What's with all the raping going on in Central Park?
 

I have read in the paper that gangs are attacking young women in central park and raping and/or robbing them. Is NYC reverting back to its old ways? Is it safe? Some of my girlfriends and I are traveling there in July and have become a little concerned for our safety. Can someone reassure us out there?

HI Jill , I do not live in NY so I cannot give you a full answer the matter in fact I would like to know too. <BR>What I believe from reading the NYTImes is that these inexcusable and terrible incidents happended at the same time that there was some kind of parade or something like that, things obviously went out of hand. It is a sign of the difficul times we live in. <BR>However I do not think this is a trend and I am sure that Mayor Giuliani and the Police Department will continue working towards a safe NY, for those who live there, and for us mere tourists ( although some tourists like me are also former Newyorkers....)I for one have tickets and reservation for September and of course will be there , ...my heart goes to the people that were attacked specially to the women, <BR>and if I lived there I would know exactly how to vote. Best wishes.have a safe and great stay in the most exciting city in the world. <BR>

What paper is that exactly that you're reading? That has been in the news regarding rowdy gangs of men attacking women (minor assault and some robbery) after the Puerto Rican Day parade in Central Park South but I've seen no account anywhere of rapes, and I read some of the better national newspapers (NYTimes, etc) so that's why I was wondering what news sources said there were rapes. I would suggest you not hang out in Central Park, I'd think that should be sufficient. I wouldn't ever do that anyway, although as an out-of-towner, I realize we may have more fear of Central Park than some New Yorkers do. I finally conquered my fear of the NY subway on my last visit and am glad I did as it was a lot more convenient for off-Broadway, etc, and wasn't bad, however I still wouldn't take it at unpopulated times or late at night. And I must say, Mr. Giuliani ought to do something to improve the subways; they are really not very good for safety reasons in terms of their lighting, etc. I've never seen one in any major city as unprotected and dark as some of the entrances to them. That made me very uncomfortable (I'm thinking of particular one near Times Square, probably about 56th St and Broadway where you have to go down in a very dark small courtyard type area that isn't exposed to view much before going into the stairs. They're pretty dirty and decrepit, also, but I wasn't scared on them except for some of those entrances. At least given the press this has received, police surveillance will probably be beefed-up, so perhaps you can look at it that way.

There was a single incident of a couple women being molested after the Puerto Rican Day Parade. However, I allowed my 16 year old daughter to go to that parade with her friends and they all came back unscathed; I will let her go next year, too. NY City will never be fully safe, nor will any other big city. You have to be on your guard and take appropriate precautions.

Some of the above reports are wrong in both directions. There were no rapes. There were some sexual attacks, fondling, etc. On the other side of the reports, it was more than two. As of 6 this evening about 24 women reported being attacked. <BR>Speaking as a New Yorker, this unfortunate incident--and it indeed was unfortunate--is/was an aberration. However, I'm sure I speak for most New Yorkers (at least I hope I do!) when I say we are embarrassed about it. <BR>But, at the same time, please don't let it color your opinion of our great city! It's still a great place to visit...and to live!

Bobby Knight was quoted, a few years ago, as saying "if you're getting raped, you might as well just lay back and enjoy it". <BR>Maybe once he's finally tossed out of Indiana he can move to New York and run against Hillary. I'd pay admission to watch that debate.

Lady, what's your point? You've pick a wrong place to attempt (and I do mean attempt) humor. What happened in New York really isn't funny!

Howard is right, this unfortunate incident was a complete abberation. The fallout will likely include a stepped-up and more cooperative police presence at the park during and after future parades. Speaking as a woman who lives in NYC, I won't stay out of the park during the day, and neither should visitors. Central Park is a great part of the city, especially in the summer, and has been quite safe in recent years; it would be a shame for you to miss out on it.

I've worked in the anti-rape movement for nearly 20 years. (Unfortunately, I still have a very busy job.) <BR> <BR>Sexual assaults happen in Central Park and big cities and they happen in sleepy little towns. And, the reality is that about 75% of the time, women are assaulted by someone with whom they are acquainted. This doesn't mean you don't to have to worry about sexual violence in Central Park, or anywhere else for that matter. But being aware and trusting your instincts about people and places is a good place to start. <BR> <BR>I strongly urge you to call your local rape crisis center to get accurate information about sexual assault, safety and self-defense information, and support for you and your friends so you can all enjoy your trip to New York. <BR> <BR>For resources in California, you can call toll-free 1-888-CALCASA and be directed to the rape crisis center nearest you. <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>

A Couple of women???? About 25 at last count. <BR> <BR>This parade has got to stop. Peurto Ricans are all a bunch of animals. They cry dicrimination at the drop of a hat. I say if you act like a jungle animal, you should be treated like one. That means shot and hung out to dry!! Message here, if you are a white law abiding citizen, stay out of the city when the trash takes over. <BR> <BR>I say ship them all back to their damn third world island. We don't want them here.

I have heard that there were no rapes <BR>at the Puerto Rican day parade. A few <BR>women were asked to remove their clothing and were sprayed by the water <BR>but nothing serious, just Puerto Ricans <BR>having fun. I would stay out of the city on that day though.

Darling "Mad": <BR> <BR>Misspelling Puerto Rico twice within the span of two sentences says a lot about your intelligence, wit, and worthless "opinion".

Oh!!! The ever so effective "you can't spell" routine. Give it up darling...I was not the one harassing innocent white women, one as young as 17. <BR> <BR>In my book the only appropriate spelling for these animals is D-E-A-D

What normal white woman would go near <BR>the Puerto Rican day parade?

So this is the first time you have heard about rapes in NYC, specifically Central Park? It happens all the time, day and night, not just during parades. Unfortunetly, woman in NYC should not venture alone especially if you are new to the city, during parades I have always chosen to stay home because it is usually a bunch of drunk men (including cops) causing all sorts or problems. <BR> <BR>I lived in NYC for over two years and never had a problem, but that doesn't mean they don't exist and I took precautions in most instances. Just be on your toes and be safe.

"Just Puerto Ricans having a little fun? Women were ASKED to remove their clothes?" <BR> <BR>Please! And certain minorities wonder why an average American doesn't want them living next door - this incident would certainly fall into the realm of what I wouldn't want happening in my neighborhood!

Having just returned last month from NYC, I was shocked to read about this. We spent hours walking everywhere in Central Park. This was a ghastly business and NOT FUN. Two french tourists and lots of misc. women got terrorized. I was stranger raped on public transportation many years ago when I was very young. (See the BOYCOTT gas thread if you are interested.)Don't like to hear about anyone going through this - it changes your whole mind set for most of your life.I took the subway to the Bronx and all over just last month. It was a bit confusing but people were helpful and there were crowds everywhere that behaved in a peaceable manner. I have seen crowd <BR>terror in my youth in Chicago and have also been caught in a stampede at a sporting event. Because I love to travel and always give people a chance until I see them "doing me wrong"- I can understand how some people might think this is "prankful" if no one is actually raped or hurt. NOT NOT NOT. The verbal assault / threat and group intimidation (as on Chicago buses in my youth also) leaves a lifetime memory that is NEVER forgotten. Don't let anyone get turned "off" from doing NYC over this, please. Manhattan was as fine as any major city can be. FINER. But one last comment--- someone expressed great anger about another poster commenting in a Chicago thread about not going into a "bad neighborhood"- for a blues band /jazz evening. Called that person a bigot and a lot more. RUDENESS This is the truth. THERE ARE BAD NEIGHBORHOODS. This is not a perfect world. Even in large groups- racial incidents HAPPEN. We who have witnessed things are not going to pretend that we didn't see what we have seen (or have seen destroyed what was once beautiful.) Chicago is much better than it was 20 years ago. Thank you, Mayor Daley for Navy Pier and lots and lots of other good things. Hope this nasty group stuff doesn't catch on here.

"A few women were asked to remove their clothing"..ASKED? More like had all their clothing RIPPED off their bodies by mobs of men. In front of witnesses and I have read policemen who did NOTHING. To me that is the shocking thing...that the police did nothing even though they knew these attacks were happening right near them. That's NYC for you.

So, we have a bigot in our midst, and an uneducated one at that. Well, I'll just assume that you are white and not, say, Puerto Rican. If that is the case, you should recall that "your kind" is responsible for a good deal of the mass murder, assasination and serial killing in this country. When was the last time the "lone gunman" had brown skin? A few times(Sirhan Sirhan, Colin Ferguson, World Trade Center, that guy in Pennsylvania recently)? On the other hand, white males seem quite willing to spray a crowd with bullets. It's really a who's who of high-profile death and destruction: Tim McVeigh and his buddies, John Hinkley, George Wallace's assasin, MLK's assasin, Harvey Milk's assasin, JFK's assassin, Ted Bundy, Luby's gunman, McDonald's gunman, day trading center killing, Pettit and Martin law firm massacre, Columbine and every other school shooting save one. Get the point? Look in the mirror, please. <BR> <BR>I think we all feel a loss of personal security in this country due to all of the violence. It is a tragedy. To pin it on one group is unfair and factually incorrect. So the next time you feel the need to avoid a brown-skinned person because of your biases, be careful that you don't walk into the path of some guy who had a fight with his wife and has decided to end it all and take you out with him. <BR> <BR>I hope no one was offended by this post, but it was the best way I could figure out to take on an outrageous bigot. Besides, some of my best friends are white. :)

This is certainly not a "black and white" issue. I think most of the people posting to this topic are racist <BR>(black and white as well). To pinpoint <BR>a racial group and say that they are <BR>the cause of all the problems is certainly a racist statement. It is a shame that we make a black and white issue out of it so quickly.

Hi ..... <BR> <BR>I live in England & all I know of this incident is what I read in the English newspapers & see on the TV. <BR> <BR>The English press is asking if this had been a Irish (ie white) parade, would the police have allowed the people to get away with it ?? The press says no ... They ask are the police terrified of doing anything in case they get accused of being racist ... what do people think ?? <BR> <BR>I find it incrediable that in a country which is meant to be civilised, the police can stand by & watch ... over 25 women were attacked/degraded/molested/robbed etc etc ... this happened over a mile in Central Park ... it was even videoed by tourists .... yet nothing was done .... why ??? ask yourself that .... <BR> <BR>I certainly don't blame all Puerto Ricans ... it's like blaming all whites for the sins of their forefathers ... <BR> <BR>But these people should be caught/tried/imprisioned ... <BR> <BR>As to those people who dismiss this as a minor incident ... well I find this incrediable ..... <BR> <BR>IGOR .... how can everyone who posts to this topic be classed as racists ... ?? <BR> <BR>To i ([email protected]): Anyone going to NY (ie tourist) would go to Central Park .... why not ... how are they meant not to know not to go .... <BR> <BR>Mark <BR> <BR> <BR>

Mark, the English press seems to have gotten it wrong. A couple of years ago during the "Irish" parade a gang beat up and killed a kid. No cops intervened. In both cases it was police negligence. The cops can't be everywhere, but when there are hundreds of cops out monitoring the event they should have gotten wind of the crime. <BR> <BR>It is unclear whether any cops witnessed any of the attacks. It is clear that they were told of the attacks by some victims and did not intervene. What is probably at work with the NYC Police, as well as with some people on this board is an ability to dismiss or laugh off male attacks on woman. Many men don't think it's a big deal if woman are grabbed, groped and stripped. If you disagree with that statement remember there were probably over fifty men participating in the attacks and many more standing and watching, along with the cops who didn't stop it. It also explains why the NYC Police Commissioner and Mayor were at first so dismissive of the seriousness of the charges, at least until the tapes showed up. They have been very responsive since then. <BR> <BR>Lastly, we in the US don't understand how almost yearly kids are killed in riots Britain at soccer matches. I guess every "civilized" society has it's problems. <BR> <BR> <BR>

So many people on this thread are stereotyping -- labelling an entire place or group based on isolated incidents. Even the initial question -- "Is NYC reverting back to its old ways?" -- is a stereotype. New York is just a place. It is not capable of being "safe" or "unsafe." INDIVIDUALS are dangerous or safe. ENTIRE ETHNIC GROUPS are not dangerous or safe, they are just groups, made up of individuals, and it is the individuals who behaved horrendously and deserve to be punished, not the group. Likewise, Central Park is neither safe nor unsafe, it's just a place, and at any given time it will have lots of good people and, yes, some bad people in it. And yes, you have to be careful no matter where you are, but even if you are careful, something bad may happen to you. But the same is true anywhere. Remember last summer a couple of women were kidnapped in one of our national parks? My point is, it can happen anywhere, but individuals are responsible for the behavior, not entire ethnic groups. <BR>By the way -- yes, it is true that most crimes of violence are committed by men. <BR>And women of all races are far more likely to be victims of crime than men. <BR>So to the extent you want to make an issue out of stereotypes, why not make it a gender issue rather than a racial one? Because obviously it is ridiculous to say "men commit most crimes and women are victims of most crimes so therefore men are bad and women are good." Labelling entire races or genders or cities on the basis of the behavior of some evil individuals is just wrong. <BR> <BR>That said, what happened to those women makes me sick, and I hope they catch every person involved and send them to jail.

This is just a statement on my recollection of the last year’s parade and not an indictment. I was in the city on business during the PR parade. As I was walking through the crowds trying to get back to my hotel, as a female I was embarrassed because of the suggestive behavior and titillating dress of some of the young women in the crowds. These are the same mixed messages that go out at Mardi Gras. I know, I know, I know….it shouldn’t matter what the behavior is, it shouldn’t warrant this reaction from the males.

Correct as usual Cindy. Dear, igor - too bad you can't follow logical argument. Cindy did not classify this problem as a race issue "Mad" did. (In an unbelievably bigoted way I might add!) Cindy merely correctly pointed out that too much killing is done and it often is done by non-minorities! Get a clue.

I have lived about 200 yards from Central Park for the last 10 years. Tourists should not hesitate to visit NY and Central Park during the day. It is a great place. I, however, will say this about the Puerto Rican Day parade and this is not a bigotted (sp?) response. New Yorkers not otherwise involved with the parade uniformly try to avoid this more than any other single event.

Hi Steve.... <BR> <BR>Thanks for putting me straight on that ... all I will say is the police appeared to play down the incident/laugh it off ... what if there hadn't been any video ?? <BR> <BR>I certainly do believe it is a terrible crime ... that is what made me respond in the 1st place ... <BR> <BR>As to kids getting killed at British soccer games yearly .... eh where ??? About 10 years ago there was an incidence at a ground where 93 fans were killed .... most of them were crushed/sufficated ... but wasn't down to a riot, but the fact police allowed to many fans in to one section ... <BR> <BR>I've been going to games for about 20 years (oh dear I getting old !!) & in all that time I've only ever seen 1 incident .... <BR> <BR>I suspect it is all a matter of perspective .... I wouldn't feel safe travelling around NYC public transport, yet would quite happily do the same in London ... for NYers it might be the other way round. <BR> <BR>Mark

Please end this post now or it will be removed. This is a forum for travel and travel related questions, comments, etc. This is not a place to debate non-travel issues. Please go to cnn.com, cspan.com or somewhere else to debate those issues. Thank you

How timely: more than 350 soccer fans were jalied this week for fighting/rioting at the Euro 2000 matches. <BR> <BR>Go away whoever is trying to impersonate the forum Moderator. They'll yank your access if you're not careful.

Last night Dateline had a 1-hour program on this. It showed the tapes and interviewed both victims and on-lookers. At last count over 50 women were molested. <BR> <BR>The non-reaction of the police is quite understandable given their recent problems when they have reacted with force in justified circumstances. <BR> <BR>I feel the police were sending a message: "this is what your city will be like if the normal law-abiding citizen refuses to speak up for us". <BR> <BR>Travel to NYC? Yes, but as in any city exercise caution. Change your path/route if you spot a "gang" ahead. Avoid darker less traveled routes at night. Etc. etc. <BR>

"Reacted with force in justified circumstances"? Um, how exactly is it "justified" to shoot a man 41 times because he's reaching for his wallet? Or to shoot and kill another man because he gets ticked off at being approached an undercover cop posing as a guy selling drugs? (How dare that man get huffy with our undercover drug pusher! He was supposed to buy something so we could arrest him!) <BR> <BR>I have dated a cop and I have the utmost respect for what they do, but that doesn't trump their need to be responsibile for their actions. Marion, if you honestly think that police officers can and should respond to legitimate inquiries into the deaths of innocent, unarmed men at the hands of police officers by ignoring blatant acts of violence and sexual molestation right in front of their eyes...then I feel tremendously sorry for you.