Suggestions for 2 weeks in National Parks - early October
 

Hello all,

I'm excited to have the green light to plan for a two week trip to the US in early October and have set my eyes on a mostly scenic national park trip with driving throughout. I'm considering landing either:

1. Seattle (for parks such as North Cascades NP, Mount Rainier NP, Glacier NP, Yellowstone NP and Grand Teton NP)
2. San Francisco or LA (for parks such as Yosemite NP, Kings Canyon NP, Sequoia NP, Grand Canyon NP, Zion NP, Bryce Canyon NP, Capitol Reef NP and Arches NP).

I'm wary those listed above are way more than I could fit in two weeks. Some I've listed as it looked 'along the way' and could benefit with a brief photo opportunity. But as a preliminary direction on which area to look into, would those with experience have any suggestions on which having the better parks in the first two week of October considering things such as scenery, weather, seasonal road and facility closures, flora/fauna, and crowds (or anything else).

Will be travelling with a couple of others and I plan on renting a car throughout the trip. I have not had any experience with national parks in the US though we do enjoy viewing natural scenery and landscape including the nature in Iceland, alps in central Europe and rural islands in Japan. Not athletic but enjoy basic walks/hikes of 2-4 hours on end (longer walks only if the reward is proportionately more, otherwise probably prefer seeing a few more different places). We enjoy photography a lot and would describe ourselves as enthusiasts. We would not prefer overnight camping. I would expect spending maybe 2 days in a big city and a bit of outlet shopping (this won't be determinative of where we go but timing to be factored in).

Grateful for any thoughts or pointers. I have browsed the National Parks Service website and they do list road closure seasons/times. I also have on hand some guide books (including Fodor's and National Geographic). However, what I can't tell with my basic knowledge so far is whether those roads are crucial in enjoying/traversing that park (e.g. Sun Road in Glacier NP). Whittling down some parks and directional pointers would be much appreciated so I could focus my research a little (would be quite impossible to figure out the attractions, routes and potential road closures for 10+ parks).

Thanks!

I've been to almost all of those parks in October. Both itineraries can work. The northern one will have fewer people but you'll also need to be more flexible. The road closure dates listed on the NPS website are the latest possible dates that the roads can be open. There could be temporary or earlier than scheduled seasonal closures due to weather. Accommodations on the northern itinerary will also be more limited as some will have already closed for the season and you may need to deal with snow/ice. Try to get to Glacier as early as possible during your time frame if you decide to include it. Here are monthly park visitation stats https://irma.nps.gov/Stats/SSRSRepor...r%29?Park=YELL

For the northern parks, if you land in Seattle I'd probably catch a second flight to someplace like Bozeman (Montana) or Jackson (Wyoming) and do the Rocky Mountain parks as soon as possible, returning to Seattle when you're done. The return airfare will be around $220 - $260, and will save at least three and possibly four days of driving. Even so, you will need to play it by ear in Yellowstone or Glacier NPs; I've been snowed on in Yellowstone in August, and don't forget that daylight hours will be declining. The same goes for higher elevations in Mount Rainier NP; going on Park Service guidelines is risky. There will be good autumn color in all of the northern national parks.

In California, the issue with Yosemite is that October is the peak of the forest fire season, and by then some/most of the famous waterfalls in the park will be trickles or even dry. It can also still be quite hot. If it was me, I'd probably focus on the red rock national parks in Arizona and Utah then; the high altitude of those parks will make for superb visiting - cool, some autumn color - and crowds will be lessened.

I'll throw another alternative, just for you to research. This is a giant "S"-shaped one-way road trip that starts in Seattle, travels west and around Olympic National Park, then through the Columbia River Gorge and south to Crater Lake, then back out to the southern Oregon coast and through the redwoods down to San Francisco. Google the places on this map - https://goo.gl/maps/6eiFmNUkRB52 This would give you a fantastic sampling of the enormous variety to be had in this region. Highly recommended.

One general note for overseas visitors. While the US national parks are glorious, in some regions they're not necessarily the be-all and end-all for scenic destinations. For example, parts of the Oregon coast, or the Columbia River Gorge would probably be designated as national parks in many parts of the world, but in the US they're not, most likely due to the amount of human settlement and activity in those areas. Or in the case of the incredible redwood groves in northern California, political and economic pressure prevented the designation of Redwood National Park for decades, long after the State of California had "cherry picked" the best groves for inclusion in State parks. To the visitor, these legal designations are not especially important; these areas are stunning regardless of which layer of government is doing the administration and conservation.

Examples -

Smith Rock State Park in eastern Oregon

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...b5eddb56c2.jpg

Avenue of the Giants, Humboldt Redwoods State Park, California

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...a1cd6d71be.jpg

To go along with the previous post, I would fly into Las Vegas for the Utah or California route. You would find plenty of outlet shopping there, and it gives you the option to choose either route as you do more research. If you pick California, drive through Death Valley on your way to Yosemite. The Utah/Arizona route would be Zion/Bryce, (possibly Arches), Grand Canyon and Sedona, ending in Phoenix.

You should be able to get a one-way car rental with no drop fee if you book through an international website.

At that time of Year and w/ 2 weeks I'd plan EITHER a California itinerary In to Las Vegas and home from SFO, hitting Death Valley, Yosemite, Calaveras Big Trees, Columbia State Historic Park, Lassen, the north coast redwoods stat and national parks (different than the Sequoia big trees at Yosemite and Calaveras) and ending at SFO (or do the route in reverse. October is a GREAT time on the CA coast. . . .

OR

An Arizona / Utah itinerary flying in to Phoenix and home from Las Vegas covering the Grand Canyon, Monument Valley, Antelope Canyon, Bryce Canyon, Zion, and a dip into CA for Death Valley . . .

Meant to add by October the worst of the fire season is usually over - though not always. Without fires in the Sierra / Sierra foothills with all the smoke, October is a wonderful time in Yosemite. The waterfalls will be essentially dry though. The fall colors, lack of crowds, crisp mornings, brilliant days - just lovely. The problem is a fire could happen any time. The odds of one at the time you are visiting aren't huge but are certainly a concern.

Glacier and Yellowstone can be beautiful in October, but if you go this route, I agree with Gardy's suggestion to fly into Bozeman or Jackson and start with Yellowstone, Teton, and Glacier and then work your way west.

>>does seem a little more repetitive compared with Glacier, Yellow Stone, Tetons in the North (please do correct me if I'm wrong).<<

IMO that is incorrect. Between the amazing sites in Death Valley, the incomparable Zion and Grand Canyon, Bryce and other SW parks are all pretty much different - then the redwoods and Yosemite found nowhere else . . .

The northern loop has wonderful amazing scenery too of course, but IMO/IME there is more variety in the SW and California.

I do love the northern parks, but you are gambling on favorable weather with no road closures. There is plenty of diversity in the southern parks. Here is a map with time/distance charts:

Southern Utah Map - OhioHick's Travel Tips

There are frequent flights to Las Vegas from SFO or LAX and it would be an easy place to plan a loop to see Grand Canyon, Monument Valley, Arches, Canyonlands,Bryce, Zion, Death Vallry, and much more. Two weeks would not be enough time to do the area justice, but would be a spectacular trip.

If you click my name and scroll down you will find several TRs for the area with links to pictures to give you an idea of the sights.

That's your choice but it is not a requirement to skip Yosemite/Redwoods. You could easily do the California parks, Death Valley and Zion/Bryce (and/or Grand Canyon/Sedona) and save the Utah parks for another trip if diverse scenery is what you're after. Honestly, the Moab part could be (and should be) combined with visiting SW Colorado and could be a two week trip all to itself.

I think you're hung up on the initial mention of waterfalls and wildfires. Peak time to see waterfalls in Yosemite is May/June. Are you going to time a future trip for that time of year? Keep in mind that the high elevations will be snowbound at the time of year (Tioga Pass will likely not open until mid to late July this year). And if you waited until July with the idea that you could see waterfalls and all roads would be open....you would run into massive crowds of tourists, Death Valley would be insanely hot, and you'd have to make other concessions to have a decent trip. Point being, there is no ideal time to visit everything, you will have to decide what is most important and how many trips you want to make to see things at the ideal time of year. If you love waterfalls, that should be the determining factor but since you haven't specifically asked about any waterfalls on the northern route, I suspect they are not real important. I'm certain that waterfalls will be fairly unspectacular everywhere in October as they depend on snowmelt in spring....so I think you're getting thrown way off track by the waterfalls comment from a previous poster.

Wildfires can happen anywhere in the West in summer and fall. Glacier just had one in August last year. Yellowstone had a massive fire in the late 80s. To be fair, fires are probably more likely in California but there are also more options to reroute and go somewhere else if Yosemite is impacted.

Well, domestic flights within the US are fairly inexpensive; for example most days in October a one-way flight from Seattle to Las Vegas is around US$70, so you could do a two-region trip if you don't mind staying in motion most of the time.

For example, fly into Seattle and do one of these road trips, around four days each. Google the places on the maps.

1. Seattle to Olympic National Park via Whidbey and Bainbridge Islands. Map - https://goo.gl/maps/t12GQuP5DcU2 . This would include alpine scenery at Hurricane Ridge, wild, rocky coastline at La Push, and the incredible Hoh rain forest. You could travel to the Olympic Peninsula via lovely Whidbey Island and the Victorian village of Port Townsend, and return by the Bainbridge Island - Seattle ferry. If interested, on the way north you could stop for a tour of the Boeing Everett plant, home of the big jets and the biggest building in the world. You'd spend two nights and three days on the Olympic Peninsula.

2. Seattle to Portland via Mount Rainier, Mount Hood and the Hood River Valley, and the Columbia River Gorge. Map - https://goo.gl/maps/FtSbGUWYCJy . IMPORTANT NOTE: Google maps doesn't permit showing roads that are closed for the winter, so while this map shows using US 12 over the Cascades south of Mount Rainier National Park, the actual route would be via WA Hwys 706 and 123 including the wonderful Stevens Canyon Road, linking the Paradise visitor center to US 12 past the Reflection Lakes and the Grove of the Patriarchs, a stand of huge and ancient trees. Then travel south from Yakima on US 97 through the Yakama Indian reservation and fabulous "old west" scenery to the Columbia River at Maryhill. Visit the Maryhill Museum and Stonehenge replica, then continue west to Hood River, Oregon. Visit the Hood River Valley, go up to Timberline Lodge on Mount Hood, then continue west to Portland airport via the waterfalls and vista points along the Columbia River Gorge. This is a fabulous driving route; I'd spend one night near Mount Rainier and two in Hood River, then fly from PDX to Las Vegas.

Reflection lake, Mount Rainier NP

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...c0857f935c.jpg

Columbia River Gorge

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...77cf74e598.jpg

Then fly to Las Vegas and get a second vehicle and do a tour - a week or 9 days - into some of the red rock national parks easily accessed from Las Vegas. You could go north to Zion, Bryce and Arches, or go east to the Grand Canyon, Monument Valley and maybe Canyon de Chelly, or you could head to the Grand Canyon then drive to LA via Joshua Tree National Park and Palm Springs - many options.

Utah loop - https://goo.gl/maps/fCLHPPgaP6x - which includes several national parks in southern and central Utah.
Arizona loop - https://goo.gl/maps/rcuS3CXC3mt - which includes the Grand Canyon, Monument Valley, Canyon de Chelly and the Petrified Forest.
Las Vegas to LA - https://goo.gl/maps/37avairfJZn - which includes the Grand Canyon and a considerable length of legendary Route 66 before visiting stunning Joshua Tree National Park and nearby (cool) Palm Springs.

Monument Valley

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...e02ca1ee74.jpg

Canyon de Chelly

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...33925250ba.jpg

Joshua Tree NP

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...504610a568.jpg

You can't go wrong with any of these options.

If you decide on the northern route, I would do it in the order you listed - Glacier, Yellowstone, Tetons. It's a gamble at that time of year but Glacier does tend to shut down earlier and it would be nice to be able to drive the GTTS Rd whereas I don't think it's critical to drive any particular road in Yellowstone (though it might mean you have a longer day because you have to drive around a closed road). It's still possible to enjoy Glacier without driving the full length of the GTTS Rd (temporary closures are likely to be a portion of the road) and you can use Hwy 2 to travel between the east and west sides. Our favorite area of the park was Many Glacier on the east side. The closest airport to Glacier is Kalispell but you're likely to have similar issues as Bozeman or Jackson. We drove from Glacier to WA via Sandpoint which was a cute, scenic town. I would try to rent a 4WD. Most SUVs come in both 2WD and 4WD versions. We usually drive our own 4WD but have also rented one out of Bozeman.

We've encountered 4WD or chain requirements at that time of year and you can't put chains on rental cars so with a 2WD you will have to wait until the restriction is lifted. It could also be sunny and dry the entire time, you just never know.

As far as the UT parks, I agree that you don't need to include them all in one trip if you're seeking more varied scenery.

Thank you all - this is a lot of information to digest. I will spend some time searching up all the names (not very good with my geography of the US yet) and plot out some places of interest.

WhereAreWe Gardyloo True I am not particularly trying to focus a trip of waterfalls - but was thinking if the waterfall is a major attraction and it doesn't have water, then it will be a bit of a let down when compared to a place which may also have waterfalls but the attraction wasn't that. Perhaps the response to this is that the waterfalls aren't the only amazing attractions in Yosemite? Variety is probably important, as is the overall impressiveness of things. I'd certainly not rule out further visits in the years to come. Flying between the North and South to see best of both seems attractive, but I feel 6 odd days for Glacier, Yellow Stone and Grand Teton might be squeezing it?

First heard about the Boeing tour - checked the Boeing website and looks like something I'd be very very excited about (not so sure for my travel buddies though..). If we do go the Seattle route I'd definitely request for a stop there. Thanks for pointing it out.

If anyone could share thoughts on things like visiting Glacier with Sun Road closed, or similar circumstances for other parks, that would be very helpful.

Grand Teton and Yellow Stone have some seasonal road closures but their road closure dates appear fixed (15 Oct for Tower Fall to Canyon being the earliest for Yellow Stone and 1 Nov earliest for all the roads mentioned for Grand Teton). Does anyone know if these dates are indeed fixed closure dates that happen every year and it is rare (always weather permitting) that they close earlier? Appears the greatest concern is only for Glacier? (see: https://www.nps.gov/yell/planyourvisit/parkroads.htm and https://www.nps.gov/grte/planyourvisit/roads.htm). This website I found through Google seems to suggest there are a number of alternatives when Sun Road is closed: https://glacierguides.com/when-the-g...oad-is-closed/

emalloy That's a very helpful map thank you - will be printing it out as I study the locations of things

Yosemite isn't just about waterfalls. I think it's worth visiting any season (OK maybe not the crowded summer season). 6 days will be very, very rushed for Glacier, Yellowstone and Tetons.

There can be temporary weather closures or roads can close for the season earlier than the scheduled date. I have a trip report from Glacier during the same time frame and we experienced both https://www.fodors.com/community/united-states/photos-from-glacier-national-park-october-2016-a-1164218/ My advice is to drive the GTTS Rd at your first opportunity. Hwy 2, the alternative route that connects both sides of the park goes through a valley and doesn't have the views. The area around Logan Pass is most prone to closure and you may still be able to drive the GTTS Rd part way from either side but not in its entirety. There are other areas of the park that aren't along the GTTS Rd that are beautiful like Many Glacier and Two Medicine.

Same thing with Yellowstone but their scheduled closures are later. Dunraven Pass (Tower Fall to Canyon) is the most prone to closure there. The alternate north south route for that section of the park is Mammoth to Norris. Of course it's possible there's a major storm and multiple roads are closed in which case everyone just has to wait it out. Yellowstone roads are plowed between the hours of 6am and 4:30pm so don't stay out late if the weather is iffy. We were in Yellowstone last October/November and multiple roads closed earlier than scheduled.

The main park roads in Grand Teton are less prone to closure but the road up to Signal Mountain Summit or side roads may be closed.

I guess the short answer to your question is that it is almost always weather related issues that cause the roads to close for the season earlier than scheduled but in my experience it's not that rare either but I'm talking in terms of days, not weeks early.

You are correct, 6 days for those 3 parks is not realistic.
However, Gardyloo's suggestion for combining north and south was predicated on doing a 4 day or so road trip out of Seattle (he gave a couple of ideas for that in his post). A drive to Glacier/Yellowstone/Teton was not part of that plan. Realistically, you should set aside 2 weeks for those parks whenever you decide to visit.