jhubbel

In about three weeks, I'm taking my first trip to Viet Nam. From Ho Chi Minh City to the Mekong Delta, from Phu Quoc to the cave adventures near Dong Hoi, from scuba diving to spelunking, this should be quite the adventure. I'm interested in other brave souls who have done athletic, adventurous trips to Viet Nam, and who like tents and hostel vs five star accommodations.

Please kindly, anyone who has suggestions: I am doing a minority tribe adventure with Ethnic travel out of Hanoi, working with Oxalis near Dong Hoi, diving with Blue Coral and A-74, and spending minimal city time. I'd love suggestions about how to get around the Mekong Delta, and any insider tips. I'm skipping Halong Bay (sheer time limits, next time around). Would love to do the motorcycle ride around Hoi An, any suggestions?

Been studying the language, doing my best to correct my accent, and planning what I hope to be a wonderful trip. I'll be posting regularly here and on TA, and giving insights as how things go and what happens, including if a river sweeps me downstream in the cave system.

Insights and feedback welcomed from seasoned Viet Nam travelers. Please keep in mind that I am also a Viet Nam era veteran, so this is a personal trip of real significance for me in that regard too. Thanks in advance to all.

jhubbel

Has anyone done the big cave system near Dong Hoi? Has anyone traveled with Oxalis? Done their multi day adventures?

Kathie

Sorry, I don't know either of those agencies.

VN is a country full of travel agencies. If you want a travel service, it's usually best to wait until you get there and can talk with agencies in person.

In terms of language, if you have a phrase or two people will be impressed, but you can do almost everything in English.

Once people know you are a VN vet, they will want to show you the local bar owned by a VN vet, etc.

Have a good trip!

crellston

Jhubbel, looking forward to hearing all about your travels. Sound like much sort of trip. I applaud you for learning the language, I am sure you will find it extremely useful as you seem to be going off the beaten track. One thing I did on a similar trip was to get 20 pr so travel phrases written down in English and Vietnamese so that when my accent failed me, I could show the people the paper. Worked a treat ( mostly!) The effort you are making we be much appreciated by the Vietnamese people. However, do bear in mind that many of the minority people in the more remote areas will not speak Vietnamese so to get the most out of a trip insist on a guide that speak their language.

When visiting Vietnam nam I usually travel independently and pick up guides along the way. As Kathie suggests, it is often better to choose a guide when there. There are loads to choose from and you will get the opportunity to meet them face to face before parting with your cash.

mareeS55

If I might suggest this, there's a wonderful small hotel in the old French diplomatic district that we stay at in Hanoi, the De Syloia Hotel, 17A Tran Hung Dao. Google it. It's lovely, and in a beautiful sector of the city, walking distance of the old quarter, the lake and the railway station up to Sapa.

In Saigon we always stay at the Majestic. Best hotel in the city.

English and French and German speakers are easily found, just ask the concierge, no need to go through tourist agencies. You can organise everything before leaving home, the people there will do it for you, they're very good on organising these things.

jhubbel

Many thanks to all. Crellson good to hear from you again! Just a note: as to the language, I have a wonderful family that has been taking care of my lawn and my nails for about seven years and Loi, the computer expert, is a university teacher who also helps out his sister at the nail shop. He has kindly spent 2-3 hours a week coaching me on basic phrases, and grilled me on the accent. Money well spent. I so appreciate the many suggestions.
So far the inquiries have been met with warm responses and I'm looking forward to leaving Jan 1. I'm also expecting many mispronounciations, many wonderful discoveries, fantastic food and absolutely breathtaking scenery. And a certain insanity for the Tet holiday.

If anyone has brought home something they found particularly lovely in terms of souvenirs from Viet Nam, what suggestions do you have? Thanks again to all for their good input. Best of the holidays to everyone.

Kathie

My favorite souvenirs have been artwork. The FIne Arts Museum in Hanoi has a gift shop that has work by locals, most of it very inexpensive. There are also art shops in the old quarter of Hanoi.

jhubbel

Thank you again.

I understand that a woman earlier took a great deal of umbrage at my referring to myself as a Vietnam veteran. I didn't say that. I said I am a Vietnam ERA veteran, which is something very specific, and I am an 80% disabled, DECORATED, veteran, who spent five years on active duty and one year as a Reservist serving my country during the latter part of that difficult war. I will be 61 in about a month. I take great care in making that distinction just as I take great pride in my service for which I earned three medals.

I don't know who this person is or what her anger is. However I do know that as a military vet who served honorably during that challenging time, it took many years before I chose to tell anyone I had served. We were spat upon, looked down on, refused the respect that we most certainly had earned for serving our country. It has only been in the last few years that I've been thanked for my service, asked to speak on Veteran's Day (I'm a professional speaker) and asked to stand at events where veterans are honored. From the time I first stood at attention at Fort Jackson, South Carolina in 1973 to the time I left the Army, both as an enlisted woman and as an officer, I was proud to wear that uniform. I help fellow vets get business with the Fortune 500. And I speak for all of us in the service: We don't need vitriol. We don't need to be attacked. It would have been slightly more polite to have asked a few questions before blasting away.

None of us is privy to the facts of someone else's life. As a long time journalist, which I learned at DINFOS (Defense Information School then housed in Indianapolis) and practiced at the Pentagon, I do my best to ask questions to understand, which is one reason I love to travel. I do my best to not make assumptions. For whoever wrote with such bile, I sincerely wish you great peace, and I hope that whatever is causing you such anger to heal. Anyone who is that angry clearly has some pain. I do most truly hope this puts this question to bed and I can continue this dialogue with others who've been adding value to this thread which I most certainly appreciate. Again, thanks to all.

sartoric

Hi jhubbel
I think you'll have a fabulous time, the Mekong delta is fascinating, and trekking to minority villages from Sapa a real highlight for me. We bought some lacquerware serving dishes in Hanoi, cheap, light and still in use today (trip was in 2009).
Enjoy!

Kathie

jhubbei, don't worry about maree. She responded to you out her own issues. She assumes all VN vets must be Australian. There was no need for you to explain yourself.

Enjoy your trip!

jhubbel

Thanks sweetie. I appreciate it. I would love some last minute pre trip suggestions, including from sartoric, about the trip you took around Sapa. I am doing that for about seven days. Any thoughts about stuff to take or what to look out for, other than wonderful people and gorgeous scenery? Since this will be winter, any thoughts about weather? I've googled everything but it always helps to hear from those who've been.

What are your thoughts and suggestions about taking photographs in the minority areas? I want to be respectful and then again I am a journalist. All insights welcomed.

sartoric

Hi jhubbel
Are you taking the train from Hanoi to Lao Cai (for Sapa) ? If I'd known I would have taken sleeping pills, the "soft sleeper" beds were slightly larger than an ironing board and about the same density.
Sapa was freezing in October, but enchanting all the same. We walked about 13 kms from one village to another with a young lady from the Red Dzao tribe. We had lunch with her at a roadside restaurant which was very rustic, basically two tables set up at the side of the owners home. There was a basket of green vegetables nearby, which turned out to be young bamboo shoots freshly cut that morning. Stir fried with some ginger & garlic they were yummy. I'd never seen them before, about the size of a middle finger and nutty. the cost for the day was about US $25 which I thought ridiculously cheap.
Have a hot pot in the Main Street of Sapa, noodles chicken and assorted veggies that you simmer in a perfumed broth at the table, delicious. We also had the best chicken spring rolls ever in Sapa.
I hope it's not too foggy/misty while you're there as the views are amazing.
There's a market with lots of ethnic tribal women selling embroidered fabric. Memorably my husband snuck away to a high point before yelling at the top of his lungs "lady wants a blanket" He then snapped away as I was swarmed by 20 or so women, all a foot shorter than me holding up their wares.
I did of course buy several.

crellston

Sartoric, your descriptions of the food are bringing back many memories for me and making me very hungry!!

We visited Sapa in December/ January at the start of our trip around the Dien Bien. Phu loop. We spent a few days in Sapa hiking around the valley an villages and loved it. The weather was great, blue skies and 20-25c temps. The morning we left it was thick fog and freezing temps. The next day we heard of snow in Sapa. The weather there really can change in an instant. A fleece and or thermal underwear would be a sensible precaution but hopefully, won't be needed.

As for people photography, Sapa was especially difficult in the town as there are so many tourists visiting, particularly at weekends. As a result, you can expect demands for payment to be the norm at these times. Out in the villages and markets, you will also probably encounter resistance as many people really do not there photos being taken. Buying something or a small fee may overcome this resistance but not always. A long lense or unobtrusive compact may be your best option.

Finally, I would echo Kathie's sentiments re the offensive post(s) I came in for some abuse from the same person at the same time. Water of a ducks back as far as I am concerned. Maybe that person has problems, maybe they are just another internet troll, either way just ignore.

Have a fantastic trip and do post atrip report of your experiences.

jhubbel

Crellston, as always, well said. It's amazing who has issues these days. At the moment, having landed here a couple of nights ago, I've been writing since three am, god I hate jet lag but at least it gives me writing time. My backpack zipper exploded during handling so when I picked it up it was taped up with all the contents shoved back in willy nilly. No idea if anything was lost. So first call of business was either repair or replace.
I'm staying in a funky little guest house in the tourist area, close to many key sites, and happily not too far from a "shop" where I could get repairs done. So after getting some money exchanged I began my trek to this shop, and what a trek it was. Anyone who's been here can attest to the tsunami wave of white helmeted motorcyclist, who care not a whit about pedestrians, and that goes for any other driver. These bikes and a great many going concerns take up all available walking space on what otherwise would be considered the sidewalk, forcing those of us who do walk out onto the street, into the onslaught of traffic. Hair raising to say the least. In many ways very funny, because there's not a thing to be done about it. I did find that joining arms with a bao (grandmother) or two helped when I needed to plough out into the middle of an intersection rather than wait for an opening when there never was one. There's a general disregard for street signs other than the basic stop or go and if you happen to not get across the street in time when the light turns green for them, then you'd better damned well be very very fast or get run over. They do not yield to pedestrians full stop.
After about a mile and a half hike and some checks along the way I found my baggage repair "shop", basically a guy and a gal in a conical hat wielding two sewing machines out on the sidewalk. She cheerfully eyeballed my backpack, pulled out a zipper, showed me, gave me a price of 145000 vnd or about thirteen dollars, and said it would be done by 5 pm. Are you kidding me? Part of me thought that might be too good to be true but at 4:45 when I had swum upstream through the traffic again, the guy handed me my better-than-new backpack with a perfectly repaired zipper, I had been saved a $300 replacement. Wow, I am impressed and very very grateful.

En route in the middle of the ocean of buzz one guy's refrigerator got disengaged right in the middle of the road, and landed on the street. I handed my backpack to two ladies on the sidewalk and sprinted (this isn't easy but it is fun) to the guy, who was trying to keep his bike upright and salvage the fridge. Soon two other guys stopped and we quickly got him off to the side of the road. It astounds me what folks put on the back of these sturdy little bikes, they flat disappear behind their loads.

There was a wonderful opportunity to try out my limited Vietnamese with a gentleman at the fruit market. I asked for two papayas, negotiated the price and got a better price, all in Vietnamese, and was tickled pink. Then I walked in with great confidence to a pho restaurant to order soup and the manager couldn't understand a word I said. All the air farted out of my balloon. Oh well. He told me in that very frank way that is common here that I "needed to work on my language skills." I'm laughing as I write this. Trust me, I sure do. Vietnamese is one tough language, the accent is tricky and it is humbling to say the least.

Saigon for me is beyond loud, being a lover of mountains and the country and silence, it's hard to be around this kind of bustle and traffic density. What I hope for today is to visit some markets and key sites before heading off to a tour of the minority villages including Sapa. As luck would have it, a young lady at a local Vietnamese restaurant has parents in Sapa who own a guesthouse and if let loose I hope to visit them with her greetings. That would be a lovely opportunity.

What was fun yesterday evening was to visit the local big supermarket and inspect the food, from the fruit to the packaged food. I always find that so fascinating in other countries. From how things are presented to seeing which countries get their goods in the stores. What brands are represented. I came home with new kinds of fruit to experiment with and lots and lots of pomelo juice, which anyone who loves citrus would adore if they ever dig into that marvelous fruit here.

Sartoric, I am flying to Hanoi, and then Ethnic Travel is the group I am joining for about eight days of touring the northwest area. I did pack for cold, although Crellston reminds me that I might not have packed enough. Sigh. Another bit of shopping to do today. I'm trying to go lighter, not heavier, guys! I have an excellent down jacket which I brought as much for the Phong Nha caves as for the northwest. I have to see what might still be in the bag after it spilled its guts in travel. Prices being what they are here, I'm sure I can find long johns for a good price!

One thing I am grateful for, though, is being where I can get excellent fruit, wonderful wonderful pho and other yummy food, and celebrate food and countryside at the same time. Thanks to Crellston who is on his own extended journey, and practicing his Spanish while I struggle with my feeble Vietnamese. Inevitably I'm going to request toilet paper instead of soy sauce at the dinner table which will send everyone else into hysterics and leave me turning red. But then, it will make another good story.

sartoric

You go for it JH, good to hear you're travelling well. Bags are always a bastard, I remember losing a suitcase wheel in Casablanca. A real drag (sorry).

jhubbel

I needed that. I've been struggling today with the pollution, I went out for a good long walk over to the big market and my eyes were streaming and burning. The humidity is high today and the suspicion is that it's holding the pollution close to the ground. Just awful. So I came back to write. One funny aspect of this little guesthouse is that the dank little room I'm in has minimal lighting. That means that when I went to repack my gear- and this is with all the lights on including the bathroom- I had to use a flashlight to see anything. I'm not making this up. The fixture overhead is very dark and has one, not four, low wattage light. The lamp on my bed doesn't work. The lamp in the bathroom is very low wattage. Hey I get saving money. But I nearly went blind in here trying to write. With my 60 year old eyeballs? Gimme my carrots! I can't even cast a shadow in here! So I spoke to the guy in charge. Yeah yeah yeah. Hour later, nothing. So I spoke to the cleaning lady who yelled at the guy in charge, who then padded upstairs to explain to me that a special person had to be brought in to take care of the light. I'm thinking: taller than you? So I got up on the bed, and reached for the light fixture, at which point he nearly had a heart attack, and pointed out the lock on the fixture. A lock? It only has one bulb in it anyway! Okay so now I'm laughing and suggesting a lamp.

Forthwith he comes back with a lamp which is now spreading lovely light all over my computer, and making the room livable in a kinda cozy way, as long a you stay within the reach of the lamp. Of course when it dies out you have to unplug the fridge, and plug in the lamp, you get the picture.

What saddens me is that the pollution is evil enough to keep me inside when I'd like to go see the water puppets or something else, but it really is pretty bad. My eyes were in misery and it's just not worth it.

For anyone who likes kitsch, I recommend the big Ben Thanh market just off the park on Le Lai street. While it's like most of the inside markets I saw in Thailand it's still fun to go poke around. I've not yet found a treasure, but I've got a big lug friend back home who likes T-shirts. If I can just have adequate time to find something I like before someone pounces on me to demand what size I want I'd be fine. That rather sends me skittering down the aisle. It's more fascinating to go watch the still live fish swimming around ready to be chosen for dinner.

No long johns to be had in this heat. That will have to wait til I get to Hanoi where winter is more likely to be felt.
And as for this place, I'm not going to recommend My My Arthouse. From the mildewy smell that greets me each time I walk in to the dungeon dark to the roach that greeted me when I leaned over to pick up the gear for my backpack, let's just say I've stayed in a few better places. But I did get a lamp.

jhubbel

By the way sartoric I failed to comment on your funny story about lady wants a blanket! That reminds me of when I was just in Tanzania, one of a small group of whites, quite likely the only whites to ever show up at this particular Maasai open market way the H out in the deep bush. We got out of our car and were immediately bullrushed by all these women selling beads in all forms. Chris, who is Tanzanian and fluent in Swahili and Ma, which is what Maasai speak, was absolutely overwhelmed, as he is very tall, handsome and spoke the language, and to boot, he was buying. So it was a feeding frenzy around this 6'5" guy, until suddenly he starts good naturedly jumping up and down with a grin on his face, speaking Ma, to clear a space for himself. Having bought himself a few extra feet, he finished his shopping, made some jokes, everyone laughed with him, gave thanks all around and everyone was happy. I keep this vignette in mind when I feel crowded, how sweetly he handled this- in the context of the culture, and with such good humor. He knew precisely what to do and how. Granted, this is his culture, but it was still a lesson in good manners. I have some photos of these wonderful women crowding in on a number of us, so close they were nearly in our pockets, their children touching our hands, legs, fingers, arms. CLOSE. We're not used to this. I rather enjoyed it, as a very new cultural experience.You got your sheep dip quite another way, and I'll bet you HAD to buy several, or else your husband would have to answer for calling in the troops!

crellston

As always jhubbel, fantastic writing! I am living your. Vietnam trip vicariously. I remember the sea of motorcyclists only too well. I had learnt from my first trip 20 odd year previously that crossing the street in Saigon was just to walk and carry on walking and the traffic would just open up and flow around you. back then it was only push bikes and it worked perfectly. Indeed it worked ok on our last trip a few years right up to the point when crossing an almost empty street and I got hit by a motorbike speeding around a corner!

Keep up the great reporting. Looking forward to reading more.

sum

Love reading this!

jhubbel

At this point I am huddled in my rather chilly hotel room on the third floor with iffy wi-fi, having coming over a very wet misty pass over very very muddy roads with Ethnic Tours, an English speaking guide named Chi who's a tiny girl in her twenties, a charming and very much in love French couple in their sixties named Serge and Marie, and a French speaking guide and our enthusiatic and hilarious driver Linh. We've stayed in two homes so far in two tribal villages, two hotels, and the experiences have run the gamut. For one, I flat love being in the country. As others who have read my missives will recall I have a habit of losing things so it won't come as any surprise that the day before we left on this journey I left my purse- and nearly two thousand dollars- in the first floor bathroom of the hostel before setting out to pay Ethnic Travel the balance of the trip fee. I was off and getting happily and thoroughly lost in the Hanoi old quarter, being accosted by everyone to take a ride (not on your life, I'll walk, thanks) and after adding at least one unnecessary but hugely entertaining mile to my journey I finally found them. I got an idea of my itinerary, paid up and left to purchase a new hat, since I donated my very pricey Goretex version to the security guards at the airport. Well, natch, I didn't get far in the shopping process before I realized that the familiar whop-whop of the purse against my body had been missing for some time now, and I stopped in the middle of the street (NOT a smart thing to do) and amidst all the angry beeping and honking tried hard to figure out where on earth I could have left my purse. First I hurried back to Ethnic Travel, and of course it wasn't there, and then we called to the hostel and I asked the girl to check the bed area and the downstairs bathroom floor where I knew I'd taken the purse off. She said it wasn't in either place. Well, after that I figured it was gone. Phooey. Two grand lost. Well, that's why we have travel insurance. I asked what I should do, given I had to leave first thing in the morning, I got some good advice, bought a hat and got lost again getting back to the hostel.

Well lo and behold, after I'd already accepted the loss of my Kindle, my books, the money and much more, there was the purse ( a little wet for wear) sitting behind the girl at the reception desk. I asked where she found it, and she said "On the bathroom floor." I refrained from saying anything about the state of mind I'd just been in for an hour, gratefully accepted my purse and money and Kindle, and enjoyed another good laugh at my tendency to misplace important things. At least not my passport.

It took us some time to get out of the pollution and traffic of Hanoi, something I've come to accept about Vietnam, and when we did it was wonderful. Soon we were sharing the road with buffalo and kids and cattle and bicycles more often than cars and motorbikes, and the lovely part of it was that there were no tourists where we went. None. At some point we were dropped of and we went for a good long hike, which for me was such a gift. We were promised hikes and cycling, and this through rice paddies which were mostly mud and water this time of year. That doesn't take away from,their beauty, nor from the placid grace that makes this area so lovely. People in tribal dress bend over their labors, the women in cone hats and plows, the water buffalo in the fields, everywhere women with babes on their backs.
At our first homestay they were under construction so we were shuttled off to the neighbor's house to sleep in the stilted home on bamboo floors. We had pads and huge thick blankets, and a long walk to the toilet. The "shower" which I could not sort out ended up being a tap near the floor, so I resorted- because the water was just icy- to soaping the essentials, ahem- and figuring that I'd do the whole thing at the next stop. Food was magnificent- a great variety of home made, much rice, vegetables, pork, chicken. The dogs are all very wary here, even the puppies, until you can catch one and cuddle them, and when they realize you're a petter, their tails go nuts and they can't lick you enough. Most would rather bite than allow you to touch, so I've learned to be very careful of them.
The terraced hills and sweet calm of the area is sometimes broken by someone's motorbike, or the loud music from a neighbor's stereo system. The first night the wife came in and proudly turned on the tv, which was irritating, because I had so badly wanted to escape just that kind of noise, and the silence was such a balm. However, Chi quite rightly pointed out that to these people, to be the only family in the village with a color tv was quite a statement of status. Sigh. This I understand fully, being a child of the fifties, of course. It's only after we've been so deeply invaded by technology that we want to return to some semblance of silence!

The morning was cool, and a light mist lay on the mountains, which were nearly conical and pointed in this area. In the early hours the women in their cone hats set forth to continue their work on prepping the fields for the rice planting to come in April. The ducks and geese with their long necks fed in the waters and the dogs patrolled the clay roads. Out in these hills the roads are only just wide enough to accommodate one car or truck, and there is much beeping around corners because their bulk takes up all available space. Much of the traffic takes place through the rice paddies by foot, motorcyle and bike which is what we did the next day.

Fully fed we took off by foot for a solid two hour hike in the morning, the sun behind the clouds to soften the heat and keep things easy on our heads. Despite the presence of many animals large and small there was little more than an organic smell- which indicates how carefully offal was used to fertilize the prolliferation of gardens. Dogs everywhere but not once did I smell dog poop. That fascinated me. The whole area was so clean smelling, and what I did smell was that wholesome smell of things growing.

Our hike took us alongside the irrigation ditches, through the paddies so that we could see the crops close up in their dormant stage. Everywhere people greeted us, tickled that they knew a few English words and we could practice our Vietnamese words. By this time I'd had a chance to negotiate prices on dudu (papaya) and buy a few things using my language and so far hadn't gotten myself arrested, no small feat yet, but there's still plenty of time. What I did find that the ability to pay two compliments to the homestay hosts: Vietnam is a beautiful country, and the Vietnamese are a beautiful people (two very simple phrases in fact) were extremely well received, and went a long way towards making us welcome. I flat forgot all my notes and I'm just lucky to be able to remember those.

More later, the troops are assembling three floors down.