27 good value tips in Paris

Old Jan 8th, 2004, 02:04 PM
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
27 good value tips in Paris

Someone emailed me asking for tips about our visit to
France.
Here are a few 'value' tips from our experience.
We visited in May 2003.
In general, France is more expensive than America -
forget Walmart, SAMS Club, Costco, and
their prices. Bring an umbrella. We paid $12 for a
cheap umbrella which would have been worth $3 here.
The euro is even more expensive today, so
consciously try to forget the exchange rate
and avoid comparing too much with the great deals
at home.
thanks,
Anil Philip (with help from Rita!)
Kansas City, KS

0. We stayed at the Comfort Inn Abaca which was a good
value as part of the Europe Express package tour, but
more expensive ($80/night) if you try to extend your
stay. It was extremely clean, rooms were small and
their breakfast very good. The front desk staff are
helpful.

1. Pickpockets: Avoid them (heh-heh!). I never met
any perhaps because I do not look like a rich American
tourist. Walmart sells a $7 money belt which was
useful. However the best thing to do is simply put
your wallet in your front trouser pocket and then when
entering crowded places, put one hand inside the
pocket, directly and firmly gripping the wallet. Avoid
getting in the subway when there is a crush - you're
on holiday and can take the next train, so sit around
and watch the people.

2. Guidebooks: If you follow them too closely, then
your trip becomes a canned Rick Steve's or Fodor's or
Frommer's tour. However I found Rick Steve's detailed
museum tours very useful (though my wife didnt like
his book too much). Frommer's has a detailed map.
Borrow all (and videos) from the public library to get
a feel for them before you decide to buy any of them.

3. A picnic lunch on the lawns of the Rodin museum is
nice. His work was In My Humble Opinion, over-rated
and the sculpture of Balzac was disgustingly silly and
vulgar. However his mistress' work of the threesome in
a struggle for Rodin was poignant and touching.

4. Perhaps the best site (and the least well known)
for me was the Holocaust memorial directly behind the
Notre Dame cathedral. Remembering it still gives me
the goosebumps. You go down a spiral staircase as
though into a dungeon and inside, it is as though you
are in prison, in Hades, in the pit. You can see the
rays of light streaming in from above, but cannot go
to it. A plaque on the floor reads, (paraphrase) "they
went down into the earth, were swallowed up and were
never seen again".

5. The War memorial Museum at Caen was good but for
me the American section in the gardens outside, was
unforgettable. There is a spring (actually a pool)
that goes over a waterfall and the water flows over a
plaque that reads "From the heart of our land flows
the blood of our youth, given to you in the name of
freedom.". President Chirac needs to see this.


6. Do not use your credit card - use an ATM. I found
that Visa charges a processing fee and on top of it,
they skim off (cheat) by charging a higher exchange
rate than what the market rate is.

7. When you are out, you can get great sandwiches at
charcuteries (deli) places that are good value.

8. Ed Epicier is a great grocery store with very cheap
foods and wines. It is next to the supermarket (forgot
the name but do not go there) at the Convention
terminus (near our hotel).

9. If you are visiting other places, stay at Etap (a
clean Motel 6)

10. Ask specifically for the Carte Orange in french,
they will try to sell you the tourist pass, but resist
it.

11. try to attend one of the Sunday concerts at the
cathedral at Notre dame - it's free and wonderful.

12. Read the "Hunchback of Notre Dame" before you visit
France, and then go up the towers.

13. My wife and I are from India but my wife speaks
reasonably fluent french, so people were bewildered
when I wore my USA T-shirt about. At the cathedral, I
gave one frenchman our camera to take our picture and
he seemed very upset and irritated - only because my
wife asked him, did he agree. Much later on, I
realized I had been wearing my USA stars and stripes
T-shirt!

14. Take film from here. One roll over there costs over
$5 - here, walmart sells a pack of 4 rolls for that
price!

15. the Seine river cruise is worth it. at night it is
romantic.

16. Avoid Rue Cler - there was absolutely nothing
worth seeing - it has become yet another touristy spot
after thousands of favourable reviews. However, the
crepe stand is nice with delicious Grand Marnier
crepes for $3 - but you can get that most places.

17. Get used to seeing dog poop, pee on the streets
and the smell of human urine in the subway station.

18. One of my most memorable memories was listening to
the poor street musicians at the subway play so
superbly. the French are not generous (to put it
mildly) so even if we gave them just one euro ($1.25),
they were happy.

19. My wife liked the Louvre a lot perhaps because she
could understand french. I did not. Because they are
rather chauvinistic, all titles, everything almost, is
in french which was annoying - since it is designated
as a UN monument - so I had to get her to translate
everything. If you are ever in Kansas City, visit the
Nelson Atkins museum - it has more and better art by
the great masters, Monet, Rodin, Van Gogh and it's
free.

20. Be patriotic, support your troops in Iraq - dont
apologise but dont argue either - simply explain the
righteousness of our cause.

21. Strike up conversations in the subway - we did
meet nice people this way!

22. Emmanuel Baptist Church is a nice church in Paris
http://perso.wanadoo.fr/ebcparis/ We were unable to
visit.

23. Near the hotel, there is a laundry. It is about $7
a load.

24. Other places we liked. the creme brulee at Le
Colimacon was out of this world! It is near the Hotel
de Ville at the Pont Noeuf bridge. Chartier is cheap
but the food is bland and tasteless to cater to the
tourist. Not worth it.
Thanks to editor Pauline Frommer for pointing us to
Le Colimacon - formerly habited by President Pompidou.

25. Go to Notre Dame for the view. Also Sacre Coeur.
Samaritaine roof-top was closed and they charge a fee
to go up there. However if you buy anything from their
store, they will let you to the roof with your
receipt.

26. Get the Insider's good value guide to France free
from the french embassy website. Get it now - it takes
about a week to arrive.

27. At Saint Chapelle, try to recognise and pick out
the Bible stories from the stained glass windows. It
is fun. I was even able to recite the story of Esther
to the entire tourist group there - to applause - and
the official Cathedral guide (who did not know the
story) took it very well!
Anil is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 02:24 PM
  #2  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
How many museums in the USA have the explantions printed in anything other than English?
jody is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 02:25 PM
  #3  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,637
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hi
I don't agree with all of your statements, but I'll comment that the memorial behind Notre Dame is a Deportation Memorial for all those deported to death camps. It is not specifically a memorial for what is considered the (Jewish) Holocaust (the Shoah).

Okay, I can't resist one more comment.
"Because they are chauvinistic almost everything is in French..."?
It's the local language, UN monument (?)notwithstanding. Here in New York, all museum captions (except perhaps at ethnic museums) are in English, as I also find them to be in London.
elaine is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 02:41 PM
  #4  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 499
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks for your tips Anil. It was fun to read. I did have to laugh at:
"19. My wife liked the Louvre a lot perhaps because she
could understand french. I did not. Because they are
rather chauvinistic, all titles, everything almost, is
in french which was annoying - since it is designated
as a UN monument - so I had to get her to translate
everything. If you are ever in Kansas City, visit the
Nelson Atkins museum - it has more and better art by
the great masters, Monet, Rodin, Van Gogh and it's
free."

Damn French not writing in English! haha! That's a good one! Also I'm going to have to point out that "better art" is really a poor statement. Although the Kansas musuem may have some pieces you like "better" it is not nessisarily because they are better works of art.
Wendy is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 03:10 PM
  #5  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,305
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
A couple additional observations:
1.I realize that what art appeals to a person is very subjective. However, I think you resorted to a bit of hyperbole when you say that the Nelson Atkins Museum in Kansas City has more and better art by the masters than the Louvre.
2. You contradict yourself. When discussing the Rodin Museum, you comment that you feel his sculture is overrated. Yet, you later refer to him as one of the masters (as in comment #1 above).
HowardR is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 03:23 PM
  #6  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 49,560
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
A few good tips here, but I must say I disagree about Rue Cler. If it's good enough for Cathérine Deneuve to go shopping on, it's good - and "authentic" - enough for me!

The Smithsonian museums here in DC are all very chauvinistic, too - isn't it a shame? All the signs only in English, and with such an international crowd coming to DC all the time! You'd think they'd wise up!

If you went looking in the Louvre for all those great Impressionist paintings that abound in Kansas City, there's a reason you were disappointed - they're in the Musée d'Orsay (and Marmottan and a few other places).

Etap is a shoe store, a nice chain, but I'd rather sleep in an Etape motel.

There's some very solid advice here, even though I'm taking issue with a few items.
StCirq is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 03:41 PM
  #7  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,182
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Interesting comments. I am glad that you saw the Deportation Memorial, the beams of light, each representing a person, are not something you forget, it's very moving.

Instead of bothering your wife translating all of those pesky chauvinistic signs in the Louvre, you should have rented an audio guide and then you would have understood what you were looking at.

I have an open mind about other people's view on art, but I have never heard Rodin referred to as silly & overrated. But at least now I know where they put all the 'good art' I was wondering where it all went!
Margie is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 04:00 PM
  #8  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,534
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 1 Post
The only think I agree with is not to go by Rick Steves or Fodors, make your own trip and experiences, not a copy cat tour of places like rue cler where Steves has drawn too many Americans to that I felt like I was at our local farmer's market.
cigalechanta is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 05:51 PM
  #9  
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 388
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
All of you need a good dictionary. The word you're looking for is not "chauvinistic." That means, for all intents and purposes, "male-centric." That means, for those of you *sans* dictionary (we're on a French board, right?), "male-oriented." If you don't know what that means, go buy a dictionary. The word you want is "xenophobic." The French language is not "chauvinistic," nor are the French people. They are, though, xenophobic, occasionaly, especially with Americans. Get over it. Go to New York City and tell me that all Americans are jerks. Same thing holds true for Parisians. They're xenophobic. And by the way...that means "afraid of foreigners." Capishe? That's not French, incidentally...
absolutkz is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 05:54 PM
  #10  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 11,212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Hi Anil,

I'd like to know more about the Louvre being a UN monument.

Thanks,
adrienne is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 06:19 PM
  #11  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,330
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
France is more expensive, generally than the US?

I don't think so. I slept in a decent two star in Paris last December for 60 euro a night. Try to find anything in NYC for that price.

If you get outside of Paris ('cause guess what Paris is NOT all that France has to offer) you can find hotels even less expensive.

And the food? Oo-la-la, try telling me that the foie gras in Cognac with a glass of slightly sweet wine for 14 euro isn't a better deal than the Cracker Barrel in Edinburgh, Indiana and we'll really have a discussion.
indytravel is offline  
Old Jan 8th, 2004, 06:41 PM
  #12  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,749
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Stop the presses. All those other art critics were wrong. The true master critic says Rodin's sculpture of Balzac is disgustingly silly and vulgar. At last! A real opinion from an expert. Thanks for setting us straight! Let me write that down in my Walmart notebook with my K-Mart pen.

Oh and the nerve of those tacky French, putting the labels up in the Louvre in French. Can you imagine such a thing? More info for my Walmart essentials.

And thank God somebody finally told us the museum in Kansas City is so much better than the Louvre. I should have known all along!
Patrick is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 10:40 AM
  #13  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 34,839
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I thought some of that was supposed to be a satire, I wasn't sure. LIke the part about being sure to tell people how patriotic you are and the righteousness of "our cause". There were some decent points for beginners, though, although I also disagree with the remark about the signs in the Louvre. I think it would be nice if they had some multilingual signs (I think I have been in some museum that did, but I can't recall which -- it is very rare, however). I think you can easily solve that problem with the headphones or decent guidebook, anyway. The name of the painting and artist needs no translation, anyway.

ON a related linguistic note, however, I'm afraid it is you absolutkz who needs a good dictionary. Chauvin was a Frenchman, actually, and the original and common meaning of "chauvinism" is excessive, blind patriotism. The sexist angle was a co-opting of that term much later. Did you look in a dictionary before you wrote that post? If so, you have a very bad one. Chauvinism is perhaps a better word for what Anil meant than xenophobia, actually.
Christina is online now  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 10:49 AM
  #14  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,937
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks for your list of tips. Some very good suggestions. Everyone should go to the Deportation Memorial. I must admit I could only good once. It is the most moving tribute the the "lost ones" I have seen. Never forget.
Elainee is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 11:28 AM
  #15  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 496
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
thanks, christina, i was about to jump on that pony (re: def. of chauvanism) myself.

in my opinion, anil makes some good points and some poor or mixed.

paris, in fact, can be way more expensive than the US if you're talking hard goods such as clothing, home furnishings etc. but for food and lodging, it is way cheap for what one gets (particularly in the food catagory).

monoprix cannot compete with walmart nor galleries lafayette or samartaine compete with even the high end american department store in price or, frankly in quality. there are good reasons for this, but let it best be said that anil is right about that aspect.

on the other hand, i challenge any one american city dweller to eat and drink, item for item at a better price than paris be it restaurant, cafe or market.

the art comments are silly. but he did make the caveat that he wasn't the artsie side of the couple.

one dangerous suggestion is that you keep your money et al in your front pocket with your hand inside. first of all the hand position tells the prospective thief exactly where the valuables are. the question then becomes would you rather be mugged or pickpocketed?

my suggestion: carry about twenty euros, one credit card (amex) and a copy of your passport in your pocket. carry your atm credit card, another copy of the passport and other cash in the top of calf length stockings (for men) or thigh highs (for the ladies). rarely will a thief look at a gift horse score a second time.

many of the other tips seem okay to me.
subcon is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 11:57 AM
  #16  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,736
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I, too, am interested in the "UN" reference.

Will make sure to visit the Deportation Museum when next in Paris. It really does sound exceptionally moving.

Ahhhhhh.... ED. I miss that store so much from when I lived in Paris many, many moons ago. I wish there were an ED in Manhattan. ED wine, ED bread, ED cheese...
michelleNYC is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 12:15 PM
  #17  
ChatNoir
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Anil, I think you made some very good points, and that was commendable since so many others never bother to do so. Guess you learned that expressing a strong opinion about art is always bound to draw fire. For what its worth, I think you got pounded worse than you deserved on those points.
 
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 12:51 PM
  #18  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
i agree chatnoir.. I mean although some of the comments werent well thought out before posting (the signs in the museum) most of the points i thought were helpful (me being a firstimer to europe in about 4 days) So thanks anil for some tips...
airo2x is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 01:19 PM
  #19  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,380
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Well, Anil, you certainly call 'em as you see 'em, which is fair enough (although I would put your subjective part separate from your practical 'tips' part next time.)

re #19 - I don't know about 'more and better' art being available this side but I would agree that there are certainly amazing collections of art to be found in off-the-beaten track places. Last time I was in Fredericton, N.B., a member of the Jordanian royal family and his entourage was being taken through the Beaverbrook, which at least says I'm not the only one who enjoys that small and eclectic collection. So I'm quite prepared to believe that there's something similar in Kansas City.
Sue_xx_yy is offline  
Old Jan 9th, 2004, 03:27 PM
  #20  
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
hmm some good tips - at least someone took the time to type them - we're all entitled to our opinions, it's a free country after all - just enjoy the tips, take the ones that make sense and leave out the rest. simple. why do people get nasty?! He just gave his opinions.
vacation03 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -