Why is Fierenze called Florence?
Jun 15th, 2006, 10:27 AM
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 687
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why is Fierenze called Florence?
I asked this question on missypie's thread, but it got lost in the shuffle. I am sure there is something language-wise that I don't understant, but I am still puzzling about why English speakers call it Florence?
Vera
Vera
Jun 15th, 2006, 11:10 AM
#8
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,416
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's Firenze in Italian. Florence is ultimately derived from the Latin name of Florentia, a name by which the Tuscan capital is called by a host of European languages such as French, German, Spanish as well as English. Italian Firenze is derived from the adjectival form fiorentino/a of Florentia.
Jun 15th, 2006, 11:20 AM
#9
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 273
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
All right, when someone says “I am from Deutschland ,” we say, “ah, yes, Germany!”
He DIDN’T say “Germany,” he said “Deutschland !”
How did NIPPON become Japan? Italy as Italia (that’s kind of obvious, but not to the person born and raised there) any many, many more examples.
I mean, if you introduce yourself and say, “Hello, my name is Raymond,” what would you think if some squirrelly s.o.b. nodded knowingly and said, “Ah, well, hello then Robespierre .”
Then you say, “I said my name is Raymond,” and they replied, “Yes, I heard you, but here we pronounce it as “Robespierre”.
How stupid is that? WHY is that?
He DIDN’T say “Germany,” he said “Deutschland !”
How did NIPPON become Japan? Italy as Italia (that’s kind of obvious, but not to the person born and raised there) any many, many more examples.
I mean, if you introduce yourself and say, “Hello, my name is Raymond,” what would you think if some squirrelly s.o.b. nodded knowingly and said, “Ah, well, hello then Robespierre .”
Then you say, “I said my name is Raymond,” and they replied, “Yes, I heard you, but here we pronounce it as “Robespierre”.
How stupid is that? WHY is that?
Jun 15th, 2006, 11:37 AM
#11
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,416
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's an old question/problem of exonym (a name by which a city, region, country or its inhabitants is referred to by those not living there) vs. endonym (a name by which they are known by inhabitants/native speakers). So Florence and Venice are exonyms, while Firenze and Venezia are endonyms. There are usually historical reasons for ex- and endonyms, such as Leghorn (a name by which Livorno was known to English merchants and navy since 16C as a strategic port). Japan is derived from Jipangu, a name by which the country was known in Malay/Chinese in 16C, and the word was brought to Europe by traders. First English reference was Giapan. Nippon or Nihon is the endonym, (the land of ) sun origin.
Jun 15th, 2006, 11:42 AM
#12
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,017
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Deutschland". The name comes from "Those who follow King Theoderich of the (east) Goths. And merely describes the fact that this were people who followed their King (in war). (Wikipedia)
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:15 PM
#16
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 479
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Obviously Firenze is Italian for its English equivalent of Florence and Alec has provided a detailed explanation of the origins of the words. It's like Genova (Italian) which is equivalent to Genoa (English) and Genes (French).
S
S
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:53 PM
#17
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 7,313
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And why do newscasters and such have to put a Spanish accent on Spanish cities/countries?
For example, when reporting about Mexico, they will say 'MEH-hee-co' instead of 'MEX-i-co', or COOba instead of KEWba. You don't hear them doing the same for Deutschland or Nippon, Eire, those are just Germany, Japan and Ireland. But the Latin countries must have their proper pronunciation.
Inconsitency. Drives. Me. Mad.
[/rant]
For example, when reporting about Mexico, they will say 'MEH-hee-co' instead of 'MEX-i-co', or COOba instead of KEWba. You don't hear them doing the same for Deutschland or Nippon, Eire, those are just Germany, Japan and Ireland. But the Latin countries must have their proper pronunciation.
Inconsitency. Drives. Me. Mad.
[/rant]
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:58 PM
#18
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,818
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let us not overlook "Nizza" on the Riviera....or Praha in the Czech Rep.
The change in names between the Austro-Hungarian Empire and Romania are classic. I devote many paragraphs in my most recent historical novel to that baby!
Stu T.
Stu T.
The change in names between the Austro-Hungarian Empire and Romania are classic. I devote many paragraphs in my most recent historical novel to that baby!
Stu T.
Stu T.
Jun 15th, 2006, 01:18 PM
#19
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 9,017
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
> hear them doing the same for Deutschland or Nippon
They simply can't pronounce it. ;-). What they'd actually say would sound like "Djutsclähnd" to a German and hardly recognizable.
They simply can't pronounce it. ;-). What they'd actually say would sound like "Djutsclähnd" to a German and hardly recognizable.
