OK, Let's hear the real truth about San Francisco...
 

Was planning to visit S.F next month, but the horror stories of filth and agressive panhandlers in the downtown area has me second guessing my plans.<BR><BR>Should I stay or should I pass?<BR><BR>I'm a Four Seasons Hotel kinda gal, but do not flinch when I see a homeless person. I currently live in Santa Monica. Where do you suggest my husband and I stay? BTW We're both in our 30's if that helps.<BR>RESPONSES FROM LOCALS AND PEOPLE WHO HAVE VISITED IN THE LAST 3 MONTH ONLY!

Sorry babe, but you posted on the WORLD WIDE WEB and therefore have no control over who will respond. You've obviously read the hundred plus responses on the How I Hated SF thread, so what exactly is still confusing you? That's the way it is, just make up your mind if you can tolerate it or not. End of problem.

The responses on the "why I hate SF" thread aren't wrong, but they do leave out the positives. Its a great city - go and see for yourself.

The poster is NOT legitimate at all! If you live in Santa Monica, vis-a-vis the homeless problem THERE, you will most definitely LOVE San Francisco!!

momo,<BR><BR>I for one am a person who enjoys big cities (NYC is my favorite destination) and can deal with quite a bit in terms of homeless people, etc. But what I saw recently in San Francisco was absolutely appalling. If you think about it, SF is really a medium-sized city with a population of about 700,000. I saw more homeless people in SF in one day that I saw in New York City in one week. Considering NYC's population of 8 million, that is amazing. SF was a great city 20-30 yrs ago. It was appealing due its culture, restaurants, etc. But now, there are many other cities that offer many of the things that SF does, so there is less desire to go there, especially with the social problems that exist there now.

There are elements of truth in all of the posts decrying and celebrating SF. I am there often on business, usually for a week or so at a time. The city has changed. Well intended but poorly executed policies that protect "rights" of homeless folks have made the SF experience less delightful. There are some aggressive homeles, usually with chronic mentall illness, but instances of anything more than a tourist made uncomfortable by confronting the stark realities of poor social policy are not common. As in any setting, if you have enough money you can pretty well insulate yourself from the harsh realities. (Not a political comment - just a functional fact!)<BR>There are still many things about SF that make a terrific visit - the natural beauty of the Bay Area, the marvelous mix of ethnicities and accompanying array of food choices, some great architecture, theatre, music, etc.

How dreadful that the reality of American society might spoil your vacation experience. Try Disney World.

Give it a try. If you hate it, don't go back. <BR><BR>I am a statistician by trade. I'd give you a 78% chance of really liking it.

I understand your hesitation about coming here. Sometimes I want to move out to escape the unpleasantness. The "hate SF" tread does indeed contain some truths. HOWEVER---<BR><BR>Please come. The new Four Seasons is fantastic, as is the new Omni (great promo rates right now). Stay away from the touristy places, and concentrate on our terrific restaurants, our fabulous ocean and bay views where ever you can grab them, and our neighborhoods: Union Street (not Square), Cow Hollow, the Marina, North Beach. There are wonderful shops and places to eat everywhere.<BR><BR>Welcome, and thanks for coming!!!

I'm pretty local as well. Lived in Pasadena--know Santa Monica. No problem with SF for you. It's mostly the folks from small places who are not familiar with homeless at all. You've been in downtown LA, right? Union Square well located for shopping but more homeless panhandlers. Fishermans Wharf more touristy. Nob Hill not as convenient to get to when traffic is bad. Financial District empty at night. Near the Civic Center, no don't stay here. Pacific Heights/Marina/Cow Hollow really nice area, not too many hotels. Enjoy SF.

I have been to San Francisco approximately 25 times over the last 5 years. Unfortunately, however, I haven't been there for 45 days and therefore (according to you) am not qualified to comment on the subject--your loss. Next time you make a "DEMAND" in your posting you may wish to include a "please" and "thank you".<BR><BR>It's simply common courtesy.<BR>

Momo,<BR><BR>Four Seasons recently opened up a hotel on Market Street, so you're in luck. That's downtown near the heart of the Financial District, a couple of blocks away from Union Square. I would suggest you stay with the old tried and true, it's not a bad location. <BR><BR>As for all the horror stories, i'll just tell you that it's not as bad as people make it out to be. Yes, homelessness is a problem here, and no one seems to be able to agree on a solution. But, in this world, i've seen worse and i've seen better. I've never encountered the kind of harassment some other posters have mentioned and I think so long as your tone and bearing support the response that is coming out of your mouth when solicited by panhandlers, they'll leave you alone. They definitely target people they believe will be more easily intimidated. Tourists are a prime target because many are insulated from the homeless where they come from and never have had to deal with the issue. <BR>But, i've never had to say more than "sorry, no" for someone to leave me alone. <BR><BR>SF has so much to offer in terms of great shopping, theater, opera, ballet, and restaurants. You'll definitely want to see a play or a show and have dinner beforehand. Some of my favorite restaurants around there are Elizabeth Daniel (great prix fixe menus), Aqua (try the Ahi appetizer), Jardiniere (the cheese course is good), Kokkari (Greek), and Boulevard (always a favorite). I've heard Fifth Floor and Postrio are also good. <BR><BR>I guess what i'm trying to say, is don't let other people discourage you from going. It's really a great city. I think the problem is that some people can't seem to get past some of the downsides, so are unable to really experience the upsides that the city has to offer because they're so focused on the bad. I'm not saying that the city doesn't have problems, it does, but it's all a matter of how much you approach it and what your tolerance level is. Go and see for yourself. I'll bet that you'll enjoy it.

I'm gonna beat my partner to the punch. Don't go to San Francisco! Go to San Jose instead. Seriously, consider all of the following. San Jose has better Museums (www.twoboringexhibits.com) a GREAT nightlife area in the SoFS area (www.somelameacronyminsanjose.com) and ZERO Homeless/gay/drug individuals (www.sjpipedreams.com). ALL the horror stories in The City, err San Francisco are correct, so come to San Jose, a better City, a more exciting city, and by all means a city for a new America! (www.ifitwereonlytrue.com)

Well, I haven't been there since November of 2001, but I'd venture not that much is different than the past 3 months, so I'll answer anyway.<BR><BR>Yes, I was surprised by the number of homeless people, but it's a big city, it's to be expected. I found most of them down in the market street area and a few in North Beach. I only got harassed once, and it was just a nasty comment when I walked by one. All the others were as polite as a panhandler can be, didn't approach me, just asked for money as I walked by. <BR><BR>I travelled via public transportation all over the entire city and I always felt safe. I find walking with confidence keeps folks away.<BR><BR>It's a great city with lots to offer. I stayed with a friend, so I can't recommend a place (and also haven't been there in 5 months so I don't think you'd be interested anyhow)

Thanks to all who answered my question.<BR>The intelligence and honesty of many of your responses helped clarify the conflicting responses I read in previous postings.<BR><BR>My apologies to those who were offended that I did not say "please" or "thank you" or by the restrictions I placed on those who could respond.<BR><BR>Let me explain myself. <BR>We all try to get advice from people who have the same expectations, vacation desires and resources we have ourselves.<BR>I live in L.A. Lots of people visit the city and there's lots of opinions on what L.A is like. So, when you post a question on the WWW, you get ALL these various answers, which isn't bad, but you need to whittle it down to getting opinions from people who live like you do, and want a vacation like you are hoping to have.<BR> If you can only spend $100 on a room, raves from somebody who only stays in rooms that are $400 is useless.<BR><BR>Therefore, asking for responses from people who live in S.F provides information from individuals who are accustom to living in a big city, (like I do) and who can give me an up to date opinion of the state of the city.<BR> <BR>BTW, The ability for people to help each other via the web is utterly fantastic. Although not all the advice is taken, every response is valuable and appreciated.<BR>PEOPLE HELPING EACH OTHER, THAT'S OUR GIFT TO THE WORLD.

I wonder why questions like this one: stay or pass? appear on this site... Is it to have somebody to blame for a bad decision and take credits for somebody's good advise? I bet the suggestions to go/not to go will split 50/50 so why even bother?

Momo<BR>I had been in Sf and La in february and I was surprise by the homeless people in Santa Monica. I'm from Rio de Janeiro and here there are many poor people in the street.<BR>When I went to Sf I read many posters about homeless at Union Square and Financial District but I thougt they are very calm.<BR>Go to SF. It's a wonderful city.

momo,<BR><BR>You are nothing short of insulting. Your "explanation" of why you phrased your posting the way you did is unsubstantiated by your reasons. The fact that you restated "please" and "thank you" in quotation marks further indicates your smarmy, self-absorbed attitude toward others. <BR><BR>By your own reasoning all it takes to know someone elses likes, dislikes, attitudes, desires and lifestyle is simply to live in a city that is similar to theirs (or to have visited there recently):how utterly ridiculous.<BR><BR>Please, don't attempt to patronize us by ending your egotistical missive with a cheap sentiment.<BR><BR>Ally

Truthfully, I didn't even notice Momo's lack of please or thank you and didn't find her request that unusual. Many, many of the questions on this board don't include please and thank yous. I live near SF and many times read responses from folks who obviously only visited for a short time or a long time ago. Sometimes their advice is just downright incorrect---not on purpose, I'm sure, but because they got things confused or forgot. I don't criticize them, but don't find their responses very helpful either. Those of us who live here have a much different view of the homeless situation in the city. For good or bad, we are not as bothered by it as some others are, and perhaps we don't get approached as often because we don't appear to be tourists. That would be an interesting study! Momo, coming from Santa Monica, should have no different experience than she does at home. Maybe I'm missing something, but I think we're all having a "Grouchy Friday" day here.

Could the Four Seasons gal be a TROLL in disguise? Same person who posted "how I hated SF"