Anyone expect to win in Las Vegas?
Dec 16th, 2003, 10:57 AM
#21
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I stick to Blackjack and video poker and generally break even or come out a little ahead. My wife plays slots and roulette and always loses everything she bets by the end of the trip. We have some friends who go to Vegas twice a year and always claim they make enough gambling to pay for the trip - every time! I am convinced they are full of crap - I guess the fact that he is an insurance salesman and she is a realtor should have been the first clue. Many people can't admit that they lose at gambling. Anytime someone tells me theyalways win money in Vegas I just say "That's nice, do you keep track of how much you lose too, or just how much you win?"
Dec 17th, 2003, 07:51 AM
#24
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I go to any gambling facility (track, casino etc) expecting only to have a good time but always hoping to win. Since I don't go very often - like once every 5 years - I don't win much but I also don't lose very much either. Last time at a casino (2 years ago)it took me 1 hour to gamble away $20 and I had fun doing it while the $20 lasted. Once it was gone we left. No casino is getting rich off just me. But I'll probably turn into one of those little old ladies that take the buses from every town in Massachusetts down to Foxwoods spending my pension in a slot machine.
Dec 17th, 2003, 08:16 AM
#25
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My parents, who are totally into gambling, offered me some advice as a gambling adult on my way to Vegas: "Prepare to lose" and "If you go to Vegas expecting to win every time, stay home!" I go and play to have a good time hoping to win but not expecting, so that the win is a bonus.
Then again, when my mom was setting up my gaming parameters for me she quickly added, "But you're not here to lose, you're here to win!"
Then again, when my mom was setting up my gaming parameters for me she quickly added, "But you're not here to lose, you're here to win!"
Dec 17th, 2003, 09:21 AM
#26
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OK, Ted, call me silly, but we go to Las Vegas twice a year and although yes we lose, we also win, and when it is all added up on the flight home, we never come home with less.
So while Hope is a better word than Expect, I do hope and expect to be a winner in Las Vegas.
Our last trip-we lost every time we played anything, the first day there. So we quit, shopped ( either way we were not hanging on to our money!) and had fun, laughed and ate and enjoyed LV.
Then after a couple of days there, after dinner one night, I put $100 into a slot machine and won $1000-and that turned it around for us. We won almost everything we played, paying ourselves back for the first loser day and for the shopping and we came home with some Christmas shopping money.
Of course, the Bellagio comped us some as we left too, which is always a treat.
This has been discussed here before. There are people who say what you say, I just have to be the one that disagrees.
But then Scarlett never was one of the crowd, was she?
So while Hope is a better word than Expect, I do hope and expect to be a winner in Las Vegas.
Our last trip-we lost every time we played anything, the first day there. So we quit, shopped ( either way we were not hanging on to our money!) and had fun, laughed and ate and enjoyed LV.
Then after a couple of days there, after dinner one night, I put $100 into a slot machine and won $1000-and that turned it around for us. We won almost everything we played, paying ourselves back for the first loser day and for the shopping and we came home with some Christmas shopping money.
Of course, the Bellagio comped us some as we left too, which is always a treat.
This has been discussed here before. There are people who say what you say, I just have to be the one that disagrees.
But then Scarlett never was one of the crowd, was she?
Dec 17th, 2003, 09:49 AM
#27
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Ted, you are so right, casinos know we're all suckers. But give it up. You can't win. Some people have this idea they win, and beat the house, they turn a blind eye to the odds are always against you. Everybody likes to claim they came home with winnings. We lost big, but had a ball, because we knew we would. Cant wait to go back to LV and lose some more.
Gin
Gin
Dec 17th, 2003, 09:58 AM
#28
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Perhaps, Scarlett, the reason I'm disagreeing with your contention is that my degree in statistics tells me that while there will in fact be a few very rare individuals that will win overall on a few consecutive visits to LV, the odds of losing money overall get higher and higher and higher every single time you bet, every single time you visit the casino. (The odds of losing a single bet, of course, stay the same for every identical bet, but the odds of losing overall become increasingly predictable with every additional bet).
You stated that you have NEVER come home without winning, after many visits.
Sorry, dear.
I'm not buying that one.
I know lots of people who claim they win regularly. They always engage in creative accounting or selective memory exercises. Like withdrawing extra cash from the ATM or getting a cash advance from the casino, but then claiming they came home from LV with more money than they arrived with. Ummmmm, that's Enron accounting.
Why can't people simply admit that overall they lose money in LV over the long haul? That they're in LV to be entertained, and gambling's a part of the entertainment? It's the people who lie about this (to themselves and others) that I don't understand.
You stated that you have NEVER come home without winning, after many visits.
Sorry, dear.
I'm not buying that one.
I know lots of people who claim they win regularly. They always engage in creative accounting or selective memory exercises. Like withdrawing extra cash from the ATM or getting a cash advance from the casino, but then claiming they came home from LV with more money than they arrived with. Ummmmm, that's Enron accounting.
Why can't people simply admit that overall they lose money in LV over the long haul? That they're in LV to be entertained, and gambling's a part of the entertainment? It's the people who lie about this (to themselves and others) that I don't understand.
Dec 17th, 2003, 10:02 AM
#29
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Wow, Call me silly, now call me a Liar 
Ted, believe what you want, and I will believe you have a degree in statistics- What you believe is really not that important to me, as what I win in LV should not be that important to you. I surely don't have to defend myself or what I say here.
I stand by what I said. So you may move on now.
Ted, believe what you want, and I will believe you have a degree in statistics- What you believe is really not that important to me, as what I win in LV should not be that important to you. I surely don't have to defend myself or what I say here.
I stand by what I said. So you may move on now.
Dec 17th, 2003, 10:26 AM
#31
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Ted Turner, why so harsh? Of course peple win AND lose when gambling, and of course they gamble expecting to win--do you think anyone gambles to LOSE? You need a lucky attitude to start. Many of my friends have won big money in Vegas, enough to cover their trips. And my friends are very nice. When they lose, they zip their lips because no one likes whiney complainers. We all love hearing about lucky wins!
BTW, you should read more carefully before you say you've caught someone in an untruth. Scarlett stated at the beginning "...that when it's all added up on the flight home, we never come home with less." She's figuring in all the goodies that come with the gambling, so she's right that they've won.
BTW, you should read more carefully before you say you've caught someone in an untruth. Scarlett stated at the beginning "...that when it's all added up on the flight home, we never come home with less." She's figuring in all the goodies that come with the gambling, so she's right that they've won.
Dec 17th, 2003, 10:44 AM
#32
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OK, here's a simple example.
Let's say the odds of winning on any trip to LV are 50-50. They're not that good (the casinos would go broke if they paid out as much as they took in), but let's just say that those are the odds.
That's equivalent to flipping a coin.
Odds of heads or tails are 50-50.
If someone claims they NEVER lose in LV, after many trips, that is the same as saying "every single time I flip a coin it comes up heads. Every time".
OK, you pull a coin out of your pocket and tell me how many times you have to flip it before you get 10 heads in a row.
If Scarlett claims to have never lost in, say, 10 trips, she's actually beating the odds by considerably more than the odds of flipping 10 heads in a row (since the odds of winning in LV are less than 50-50 assuming she's not exclusively playing poker, sports book, Jackpot video poker).
BTW, the odds of flipping 10 heads in a row is 1 in 1024.
In LV, the odds of winning overall at blackjack playing perfect strategy (not counting cards) for 4 hours a day, 3 days per trip, 2 times per year will be a lot less than 1 in 1024.
Maybe Scarlett is that 1 in 1024.
Could be I suppose.
Let's say the odds of winning on any trip to LV are 50-50. They're not that good (the casinos would go broke if they paid out as much as they took in), but let's just say that those are the odds.
That's equivalent to flipping a coin.
Odds of heads or tails are 50-50.
If someone claims they NEVER lose in LV, after many trips, that is the same as saying "every single time I flip a coin it comes up heads. Every time".
OK, you pull a coin out of your pocket and tell me how many times you have to flip it before you get 10 heads in a row.
If Scarlett claims to have never lost in, say, 10 trips, she's actually beating the odds by considerably more than the odds of flipping 10 heads in a row (since the odds of winning in LV are less than 50-50 assuming she's not exclusively playing poker, sports book, Jackpot video poker).
BTW, the odds of flipping 10 heads in a row is 1 in 1024.
In LV, the odds of winning overall at blackjack playing perfect strategy (not counting cards) for 4 hours a day, 3 days per trip, 2 times per year will be a lot less than 1 in 1024.
Maybe Scarlett is that 1 in 1024.
Could be I suppose.
Dec 17th, 2003, 10:45 AM
#33
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dln, do you see you bolstered Teds view, so all the credibility swings to the stat man.
" .. when they win they zip their lips ... and we all love hearing about lucky wins". dln you tell us nobody talks about losing, they brag about wins, which are lucky. That looks to us like its Ted's position, and I think perhaps you must feel the same way now too.
" .. when they win they zip their lips ... and we all love hearing about lucky wins". dln you tell us nobody talks about losing, they brag about wins, which are lucky. That looks to us like its Ted's position, and I think perhaps you must feel the same way now too.
Dec 17th, 2003, 10:57 AM
#35
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Thank you dln, you said it so much better than I could have.
I say! HollyJim is the same as Ginny, they put in their two or less cents worth, then disappear! How odd.
I like the thinking that says that Scarlett is the 1 in 1024, although I would rather be known as 1 in a Million!
Relax, Ted, you will be a winner too, some day.
I say! HollyJim is the same as Ginny, they put in their two or less cents worth, then disappear! How odd.
I like the thinking that says that Scarlett is the 1 in 1024, although I would rather be known as 1 in a Million!
Relax, Ted, you will be a winner too, some day.
Dec 17th, 2003, 11:02 AM
#36
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HollyJim (who never posted before, how very curious!), I have no desire to get in a mathematical or "hesaid/shesaid" argument with you or Ted.
I'll only say the pleasure of winning and having a fun time in Vegas overrides any losses, or why would anyone go? When gambling is the entertainment, along with all the other extra entertainment offered, the vacationer wins! You can offer all the stats you wants, but in my book, any time you have a good vacation and you're satisfied and happy, you win.
I'll only say the pleasure of winning and having a fun time in Vegas overrides any losses, or why would anyone go? When gambling is the entertainment, along with all the other extra entertainment offered, the vacationer wins! You can offer all the stats you wants, but in my book, any time you have a good vacation and you're satisfied and happy, you win.
Dec 17th, 2003, 11:14 AM
#38
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Though not LV but Atlantic City many years ago I gambled for the first time and lost everything within an hour! Been afraid to gamble ever since and did so for the first time last week in Puerto Rico. The first night I profited $45 and the second night I lost $45 so I broke even. That was enough for me! I enjoyed it for its entertainment value and didn't bet big or expect to win big. I also knew not to loose big too!
Dec 17th, 2003, 12:12 PM
#39
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That's really my point, dln.
Gambling should be viewed as entertainment.
If you win, great. That's a bonus.
The casinos offer comps to people like Scarlett because the casinos know that over time they're winning far more than the value of the comps they pay out.
But getting the comps is a fun perk, and part of the entertainment factor.
I'm not trying to imply gambling is a useless or silly activity. Some people enjoy it as much as going to a football game or play or beach.
But there's way too much misinformation out there and way too much superstition.
Your own comment was that "...you need a lucky attitude to start".
Attitude certainly can determine whether or not you have fun. But it has zero to do with whether you win or lose. That's a pure statistical process, and the casinos win lots of money from people who simply don't understand what's going on.
I think casinos taking money from people who don't know what's going on is sad and/or wrong. If they know the score and gamble for fun, everything's on the up and up IMO.
I'll get off my soap box now.
Sorry for the rant.
Gambling should be viewed as entertainment.
If you win, great. That's a bonus.
The casinos offer comps to people like Scarlett because the casinos know that over time they're winning far more than the value of the comps they pay out.
But getting the comps is a fun perk, and part of the entertainment factor.
I'm not trying to imply gambling is a useless or silly activity. Some people enjoy it as much as going to a football game or play or beach.
But there's way too much misinformation out there and way too much superstition.
Your own comment was that "...you need a lucky attitude to start".
Attitude certainly can determine whether or not you have fun. But it has zero to do with whether you win or lose. That's a pure statistical process, and the casinos win lots of money from people who simply don't understand what's going on.
I think casinos taking money from people who don't know what's going on is sad and/or wrong. If they know the score and gamble for fun, everything's on the up and up IMO.
I'll get off my soap box now.
Sorry for the rant.
Dec 17th, 2003, 01:26 PM
#40
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"For some reason though I can never seem to win enough to retire at the $5 BJ table."
Same here!! So, why do we play? Lord knows, most of us don't look like we're having much fun!
I've decided that (if there is a) next time, I'll gamble up to what I can easily afford to lose, and play only those games where a win might be enough to get me to early retirement. That possibility would be much more entertaining to me than four hours at a BJ table.
Same here!! So, why do we play? Lord knows, most of us don't look like we're having much fun!
I've decided that (if there is a) next time, I'll gamble up to what I can easily afford to lose, and play only those games where a win might be enough to get me to early retirement. That possibility would be much more entertaining to me than four hours at a BJ table.
