I think this thread has jumped the shark.

I'm not sure it was on the right side of the shark to begin with;)

hahaha. Good point, mmouse.

I too have some issues with some of these online "agencies".

When I am renting a unique space, I too like to actually speak with an owner whenever possible; I would also think that it might make an owner more comfortable to actually speak with potential renters.

Most of these online sites are now blocking direct communication between owner and renter primarily so that people will not try workarounds to eliminate the website fees. This I completely understand and am fine with as long as the fee structure is reasonable. But, in the case of VRBO anyway, last year VRBO started charging renters an additional fee (on top of the large listing fee that owners already pay). This new fee does absolutely nothing for the renter and just lines the pockets of VRBO. Do a bit of research, and you'll find a ton of info about owners and renters who are furious with VRBO because of this gouging I am assuming that Flipkey is now having similar issues and owners are getting fed up.

The situation with vrbo is even worse then that julies.

Not are they only double dipping, charging on both sides. Their guarantee policy means that a renter can ask for a full refund for any bogus reason. That means that the owner is not only out the fee, they have to pay for the property to be cleaned, are then fined by vrbo and subjected to being dropped to the bottom of the listings in their area.

Moderators, you deleted the cowardly lion? That was what you found offensive? Yet the threesome can degrade my thread all they want?

Finding workarounds for fees that are outlined in the terms of agreement is in fact a violation of the terms of agreement. Again, really, why use a site if you disagree with their policies? The fees are how you pay for their service. If you aren't paying the fees, they don't want you using their service.

I am enjoying how we've been promoted from "interfering" to "degrading". What's the next badge you'll award? I'd like to know what I'm working towards...

While you are enjoying yourself…

You make me sad.

I find many apartment owners use multiple sites also.
What was wrong with the Wizard of Oz link? SMH over this thread.

>>What was wrong with the Wizard of Oz link<<

Possibly nothing but I've seen others deleted that were just links with no explanation. Maybe it was caught up in all the deleting of ads lately. Maybe post it again and see what happens . . .

Your whole thread was motivated from a dark place...you didn't want advice at all, you wanted commiseration. On the fact that flipkey didn't let you or your prospective host violate their own rules. Which I'm no fan of flipkey but I kind of feel like giving them a standing ovation after this.

Sf, if you read any recent threads about vrbo, you'll find out that they changed their policy. They used to charge a fee to the owners for a listing service, and then with little fanfare, decided to keep charging owners (different levels per annum) and now in addition renters (a sliding percentage fee). So yes, skimming and gouging.

Is that really skimming and gouging? Or is it just doing business?

It's not "double-dipping" if it's not charging the same group two times for the same thing.

Yes it is skimming and gouging, imo. I didn't use the phrase double dipping.

marvelousmouse on May 1, 17 at 3:36pm
Finding workarounds for fees that are outlined in the terms of agreement is in fact a violation of the terms of agreement. Again, really, why use a site if you disagree with their policies? The fees are how you pay for their service. If you aren't paying the fees, they don't want you using their service.

I agree. It doesn't serve any purpose to keep whining about the charges. Just don't use that company. Problem solved.

I completely agree with tabernash, whether or not I like the fact that they charge fees to both "landlords" and "tenants". That's their business model, like it or not. If not, don't use it.

sylvia,the OP used term "double dipping".
If you feel they are "skimming and gouging", don't use them.
Problem solved.

To me, as a longtime user of VRBO this is outright price gouging. It used to be that the owner paid a hefty fee to VRBO as a listing website. Then, a year ago VRBO decided to keep charging owners the same listing fee as before. But, suddenly renters were also charged a hefty fee. And, as a renter I get absolutely nothing more than I did before this fee was added. I looked into this in depth when I first found out, and discovered that as a renter there is no advantage whatsoever to me for the money I pay for that additional fee.

In the past five or so years VRBO (and its owner Homeaway) essentially gobbled up all of their smaller former competitors. So, there are not a lot of alternatives out there, and saying don't use VRBO if you don't like them is easier said than done.

Julies- I can understand your perspective. But the advantage to you as a renter is so that you can keep using vrbo. I mean, there is no advantage to consumers to pay an increase resort fees or credit card fees or nearly any other kind of fee. It's a profit for the company in question. They've got a right to charge it and they continue to do so because people pay it even if they don't like it.

I also get the takeover issue. But it's not like like you don't have other options. You can rent through a property company. You can stay at a hotel or hostel. You can camp. Vrbo will continue to charge those fees because people pay for the experience and the convenience of renting apartments. Your complaints sound like the people who complain that cities like NYC or SF or Paris make short term rentals illegal. Like those cities are actively impeding tourists' ability to visit those cities.. They're not. They're trying to eliminate the problem caused by people who don't want to pay taxes- hotel taxes, commercial business taxes, whatever.

I guess I really don't get why someone would see those fees and automatically come up with a way to not pay the fees but continue to use the service. Because that's what vrbo is trying to stop here. I would see the fees and either say either "I don't want to use vrbo anymore because it isn't worth paying those fees" or "well, I'll pay the fee because I still like the service". For one thing, I'm assuming you can get kicked off of vrbo as either renter or owner if you are caught violating their terms of service.

Good points, mm.

If you are going to contest all the fees we get charged-- start with resort fees.

Yes, that is the top of my list as well. And it's like they're a virus. One place starts charging it, soon spreads to every hotel in the area.