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LLindaC Jul 19th, 2006 07:58 AM

Sorry- I meant for Mendocino/Sonoma it is really easy flying out of SAC.

PamSF Jul 19th, 2006 08:00 AM

The drive to Carmel is about 2 hours. Unless you really hope to spend time in Half Moon Bay, I'd say spend the day in SF and then drive down to Carmel/Monterey in the morning the following day. You will avoid commute traffic through San Jose if you travel at that time. I agree with the post to walk in Point Lobos. It's so much coastal scenery, easily accessed and will clear your heads. You have probably booked your lodging but ,if not, consider staying in Pacific Grove. It's a small and charming town. One can easily reach Carmel by car and actually walk into Monterey via the shorepath.

You have booked some good amount of time in Sonoma. I might also suggest you take a look at the di Rosa Preserve. This is in close proximity(by car) to your hotel. It's a two hour docent led tour through a stunning collection of Bay Area modern art. We often take folks here and then venture up Hwy 29 to Don Giovanni in Napa for lunch(on the patio). Make reservations for almost everyplace you hope to go during August.

Most of the tasting rooms in Napa do charge. Some will provide you a discount(?) on wines purchased. Of the many tasting rooms in Napa, I really like Robert Sinsky(on the Silverado Trail). There is a $15 tasting fee credited to purchase. This is a good place to taste pinot noir. It's also a very nice tasting room in design. Rombauer(also on the trail) is free. If they have their chardonnay, that's the big deal...yummy!

Many of the tasting rooms in Sonoma are smaller and somewhat less crowded. I agree you should head over to the Healdsburg area. If you travel along Alexander Valley Road you will have a wide variety of great tasting rooms to choose from. This is an excellent area for Zinfandel and Pinot Noir. Do check out the wineroad site someone suggested to you.

Check out Chowhound.Com and click to the message boards. You might be overwhelmed by the format initially(as I was) but you can get some great suggestions. I might add if you simply post the question as to where the "hounds" recommend you eat given what you like you will get lots of answers.

LLindaC does know her wines and is a good source of info.

The weather is very hot right now(it will be hotter in Napa and Sonoma as they are somewhat more inland. Frankly, when we get really hot, it is usually followed in relatively short time by fog from the coast. That same fog can make an August day in SF rather chilly. I used to live in SF and have worn everything from linen to down during August. Layering your clothes is the best advice when staying in SF and probably the Carmel/Monterey area as well.

You are coming at a good time, a busy time and the time you have. I think it will be a great way to transition to a new job.

shelja Jul 19th, 2006 05:39 PM

Thank you all. How do Mendocino and Carmel compare? If we just went north would we miss the coastal drive? How do these two areas differ?

Catbert Jul 19th, 2006 05:46 PM

You'll get plenty of coastline on the way to Mendocino. And it's a more rugged, dramatic coastline. I think of Mendocino as a much smaller, intimate town than Monterey or Carmel. It's also a lot less crowded and touristy. It's very charming.

trippinkpj Jul 19th, 2006 05:47 PM

Carmel and Monterey have nice weather right now. As the previous poster said, the coast is not hot. It's cool to warm in some spots. I can't really answer your comparision question, because I've spent much more time in Carmel/ Monterey than Mendocino. I think you'll find good info on both of these areas, by doing a search on previous posts.

trippinkpj Jul 19th, 2006 07:49 PM

If you do go to Carmel/ Monterey area visit Pacific Grove. The downtown is more small town than Carmel or Monterey. Check prevois posts on lodging and dining in PG.

Ramblero Jul 20th, 2006 06:41 AM

Whew!!! Where to begin. Sacramento is too far out of the way, time-wise to fly in/out of. If you're picking up a car at the airport, SFO is 20 minutes from the city. Since you're flying in Fri night, you can take BART (pack light!) from the airport to the City and take a cab to your hotel and pick up a car Sat AM close to where you're staying. Be prepared for weather that ranges ffrom 50°+, windy and foggy, at night on the ocean to 100°+ inland (wine country) during the day.

I'd spend 3 days in SF.
2 nights in Carmel.
2 nights in the wine country.

Forget Half Moon Bay....there's nothing there worthwhile...unless you're heavy-duty surfer dudes...in which case Maverick's is one of the top 5 places on the earth...if the conditions are heavy (50' waves).

Carmel is a 2+ hr drive (take 101 to Salinas and then go West to Carmel...stop at the mission in San Juan Bautista on the way). You want spectacular US 1 drives? Don't take 1 to Carmel from SF...you don't have time. Take 1 from Carmel south to Big Sur. Eat at Nepenthe ($$)...or Post Ranch ($$$$)...or Rocky Point Restaurant 5? miles so. of Carmel (I haven't beeen there in years...but the view (and sea otters) were wondeful. While you're there, keep going thru Big Sur and see the Hearst Castle (an all day trip down, thru and back to Carmel).

SF. Go see the flower conservatory in Golden Gate Park & the new DeYoung Museum. Go see MOMA (Museum of Modern Art @ 3rd & Mission and the Martin Luther King memorial at the park across the street from MOMA. Go through Golden Gate Park & the Japanese Tea Garden. Take the ferry to Alcatraz or Angle Island...or Belvedere for lunch. Drive over the GG Bridge and have lunch in Sausalito. Go have dinner at Anjou (just off Union Sq in SF.)...wonderful French bistro. Go have dinner at The House (Asian/California fusion) on Grant at Columbus/Broadway (park @ garage on Broadway about 1/2 block west of Columbus.) Fantastic! Or Boulevard or The Slanted Door (Thai) at the Ferry Building. Have drinks at the top of the Hyatt Regency. Have sushi at Ebisu, 9th & Lincoln @ GG Park. (I introduced a friend from UT to sushi at Ebisu. After that experience...she wanted sushi for breakfast, lunch & dinner every day while she was here for 7 days.) Drive over to Berkeley and have dinner at Chez Panisse Café. Get tickets to a Giants game...in the best ball park in the country. Hurry. You're running out of time. There's too much to do.

(FYI...I've lived here for over 35 years.)

Have Fun!!! Report back!!!!

: )

shelja Jul 20th, 2006 07:16 AM

Thank you all and thanks Ramblero for the last post - it was great. I think we will spend weekends in SF and weekdays mostly in Carmel/Big Sur and Sonoma. So here is the plan:

-Arrive SFO Aug 4th at 10:30pm. Take BART to Marriott on Union Square area (got it for $159). Spend day in SF.
-Get up on Sun and drive to Carmel. Spend Sunday in Carmel. Stay at Quail Lodge in Carmel Valley.
- Monday - drive to Big Sur and stop at Point Lobos and Hearst Castle. have lunch at Nepthune. Return to Quail Lodge
-Tues - spend morning in Carmel and start drive to Sonoma.
-Spend Tues night through Fri afternoon in Sonoma. Stay at Lodge at Sonoma Renaissance. Wineries and restaurants TBD
-Fri afternoon head back to SF and spend Fri evening and Sat in SF.

Let me know what you all think. I appreciate all of your help.

saps Jul 20th, 2006 07:22 AM

I think it sounds great.

Friday afternoon traffic leaving the San Jose area (if you take 101 out of Carmel) will be heavy but you have left yourself plenty of time to not feel rushed.

Have fun.

iamq Jul 20th, 2006 09:08 AM

Can I come?
Nepenthe is an interesting place to stop, but I'd eat elsewhere. It's a bit of a rip-off and the food is mediocre at the VERY best. Se sure to take the short side trip out to Pfieffer Beach while in Big Sur. Have a great trip.
-Bill

thezanmiller Jul 20th, 2006 09:12 AM

If you opt for S.F. and wine country, I have found it easier to fly in and out of Oakland (cheap flights via Southwest, too).

There are many terrific restaurants in wine country. Some of my favorites: Bouchon for lunch (I hope I spelled this right -- great bakery, same owner as French Laundry); Taylor's Refresher in Napa is a fun, casual lunch spot along Napa's main drag.

Prime and Martini House are also terrific -- great dinner places.

As for wineries, if you are first timers to the area I would highly suggest a private tour/appointment at Coppola (Rubicon Estate) if you can arrange it. (See the caves, enjoy the ambiance of the estate, taste the Rubicon, their flagship wine.) Heitz cellers in Napa is another favorite. They have a small tasting room and offer free tastings, and their wine is killer. We also enjoyed a very nice tour at Chateau Montelena -- they are known for chardonnay.



bayworld Jul 20th, 2006 09:43 AM

Your itinerary sounds great. The only other destination in SF itself is one that is a bit of a local secret - the Sutro Baths and Sutro Park trail, not far from GG Park. The Baths were an actual working baths and are now ruins, with a small cave that leads to a tiny beach. Even better is the fantastic ending to the Sutro Heights Park trail atop the cliff (which starts at the top of the stairs where you climb down to the baths), where you clamber up after an easy,winding hike to a mesa that overlooks the Pacific and from which you can see west and north to the GG Bridge. I have lived here in the Bay Area for many years, been to every place on your list, and travelled to 40+ countries, but that view from that mesa is like nothing I have ever seen (there's even a small rock maze on the mesa which kids love). The Cliff House restaurant next door is also much better these days and you can have a drink there while watching the sunset and the surf pound the rocks below. Great way to end a day.

The other advice is, slow down, stop often (esp. near the ocean) and relax. If you see roadside fruit stands buy whatever is in season (this is the fruit and veg basket of the US after all). And pack lunches when you are not eating special meals, as it will give you the chance to spend more time exploring quiet places like Point Lobos at leisure! Enjoy!

SAB Jul 20th, 2006 09:47 AM

Shelja --trying to see Point Lobos, Big Sur and Hearst before lunch is not feasible. Carmel to Hearst can be a 3 hour drive during the summer--lots of people taking in the views. I would recommend that you skip a visit to Hearst. I second peterboys recommendation that you drive down 1, visit Julia Pfeiffer Burns State Park.

LLindaC Jul 20th, 2006 10:12 AM

I don't agree with Rubicon. What a ripoff! They charge you 25 bucks to park the car then pour cheap wine.Tourist trap. I agree you should do one tour, but since you are staying in Sonoma, skip Napa and focus on specific areas, such as the Alexander Valley, Dry Creek Valley, Russian River Valley. Benziger has a fun tour and is a nice stop. It's fun to visit some of the gorgeous places, such as Gloria Ferrer, but also fun to visit some of the small, fun ones such as Topolos. Each winery has its own character, decor, etc, it's fun to "stumble" upon some, but also worthwhile to get a map, guidebook, etc and do a bit of research! We loved J Winery and the food/wine pairings. Other wineries are copying them now. My husband and I have taken many trips to the area and still enjoy revisiting some of our favorites to check out the new vintages. We particularly like Imagery, Roshambo, Limerick Lane, Gary Ferrell, Ledson, Amphora. Papapietro-Perry, Wilson and our all time must see, Meeker in Geyserville in the old bank building. Locals is next door with many good, small wineries represented. Healdsburg is a wonderful stop for dinner (Willi's Seafood)and has many tasting rooms, our favorite Rosenblum, yum. Last time, we attempted to hit every winery in Alexander Valley, which was fun. Loved Fieldstone and Johnson Family in particular. Driving in Sonoma Valley is beautiful- the roads are well marked with signs to the wineries on road signs.

shelja Jul 20th, 2006 10:38 AM

Thank you all so much. One more question - would you recommend that we drive ourselves around Sonoma Valley or hire a towncar? Thanks.

bobludlow Jul 20th, 2006 10:46 AM

Whether you end up choosing Mendocino or Carmel, there is no reason to shorten your San Francisco time to visit Half Moon Bay. Same coastline, but of the three Half Moon Bay is the least magical. Plus the best drive down the coast from SF is closed right now due to some major mudslides - you would have to take one of the two peninsula freeways. Why bother?

saps Jul 20th, 2006 11:09 AM

If you both are going to drink then hire a town car. If one of you is not drinking (or a small amount over a long time) then drive yourself. Get a good map and you will be fine.

I don't think I'm shedding new light here...

LLindaC Jul 20th, 2006 11:11 AM

Drive yourselves. My hints for enjoying wine tastings:
1. Have a huge breakfast. Go to first winery early. Do your tour at second or third.
2. When doing tastings, skip the ones you know you won't like (though this is a problem for me, lol)
3. Share a tasting with your spouse. Sip, taste. Don't feel bad about pouring out the leftovers
4. Have scenic picnic lunch
5. Have coffee midday. Keep snacks in the car, cheese, crackers, etc
I've found that you can do 6-7 wineries per day easily without feeling woozy or being illegal. Driving is very easy in Sonoma and we always enjoy it.

Ramblero Jul 20th, 2006 04:50 PM

Ummmmm....you can't BEGIN to see SF in one day (Sat). Consider driving to Carmel on Monday. I'd still argue for stopping in San Juan Bautista to see the mission (and have lunch at Les Jardins de San Juan) and get to Carmel around 2. You can see most of downtown Carmel in 4 or 5 hrs. IF you go to Hearst Castle (an approx 200+ mile rnd trip or 2 - 3 hrs each way down 1 (a SPECTACULAR 2 lane rd 500' above the ocean...with very limited passing opportunities), leave EARLY in the AM and you MIGHT be back for dinner at 8 or 9 (make reservations - everywhere). Come on!!!! Nepenthe is Far Out!!! (essence of 1960's hippy California in a spectacular location).

Also...check to see if your hotel has a shuttle at the airport vs taking BART (which runs every 20 minutes, last train at 11:46PM). It would be a lot easier. You'd still probably want to take a cab from the BART station to your hotel.

Carmel vs Mendocino??? How 'bout BIG MONEY vs Hipdome!!! 'member....Carmel is Pebble Beach, Clint Eastwood and Rodeo Drive on the Beach. Mendocino is where all the smart, educated, moneyed SF Hippys went after the fall of Haight-Ashbury and the Summer of Love. Oh...you have no idea what I'm talking about....you weren't even born. Well...anyway...you can't do both. Actually....extend your trip for ( counts fingers) about 5 more days and do - this is a MUST - Yosemite ( 4 + hrs to get there, over-night at the Awhanee...ok, ok, Yosemite Lodge (call immediately and see if you can get reservations)) and back the next day and 3 nights on the North Coast (Mendocino, Gualala (St. Orres) and Sea Ranch at the lodge.) Spectacular. Yannow...once they've seen this, you can't keep 'em back in Ohio.

Even tho I've been there a number of times, others here are much better versed on The Wine Country. I'd just rather drink the stuff. : )

kbob88 Jul 20th, 2006 09:10 PM

Here are some thoughts, based on ferrying visitors around whenever they come out to visit me:

You're not allowing enough time for SF, but you're probably most likely to have chances to visit it again in the future, so you can see things you missed later.

Blow off Half Moon Bay: you don't have time and it's not all that, plus hwy 1 is closed b/w HMB and SF/Daly City due to a landslide, and the traffic on rt 92 is awful.

You can do a day trip to Hearst Castle from Carmel and still hit Pt Lobos, Julia Pfeiffer Burns, and maybe Pfeiffer Beach. It's a long day, with an early start, but I've done it. In the summer Pt Lobos closing time is usually extended past the normal 5pm; call them to find out. BTW, if you're in Big Sur, don't miss the McWay Falls at Julia Pfeiffer Burns St Park. It's a must see.

That said Hearst Castle is a question mark: it's beautiful up there and interesting, but it's not cheap, and the tour is very guided, and not that long.

Cambria is OK but not worth the extra time -- unless you wanted to stay down there and drive back the next day.

On your way to Monterey/Carmel, if it's not rush hour in San Jose, the fast route is down 280 from SF to 85 south to 101 south, then down through Gilroy. The more scenic route is 280 -> 85 -> 17 S -> rt 1 S in Santa Cruz. That way you could stop in Santa Cruz on the way down, maybe try some surfing.

Up north, Sonoma County is where it's at -- don't bother with Napa, it's too commercialized and busy. Stay in either Sonoma town or Healdsburg. I think the wineries are better in Healdsburg area (Russian River, Dry Creek Valley, Alexander Valley, Chalk Hill), but Sonoma has more history. They're both really nice little towns with great central plazas. Sonoma has the old historic mission and presidio area. Healdsburg probably has slightly better shops, and better wineries. That said, they're only about 30-40 minutes from each other. Consider renting some bikes and biking around the wine country in the morning; it's a great way to tour. Then go tasting in the afternoon.

Wineries: around Healdsburg, I like DeLoach, Hartford Family, Gary Farrell, Ridge, Chalk Hill, and Robert Young for very good wines. If you want good wines but great locations/scenery/tasting rooms, try Everett Ridge, Hop Kiln, Roshambo, Stryker-Sonoma, Field Stone, and Lambert Bridge.

Mendocino is nice. It is more laid-back , granola-y, and small-townish than Carmel. It's also a torturous, curvy (although very pretty) hour drive from rt 101. The road goes through the Anderson valley, which has lots of smaller, lesser-known wineries. Ft Bragg up there isn't bad either. The coast up there is beautiful, but it's not as dramatic as Big Sur, no way. On the other hand, the entire coast (north and south) may all be totally fogged in anyway (often is in August). Best to have an inland backup plan just in case.

Given that you only have a week, I'm not sure that going to both Sonoma and Big Sur is a great idea. It's certainly doable, but it is a lot of driving (something we Californians do a lot of). You could do Sonoma area and then do Anderson Valley / Mendocino / Ft Bragg for your coastal experience. Or you could do Monterey / Carmel / Big Sur, and tack on the very good Paso Robles wine country, Cambria, Hearst Castle, Morro Bay, Pismo Beach and San Luis Obispo and return the fast route via hwy 101 (about 3.5 hours to SF). Probably depart Carmel, stay night in Cambria, then stay next night in SLO or Paso Robles. Either option might make for a more relaxing and less hectic trip.

And don't forget the Marin Headlands -- when you visit the Golden Gate Bridge, make sure you drive up into the headlands and enjoy the views, and maybe take a hike. Marin also has great parks and sights too, like Pt Reyes.


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