Thanks for the injection of reality, Stu. How many of us were biting our tongues?

>>How many of us were biting our tongues?<<

Me >)

Besides Stu's dose of tough love . . . IF you insist on the wine areas north of SF - the LAST place I'd stay is downtown (or even suburban) Napa.

Carmel is one of our favorite places to visit on the Central Coast and we've stayed in the area many times. Our first few trips we stayed in Carmel itself and nothing beats being able to walk out the door to explore the village shops and restaurants.

However all the properties we stayed at were somewhat lacking, older, musty properties with small rooms and paper thin walls. Maybe we just chose the wrong places? Since then we've stayed at hotels in Monterey and have been pleased with what we've found and our choices. It's an easy drive over to Carmel even after dark for dinner.

Thanks. My friend really wants to go to Napa and isn't budging. We will see San Fran the day before we leave and are planning on spending 1 night there.
We may spend 2 or 3 nights in Napa, not sure yet. It's looking like just 2 maybe. We took the advise to spend some nights in Carmel instead of going from hotel to hotel in that area. From Carmel we plan on seeing as much as we can which includes Big Sur (Nepenthe), Point Lobos, Monterey Aquarium, etc. If we can somehow fit in Hearst Castle then I want to do that... We have a year before the trip so I am gathering data and then I am sharing it with them.

>>My friend really wants to go to Napa and isn't budging.<<

OK -- but please consider not staying IN Napa. Somewhere else in the Napa Valley would be much nicer. Calistoga, St Helena - anywhere.

Have her research the Sonoma Valley as well -- If you want a big town IMO Sonoma would be better than Napa, And Healdsburg would be great.

ok , thanks. I guess I should have said Napa Valley, I didn't know the difference. Sonoma would be good too.

I wouldn't call Sonoma a big town. It has the feel of a small town surrounded by vineyards.

>>My friend really wants to go to Napa and isn't budging.<<<

Then make her drive all the way from Napa to Carmel. If you stay in Calistoga, that adds 3/4 - 1 hr to the trip - making it a horrible 4 1/2 to 6 hr drive if you "hug" the East Bay route. Again - the section from Vallejo to the Bay Bridge has been designated the "most congested" for the past 6 years in a row - and if you leave Napa early (7-7:30am), you'll hit it at peak congestion time.

I would not take the mapquest/East Bay route to/from Napa. Instead - go via the Golden Gate Bridge - but avoid driving through the "heart" of San Francisco by driving from SFO via 380 to 280 to Brotherhood Way, Sunset Blvd, Golden Gate Park/MLK drive, Crossover Drive, Park Presidio to the GG Bridge. To Carmel - do the reverse and then take Hwy 92 from 280 to Half Moon Bay, and then Hwy 1 all the way to the Monterey area.

It's 2 1/2 to 3 hrs back to San Francisco from Carmel on a Saturday. And you'll have a car. What do you plan to do with the car?? Stashing it will consume some time and energy. That leaves you with a half-day in San Francisco - at best.

Stu Dudley

It seems some come here to ask about the details of a trip while they insist on missing the bigger picture. We can't save everyone from themselves, nor from the effects of difficult traveling companions. I imagine we've all dealt with one of those, at least one. I certainly have and why I now prefer going it alone if that's the alternative. At least they'll have wine.

I didn't mean Sonoma is a big town -- but if they want to stay in a 'town' instead of essentially a village -- then Sonoma would be better than Napa.

Calistoga was once my favorite, for stays at Dr. Wilkinson's. There's a thought, for me, if not for our errant OP.

http://www.drwilkinson.com/

Here are some recent suggestions:

http://www.fodors.com/community/unit...l-272422-2.cfm

Tried looking into Healdsburg and most places are sold out already. I'll try Sonoma, Caslisoga and St. Helena (etc) as well. It seems when reading these posts and past posts of others, that some love Napa and some seem to say its not worth it. I guess everyone has a different opinion on it. Seeing that the trip is longer than I expected to Carmel, maybe a night stay in San Fran would help. (and she will drive) The friend that really wants to go to Napa/ Sonoma already has been there 11 yrs ago and her friend just came back from there this year, so she knows a little about it.

Thanks for the Carmel suggestions, they are great!!!!