Four Stars for LE BERNARDIN; NYTimes review
May 23rd, 2012, 03:26 AM
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Four Stars for LE BERNARDIN; NYTimes review
May 23rd, 2012, 05:15 AM
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I ate there shortly after it first opened in 1972 and it was very good back then. Over the years I've gone back numerous times whenever I've been in NYC and have always had a fantastic meal - it just continues to amaze. For 40 years it has been on my list as the best seafood restaurant anywhere. If you wan't a truly exceptional meal don't miss dining here but it is not for the budget minded.
May 23rd, 2012, 05:20 AM
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Oops! That should have read "since it first opened in 1986" and it's only been about 30 years, not 40. I confused the dates with La Bernadin in Paris which opened in 1972. Regardless of the opening date, it's a fabulous restaurant.
May 23rd, 2012, 11:01 AM
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Loved reading the review in the NY Times day - and wanted to get there last time was in the City - but alas - was only so much time.
Meister Chef Ripert is a great interview - and has been on Squawk Box - among other shows.
Meister Chef Ripert is a great interview - and has been on Squawk Box - among other shows.
May 23rd, 2012, 11:55 AM
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Had a very good meal there 2 years ago but what I remember most was, when we ordered the lengthy tasting menus, that the waiter said he needed to turn that table in 2 1/2 hours whether we were done or not. Pretty brisk, almost brusque, service IMO, but good food.
I'd go back but liked our NYC dining experiences at Per Se, Eleven Madison Park and even Jean Georges better.
I'd go back but liked our NYC dining experiences at Per Se, Eleven Madison Park and even Jean Georges better.
May 25th, 2012, 08:52 AM
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We had a great experience there a few weeks ago. We were not disappointed in any way...food, wine selection, decor, service were all impeccable. I was expecting to be possibly a bit underwhelmed but that was not the case. The four stars were well deserved. Hell, I even loved the ladies room!
Bill H...your case is kind of shocking. I think I would have gotten management involved...if you are ordering a tasting menu you should not be time limited ever (especially at those prices).
Bill H...your case is kind of shocking. I think I would have gotten management involved...if you are ordering a tasting menu you should not be time limited ever (especially at those prices).
May 25th, 2012, 10:07 AM
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"Bill H...your case is kind of shocking. ... That does sound shocking. Did you have a reservation, or did you walk in?"
From what I've read on ChowHound it's not all that shocking (example below).
Yes, we had reservations a month in advance via OpenTable. When the restaurant called a couple days before the meal to confirm I asked if we could order different sized meals (different # of courses, the options being 4, 7 or 8) and was told 'usually not' but to ask the captain when we were seated. My wife isn't as big an eater and would prefer the normal four course meal, while I can handle more courses and wanted to try the 8 course tasting menu.
Anyway when we were seated I brought this up and was told 'no' on the 4 vs 8 courses so I asked if she could get the 7 course tasting menu while I got the 8 courses. Apparently this was a Q they were not used to as the waiter disappeared for several minutes to check, then returned and said "yes, but we need to turn the table ...", with the implication we would be finishing dessert and petit-fours at the bar (or in a doggy bag) if things lagged.
I told him if they could bring it that fast we could likely eat it that fast; they did and we did, but it felt rushed, like Lucy grabbing bon-bons off the assembly line. Maybe because we wasted 10-15 minutes getting the menu Q sorted out.
Below is a link to a ChowHound post where the guy has a similar experience. I've seen several other such postings over there so it's not uncommon (also seen many postings praising the 'warm service' so it's not the norm either, I'm sure).
Here's a quote from the ChowHound article:
But the fundamental reason why I will not be returning any time soon is the service. ...
But what struck me about the service Friday night was its fundamental lack of sincerity. Some here have described it as a kind of coldness or arrogance or pretension, but I think it goes deeper than that. It's hard to encapsulate in concrete details, but I never felt as though the servers here thought themselves to be in the hospitality business, devoted to making their diners happy. Rather, it seemed like they were parts of a corporate machinery, who viewed diners simply as marks or profit centers and were determined to get their share of the take. Granted, I imagine most waiters, everywhere, think along somewhat similar lines, as well, but the good ones overlay that with warmth, professionalism, and a genuine desire to please. Not so here. GIven the restaurant's apparent desire to turn many of its tables in 2 or 2.5 hours, there's an inescapable feeling of the assembly line here.
Maybe it just depends on how busy they are any given night, though I think they are full for both services almost every night.
We've had 31 meals the past 2 1/2 years at similarly rated restaurants (Michelin 3* or Forbes 5*) and never had this feeling of being rushed. When we've asked for different sized menus about half the time they say 'not possible' even if it's just a couple of extra courses (I understand it makes it more difficult for the kitchen so I'm OK with it), but half the time they're fine with it, the most memorable being Robuchon in Vegas where my wife had the standard four course menu and I had a 15 course degustation menu. They even brought her a small empty plate and silverware with each of my extra courses in case she wanted a nibble, and included an extra dessert for her to lessen the pain of watching me eat sweets. This was great service.
Here's the ChowHound link: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/849137
From what I've read on ChowHound it's not all that shocking (example below).
Yes, we had reservations a month in advance via OpenTable. When the restaurant called a couple days before the meal to confirm I asked if we could order different sized meals (different # of courses, the options being 4, 7 or 8) and was told 'usually not' but to ask the captain when we were seated. My wife isn't as big an eater and would prefer the normal four course meal, while I can handle more courses and wanted to try the 8 course tasting menu.
Anyway when we were seated I brought this up and was told 'no' on the 4 vs 8 courses so I asked if she could get the 7 course tasting menu while I got the 8 courses. Apparently this was a Q they were not used to as the waiter disappeared for several minutes to check, then returned and said "yes, but we need to turn the table ...", with the implication we would be finishing dessert and petit-fours at the bar (or in a doggy bag) if things lagged.
I told him if they could bring it that fast we could likely eat it that fast; they did and we did, but it felt rushed, like Lucy grabbing bon-bons off the assembly line. Maybe because we wasted 10-15 minutes getting the menu Q sorted out.
Below is a link to a ChowHound post where the guy has a similar experience. I've seen several other such postings over there so it's not uncommon (also seen many postings praising the 'warm service' so it's not the norm either, I'm sure).
Here's a quote from the ChowHound article:
But the fundamental reason why I will not be returning any time soon is the service. ...
But what struck me about the service Friday night was its fundamental lack of sincerity. Some here have described it as a kind of coldness or arrogance or pretension, but I think it goes deeper than that. It's hard to encapsulate in concrete details, but I never felt as though the servers here thought themselves to be in the hospitality business, devoted to making their diners happy. Rather, it seemed like they were parts of a corporate machinery, who viewed diners simply as marks or profit centers and were determined to get their share of the take. Granted, I imagine most waiters, everywhere, think along somewhat similar lines, as well, but the good ones overlay that with warmth, professionalism, and a genuine desire to please. Not so here. GIven the restaurant's apparent desire to turn many of its tables in 2 or 2.5 hours, there's an inescapable feeling of the assembly line here.
Maybe it just depends on how busy they are any given night, though I think they are full for both services almost every night.
We've had 31 meals the past 2 1/2 years at similarly rated restaurants (Michelin 3* or Forbes 5*) and never had this feeling of being rushed. When we've asked for different sized menus about half the time they say 'not possible' even if it's just a couple of extra courses (I understand it makes it more difficult for the kitchen so I'm OK with it), but half the time they're fine with it, the most memorable being Robuchon in Vegas where my wife had the standard four course menu and I had a 15 course degustation menu. They even brought her a small empty plate and silverware with each of my extra courses in case she wanted a nibble, and included an extra dessert for her to lessen the pain of watching me eat sweets. This was great service.
Here's the ChowHound link: http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/849137
May 25th, 2012, 10:16 AM
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I like the renovated dining room, and I love their new bar area, which makes it much easier to get in and eat there, even at a moment's notice. I'm sure it has increased their revenue tremendously too.
Unfortunately, there now seem to be too many tables and far, far too many items on the carte for the kitchen to function competently. Or maybe, as suggested in the Chowhound post that Bill_H copied, they just don't care anymore. Le Bernardin is historically one of my favorite restaurants, but it is currently as weak as I've ever seen it. Although I still think it's far better than Per Se, which has always been very erratic, and often dismal, from its beginning.
Unfortunately, there now seem to be too many tables and far, far too many items on the carte for the kitchen to function competently. Or maybe, as suggested in the Chowhound post that Bill_H copied, they just don't care anymore. Le Bernardin is historically one of my favorite restaurants, but it is currently as weak as I've ever seen it. Although I still think it's far better than Per Se, which has always been very erratic, and often dismal, from its beginning.
May 25th, 2012, 12:21 PM
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Thanks for taking the time to explain, Bill. That would have annoyed me, too. I remember another CH post about poor service; let me see if I can find it. Ok, here:
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/779704
I know it has nothing to do with the subject at hand, but I did like my dinner at NoMad recently, and would recommend.
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/779704
I know it has nothing to do with the subject at hand, but I did like my dinner at NoMad recently, and would recommend.
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