State cracking down on vacation rentals?
May 22nd, 2013, 09:05 AM
#1
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State cracking down on vacation rentals?
I've just had my reservations cancelled by owners (vrbo and airbnb) due to the apparent crackdown on vacation rentals.
Heads up for those looking for places - sounds like prices will rise substantially at hotels as they book up. Long term, I think that tourism will fall if visitors cannot find secondary accommodations. Many of the places I have seen listed are beautifully maintained and provide safe, local (i.e., non-resort), and practical places to stay. Hawaii is expensive as it is, taking away affordable lodgings will cost it out of many tourists' budgets, IMHO.
Any thoughts from locals? Tourists?
Enjoy-la!
Heads up for those looking for places - sounds like prices will rise substantially at hotels as they book up. Long term, I think that tourism will fall if visitors cannot find secondary accommodations. Many of the places I have seen listed are beautifully maintained and provide safe, local (i.e., non-resort), and practical places to stay. Hawaii is expensive as it is, taking away affordable lodgings will cost it out of many tourists' budgets, IMHO.
Any thoughts from locals? Tourists?
Enjoy-la!
May 22nd, 2013, 09:59 AM
#2
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This isn't new. A few years ago, most of the places offering themselves as B&Bs in Hawaii were closed by the state. The fact that authorities are now cracking down on vacation rentals also doesn't surprise me. It's a state with exceedingly expensive real estate ... so much so that locals can sometimes no longer afford to live in their home state. We're having a similar experience in New York City, where there is a law prohibiting rentals of less than 30 days.
May 22nd, 2013, 11:20 AM
#3
This has been going on for a long time, klam.
But I thought it was a "crackdown" on *illegal* rentals? I thought is was supported by locals to manage an influx of tourists pouring into their residential neighborhoods?
Am I way off base here?
But I thought it was a "crackdown" on *illegal* rentals? I thought is was supported by locals to manage an influx of tourists pouring into their residential neighborhoods?
Am I way off base here?
May 22nd, 2013, 03:54 PM
#5
I am not aware of any new "crackdown" on Oahu vacation rentals at this time. Perhaps these owners just got reported? (Or found someone willing to pay more, the cynic in me thinks).If they actually have a B&B lisense, there is no reason they should be cancelling on you.
This has been a long time controversy on Oahu. Very few B&B have a license to operate. Our zoning laws tend to be very clear: no business in residential neighborhoods, unless the owner managed to get a transient rental license during a brief period in our history.
Add in the fact that homes are close to each other, parking is always scarse, and most residents have paid a pretty penny to live in a nice residential area, and you can understand there is a lot of friction over illagal rentals. The problem is especailly bad in areas like Kailua where the town, proximity to the beach, and many larger homes with pools make renting a tempting option for both the owners and prospective guests. I know I'd be livid if I had to listen to or fight for parking with a new set of strangers next door every week.
Problem is even worse now that hotels are at 100% ooccupancy and rates are higher than ever. As far as tourism dropping, there is some thought that we are at our limit already.
As a regular traveler, I see both sides of this issue, and think the non-resort guests can be a good type of tourist, but I don't know how (or if) the problem will ever be resolved.
This has been a long time controversy on Oahu. Very few B&B have a license to operate. Our zoning laws tend to be very clear: no business in residential neighborhoods, unless the owner managed to get a transient rental license during a brief period in our history.
Add in the fact that homes are close to each other, parking is always scarse, and most residents have paid a pretty penny to live in a nice residential area, and you can understand there is a lot of friction over illagal rentals. The problem is especailly bad in areas like Kailua where the town, proximity to the beach, and many larger homes with pools make renting a tempting option for both the owners and prospective guests. I know I'd be livid if I had to listen to or fight for parking with a new set of strangers next door every week.
Problem is even worse now that hotels are at 100% ooccupancy and rates are higher than ever. As far as tourism dropping, there is some thought that we are at our limit already.
As a regular traveler, I see both sides of this issue, and think the non-resort guests can be a good type of tourist, but I don't know how (or if) the problem will ever be resolved.
May 22nd, 2013, 04:30 PM
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I have to wonder if this was just a ploy because someone else wants to rent for a longer time that coincides with your dates. If you were going to rent a for a week, and someone else wanted 2 weeks that include your dates... Well...doesn't take much to figure they'd rather that the 2 week guests.
May 22nd, 2013, 07:35 PM
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I'd be interested to know what island and area. I know on Kauai and Maui it started to be a hot topic on island until the economy crashed.
I also can understand both sides here, but wonder in Hawaii, how much the hotel industry is lobbying regulations. What's better for certain neighborhoods? For some having half the tenants no longer allowed to rent out to tourists will mean a basic ghost town for 9 months out of the year or more. For others, transient rentals have a negative effect on a well established and fully occupied year round hood.
All I know is there are a lot of politics going on in the islands in regards to transient rentals.
I also can understand both sides here, but wonder in Hawaii, how much the hotel industry is lobbying regulations. What's better for certain neighborhoods? For some having half the tenants no longer allowed to rent out to tourists will mean a basic ghost town for 9 months out of the year or more. For others, transient rentals have a negative effect on a well established and fully occupied year round hood.
All I know is there are a lot of politics going on in the islands in regards to transient rentals.
May 23rd, 2013, 04:04 AM
#9
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This is my first trip to Hawaii so I'm unfamiliar with its transient rental history.
The crackdown is on "illegals". All of the units I was interested in had private entrance and lanai, were a complete unit with inside shower, full kitchen and own on-property parking. I think the kicker maybe that the unit has to be completely separate (i.e., no above/below suites). One that cancelled on me is actually a separate 2 bdrm wing connected to the main house by a carport but still deemed illegal.
I too thought perhaps we'd been dumped for a longer rental as well, but when I checked the listings (both vrbo & abnb) they were actually pulled for any dates, so I think the story I'm hearing is true. I had a spreadsheet of listings I was interested in (to compare amenities and price) and when I looked at some of my other choices, their ads were also pulled. Of course, this is still anecdotal but there are enough incidences for me to believe it's true.
As for me, one owner was extremely apologetic and said "circumstances completely beyond our control", the other one told me what was going on, that's how I found out. Both are on Kauai. To airbnb's credit (pun intended) they offered an extra free $50 if I book another place. However, that isn't enough to cover the difference to move up to a 'separate unit' category which is what I probably will re-book on vrbo. So we'll still enjoy our vacation, just at a higher cost.
For us, we'll still go ahead with our plans but if I were just starting to research this trip, the additional cost of lodgings would take away from helicopter flights, catamaran tours and kayak rentals. Lodgings would get more of the pie but other tourism operators would see a decline. Alternatively, as coming from the east coast is expensive time & $$-wise, I might just choose somewhere in FL as my sun-fun destination. As PP mentioned, perhaps Hawaii is at tourism capacity already so it doesn't matter to them whether we vacation there or not.
Enjoy-la!
The crackdown is on "illegals". All of the units I was interested in had private entrance and lanai, were a complete unit with inside shower, full kitchen and own on-property parking. I think the kicker maybe that the unit has to be completely separate (i.e., no above/below suites). One that cancelled on me is actually a separate 2 bdrm wing connected to the main house by a carport but still deemed illegal.
I too thought perhaps we'd been dumped for a longer rental as well, but when I checked the listings (both vrbo & abnb) they were actually pulled for any dates, so I think the story I'm hearing is true. I had a spreadsheet of listings I was interested in (to compare amenities and price) and when I looked at some of my other choices, their ads were also pulled. Of course, this is still anecdotal but there are enough incidences for me to believe it's true.
As for me, one owner was extremely apologetic and said "circumstances completely beyond our control", the other one told me what was going on, that's how I found out. Both are on Kauai. To airbnb's credit (pun intended) they offered an extra free $50 if I book another place. However, that isn't enough to cover the difference to move up to a 'separate unit' category which is what I probably will re-book on vrbo. So we'll still enjoy our vacation, just at a higher cost.
For us, we'll still go ahead with our plans but if I were just starting to research this trip, the additional cost of lodgings would take away from helicopter flights, catamaran tours and kayak rentals. Lodgings would get more of the pie but other tourism operators would see a decline. Alternatively, as coming from the east coast is expensive time & $$-wise, I might just choose somewhere in FL as my sun-fun destination. As PP mentioned, perhaps Hawaii is at tourism capacity already so it doesn't matter to them whether we vacation there or not.
Enjoy-la!
May 23rd, 2013, 08:13 AM
#10
Well I guess, but Florida is not Hawaii, that's for sure.
<so it doesn't matter to them whether we vacation there or not>
That is not what this situation is about. It is not about discouraging tourists from visiting. It's about rental laws in residential areas. Please read Lcuy's post carefully. This is not new.
You could make it easier and just stay in a modest hotel instead?
May 27th, 2013, 04:58 PM
#11
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OUCH. I have rented many times with VRBO and this has never happened to me. Several of the rentals have been in Hawaii. I am thinking they did not have a license that was current...Hope it doesn't happen to us next year. We already have airline tickets and a place thru VRBO. Makes it very rough when hotels book up so quickly and you think you have a place and then NADA.
May 28th, 2013, 07:26 AM
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Anyone seeking a rental should ask for the unit's vacation rental license number. You can also check it out with the state.
I don't want my neighbor in Illinois renting his MIL apartment to transients; same for people in Hawaii. The state doesn't want people renting 'under the table' -- not paying rental taxes to the state.
We own and rent a condo on Maui. It is in a designated vacation rental complex. We have a state permit -- and we collect and pay state and county taxes on rental income (13.42%). We are also required to have a licensed representative on Maui to deal with any guest-related problems at our condo.
You still have the option of renting a *licensed* condo, Klam. Your bottom line may be higher by 13.42%!
I don't want my neighbor in Illinois renting his MIL apartment to transients; same for people in Hawaii. The state doesn't want people renting 'under the table' -- not paying rental taxes to the state.
We own and rent a condo on Maui. It is in a designated vacation rental complex. We have a state permit -- and we collect and pay state and county taxes on rental income (13.42%). We are also required to have a licensed representative on Maui to deal with any guest-related problems at our condo.
You still have the option of renting a *licensed* condo, Klam. Your bottom line may be higher by 13.42%!
May 28th, 2013, 10:02 AM
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this is a gigantic topic. On Kauai decades ago, "hui" groups owned and operated vacation rentals for their mainland clans under the radar, no taxes went to local economy, tons of disrupted neighborhood in Haena, zero regulations or enforcement due to illegality. Many city amendments to legislation, city council meetings attended by us all to advocate for the ones that were legal,. One tangent:If above board, they provide jobs to all the private chefs/massage therapists/surf instructors etc that i and others employ. It gets complex with wealthy mainlanders buying agriculture land zoned specifically yet allowed to be used as TVR under new provisions if grandfathered in before 2007 with proof of occupancy, etc etc...big money always carries a big voice here.
Its absolutely crazy in all regards.There is no crackdown. They just go stealthy. Hotel lobbying always carry big weight. On Oahu in my Kailua neighborhood, 30 day rentals are by law however most do not post calendars and book quietly. Its a given that most homes owned by non locals are rentals and discouraged local residence are blue in the face from complaining to powers that be. i recall the japanese in their heyday when their economy was ripe, buying up multitudes of shoreline homes throughout Kailua/Lanikai and doing with them as they pleased, immediately blocking easements to our beaches, putting up walls and fences, no parking zones. At their will. Tons of money involved=going to owners from rentals, going to county for taxes, going in coffers from inspectors approving selected property . I/we testified numerous times in front of city council to voice concern. All that does is put you in pro or con camp. Its more complex than simple procedure. Regardless, down turn in economy switched gears. Generated revenues trump all dissatisfactions. With everyone working for the guest industry directly or otherwise, issues will be addresses publicly with back room decisions made. Major developments coming, Ex: Ebay founder Omidyar wants to turn Kauakahiunu ridge above Hanalei into new large homes, unaffordable to residents with noone living in year round so will be vacation rentals. Everyone wants their slice.
On topic, find the legal place to stay. Abundant selections! I work with local hotels yet love private villas and shoreline cottages...families, friends, movie stars flock here for specific shoreline savor...
Its absolutely crazy in all regards.There is no crackdown. They just go stealthy. Hotel lobbying always carry big weight. On Oahu in my Kailua neighborhood, 30 day rentals are by law however most do not post calendars and book quietly. Its a given that most homes owned by non locals are rentals and discouraged local residence are blue in the face from complaining to powers that be. i recall the japanese in their heyday when their economy was ripe, buying up multitudes of shoreline homes throughout Kailua/Lanikai and doing with them as they pleased, immediately blocking easements to our beaches, putting up walls and fences, no parking zones. At their will. Tons of money involved=going to owners from rentals, going to county for taxes, going in coffers from inspectors approving selected property . I/we testified numerous times in front of city council to voice concern. All that does is put you in pro or con camp. Its more complex than simple procedure. Regardless, down turn in economy switched gears. Generated revenues trump all dissatisfactions. With everyone working for the guest industry directly or otherwise, issues will be addresses publicly with back room decisions made. Major developments coming, Ex: Ebay founder Omidyar wants to turn Kauakahiunu ridge above Hanalei into new large homes, unaffordable to residents with noone living in year round so will be vacation rentals. Everyone wants their slice.
On topic, find the legal place to stay. Abundant selections! I work with local hotels yet love private villas and shoreline cottages...families, friends, movie stars flock here for specific shoreline savor...
May 28th, 2013, 10:47 AM
#14
Thank you very much for the detailed information. I was hoping some local people in-the-know chimed in. I know this is a very complex issue, that the reasons for were not accurately described in the assumption of the OP here.
May 28th, 2013, 10:53 AM
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ChiSue is right on, rent a place in a VDA area (Visitor Designated Area) such as Poipu, Princeville, Hanalei, etc. and ask for their TVR permit to ensure they are legal. This is not to say that all rentals in other areas are not legal, there are some for example in Anini and Haena that are legal, just check.
One popular B&B was closed last year on Kauai for this reason.
One popular B&B was closed last year on Kauai for this reason.
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