Wine in Burgundy
Apr 27th, 2005, 04:52 PM
#24
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Okay, Judy let the cat out of the bag. Burgundy's best-kept secret is the tasting lunch at Olivier Leflaive's. Pascal Wagner, the host and sommelier, is an absolute delight, a whirlwind of knowledge and enthusiasm, and speaks perfect English. Lunch there is something you will never forget, and never regret unless you attempt to drive afterwards. We stayed at the Hotel Montrachet, two blocks away, which was about as far as we could stagger. Make reservations, as the place is quite small. And, the food was great, the cheeses incredible. olivier-leflaive.com
Apr 28th, 2005, 07:35 AM
#26
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Thanks Judy for the lunch recommendation at Olivier Leflaive. I pulled up their website and this looks like fun and vedette, thanks for your input. Maybe they have a couch we can nap on after the lunch and tasting.
Dave, I liked your analogy.
Dave, I liked your analogy.
Apr 28th, 2005, 08:43 AM
#27
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You might plan a lunch or dinner at Le Vieux Moulin in Bouilland. The restaurant has one Michelin star and an extensive list of Burgundian wines, including quite a few half-bottles. The hamlet of Bouilland is about a 20-minute drive from Beaune along a bucolic country road.
Apr 28th, 2005, 11:22 AM
#28
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You know, between underhill, Dave, Judy and vedette, we may have to extend our stay in Beaune and cut back on St Remy. Not to mention starting our exercise program early to provide for the coming splurge. Le Vieux Bouilland sounds very interesting and we will give it a try for dinner one night. We live in New Orleans so we are somewhat used to the french style of cooking even though ours tends to be mixed with a little Cajun twist.
Keep those suggestions coming!
Keep those suggestions coming!
Apr 28th, 2005, 11:52 AM
#29
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rlbplf, the lunch at leflaive lasted well over two hours. We were careful to taste and not consume everything Pascal poured! We took a long walk through the village after lunch and then felt that driving was an option.
It would have been nice to stay within walking distance or have a driver to really take advantage of the experience.
It would have been nice to stay within walking distance or have a driver to really take advantage of the experience.
May 3rd, 2005, 10:33 PM
#32
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Did my homework but slow to turn it in:
Jean-Paul Quenault Of Le Vin in La Charite-sur-Loire suggests two good wineries near Beaune that offer tastings (call ahead). Marc Colin in Saint Aubin, appellation Saint Aubin, mainly whites but he does produce some reds, phone no. 03.80.21.30.43, and David Duband in Chevannes, appellation Nuits St. Georges, phone no. 03.80.61.41.15. Do tell them you're calling on the recommendation of M. Quenault in La Charite, who sells their wines.
Jean-Paul Quenault Of Le Vin in La Charite-sur-Loire suggests two good wineries near Beaune that offer tastings (call ahead). Marc Colin in Saint Aubin, appellation Saint Aubin, mainly whites but he does produce some reds, phone no. 03.80.21.30.43, and David Duband in Chevannes, appellation Nuits St. Georges, phone no. 03.80.61.41.15. Do tell them you're calling on the recommendation of M. Quenault in La Charite, who sells their wines.
May 5th, 2005, 08:18 AM
#33
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Dave, thank you so much for remembering my request for help. I look forward to visiting the two wineries your friend suggested and will report on how it goes when we return in late July. We will raise a glass or two to you!
May 28th, 2005, 08:17 AM
#34
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My wife and I just got back from a couple weeks in France, with some time spent in the Rhone and Burgundy wine country.
I think a lot really depends on what you're looking for in wine country.
We live in the United States' best wine region (Willamette Valley, Oregon) <g>, so we're not at all interested in simply schlepping through wine-tasting rooms for low-end wines or plodding along on one more winery tour that explains basic vinification and appelations.
By luck on this trip, we had the best "walk-in" winery experience ever, but it was at Chateau de Beaucastel in Chateauneuf-du-Pape. We were joined a small group (5 people) who had an appt and were given very insightful information on vineyard soils, vine root structures, etc., ending with a tasting of single-grape wines for the 13 individual white and red wines that are blended to make Beaucastel's red wine. We then tasted a proportional blend of the whites, then of the reds, then a 2001 Beaucastel from the bottle, then a 1988. No pressure to buy at the end, but I was thrilled to buy a bottle of hard-to-find "Vielles Vignes".
In Burgundy, we never made quite the same connection. But with a willingness to buy one of their better quality bottles, we did end up having some wineries that opened their better bottles for us. Moillard north of Nuits St. Georges is one, and Chateau de La Tour in Vougeot is another. At At Ch. de La Tour the person spoke excellent English and had lots of insightful information into the soils and growing practices (this winery changed to organic not too long ago).
The information we got on the vineyard and wine-tasting tours at the Beaune TI center seemed like they were a very bad deal if you have your own car. $45 euro or so to be driven around some famous vineyards (we saw several of the tour vehicles on our own exploration and they didn't even stop to let people out) and then drink some average wine at the end.
(continued ...)
I think a lot really depends on what you're looking for in wine country.
We live in the United States' best wine region (Willamette Valley, Oregon) <g>, so we're not at all interested in simply schlepping through wine-tasting rooms for low-end wines or plodding along on one more winery tour that explains basic vinification and appelations.
By luck on this trip, we had the best "walk-in" winery experience ever, but it was at Chateau de Beaucastel in Chateauneuf-du-Pape. We were joined a small group (5 people) who had an appt and were given very insightful information on vineyard soils, vine root structures, etc., ending with a tasting of single-grape wines for the 13 individual white and red wines that are blended to make Beaucastel's red wine. We then tasted a proportional blend of the whites, then of the reds, then a 2001 Beaucastel from the bottle, then a 1988. No pressure to buy at the end, but I was thrilled to buy a bottle of hard-to-find "Vielles Vignes".
In Burgundy, we never made quite the same connection. But with a willingness to buy one of their better quality bottles, we did end up having some wineries that opened their better bottles for us. Moillard north of Nuits St. Georges is one, and Chateau de La Tour in Vougeot is another. At At Ch. de La Tour the person spoke excellent English and had lots of insightful information into the soils and growing practices (this winery changed to organic not too long ago).
The information we got on the vineyard and wine-tasting tours at the Beaune TI center seemed like they were a very bad deal if you have your own car. $45 euro or so to be driven around some famous vineyards (we saw several of the tour vehicles on our own exploration and they didn't even stop to let people out) and then drink some average wine at the end.
(continued ...)
May 28th, 2005, 08:30 AM
#35
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We paid for the tasting at the what was billed as a good place in Beaune (Marche aux Vins) written up in several books. The place where they give you a little tin tastevin and send you off to follow signs through their cellar. Most of the wine was swill and there was no "added value".
We also paid for the tour and tasting at Chateau de Meursault. The wines available were reasonable quality and at the end, a person who spoke limited English provided some useful information. This would be a good value introduction to see an interesting cellar and taste some decent wine.
The tasting lunch at Maison Olivier Leflaive looked like an interesting and good value. But with our limited time, we didn't do this. For one thing, we're more interested in Cote de Nuits wines than Cote de Beaune, and Leflaive's wine style isn't our favorite. Still, I would do it if we have more time on another trip.
An excellent book is "Touring In Wine Country -- Burgundy" by Hubrecht Duijker (not sure if it's still in print). It has topo maps of all the vineyards, as well as a driving tour and descriptions of the character of different wines. It lists recommended producers, hotels, and restaurants, too.
So much of the story (valid and hype) of wine in Burgundy is about the vineyards, how they're situated and who owns which rows (or plants), so I recommend going out and walking some of the vineyard lanes and pondering how a few feet seperating vineyards can make a huge difference in the price of a bottle. Or how the same very highly touted vineyward can have different owners for the rows planted in well-drained soil at the top versus rows planted in the sometimes water-logged bottom. Makes you realize how much there is to know, enjoy, and be appropriately skeptical about next time you shop for Burgundies.
BTW, I found prices are basically just as good in the states (if you have access to a good wine store). So, I bought only as the (fair) price of taking up someone's time and tasting their wine.
HTH
-- Paul
We also paid for the tour and tasting at Chateau de Meursault. The wines available were reasonable quality and at the end, a person who spoke limited English provided some useful information. This would be a good value introduction to see an interesting cellar and taste some decent wine.
The tasting lunch at Maison Olivier Leflaive looked like an interesting and good value. But with our limited time, we didn't do this. For one thing, we're more interested in Cote de Nuits wines than Cote de Beaune, and Leflaive's wine style isn't our favorite. Still, I would do it if we have more time on another trip.
An excellent book is "Touring In Wine Country -- Burgundy" by Hubrecht Duijker (not sure if it's still in print). It has topo maps of all the vineyards, as well as a driving tour and descriptions of the character of different wines. It lists recommended producers, hotels, and restaurants, too.
So much of the story (valid and hype) of wine in Burgundy is about the vineyards, how they're situated and who owns which rows (or plants), so I recommend going out and walking some of the vineyard lanes and pondering how a few feet seperating vineyards can make a huge difference in the price of a bottle. Or how the same very highly touted vineyward can have different owners for the rows planted in well-drained soil at the top versus rows planted in the sometimes water-logged bottom. Makes you realize how much there is to know, enjoy, and be appropriately skeptical about next time you shop for Burgundies.
BTW, I found prices are basically just as good in the states (if you have access to a good wine store). So, I bought only as the (fair) price of taking up someone's time and tasting their wine.
HTH
-- Paul
May 28th, 2005, 11:19 AM
#36
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Paul,
We share the same enthusiasm for Beaune! I thought as we were making our escape: "Perhaps they're just having a bad day." As for tasting, well, it's fraught. I stand by what I said a ways back in this string: Better to get yourself to a caviste who loves wine more than money, pours in the shop, and knows a passel of vintners by their first names!
We share the same enthusiasm for Beaune! I thought as we were making our escape: "Perhaps they're just having a bad day." As for tasting, well, it's fraught. I stand by what I said a ways back in this string: Better to get yourself to a caviste who loves wine more than money, pours in the shop, and knows a passel of vintners by their first names!
May 28th, 2005, 12:09 PM
#37
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Dave,
I'm with you on the benefits of a good cavist, there and here in Oregon where any visitor will face similar problems (on a different scale, of course) trying to taste the "good stuff."
We sniffed around a few places in Beaune with no luck.
In the end, we're responsible for some missed opportunities because we simply didn't get as much research on this part of the trip completed before we were on our way.
Still, we had a good time. The Beaucastel experience far exceeded my expectations for a "magic moment" in the wine world.
Cheers!
-- Paul
I'm with you on the benefits of a good cavist, there and here in Oregon where any visitor will face similar problems (on a different scale, of course) trying to taste the "good stuff."
We sniffed around a few places in Beaune with no luck.
In the end, we're responsible for some missed opportunities because we simply didn't get as much research on this part of the trip completed before we were on our way.
Still, we had a good time. The Beaucastel experience far exceeded my expectations for a "magic moment" in the wine world.
Cheers!
-- Paul
