Fourteen days Siem Reap and Thailand and/or Vietnam?
Jan 29th, 2018, 01:09 PM
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Fourteen days Siem Reap and Thailand and/or Vietnam?
We are so excited to be planning for our next continent and family adventure. We are headed to Siem Reap and Thailand. We will be flying business class so we will sleep and hopefully offset jet lag some. We will actually arrive in Hong Kong and Dec 20 and stay the night before catching a non stop to Siem Reap on Dec 21 (arriving at 4:30 PM). Here is what I am thinking for Thailand:
Dec 20 HKG
Dec 21, 22, 23-stay night in Siem Reap Angor Wat
Dec 24 REP-Chiang Mai via BKK
Dec 24, 25, 26, 27, 28-Chiang Mai (planning on doing elephant sanctuary-only an ethical one, and looking into other cultural trips, trekking, rice fields)
Dec 29, 30, 21, Jan 1, 2-This is where I am trying to decide-Vietnam or Thai coast (or both?). Family wants to see beautiful stone islands but we aren't really lay on the beach people so it would need to be somewhere we can do some hiking into nature areas and have other cultural experiences.
Jan 3 and if need be 4-Bangkok or Ho Chi Minh (I'm hoping) to get home
Is the break up of days ok? more time one place, less somewhere else? Favorite experiences, hotels, etc?
The Fodors forums have always been spot on, so hoping for some more great advice! Thanks!
Dec 20 HKG
Dec 21, 22, 23-stay night in Siem Reap Angor Wat
Dec 24 REP-Chiang Mai via BKK
Dec 24, 25, 26, 27, 28-Chiang Mai (planning on doing elephant sanctuary-only an ethical one, and looking into other cultural trips, trekking, rice fields)
Dec 29, 30, 21, Jan 1, 2-This is where I am trying to decide-Vietnam or Thai coast (or both?). Family wants to see beautiful stone islands but we aren't really lay on the beach people so it would need to be somewhere we can do some hiking into nature areas and have other cultural experiences.
Jan 3 and if need be 4-Bangkok or Ho Chi Minh (I'm hoping) to get home
Is the break up of days ok? more time one place, less somewhere else? Favorite experiences, hotels, etc?
The Fodors forums have always been spot on, so hoping for some more great advice! Thanks!
Jan 29th, 2018, 01:30 PM
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For your stay in Siem Reap I'd recommend Viroth Hotel. Just off the main drag and thankful that it was. It's very quiet and the service was terrific. Rooms are huge and the air conditioning works perfectly. We were there for 3 nights and got to see plenty. We hired a tour guide who provided a car with driver. This was money well spent.
We visited Hanoi on this same trip, 3 full days in Hanoi and an overnight on Halong Bay on a junk cruise. We stayed in Le Selva Hotel which provided all the details from travel visa to a driver pick up and return to the airport. They also recommended a street food tour guide that blew us away.
We visited Hanoi on this same trip, 3 full days in Hanoi and an overnight on Halong Bay on a junk cruise. We stayed in Le Selva Hotel which provided all the details from travel visa to a driver pick up and return to the airport. They also recommended a street food tour guide that blew us away.
Jan 29th, 2018, 02:02 PM
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I can highly recommend our guide in Siem Reap. Her name is Kanha Reath and she owns AnkorJourneys. A former teacher, she grew up in the area evening picnicing as a teenager among the ruins. She has a wonderful driver and the three days we spent with her were magical and educational. We were able to ask to see different aspects of the area and she always obliged. A food tour was a highlight. She also can provide home stays with her family. We chose her because it is a woman owned business which is rare in Cambodia and we wanted to support her venture. No other ties to Kanha other than a happy customer and her family!
Last edited by StacyB; Jan 29th, 2018 at 02:03 PM. Reason: link didn't work
Jan 29th, 2018, 03:21 PM
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Find a copy of Dawn Rooney's book, Angkor: A Guide to Cambodia's Wondrous Temples to help you prepare for this journey. Rooney says that it takes three full days (4 nights) just to see the major temples. We spent a week and old have enjoyed even more time. Doing some research will help you decide how much time to spend in Siem Reap. IMO, three nights is not enough.
I'd suggest you choose either Thailand or VN, and not try to do both. This is a part of the world that rewards slow travel.
I'd suggest you choose either Thailand or VN, and not try to do both. This is a part of the world that rewards slow travel.
Jan 30th, 2018, 04:53 AM
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Ret and Stacy-Thank you for the suggestions.
Kathie, I spent more time reading last night and the more I read, the more I am thinking Vietnam may be a better fit for us. It seems Chiang Mai can be hit or miss with people, and really we like getting off the beaten path as much as possible. It seems everywhere is overrun with tourists (including Anger Wat-but that is a must see). We actually had hoped to do Myanmar instead, but wasn't too sure about that. If we ended up in Vietnam, it sounds like we should spend some time in the north and the south but skip the middle due to rains/flood in December. It sounds like Ninh Binh and Mai Chau may be good options for us. Staying at ecolodges that do some day trekking into the hills? We aren't lovers of heat and humidity so doing that in an area that is less likely to be in those conditions would be preferred. Sounds like some time on the Mekong Delta, might also be good. We might have to do Halong Bay (my daughter just loves the look of it) but realize that time of year it can be iffy.
Kathie, I spent more time reading last night and the more I read, the more I am thinking Vietnam may be a better fit for us. It seems Chiang Mai can be hit or miss with people, and really we like getting off the beaten path as much as possible. It seems everywhere is overrun with tourists (including Anger Wat-but that is a must see). We actually had hoped to do Myanmar instead, but wasn't too sure about that. If we ended up in Vietnam, it sounds like we should spend some time in the north and the south but skip the middle due to rains/flood in December. It sounds like Ninh Binh and Mai Chau may be good options for us. Staying at ecolodges that do some day trekking into the hills? We aren't lovers of heat and humidity so doing that in an area that is less likely to be in those conditions would be preferred. Sounds like some time on the Mekong Delta, might also be good. We might have to do Halong Bay (my daughter just loves the look of it) but realize that time of year it can be iffy.
Jan 30th, 2018, 10:40 AM
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Hi Odie
i am a great fan of Chiang Mai and Northern Thailand, plenty of trekking, hiking and beautiful scenery up there, particularly in less visited places like te Mai Hong Sorn loop out to MHS, Soppong, Mai Sariang etc., but Vietnam wins every time if comparing the two countries.
Angkor Wat is indeed amazing but it has suffered a great deal through massively increasing numbers of tour groups. We first visited 20 years ago and loved and last returned in 2014 as my in laws wante to see it on their wedding anniversary trip. I was shocked!
From reading your posts, I do feel that Vietnam would be a good fit for you. We have visited many times and never tire of the country. Wonderful people, great food and very easy to get off the beaten track.
In 2015 we visited in December which was a good time for both trekking in the north and visiting the Mekong Delta. Hanoi and Saigon are also our two favourite cities in Asia.
In the north we hired a guide and driver and hiked/ drove from the Mai Chau valley through the Black River Valley and Pu Long National Park to Ninh Binh and had a fantastic time. Hiking can be varied depending on wishes and abilities. We mostly stayed in homestays in minority villages. Not for everyone but w loved it. basic accommodation but the food and hospitality were out of this world, as was the scenery.
in the Mekong Delta we travelled independently. It is a huge area but relatively easy to get around whether by bus, boat, bicycle or car. Ben Tre, Can Tho and especially Chau Doc are all worth considering.
Details of our travels in both the north and south of the country can be found on our blog at https://accidentalnomads.com/category/vietnam/ .
In fourteen days you would be pushing it to include everything but if you allow say 4/5 day apiece for the northern countryside and a similar amount for the delta, then that would allow 2/3 days each for Hanoi and Saigon. I wasn’t that impressed by Halong Bay, Bai Tu Long might be better but either way it takes along time to get there, although you could perhaps get there from Ninh Binh rather than Hanoi. Ninh Binh is often described at Halong Bay on land. I much preferred it to Halong.
i am a great fan of Chiang Mai and Northern Thailand, plenty of trekking, hiking and beautiful scenery up there, particularly in less visited places like te Mai Hong Sorn loop out to MHS, Soppong, Mai Sariang etc., but Vietnam wins every time if comparing the two countries.
Angkor Wat is indeed amazing but it has suffered a great deal through massively increasing numbers of tour groups. We first visited 20 years ago and loved and last returned in 2014 as my in laws wante to see it on their wedding anniversary trip. I was shocked!
From reading your posts, I do feel that Vietnam would be a good fit for you. We have visited many times and never tire of the country. Wonderful people, great food and very easy to get off the beaten track.
In 2015 we visited in December which was a good time for both trekking in the north and visiting the Mekong Delta. Hanoi and Saigon are also our two favourite cities in Asia.
In the north we hired a guide and driver and hiked/ drove from the Mai Chau valley through the Black River Valley and Pu Long National Park to Ninh Binh and had a fantastic time. Hiking can be varied depending on wishes and abilities. We mostly stayed in homestays in minority villages. Not for everyone but w loved it. basic accommodation but the food and hospitality were out of this world, as was the scenery.
in the Mekong Delta we travelled independently. It is a huge area but relatively easy to get around whether by bus, boat, bicycle or car. Ben Tre, Can Tho and especially Chau Doc are all worth considering.
Details of our travels in both the north and south of the country can be found on our blog at https://accidentalnomads.com/category/vietnam/ .
In fourteen days you would be pushing it to include everything but if you allow say 4/5 day apiece for the northern countryside and a similar amount for the delta, then that would allow 2/3 days each for Hanoi and Saigon. I wasn’t that impressed by Halong Bay, Bai Tu Long might be better but either way it takes along time to get there, although you could perhaps get there from Ninh Binh rather than Hanoi. Ninh Binh is often described at Halong Bay on land. I much preferred it to Halong.
Jan 30th, 2018, 04:52 PM
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crellston-so happy to see your post-I was worried you were not going to post in Asia any more and I have gotten great information from you for other travels!
We are not really city people. A day in one is fine but when we travel abroad, we tend to want to see the nature, small villages and rural culture. I have had a deeper discussion with my daughter over must dos (SE Asia is her pick) and was then bummed to learn that rice fields are out in December-that was one of the big things on her list. That leaves me with elephants (hard to come by in Vietnam), islands and some cultural interaction. So if we take the days for the city out and we do Angor Wat (hopefully by some private tuk tuk operator that knows the ins and outs), I feel like I am left with the following possibilities:
My original-leaving Vietnam out:
Dec 20 HKG
Dec 21, 22, 23-stay night in Siem Reap Angor Wat
Dec 24 REP-Chiang Mai via BKK
Dec 24, 25, 26, 27, 28-Chiang Mai (planning on doing elephant sanctuary-only an ethical one, and looking into other cultural trips)
Dec 29, 30, 21, Jan 1, 2-southern Thailand (Khao Lak? Krabi?)
or Cambodia and Vietnam:
I can visit the Mondulkiri elephant sanctuary in Cambodia (a eight hour drive from Siem Reap and a five hour drive from Phnom Penh) in the middle between Angor Wat and Vietnam so either of these:
Dec 20 HKG-SAI
21-26 Mekong Delta/southern VN where?
27 SAI-PNH overnight
28-PNH-sanctuary (5 hours)
29-sanctuary
30-sanctuary-PNH-REP
31-Jan 2 REP
Jan 3- REP-? (unknown for flight back on Jan 4
Jan 4-flight home
or
Dec 20 HKG
21-24 REP
25 REP-Sanctuary (8 hours)
26 sanctuary
27-sanctuary to PNH-SAI
28-Jan 2 Mekong Delta and ?
Jan 3- SAI-? (unknown for flight back on Jan 4)
Jan 4-flight home
These are based on flights that I know I can secure with miles and/or purchasing. I am feeling at a loss for the best places to be. I don;t want hot and humid but I don;t want to be trekking in snow in Vietnam either! The natural beauty of the area is going to be more important than the temperature I think.
Sorry for the very long post!
We are not really city people. A day in one is fine but when we travel abroad, we tend to want to see the nature, small villages and rural culture. I have had a deeper discussion with my daughter over must dos (SE Asia is her pick) and was then bummed to learn that rice fields are out in December-that was one of the big things on her list. That leaves me with elephants (hard to come by in Vietnam), islands and some cultural interaction. So if we take the days for the city out and we do Angor Wat (hopefully by some private tuk tuk operator that knows the ins and outs), I feel like I am left with the following possibilities:
My original-leaving Vietnam out:
Dec 20 HKG
Dec 21, 22, 23-stay night in Siem Reap Angor Wat
Dec 24 REP-Chiang Mai via BKK
Dec 24, 25, 26, 27, 28-Chiang Mai (planning on doing elephant sanctuary-only an ethical one, and looking into other cultural trips)
Dec 29, 30, 21, Jan 1, 2-southern Thailand (Khao Lak? Krabi?)
or Cambodia and Vietnam:
I can visit the Mondulkiri elephant sanctuary in Cambodia (a eight hour drive from Siem Reap and a five hour drive from Phnom Penh) in the middle between Angor Wat and Vietnam so either of these:
Dec 20 HKG-SAI
21-26 Mekong Delta/southern VN where?
27 SAI-PNH overnight
28-PNH-sanctuary (5 hours)
29-sanctuary
30-sanctuary-PNH-REP
31-Jan 2 REP
Jan 3- REP-? (unknown for flight back on Jan 4
Jan 4-flight home
or
Dec 20 HKG
21-24 REP
25 REP-Sanctuary (8 hours)
26 sanctuary
27-sanctuary to PNH-SAI
28-Jan 2 Mekong Delta and ?
Jan 3- SAI-? (unknown for flight back on Jan 4)
Jan 4-flight home
These are based on flights that I know I can secure with miles and/or purchasing. I am feeling at a loss for the best places to be. I don;t want hot and humid but I don;t want to be trekking in snow in Vietnam either! The natural beauty of the area is going to be more important than the temperature I think.
Sorry for the very long post!
Jan 30th, 2018, 10:28 PM
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Jan 31st, 2018, 12:08 AM
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You are welcome odie.
Your requirement to see elephants is definitely making life difficult! Opportunities are limited everywhere and are non existent in Vietnam. I know nothing of the elephant project at Mondulkri, but have travelled in the area. Unless the roads have improved dramatically in recent years, expect a long uncomfortable trip! Getting there and onwards I feel, would take a disproportionate amount of your time. I think there is a place called Elephant Hills in Khao Sok NP which may be worth investigating as an option. Re rice harvests. it is the wrong time of yer for the terraces in the north but in the south of Vietnam and Cambodia there are three rice harvests a year so you should see the rice in many different stages of its growth cycle - i.e. green- yellow-gone!
Option 1
The place near Chiang Mai can be reached directly from CM airport avoiding the need to stay in CM and help with your desire to minimise time spent in big cities. Given your interests I would consider renting a car from the airport driving to the Elephant project. stay there for a few days and then drive the Mai Hong Soon loop I mentioned above. takes around 3-6 days depending on how long to want to stay in each place. I did do a TR on this a few years back Cooking in Chiang Mai & Driving Around Northern Thailand
Do have a look at Fern Resort just outside of MHS town Fern Resort - EcoTourism Resort for Nature Lovers . It operates a community based tourism project and is a good place to stay for a couple of days hiking around the minority villages. Soppong has some traditional hill tribe markets and some nice river cave trips. You may even see some rice! Mai Sariang is a pleasant riverside town and makes a nice stop before driving on to Doi Inthanon NP, the one place in Thailand I have felt cold!
Alternatively, in a slightly different direction from CM is https://www.chiangdaonest.com . Again, a good place for hiking and other activities. it is a little isolated though. Could be combined with Chiang Rai, much smaller and more manageable than CM and has some interesting sites and steric walking market https://accidentalnomads.com/2015/10...ack-and-white/
Khao Lak is arguably quieter than Krabi but lacks the limestone karst scenery of Krabi but is a good jumping off point for Khao Sok NP for trips into the jungle and through the karst scenery on the lake. There is also http://www.elephanthills.com in KS NP. Clearly you should check out their credentials
OPTION 2 & 3
Absolutely the best way to see the Mekong Delta would be the reverse of the trips we have done in the last few visits:
I really wouldn’t write off the north of the country. you are very unlikely to see any snow and temps will be quite pleasant for hiking as described in our blog. You will likely be able to get flights to Hanoi relatively easily. Ethnic Travel or similar operators are probably the best way to go. having someone else deal with the logistics was very welcome in this part of Vietnam.
South Vietnam and Cambodia will be in their “cool” season but that is relative - you can still expect 30c but the humidity shouldn’t be too bad. Angkor is generally hot all the time as the massive amounts of stone seem to act act as a the worlds largest heat sink!
Your requirement to see elephants is definitely making life difficult! Opportunities are limited everywhere and are non existent in Vietnam. I know nothing of the elephant project at Mondulkri, but have travelled in the area. Unless the roads have improved dramatically in recent years, expect a long uncomfortable trip! Getting there and onwards I feel, would take a disproportionate amount of your time. I think there is a place called Elephant Hills in Khao Sok NP which may be worth investigating as an option. Re rice harvests. it is the wrong time of yer for the terraces in the north but in the south of Vietnam and Cambodia there are three rice harvests a year so you should see the rice in many different stages of its growth cycle - i.e. green- yellow-gone!
Option 1
The place near Chiang Mai can be reached directly from CM airport avoiding the need to stay in CM and help with your desire to minimise time spent in big cities. Given your interests I would consider renting a car from the airport driving to the Elephant project. stay there for a few days and then drive the Mai Hong Soon loop I mentioned above. takes around 3-6 days depending on how long to want to stay in each place. I did do a TR on this a few years back Cooking in Chiang Mai & Driving Around Northern Thailand
Do have a look at Fern Resort just outside of MHS town Fern Resort - EcoTourism Resort for Nature Lovers . It operates a community based tourism project and is a good place to stay for a couple of days hiking around the minority villages. Soppong has some traditional hill tribe markets and some nice river cave trips. You may even see some rice! Mai Sariang is a pleasant riverside town and makes a nice stop before driving on to Doi Inthanon NP, the one place in Thailand I have felt cold!
Alternatively, in a slightly different direction from CM is https://www.chiangdaonest.com . Again, a good place for hiking and other activities. it is a little isolated though. Could be combined with Chiang Rai, much smaller and more manageable than CM and has some interesting sites and steric walking market https://accidentalnomads.com/2015/10...ack-and-white/
Khao Lak is arguably quieter than Krabi but lacks the limestone karst scenery of Krabi but is a good jumping off point for Khao Sok NP for trips into the jungle and through the karst scenery on the lake. There is also http://www.elephanthills.com in KS NP. Clearly you should check out their credentials
OPTION 2 & 3
Absolutely the best way to see the Mekong Delta would be the reverse of the trips we have done in the last few visits:
- Get the boat from PP to Chau Doc crossing the border on the way into Vietnam - 5-6 hours
- Spend a couple of nights in CD. visit the Cham villages on the river, the fish farms on arrival.
- next day, hire a car and driver to take you on an early morning trip to the submerged forest ( amazing!) visiting Sam Mountain and its temple on the way back.
- Bus to Can Tho and either stay in the city overnight and visit Cai Rang floating market at 5.30 the next morning or, find a homestay out in the countryside for a couple of day.
- Either get a boat to Ben Tre via Ninh Long for a different side to the delta or bus straight back to Saigon
I really wouldn’t write off the north of the country. you are very unlikely to see any snow and temps will be quite pleasant for hiking as described in our blog. You will likely be able to get flights to Hanoi relatively easily. Ethnic Travel or similar operators are probably the best way to go. having someone else deal with the logistics was very welcome in this part of Vietnam.
South Vietnam and Cambodia will be in their “cool” season but that is relative - you can still expect 30c but the humidity shouldn’t be too bad. Angkor is generally hot all the time as the massive amounts of stone seem to act act as a the worlds largest heat sink!
Jan 31st, 2018, 06:54 AM
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Crellston-Once again who have proven just how invaluable you are to these boards! Thank you for all the info! I am going to look into all of your suggestions, and work on plotting another itinerary. We don't mind moving about too much but do prefer staying in one place for a few nights and doing satellite trips out from there. I will be back with another itinerary. Thanks again!
Feb 2nd, 2018, 12:50 AM
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This time is so great to visit Vietnam although the weather is a bit cold. You don't forget to bring the clothes for keeping the body warm. In Vietnam this time is quite close to Tet holiday; therefore, the atmosphere throughout the country is very bustling and busy. There will be many flower markets selling peach trees, kumquat and yellow apricot flower. You can go to visit some places in Northern Vietnam such as Hanoi, Ninh Binh and Halong. This is not peak season in Vietnam, so the destinations are not too crowded, except for Hanoi.
