No, the Jewish homes would have used fat rendered from their Kosher butcher. But for most Eastern Europeans and lots of other places, it is mostly lard made from butcher sources that would be mixed, but would be mostly pig/pork. But the Jewish populations almost always had to follow the localities sources, as far as they were able.That one reason why being Kosher was even "harder" then, I would think.

I use canola oil with all my pan fried things (less and less of those as time goes on) and fry them very crispy. Make sure you have the oil very hot before you drop in potatoes and then they will be lighter and not greasy from absorbing cooling fats. I always do press with a paper towel on both sides when they come out as I try to make them as free of fat excess as possible. I hate that lead balloon feeling you get from greasy food input, like after eating potato chips. You don't get that grease soak if you put mixture in when fat/oil are very hot and if you pat/press both sides and salt immediately upon taking out. That's why I almost always do latkes or cannoli shells or anything with that heat and speed, with a duo or more. One to fry, one to pat/salt etc. We used to have a great assembly line and one SON would do ravioli, or cannoli shells with me. Cannoli shells you need at least three. One to cut dough and wrap on the rods, one to dip sticks in oil / fry/ turn and get out before they are too dark, and one to slide the shell off the rods and get to the draining/paper or rack. I did them with just two a couple of years ago and we both ended up with small burns and quite a few overdone shells. We make our cannoli shells very rarely now, but I know how to do it and the dough has no other liquid but wine.

Lots of this stuff is so much fun and for religious or any traditional holiday children love to help and learn. Now with food processors I don't think the latest generation even knows how to grate. It's hard work and you always lose some knuckle skin. I used to do 20 lbs. and it would take me most of Saturday when I was a girl. We didn't have "activities" we had that kind of work. ALWAYS. I am rather glad that my granddaughters aren't "working" all the time. But skills are lost.

Be careful if you are using Crisco and heating in a shallow pan. It smokes at a lower heat, I think, and you don't want to start a grease fire or your smoke alarm going off- or worse burn yourself. But DON'T cook on a slow heat with Crisco or you will have grease bombs as a result. If it starts to smoke at ALL, turn it down.

Trouble with this kind of skill is that by the time you get really good at it, you may have passed the point in your life when you afford these kind of calories with any amount of exercise you would do. Well, that is why they are so good for a traditional feast, like Chanukah- because they are happy/special ways to celebrate. Just once or twice a year, or for very special celebration.

To get the smell out of the air, I use a scented candle. Grease was "burnt" if you can smelt it REALLY heavy. And it will hang awhile.

Oh my dear ones, I just read all the additonal postings. Now tomorrow I am going to reread. Right at the moment my head is spinning but at the same time I understand because it is like when I try to tell people how to cook Italian food.

I only know how to do it. Have nothing written down. I have cooked for 300 people. But to tell someone how to prepare pasta for say 30, no idea. I try to explain but it is always a problem because I do not have an exact receipe written down about any dishes. Because one just knows how much of this and that and when to do what and when.

A side note, my Italian grandmother always told me that the two cultures that were the same were the Italians and the Jews. She always said that their morals, their love of family, their love of God, their love of their history etc. bonded them together in ways most people did not understand.

Well dear ones, IMHO it is true. And I am going to prepare latkes, but know that they will not be as wonderful as if I had learned how to cook them at a dear grandmothers elbow. But I am overwhelmed by all the good and beautiful advice you have posted to help me. I wish we could all sit down together to enjoy a wonderful meal together. Shalom!

ita: I have never frozen latkes, we always eat them as I cook them but you could test a pancake out - it shouldn't take long to freeze. I also use canola oil. As for the smell, usually the smell that lingers is pleasant unless the oil burns then as JJ5 suggested, lighting a scented candle helps...a bit!

This IS a great thread. I really enjoy learning about the cultural traditions of food and the family.

LoveItaly - I have never used Crisco to fry latkes. I use canola, corn or peanut oil for my latkes - depending on what I have in the house.

I drain them on a brown grocery bag.

I have only frozen them one time, a few years ago when my non-Jewish in-laws and some other friends were coming for dinner. I didn't want to look frazzled and I didn't want to be stuck in the kitchen when they were there. I'd do it again.

If you freeze them, fry them a little underdone to allow for browning in the reheating stage.
On the advise of my cousin, a fabulous cook, Jewish and otherwise, I made them a few days in advance and froze them in one layer on individual cookie sheets, separating the layers with wax paper or parchment paper. When they are frozen, put them into a plastic freezer bag. I think that you can only freeze them for 4-5 days. Mine were only frozen for 2 days.

You reheat them on cookie sheets in a 450 degree oven for 5-8 minutes, or a 350 degree oven for 15 minutes until they are hot, sizzling, and crispy.

Actually they were even better than I had expected. Everyone was pleased, my kitchen was clean, and I was able to eat with my guests.

I used to use Russets exclusively until Yukon Golds became popular. I like them both. The russets have a more 'potato-y' flavor, and the yukon golds are very smooth tasting. I have never tried red potatoes, but I probably will now that they have been so highly recommended.

One recipe that I saw online said "this serves a family of four, as long as the mother doesn't eat!" ;-)

Potatoes - shred with shredding blade on Cuisinart. Couldn't be easier.

Oil - vegetable!!

Serve with sour cream and/or applesauce.

When placing on table, move quickly out of way. ((Y))

One Wandering Jew, it IS a small world! I was born in Bobruisk. Belarus rocks huh ;) And in 15 years of living in USA never ever had a desire to visit.

Yesterday the children came for their Chanukah Gelt. Latkes went fast. Like lightning! By the way, I don't squeeze. I just poor the liquid off before addint salt. Correct me if I'm wrong, but after you add salt and spices the potatos give more liquid, and if you squeeze that you lose salt and flavor. With each spoonful which goes onto a frying pan (or 2 or 3) I just pick up some of that liquid which will evaporate.

I use eigher canola oil or 1/2 canola 1/2 olive. Olive oil is expensive, this is the only reason for me. Lard for latkes? EEEEWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

Yesterday I had apple sauce and red caviar to go with latkes - they sell cheap caviar in russian stores. Surprisingly enough all 4 kids liked the sauce. My tommy is going to have a holiday today feasting on the caviar leftovers :)

I asked my dad what my grandmother fried the latkes in. And he said "Wesson oil". LOL! And then I said, "no, in Europe." And he said it was an "oil" that had a white/solid head at room temperature. So in only 60-70 years we have another mystery! I think it had to be from the butcher or Kosher butcher, or was some kind of crude soy or vegtable oil, maybe sunflower. Not corn in Europe. But in our case it definitely was not olive oil which gives a much different taste. Eastern Europe/ Russia does not have the same uses /connotations of "lard" as we do- AT ALL.

I have done exactly like Nina66 and froze them that way. Mine were overdone and lost their signature crispness at the same time. My group is spoiled. But her tip of doing a bit lighter doneness-is right on. But they are just not as crisp and we like them very crispy.

I'll never get to be an expert at any freezing etc. with these as Jed is right because in my house I have never had any practice freezing finished products overall. AND these! You do need to stand back- QUICK.

Love Italy, my mother also compares the Jewish/ Italian cultural family/traditions endlessly. There is a double dose in her family. And we were all educated by Catholic nuns. Do you think we know a bit about guilt? Ha-ha!

JJ5 Guilt you say?? Oh yes indeed!
:-[ Is there anyway to get rid of it? I think not. Rather builtin, isn't it.

Thank you so much all of you. Am emailing this thread to myself.

Take good care.

JJ5 and LoveItaly ... Joan Rivers said that she was raised in Scarsdale which had a large Jewish and Italian population. The high school she went to was 'Our Lady of Perpetual Guilt'. ;-)

There is nothing, absolutely nothing that can compare to a fresh lake right out of the frying pan. Freezing is a weak substitute, but but works in a pinch if you can't spare the cooking and clean up time on the day of your dinner.

Also if for just one or two people, freezing some from your original batch for a few days, allows you a 'freebie' when you re-heat them a few days later.

Thanks to all of you for taking my original Chanukah wish and turning it into a delighful, insightful, discussion from all sides. Isn't that what the Holiday Season is suppose to be all about.

Maybe Fodor's will consider a new group/topic. Of course it would have to be travel related:

- How Many Latkes Are You Allowed in Your Carryon

-How Many Latkes Do I Tip For Good Service

-How Do You Keep Latkes Warm in NYC in December

- Funny Stories About Electric Frying Pans Setting Off Smoke Detectors in Hotel Rooms

- The Best Place For Latkes in Nepal

- Has Anyone Ever Been to The Great Latke Cookoff in Kansas City

Chanukah is almost over, but the warmth of this thread will stay with me for the rest of the year. Not to mention the added inches to my hips!

Nina

Next year I'm going to the Latke Macabee Winter Olympics :-D

Do they have separate events for sweet potatoes, russets, and yukon golds?

I've had some latkes that could easily be used in the discus throw.

Warning -- the applesauce will be tested for steroids prior to each event.

My first batches could have been used as practice pucks for the hockey teams.

No, JJ5, I believe that would have been the use for my mother's cannon - I mean matzoh - balls (but that's a WHOLE other thread)! They were delcious, too, by the way. They have a middle with cinnamon. Has anyone heard of that before? Apparently, that's the way they made them in the Lithuanian town her ancestors were from.

Susan
Best wishes to everyone for a delightful thred and a very happy and healthy holiday and new year!

Oh Nina 66, sharing Joan Rivers comment, too funny!! I had told my daughter about this thread today (she is a graduate of Catholic schools) and she laughed her head off. I always tease her about her "mother's guilt", you all know the feeling I am sure, anytime one of the children are not perfect.

But now about Matzo Balls!

I do not know how to make them.

So I buy the Manischewitz Matzo Ball soup (in chicken broth of course).

Does anyone approve? I really love this, on a cold winter night. You gently warm up this (it comes in a glass jar) of matzo balls and chicken broth until hot. Imagine homemade is better but since I do not know how to make matzo balls (do know how to make good chicken broth) I do enjoy it.

I have always used the recipe on the box of matzoh meal, and been happy with the results. I use chicken fat as the fat and add chopped parsley to make them pretty.

LoveItaly, I wish that I could help you with a recipe for matzoh balls, but like so many other second generation Americans, I was never taught my ancestors' recipes.

Whenever I asked my mother to let me help her cook or bake, she always shooed me out of the kitchen, saying that it was easier for her to make it by herself. Funny, but when it came time to dry the dishes, she never felt that she could do it better by herself!

The few times she did attempt to give me a recipe, it always went something like this - 'add a little of this, a little of that, you know, until it looks right'. If I knew what it was suppose to look like, I wouldn't have asked her ;-)

As a young adult, I asked for the recipe for her world famous mondel broit (sp), which is similiar to biscotti.

She actually wrote down the ingredients and directions, but didn't give an exact amount for the flour. When I asked her, I got the 'you'll know when it looks right'. WRONG ... I kept adding flour until the slab of dough weighed about three pounds, and then I decided that I was out of my element, and that it must be time to bake it.

It was dense and tasted like a sack of flour, abslultely no flavor. When I told her. she said me that I must have used too much flour... #%$#&^*#*$#

I have found other recipes for mondel broit and have made it over the years, but you guessed it --- it's not the same.

Years ago she showed my daughter how to make matzoh balls. I guess the 'just right' thing skips a generation.

Maybe I'll ask my daughter to devulge my mother's recipe. If she refuses or give me that 'just right' business, I'll ground her and send her to her room ... even though she is 47 years old ;-)

What I'd give to make my mother's honey cake. I've had many of them over the years, but none as moist or as flavorful.

I'll get the recipe from my Mom and post here later. I'm not sure I ever got the recipe from her -- it's always been her thing to make. They're dense and flavorful, NOT light and fluffy. You know, there's two distinct types. Having grown up on these, I much prefer them.

She's even somehow perfected a low fat version, but I like the original. Now I DO have her wonderful recipe for mondel bread. I'll post that as well if anyone's interested. It's super easy and delicious. Both recipes were handed down from her ancestors from Lithuania.

Susan

My matzoh balls come from the recipe on the matzoh meal box too, just like abram. I love them but no one in my family was big on them unless they had a cold or were sick. I don't know why, so I didn't make them very often and not at all in recent years. They are not hard, and I always did notice when "out" that there are two basic kinds like bellairegirl says. And I also like the dense ones.

My first husband came from first generation Lithuanian/German ancentry and his mother made excellent kugela (not sure of the spelling) and several other recipes that were delicious and very heavy (dense). There is a restaurant in Bridgeport neighborhood of Chicago called Healthy Foods (HA-HA)
that makes all of these dishes and the owner is from Lithuania. It was just featured on Check Please (a PBS show in Chicago). And I am tempted to take a ride there before spring now, after reading all on this thread.

I wish I would have had Nina66's mom teach me some things. My German grandmother only had sons, so she was more apt to teach me than anyone and she is the only one who taught me very precisely. My Sicilian half, just say "throw a hand-full etc." and none of their recipes are exact. I can not duplicate my mom's biscotti, and I gave up trying. And my mom's and my aunt's ravioli dough is very different, and I don't really get "why" as the egg/ flour proportion is the same. Must be the way/length of time they mix/knead?
No one ever let me stay around to see this as they were made "ahead" of the feast.

My daughter is so into healthy foods that she doesn't want to learn a lot of the heavier dishes. My sons all do and have learned several.

Well one more day and I am taking a day off to make Manicotti for our pre-Christmas Christmas, as many of us are spread out elsewhere on Dec. 24 and 25.

I should have my granddaughters over and have them help. But guess what, I don't want them "in the way." HA=HA!
Well, maybe when school is off and when they are a bit older.

Happy HOLIDAYS and special occasions and Health and Peace in 2005

LoveItaly - "So I buy the Manischewitz Matzo Ball soup (in chicken broth of course)."

It's like buying frozen waffles or making them yourself. If it doesn't involve making a big mess in the kitchen it just doesn't taste as good. ((R))