Carolyn

In our travels lately, we have noticed that many, many (not all) children don't know how to behave on an airplane, in a restaurant or hotel, at a pool, etc. Allow me to vent: I don't remember my children being so ill-behaved; moreover, if they did misbehave, we spoke to them immediately and the problem was solved. Our recent trips to Florida and California have been marred by such children, especially on airplanes, with parents who seem to ignore or encourage rude,loud behavior. The last straw was the couple behind us on a flight last weekend who chose to diaper their 2-year-old at their seats; it was not a wet diaper, but a dirty one, and the odor was soon all over the section. It was all I could do to restrain my husband. I do remember how difficult it is to travel with an infant; that's not what I'm talking about. How do you handle these situations?

Gee

Hey Carolyn,

I know what you mean. Kids now are so bad! If I were you, I'd just tell the kids straight out to stop yelling or better yet..tell the parents. I have done so in the past. The kids/parents get mad but so what! They need to control their brats!

Rob

Has anyone noticed that very few people want to accept responsibility for their actions or their kids actions? Considering that adults get drunk and attack flight attendants....what's a little baby shit? Anyway, please vent ....not that it will do anything but make you feel a little better. We own a B&B in New Orleans and had several tennis pros & their wives rent our place for a weekend. Other friends of theirs (with a 10 year old girl & her 18month old sister) came into town and were staying at another B&B. All the pros and their wives were in their 30s and of course wanted to "play" in New Orleans. They left the 10 year old here at my place to baysit her 18 month old sister. Guess how long before the 10 year old freaks out and is scared? Guess who babysat til 1:00am? Guess who got an earful when they returned at 1:00am. Do you think they gave a damn? No, not at all and were, in fact, indignant that I confronted them. I used to say I thought kids were pretty good in gumbo...but Mom & Dad would've been delicious!

Owen O'Neill

I've learned to ignore them (the parents and the kids)unless it gets so extreme that I say something to the parents - who invariably don't care or truly don't "get it". The other thing I do (which produces far greater personal satisfaction) is to COMPLIMENT the parents and kids I encounter in my travels when I see kids who behave as we wish they all would.

Petra

Thank you for stating that not all children misbehave in public. I am sorry that you have had this experience and I think these parents give all of us a bad reputation. As a mother of two, who travels quite often, I am extremely proud of my children when they travel. They are very well behaved and quiet and have been since we began traveling. Unfortunately, I have encountered more rude adults in my travels than rude children. Once on a cross country flight, a flight attendant accused me of putting a dirty diaper in the galley trash. My son had been asleep the entire flight and I had never even gotten up from my seat. Even the passengers behind me spoke up in my defense, but this flight attendant continued to berate me for the rest of the flight. (Another flight attendant took me aside after the flight and explained that there had been no dirty diaper in the galley after all). I also had to deal with a drunken man on a flight to the Carribbean. He was drunk before take-off and continued drinking throughout our flight. He was vulgar and rude and I had to explain to my children that they should try to ignore him. I also sat next to a older gentleman on a flight who insisted on swearing and screaming at everyone because he was afraid of flying. My point is, there are rude children and there are rude adults. I suppose we have to learn to take it all in stride. Is this enough of an issue to start an argument over, or do we just try to let these things go. I am sorry for your experiences, just as I am sorry for mine. My choice is to not let them bother me and to look forward to the joys of being on vacation!

stephanie

Owen & Petra, so very nicely said. I appreciate your comments as another mother of very small children who travel a lot and are very well behaved. It IS sad that the bad ones spoil it for everyone else.

We've had nothing but good experiences traveling with our kids, and the people around us have been nothing but kind and understanding.

I try to remember that if I'm going to use public transportation of any sort, or go anywhere public, that I have to share that space with many different people. I can't decide who else travels on that plane or control what they do. Though THEY TOO should be considerate of the fact that they are sharing the space with others.

We know all too well that airplanes are very small places where children can begin to feel cooped up and feel a lack of control of their environment. Same goes for the parents. There is nowhere to sit a child in "time out" on an airplane. However, I believe that it starts at home. Good behavior and parenting at home should carry over to other situations including travel.

Is it just me or are kids more spoiled, selfish, and disrespecting than before, and parents less willing to follow through with discipline and limitations with their children now than before?

Anyhow, I also try to remember when I'm flying that I'm going on a vacation and that I'm fortunate to be doing so. (And I also pray frequently to make it "there" and for a safe landing!) We have the power to pick our battles, to choose happiness or not.

Mike

Grrrrrrrrr that's what I say about noisy ill behaved rugrats on planes and running all over motels etc. Children are just so vile on the whole. I will never understand why anyone would ever want one of these incrediably noisy, smelly, disruptive, whiny, demanding, ill tempered midgets. Why do you people even want to own one of these things? I'm sure I'll be attacked for staying the truth here but the fact is when Dear Abby asked her readers in a secret poll a few years ago how many people would choose not to have children again if they could to those who already had them in reality, about 75% said they would NOT have the kids if they could live it over. That says alot.

Natalie

Hey Mike, were you born an adult?

What a lot of people don't realize is that many parents are held hostage by their kids in public. There is a damned if you do and damned if you don't element to correcting your children in public. In any situation, if your child is acting up, half of the people around would vote for you to nip it in the bud; however, half of the people would give you a dirty look if you say or do anything. Kids pick up on that, and can use it to get what they want. As a parent, I have found that if you show your children you are not afraid to tell them that they will be grounded (or not get that treat they want)in public -THEN FOLLOW THROUGH, you'll have very few problems.
It seems there is a level of intoleration toward children - badly behaved or otherwise. That's a shame!

Michelle

Ha! Looks like Mike got what he deserved. Isn't it amazing how we conveniently forget what little terrors we were when we were young (granted probably better than the majority of the kids now a days,but...)? Looks like Mike did.

ilisa

Mike, you ask why do any of us want to own one of these things? First, I am expecting a child in a few weeks, and last time I checked, I am not going to the store to purchase her. Second, she is not a thing. A thing is an item that can be discarded. Maybe you were lacking something in childhood and were commonly referred to as a thing...

Owen O'Neill

How about if we all ignore "Mike" and any postings by people who employ his tactics? The tone of his message and it's confrontational qualities are suspiciously similar to messages posted last year on this forum. Fodor's was ultimately able to deal with the problem and the "trash" postings stopped but COMPLETELY ignoring cretans like this is usually an effective tactic. They (he) are looking for a fight - let's not lend any credibility to their argument by responding.

martha

Until I read that his screed was part of a pattern of obnoxious behavior, I assumed that Mike was just satirizing crotchety adult behavior. Wow.
I think Carolyn's original question is a good one, and the vehemence of the posts responding to it illustrates the problem. Yes, children need some accommodation, and yes, adults can be plenty obnoxious. But when adults are being hideous, you can decide whether to deal with them and do so. When a child is misbehaving, talking to them is usurping a parent's role (or what should be a parents role, tho' many seem to have abandoned it), and the parent's response is likely to be to turn on you rather than insist the child shape up. Sometimes parents just don't realize that what the kid is doing bothers you, amazing as that can be in some cases. But a lot of parents seem to tolerate much wilder behavior than my siblings and I were ever allowed to indulge in. Reprimand their precious spawn and you're the bad guy. Now you've got two problems instead of one.

April

Well maybe Mike wouldn't have that attitude if more parents would 'parent' their children. I had one kid kick the back of my airplane seat throughout a nine hour flight although we repeatedly asked the mother to DO something. The other day in a line-up several kids in different families ran around and yakked, loudly, the whole time. What were the parents doing all the while? Ignoring or encouraging the behaviour as if they had to win their child's approval and admiration. (No I did not act like this at that age.) It's not a dislike of children I'm talking about, but rude behaviour by anyone. Maybe it's time to stop avoiding the issue - maybe the next time you should not hold your husband back!

Opal

There is a film all about people travelling in Europe called "Two for the Road" (made in the late 60s starring Audrey Hepburn) that shows just how children traveling often are. Check it out at a video store to see what I have seen in real life many many times both with strangers kids and relative's kids. This kid in the film is like the ones I have so often seen: screams that she is hungry then refuses to eat then says 2 minutes after leaving the resturant that she's hungry. Demands very toy and candy in sight and has temper tamptrums until she gets them.
Constantly interrupts adults who are trying to talk. Shreaks, cries and shouts at unbelievable volume levels. Jumps up and down kicking and twisting for very long time periods. And does all this in public with neither she/he nor the parents caring one twit. The parents just sit there smoking, watching tv or talking on the phone and meanwhile others including many strangers have to live with this hellion in their midsts.
Why do you people with children think everyone else should like to have their trips
invaded by something like this?

ilisa

This may come as a surprise, Opal, but there are many parents that do not think other people should have their trips invaded by rude, ill-behaved children. To lump all parents into one category is very irresponsible.

Amy

Is this a travel forum or a hate forum? I usually enjoy this site, but this is terrible. While we are on this topic I have a queation. Is there a changing table on most airplanes? I have never needed to change an infant on a flight, but the last time I used a the bathroom on one it was a tiny little closet. As far as unruly children are concerned, have you ever offered to help? Often parents feel helpless and are doing the best that they can. An airplane is a confined area, and options are minimal. I have been lucky when traveling with my small children. I usually fly when they will sleep. I also bring food and books to help keep them busy. If a child is in pain(ears) unfortunalty there is not alot you can do to stop the crying. That's the breaks. Children are our Future, let's try and be more positive.

Amy

Is this a travel forum or a hate forum? I usually enjoy this site, but this is terrible. While we are on this topic I have a queation. Is there a changing table on most airplanes? I have never needed to change an infant on a flight, but the last time I used a the bathroom on one it was a tiny little closet. As far as unruly children are concerned, have you ever offered to help? Often parents feel helpless and are doing the best that they can. An airplane is a confined area, and options are minimal. I have been lucky when traveling with my small children. I usually fly when they will sle

martha

Several of the parents who have posted on this site refuse to acknowledge that some kids are not just being kids--they're being obnoxious. Perhaps they could all wear Whitney Houston pins when they travel. Then, when some brat is kicking the back of your seat for hours, you can ask the Whitney Houstonite to change seats with you.
I'll be wearing a Judith Martin ("Miss Manners") pin. Mike will probably go for an Ezzo/Babywise pin.

April

Excellent solution, Martha. I wish I'd thought of it. Next time...
And Amy, I don't think this is a hate forum - it's just 'reality'. Obviously if everyone was considerate of others, there wouldn't be a problem.

D.B.

Become French: spit on the parents and stuff the kids into the overhead compartment. (Just a funny reference to another link I was reading.)