shellychen

Dear all,
i will be going to europe in december and will have a week in london. However shall i split up the 7 days in london to 4 days in london and 3 days in amsterdam to see the windmills and Zaanse Schans wooden shoe?
Next i will train to paris for 4 nights and train to italy for 8 days.
lastly 4 days at germany munich.
Is there a day tour in italy? I dont want to spend time taking train to all the cities as i think it will be very tiring.If the land tour 's price is reasonable,i will take up the day tour for some cities in italy.

Jean

>> Is there a day tour in italy? I dont want to spend time taking train to all the cities as i think it will be very tiring.<<

I don't understand this question at all. Where do you want to go in Italy? Do you think buses are faster, more comfortable than trains?

You are thinking in terms of days in each place, but you haven't factored in the time needed to travel from city to city.

Do the 4 days in London include your arrival day? You will have 2.5 days in Amsterdam and 3.5 days in Paris. There are night trains from Paris to Venice, Florence and Rome, if that option appeals to you. It's likely you would only have 3-3.5 days in Munich.

FYI, it will be dark in London by 4:00p, slightly later in Amsterdam and about 5:00p in Paris.

StCirq

I don't understand either. What are "all the cities" you want to see? What do you want to see? How? By private driver and tour,on your own on the train...what? Do you have basic guidebooks that explain how best to tour these cities on your own or with help from tour companies?

shellychen

Dear Jean,
the 4 days in london dont include my arrival day.(i will be reaching london on the 2/12 early morning.)so from 2/12-5/12 in london.
6/12-8/12 amsterdam
9/12-12/12 paris
13/12-20/12 italy
21/12-24/12 munich
25/12 fly off

As i will be going to italy for 8 days,i am thinking to go florence,venice(1day?),verona,but i am not sure whether i should put rome,or bologna and cinque into this 8 days as well..
how these cities should be arranged if i am coming from paris?
thank you so much!

michelhuebeli

Your program is ambitious, especially for December when days are short, the weather can slow you down, and you don’t get to see as much of a city as at other times. With this many targets that are so far apart, in such a short time, travel times, as mentioned by others, will further limit how much you can actually see and do in the short time you have.

You don’t tell us what you wish to see and do in those places. With so little time and so few hours in a day, you need to read up and watch travel DVDs, until you have a list of your personal favorite targets, then you need to map out how you can get from one such target to the next in each of the cities you mention.

As far as Italy - you’re being awfully vague. Which part? Which city/cities? A tour wouldn't save you time or money - plan what you want to see and limit yourself to a minimum. Italy could easily keep you happy travelling nonstop for three months and you’d never see every place and every site worth visiting.

Here are a few practical suggestions to help minimize the negatives.

From London to Amsterdam, consider taking a cheap flight late in the day, after dark so you’re not missing much daytime action. EasyJet flies from the Southend airport for example, look up www.southendairport.com/getting-here - I see December flights for as little as 28 GBP, or, with other airlines also, for 38 GBP from Gatwick or Stansted or Luton, so there are plenty of choices.

The train from Amsterdam to Paris varies hugely in price depending on the time of departure. It could be 49 Euros or, an hour earlier or later, 98 Euros. Pick one that leaves late in the day and has a fare that falls within your budget. See www.thalys.com

Again to save time, consider taking the night train from Paris to Italy, Milan or Rome or Venice - see https://www.thello.com There are several levels of sleeping comfort. You won’t sleep as soundly as in a good hotel bed in a quiet street, but you’re not wasting any precious time getting from A to B - you’re there the next morning.

For the time you have available, you might want to make it Rome, then Florence, then Venice, then take the night train to Munich. You won’t see not nearly enough of Rome or Florence or Venice, but if a quick sampling is all you’re after, at least it’s doable. Look at www.trenitalia.it and also at www.italotreno.it/en/Pages/default.aspx for trains within Italy.

If you make Venice your last Italian stop, then you can again save a day’s travel by taking the 20:57 departure of the City Night Line train that gets you into Munich by 06:15. The train goes all the way, no need for any changing en route.

Input the city names in Italian - Venezia S. Lucia for example (Santa Lucia is the station by the canals), and Monaco Hbf for Munich (Monaco is the Italian name for Munich, Hbf is the German abbreviation for the main central station in Munich called Hauptbahnhof).

Or look up the night train to Munich on the German website, www.bahn.de - it is often easier to deal with.

bilboburgler

michel, great advice, very rushed but you have offered up a possible plan.

PalenQ

To help plan your train part check out the following superb IMO sources: www.seat61.com; www.ricksteves.com and www.budgeteuropetravel.com - download the latter's free and excellent IMO European Planning & Rail Guide http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id2.html) - consider taking overnight trains between Paris and Italy and Italy and Germany to lessen daytime travel time and also to save on the cost of a night in a hotel.

PalenQ

,i will take up the day tour for some cities in italy.

Rome has hop on hop off double-decker buses that run a route around town hitting major sites - you can get on and off all day on one day ticket - gives commentary en route. No advance planning needed - just show up and pay.

shellychen

Dear Michael and everyone,
thank you so much for your advice and help!
regarding to italy itinerary,i actually have some constrains.
firstly,there are 2 of us who will reach in italy on the 13th from paris and will meet another person to travel together,she will come from swiss.Next,there will be another friend join us on the 16th reaching milan at 11am.
can i plan in such a route:
13th:milan)
14th-15th dec3 of us head to verona and stay one night)
16thhead to florence and meet another friend so 4 of us can travel together.We will stay for 4 nights till 16-19 dec)
20-21 dechead to venice and stay for 1 night)take night train on 21 dec
22th-23th :munich
24th dec: head to frankfurt
25th dec:fly off from frankfurt

shellychen

Also can i go siena when i am in florence?

michelhuebeli

Siena is a great day trip from Florence. A good way to do it is to take the accompanied coach - a guide is on board who says a few words on the way, nothing much of importance, but what matters is the "real" guide that meets the coach in Siena and takes you around. They tend to be excellent, you really learn what it is you're looking at.

These coaches leave daily around 8AM or so, your hotel will know, you'll see flyers everywhere, and across from the main train station, at an angle to the right, is a travel agency where you can book and outside of which the coach leaves in the morning.

There is usually an option to also go to San Gimignano after Siena, but in winter with the short days I would not even consider that - it makes for a very long day even in summer.

shellychen

Dear Michael,thank you for your advice.if i have(3.5 days) 4 nights in florence,can i spend 2 nights in touring the city and 1 day at siena,hald day at pisa?

PalenQ

I think for the average bloke two full days in Florence where most sites are in a compact area in the city centre is fine and a day trip to Siena fantastic - giving you something besides the Uber big tourist cities like Rome and Venice - 1/2 day in Pisa too - be sure to book a time slot if wishing to ascend the Leaning Tower or face a dauntingly long wait in line perhaps. go to the official site - other sites charge more for the same booking.