. You will be in their proximity but you will be very lucky if you come any closer than about 6 foot and this will be for seconds if that as they swim at a rate of 12 Km per hour. To obtain a good idea as to what the penguins are about you will be much better off simply visiting Boulders Beach.
No matter what if you want to do all that you have specified then because of distance I would suggest that you do what you want to do over two days and that means that you will have to backtrack over roads that you would have already covered.
I want to preface what I am about to tell you by saying that I would not normally recommend what I am going to suggest because it really is a seriously crammed up journey and as far as I am concerned you will lose out badly by trying to do too much and thus seeing very little however as it is your request you could do the following:
Wake up at 05h00, have an early breakfast and make your way out to Simonstown (45-50 minute drive). Go to Glencairn and join Jenny on her “baboon matters walk”. This is an amazing experience. After the walk (about 12h00) you can drive to Boulders Beach (15 minutes away and do your kayaking.) After this you could cross over Red Hill and via Scarborough, Kommetjie, Noordhoek and Chapmans Peak travel to Hout Bay where you can catch the last ferry to Seal Island.
If you do the above journey you will be missing out on so much such as Cape Point, The Cape of Good Hope Nature reserve, Muizenberg, Fish Hoek and Kalk Bay that I really would urge you NOT to go down this road.
You could split the events up into two days by going to Hout Bay , Sea Island, Chapmans Peak, Noordhoek, Cape of Good Hope nature reserve including Cape Point and the Cape of Good Hope. Thereafter you can visit the penguin colony and kayak if you want to. I doubt if you will make the baboon matters journey timeously so you will then have to return to Davids via Fish Hoek, Kalk Bay and Muizenberg. This will mean that you will have to do the baboon matters walk the following day which automatically means that you will be backtracking which you have specifically asked to avoid.
Overall I think that there is so much else to do in Cape Town that you will be missing out many events such as Table Mountain, the winelands etc and I seriously would like to suggest that you give this all a rethink.
Please understand I am not trying to be negative about your ideas, all I am trying to do is save you from the situation of trying to do too much and thus seeing nothing because you are in a permanent rush.
Btw I would give Hylton Ross a HUGE MISS when it comes to a township tour as the journey is a pure tourist event and when it comes to township visits I very strongly feel that this is NOT the way to go. Not trying to run down Chris80's idea but Spier is a total tourist trap and you could do much better by visiting so many other winefarms in the Stellenbosch region.
mandib, if you go to
http://www.baboonmatters.org.za/
http://animaltalk.org.uk/baboons.html
you will find out a lot more about the baboon matters walk.
Hope all of the above helps.
Very proudly part of the wonderful
nation of South Africa
As an opener I must tell you that you could be trying to cram to much into 2 days. Furthermore by trying to do what you have mentioned you will be losing out rather badly in that you will be missing out on so much else that you could do in Cape Town.
By staying at Davids everything can be done in one day outings so don’t worry about staying anywhere else as Davids will suit your needs to the full.
Here’s a fair warning kayaking with the penguins will not get you very close to them. You will be in their proximity but you will be very lucky if you come any closer than about 6 foot and this will be for seconds if that as they swim at a rate of 12 Km per hour. To obtain a good idea as to what the penguins are about you will be much better off simply visiting Boulders Beach.
No matter what if you want to do all that you have specified then because of distance I would suggest that you do what you want to do over two days and that means that you will have to backtrack over roads that you would have already covered.
I want to preface what I am about to tell you by saying that I would not normally recommend what I am going to suggest because it really is a seriously crammed up journey and as far as I am concerned you will lose out badly by trying to do too much and thus seeing very little however as it is your request you could do the following:
Wake up at 05h00, have an early breakfast and make your way out to Simonstown (45-50 minute drive). Go to Glencairn and join Jenny on her “baboon matters walk”. This is an amazing experience. After the walk (about 12h00) you can drive to Boulders Beach (15 minutes away and do your kayaking.) After this you could cross over Red Hill and via Scarborough, Kommetjie, Noordhoek and Chapmans Peak travel to Hout Bay where you can catch the last ferry to Seal Island.
If you do the above journey you will be missing out on so much such as Cape Point, The Cape of Good Hope Nature reserve, Muizenberg, Fish Hoek and Kalk Bay that I really would urge you NOT to go down this road.
You could split the events up into two days by going to Hout Bay , Sea Island, Chapmans Peak, Noordhoek, Cape of Good Hope nature reserve including Cape Point and the Cape of Good Hope. Thereafter you can visit the penguin colony and kayak if you want to. I doubt if you will make the baboon matters journey timeously so you will then have to return to Davids via Fish Hoek, Kalk Bay and Muizenberg. This will mean that you will have to do the baboon matters walk the following day which automatically means that you will be backtracking which you have specifically asked to avoid.
Overall I think that there is so much else to do in Cape Town that you will be missing out many events such as Table Mountain, the winelands etc and I seriously would like to suggest that you give this all a rethink.
Please understand I am not trying to be negative about your ideas, all I am trying to do is save you from the situation of trying to do too much and thus seeing nothing because you are in a permanent rush.
Btw I would give Hylton Ross a HUGE MISS when it comes to a township tour as the journey is a pure tourist event and when it comes to township visits I very strongly feel that this is NOT the way to go. Not trying to run down Chris80's idea but Spier is a total tourist trap and you could do much better by visiting so many other winefarms in the Stellenbosch region.
mandib, if you go to
http://www.baboonmatters.org.za/
http://animaltalk.org.uk/baboons.html
you will find out a lot more about the baboon matters walk.
Hope all of the above helps.
Very proudly part of the wonderful
nation of South Africa
Mar 1st, 2007, 09:38 PM
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I want to echo Selwyn's comments re: Hylton Ross. The only recent incident of note in a township in Cape Town happened with a Hylton Ross bus full of tourists (November 2006), some of whom were robbed in Langa (http://iafrica.com/news/sa/482407.htm). The company is known for drive-by township tours and do not spend enough time on community relationship development, they usually don't stop for meals in the townships (because they get their % kickback at the more expensive restaurants in the more affluent suburbs), and they don't pay their guides particularly well. I work in the field with black tour operators, community projects and micro-tour operators, and Hylton Ross is not highly regarded at the grassroots level or by the black industry when it comes to community and cultural tours. They're a perfectly reputable firm and professional with a strong overall track record, but they don't have this particular tour offering fully developed as yet.
Also, "Township Tours" as a particular tour are limited versions of community and cultural tours. This is really what you want to look for -- not a drive through of a township to 'see how the poor people live,' but a contextualised visit to meet people and understand their lives, their traditions, their concerns in a way that isn't charity and that maintains the dignity of all involved.
So YES by all means do a cultural or community tour. I have posted guidelines for selecting these kinds of tours on my blog if you care to look deeper. http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com/20...ity-tours.html
In my work with Ishabi, we have interviewed and vetted a number of highly professional local black guides and micro-tour operators who specialise in community and cultural tours, including Nthuseng Tours, Nomthunzie Township Tours, Fisher Tours, Triple-M Tours and others. There are also interesting tours offered by the likes of Coffee Beans Routes (music tours) and even cooking classes for Cape Malay cuisine, where you'll learn all about the Cape Malay culture, community and traditions.
Finally, there are well-established independent guides of all ethnicities and from all parts of Cape Town who do excellent community tours (as a search in this forum on Selwyn will attest to -- he has many loyal fans!).
HTH
Kurt
http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com
Also, "Township Tours" as a particular tour are limited versions of community and cultural tours. This is really what you want to look for -- not a drive through of a township to 'see how the poor people live,' but a contextualised visit to meet people and understand their lives, their traditions, their concerns in a way that isn't charity and that maintains the dignity of all involved.
So YES by all means do a cultural or community tour. I have posted guidelines for selecting these kinds of tours on my blog if you care to look deeper. http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com/20...ity-tours.html
In my work with Ishabi, we have interviewed and vetted a number of highly professional local black guides and micro-tour operators who specialise in community and cultural tours, including Nthuseng Tours, Nomthunzie Township Tours, Fisher Tours, Triple-M Tours and others. There are also interesting tours offered by the likes of Coffee Beans Routes (music tours) and even cooking classes for Cape Malay cuisine, where you'll learn all about the Cape Malay culture, community and traditions.
Finally, there are well-established independent guides of all ethnicities and from all parts of Cape Town who do excellent community tours (as a search in this forum on Selwyn will attest to -- he has many loyal fans!).
HTH
Kurt
http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com
Mar 3rd, 2007, 07:08 AM
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Selwyn and Kurt, you are totally misinformed about Hylton Ross Tours. Your knowledge is sadly lacking or otherwise you are just jealous. Wake up boys, it was not a Hylton Ross coach that was robbed.
Hylton Ross rents out coaches and is therefor just following the instructions of the tour operator when they drive through the Townships. As a matter of fact often under the instructions of "black" guides on board.
Regarding their scheduled township tour you will notice that they have less stops than other operators but they stop for a longer period of time so as to allow the maximum time for inter-action. The places that are visited along the route benifit hugely.
Hylton Ross is a major contributor to the TCD Trust. What contributions do you make.
A while ago, Selwyn, you portrayed your fellow guides as commision hunters, slated the 12 Apostles hotel and now you're running down other companies. You're exactly what we don't need here.
oh ...and let us know when you collect your comm. from Davids
Hylton Ross rents out coaches and is therefor just following the instructions of the tour operator when they drive through the Townships. As a matter of fact often under the instructions of "black" guides on board.
Regarding their scheduled township tour you will notice that they have less stops than other operators but they stop for a longer period of time so as to allow the maximum time for inter-action. The places that are visited along the route benifit hugely.
Hylton Ross is a major contributor to the TCD Trust. What contributions do you make.
A while ago, Selwyn, you portrayed your fellow guides as commision hunters, slated the 12 Apostles hotel and now you're running down other companies. You're exactly what we don't need here.
oh ...and let us know when you collect your comm. from Davids
Mar 3rd, 2007, 09:41 AM
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AfricaJ,
I am going to answer you in a one off mail and will not respond thereafter as I do not want to start a fight with you or anybody on this board as I dont think it is the pcase to do so.
I have never ever collected a single commission in 10 years from anybody and I am well known for this. On the other hand I have passed on many tourguide commissions to so many visitors to Cape Town amongst others many Fodorites simply to attract them to Cape Town. Please note I have not even toured with most of these people, I have simply helped them attain a discount. I take great pride in helping people who want to vsist our country in this manner. If you can prove differently be my guest. If you cant then hold your tongue!
You ask what do I do for the townships?
I run 12 different projects ranging from sending and paying for kids to go school (old Model C schools which cost believe me) to running two soup kitchens in Kayamandi (feeding 150 kids 8 times a month), a township near Stellenbosch. I run and pay for ballroom dancing classes as well as Afrocentric dance classes so as to attract kids off the streets in Kayamandi. I run special classes for kids to learn English so that they can move on to better schools who will only accept learners who can speak English. I find the teachers for the dancing and English classes and pay for them. All classes take place at the Ikamva Lethu centre
I run a project called fruit for kids whereby we feed 100 kids twice a week with a fruit. The fruit is bought from local spaza stores so that the moneys stay in the township. The kids all come from the Isibane Sempumulelo crèche in Kayamandi
I sponsor in its entirety uniforms, buses etc a teenage choir called Bana Bagotso (Children of peace). This choir practices and performs at the Ikamva Lethu centre and have cut a CD for which I paid for the total production costs
As already said most of the above takes place in a centre called the Ikamva Lethu Centre which is a large hall in Kayamandi that I have been hiring for the past 6 years. I take care of the total running expenses for the hall. Furthermore the hall has a full time manageress (Thembekazi Bangani) whose salary I pay. You dont want to even know how much the expense of doing this comes to.
Now lets go one step further. I do NOT accept tips from my visitors. I ask them to rather help me in the township of Kayamandi and believe me they do however they dont make up the total costs of running all these projects so guess what I give up about 50% of my profits from tourguiding to keep all the above projects alive and have been doing so for close on 8 years already.
In 2005 I was totally instrumental in sending two 10 year old kids who lived in a shack in Kayamandi on a jet for 10 days to London to stay with a British family who had toured with me in the past. They had a blast that they will never ever forget and I felt great about attaining this for them.
There are many other activities that I attain in the township, it is just that I dont want to start naming them all right now.
To all of the above I can tell you that there are so many visitors as well as Fodorites amongst others who could attest to all of the above. Furthermore all is 100% corroborated with pictures and videos on my website and let me tell you pictures don’t lie!
As far as Kurt is concerned I have never met or spoken to him but I can tell you that the project that he works for viz. the Ishabi project is a wonderful community based operation which helps many previously disadvantaged South Africans. Some of these folk are amongst others some of my fellow black South African tourguide friends. I would support the project all the way as the Ishabi Project does work in a very positive manner to help all South Africans become part of our new and wonderful country. As far as the Hylton Ross tours are concerned Kurts words could not explain it any better as to why I don’t agree with these type of what I call “gawk tours” Hylton Ross Tours might well put something back into the community (I really don’t know whether they do) but believe me the bottom line is what counts to them and they will promote a gawk tour to do so.
I dont know much about the Langa holding up of the bus other than I know that it happened. I never commented on it at all so apologies from you will be in order thank you!
So AfricaJ all I can tell you is that I am trying my damndest to build the new South Africa for us all and the above are only some of the ways in which I go about matters. I visit and work in townships close on to 5 times a week (3 days touring and two days working in the township). How many times do you put foot in a township? I dont need to be jealous of anybody in the tourguide industry, least of all Hylton Ross, as I have enough work for 300 days of the year and could fill 600 days if I wanted to. Ask the many Fodorites on this board whom I could not help tourwise because I was pre-booked when they needed me. Ask other tourguides who look at me jealously and ask how do you do it? The formula is simple love where you are, love the people around you, love what you do and MOST IMPORTANT do all sincerely. In this way I love my country and its peoples very very dearly.
I hate broadcasting all of the above and have never done so in public other than partially on my website. I say this because I DO NOT do what I do for the publicity, I do it for the genuine love of helping others, however with you cornering me so viciously in your mail you have lft me with no option but to defend myself with the above info.
Apologies will be accepted gracefully.
I remain <b>VERY VERY</b> proudly part of the wonderfulnation of South Africa
I am going to answer you in a one off mail and will not respond thereafter as I do not want to start a fight with you or anybody on this board as I dont think it is the pcase to do so.
I have never ever collected a single commission in 10 years from anybody and I am well known for this. On the other hand I have passed on many tourguide commissions to so many visitors to Cape Town amongst others many Fodorites simply to attract them to Cape Town. Please note I have not even toured with most of these people, I have simply helped them attain a discount. I take great pride in helping people who want to vsist our country in this manner. If you can prove differently be my guest. If you cant then hold your tongue!
You ask what do I do for the townships?
I run 12 different projects ranging from sending and paying for kids to go school (old Model C schools which cost believe me) to running two soup kitchens in Kayamandi (feeding 150 kids 8 times a month), a township near Stellenbosch. I run and pay for ballroom dancing classes as well as Afrocentric dance classes so as to attract kids off the streets in Kayamandi. I run special classes for kids to learn English so that they can move on to better schools who will only accept learners who can speak English. I find the teachers for the dancing and English classes and pay for them. All classes take place at the Ikamva Lethu centre
I run a project called fruit for kids whereby we feed 100 kids twice a week with a fruit. The fruit is bought from local spaza stores so that the moneys stay in the township. The kids all come from the Isibane Sempumulelo crèche in Kayamandi
I sponsor in its entirety uniforms, buses etc a teenage choir called Bana Bagotso (Children of peace). This choir practices and performs at the Ikamva Lethu centre and have cut a CD for which I paid for the total production costs
As already said most of the above takes place in a centre called the Ikamva Lethu Centre which is a large hall in Kayamandi that I have been hiring for the past 6 years. I take care of the total running expenses for the hall. Furthermore the hall has a full time manageress (Thembekazi Bangani) whose salary I pay. You dont want to even know how much the expense of doing this comes to.
Now lets go one step further. I do NOT accept tips from my visitors. I ask them to rather help me in the township of Kayamandi and believe me they do however they dont make up the total costs of running all these projects so guess what I give up about 50% of my profits from tourguiding to keep all the above projects alive and have been doing so for close on 8 years already.
In 2005 I was totally instrumental in sending two 10 year old kids who lived in a shack in Kayamandi on a jet for 10 days to London to stay with a British family who had toured with me in the past. They had a blast that they will never ever forget and I felt great about attaining this for them.
There are many other activities that I attain in the township, it is just that I dont want to start naming them all right now.
To all of the above I can tell you that there are so many visitors as well as Fodorites amongst others who could attest to all of the above. Furthermore all is 100% corroborated with pictures and videos on my website and let me tell you pictures don’t lie!
As far as Kurt is concerned I have never met or spoken to him but I can tell you that the project that he works for viz. the Ishabi project is a wonderful community based operation which helps many previously disadvantaged South Africans. Some of these folk are amongst others some of my fellow black South African tourguide friends. I would support the project all the way as the Ishabi Project does work in a very positive manner to help all South Africans become part of our new and wonderful country. As far as the Hylton Ross tours are concerned Kurts words could not explain it any better as to why I don’t agree with these type of what I call “gawk tours” Hylton Ross Tours might well put something back into the community (I really don’t know whether they do) but believe me the bottom line is what counts to them and they will promote a gawk tour to do so.
I dont know much about the Langa holding up of the bus other than I know that it happened. I never commented on it at all so apologies from you will be in order thank you!
So AfricaJ all I can tell you is that I am trying my damndest to build the new South Africa for us all and the above are only some of the ways in which I go about matters. I visit and work in townships close on to 5 times a week (3 days touring and two days working in the township). How many times do you put foot in a township? I dont need to be jealous of anybody in the tourguide industry, least of all Hylton Ross, as I have enough work for 300 days of the year and could fill 600 days if I wanted to. Ask the many Fodorites on this board whom I could not help tourwise because I was pre-booked when they needed me. Ask other tourguides who look at me jealously and ask how do you do it? The formula is simple love where you are, love the people around you, love what you do and MOST IMPORTANT do all sincerely. In this way I love my country and its peoples very very dearly.
I hate broadcasting all of the above and have never done so in public other than partially on my website. I say this because I DO NOT do what I do for the publicity, I do it for the genuine love of helping others, however with you cornering me so viciously in your mail you have lft me with no option but to defend myself with the above info.
Apologies will be accepted gracefully.
I remain <b>VERY VERY</b> proudly part of the wonderful
nation of South Africa
Mar 4th, 2007, 03:13 AM
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A couple of items to add to Selwyn's reply to AfricanJ:
Firstly, the information I provided was directly from the guides and community organisations who have firsthand knowledge of the matters concerned and with whom I have spoken myself. To state that my knowledge is "sadly lacking" is simply false. The opinions of the black tourism industry members that I work with regarding Hylton Ross (including current employees and guides of theirs) is exactly as I stated it:
"not highly regarded at the grassroots level or by the black industry when it comes to community and cultural tours"
I did not slate Hylton Ross as a company, and in fact went out of my way to be balanced in my statements.
Secondly, contributing to a trust is not a sufficient indicator of responsible community relationships. In some cases trust contributions are a payoff to buy access, it works well for PR and to ease their conscience, and it complies with both the BBBEE scorecard mandate and the pressure for corporate social investment, so it is far from a simple altruistic motivation on the part of any corporation. Charity encourages dependency and is not a sustainable way to develop tourism or uplift communities. What the community-based tourism destinations need is business, sustainable and fair business from the rest of the industry.
Finally, the community leaders and organisations we work with at Ishabi feel spoken down to and manipulated by Hylton Ross (and much of the mainstream industry it must be said). It is no accident that Cape Town Tourism has been mandated by the Premier and the Mayor to develop a code of conduct for community and cultural tours. Business practices such as these must change, and they will. You'll hear a lot more about this in May, which is Responsible Tourism month.
I'm happy to discuss this in more detail at anytime, but Fodor's is probably not the appropriate forum. In the future, I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't attack as your first contribution to the discussion. Feel free to contact me at your convenience, or to come to Ishabi and I'll arrange to have you meet some of the people we work with so you can better understand the issues for yourself.
Let's keep in mind that we all have the same goal, which is to help people have a wonderful and fulfilling visit to South Africa.
Kurt
http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com
Firstly, the information I provided was directly from the guides and community organisations who have firsthand knowledge of the matters concerned and with whom I have spoken myself. To state that my knowledge is "sadly lacking" is simply false. The opinions of the black tourism industry members that I work with regarding Hylton Ross (including current employees and guides of theirs) is exactly as I stated it:
"not highly regarded at the grassroots level or by the black industry when it comes to community and cultural tours"
I did not slate Hylton Ross as a company, and in fact went out of my way to be balanced in my statements.
Secondly, contributing to a trust is not a sufficient indicator of responsible community relationships. In some cases trust contributions are a payoff to buy access, it works well for PR and to ease their conscience, and it complies with both the BBBEE scorecard mandate and the pressure for corporate social investment, so it is far from a simple altruistic motivation on the part of any corporation. Charity encourages dependency and is not a sustainable way to develop tourism or uplift communities. What the community-based tourism destinations need is business, sustainable and fair business from the rest of the industry.
Finally, the community leaders and organisations we work with at Ishabi feel spoken down to and manipulated by Hylton Ross (and much of the mainstream industry it must be said). It is no accident that Cape Town Tourism has been mandated by the Premier and the Mayor to develop a code of conduct for community and cultural tours. Business practices such as these must change, and they will. You'll hear a lot more about this in May, which is Responsible Tourism month.
I'm happy to discuss this in more detail at anytime, but Fodor's is probably not the appropriate forum. In the future, I'd appreciate it if you wouldn't attack as your first contribution to the discussion. Feel free to contact me at your convenience, or to come to Ishabi and I'll arrange to have you meet some of the people we work with so you can better understand the issues for yourself.
Let's keep in mind that we all have the same goal, which is to help people have a wonderful and fulfilling visit to South Africa.
Kurt
http://afrikatourism.blogspot.com
Mar 4th, 2007, 06:55 AM
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Kurt,
i see your problem. YOU ARE BEING MIS-INFORMED. I in fact spoke to the driver and the guide who were involved. So i know who it was but again i do not slander others to try and win clients.
Selwyn,
respect to you for what you do in the Townships.
However, it is clear that you have very very little idea of the involvement of larger companies in the Townships.
You are completely missing my point. I gave you a chance to appologise, not to advertise.
I get the picture that both of you are involved in the tourism industry and that you are now openly lying, because
surely you know that coaches that go into the Townships are on Hire. Therefore the coach companies may not interfere with the programme.
Fodorites are asking you tell them what would work for them, not to air your gripes and express your misgivings.I fear we ahave begun to see the other side of you.
Hylton Ross Tours have trained many black tourist guides. There is no organisation that does not have issues.
Are you really trying to build a new South Africa or a business.
Tell us again why you are broadcasting that you do not take comm. etc
Do you not realise that big businesses also employ black and coloured people
Please stop misleading people and give them choices to decide for themselves.
You should not even have mentioned another companies name in this regard.
Sorry, no apologies from me
i see your problem. YOU ARE BEING MIS-INFORMED. I in fact spoke to the driver and the guide who were involved. So i know who it was but again i do not slander others to try and win clients.
Selwyn,
respect to you for what you do in the Townships.
However, it is clear that you have very very little idea of the involvement of larger companies in the Townships.
You are completely missing my point. I gave you a chance to appologise, not to advertise.
I get the picture that both of you are involved in the tourism industry and that you are now openly lying, because
surely you know that coaches that go into the Townships are on Hire. Therefore the coach companies may not interfere with the programme.
Fodorites are asking you tell them what would work for them, not to air your gripes and express your misgivings.I fear we ahave begun to see the other side of you.
Hylton Ross Tours have trained many black tourist guides. There is no organisation that does not have issues.
Are you really trying to build a new South Africa or a business.
Tell us again why you are broadcasting that you do not take comm. etc
Do you not realise that big businesses also employ black and coloured people
Please stop misleading people and give them choices to decide for themselves.
You should not even have mentioned another companies name in this regard.
Sorry, no apologies from me
