why are french people so chauvinists?
 

hi there <BR> <BR>i just turned back from a few days holiday in the provence. i talk 5 languages (my mothertounge swiss german, german, italian, english and french) and i live now in italy. i have to think a lot when i talk in french but i can at least order something and i can follow the news in the tv and i do understand what they are telling me. i had the 3 times when i was in paris the strong feeling, that they didn't understand me or they just didn't want to understand. i allways thaught, that the french people who live in the south are very different and not so snobs and chauvinists, but i was very very wrong. i never ever felt so uncomfortable and discriminated like there. i spoke french and they stared at me like i'm from mars. what made me real sad was, that they neather doesn't speak another language! nothing like: we try it in english or maybe in italian, nono! we speak french only and if you don't speak it perfect i don't understand you, why should i, you are in my country....... <BR> <BR>well, i'm sorry but i just decided, that france with the habitants can stay where they are. i prefer to spend my holidays in countries where people are friendly and try to help you if you don't speak the language perfect. <BR> <BR>i wish you however a nice holiday there and hope, that you find the right people...... <BR> <BR>tanti saluti <BR> <BR>christina

Christina grüezi! <BR>Well I understand what you mean. Some French are definitely chauvinists. But up to now, I always thought only the Parisians were like that in particular. I am sorry to hear that some people in the Provence are just as bad. Nevertheless, that is an area in France which is just great. I hope this experience will not keep you from returning anyway. <BR>S'git nüt, wo's nit git! <BR>

ciao ursula <BR> <BR>schtimmt, äs git nüt wos nit git! aber di blöde franzose hei mi würklech hässig gmacht u äs isch zwar bsungers ufem hochplateau ob lax st. croix sehr schön mit au dene lavändufäuder aber hie im chianti gfauts mer fasch no besser...... bi ni iz o ä snob?? ;-) <BR> <BR>viu liebi grüess wohäre o immer! <BR> <BR>christina

Christina hi again: NO, non sei un snob!Best regards from Zurich. Going to bed right now. I'll mail you sometime to Italy. Lived in Florence some time to study Italian. Huh, i verbi italiani. Ho dimenticato quasi tutto. Ciao et buona notte, cara. <BR>PS: Das isch nid mini rächti Adresse. I ha zvil e-poscht übercho, wo si gmerkt hei, das ig in dr Schwiz wohne. Capische?

Hi Christina, I'm sorry for your unpleasent experiance in France. When I was there many years ago, it was only in Paris that I felt uncomfortable, other parts were just fine. You've always been so pleasent on the Forum that I can't believe that it was you. <BR>I hope that if you go back, your experiance will be more pleasent. <BR>Regards <BR>Art <BR>

Wow Christina! This is such the OPPOSITE of my experience travelling throughout France. I speak English and very little French (enough to get by French) but I try. When somebody doesn't understand me and I can tell they don't, they then ask me if I speak English! I have RARELY encountered anybody in France who has not turned out to be extremely helpful and nice when I attempt to speak some of their language (have been there 9 times in the last 2.5 years). I'm sorry to hear you had this experience, but I can say that I haven't. Also, having a phrase book with me helps as well - if they don't understand me and I don't understand them, I just give them the phrase book and ask them to point out what they're trying to say. Finally, I have noticed that the more I attempt to speak the language, the friendlier people are towards me (they can totally tell I'm American with the accent I have with my French :-)). . .

It's obvious. "Chauvin" was French. The term is theirs.

I don't understand why someone would be rude to a tourist who does not speak their language? If you lived there and did not attempt to learn the language that would be different. Of course, it is wise and thoughtful to learn as much of their language as possible before your trip to France (or wherever) but to be totally fluent? I am not impressed <BR>with this attitude. But, since I will be making my first trip to Paris this summer I will go with an open mind. <BR>Patti

Don't know where you got the impression that the French were less chauvanist in the South, most say they are less so in the North.A couple I know (Scots & Norwegian) opened an Auberge there & had nothing but trouble from petty officials.They speak every language from Hindi to Japanese.They got the distinct impression that outsiders weren't well liked.I've heard the same thing said about Southerers by (French) people I know in Brittany.The South has more immigrants & more votes for right wing racist parties. <BR>I like the French, but there are differences between the North & South.We have the same setup here in the UK, some may say also in the US. <BR>I hope most of those you met were OK,I know nasty people seem so much worse away from home as you feel more threatened, but keep it in perspective, there are plenty like that in your own country, I know there are in mine.

I am copy/pasting hereafter a posting I found on Virtual Tourist regarding the attitude of the French. <BR> <BR>quote <BR>World: American Tourists in France <BR>Sat Apr 28 09:02:20 2001 <BR> <BR>Q: I am starting a new post on this topic. I am French but I have lived in California for many years. I often look at the French from an American perspective and here are my observations on how to deal with the French in general. <BR>1.Yes, the French can be rude, especially in Paris where people are in a hurry and stressed out. Keep in mind that the rude people are rude to other french people as well. It happened to me many times. DO NOT TAKE IT PERSONALLY and don't assume that it is because you are american. <BR>2. The stereotype of the American is that they are uncultured, know nothing about history, eat bad food, speak only english, talk too loud, are very materialistic and expect a high quality of service. <BR>3. Here is some advice to all American tourists in France: do not stop people in the street and start speaking English to them. Ask them in French "parlez-vous anglais?". The French will be more likely to help if you act humble ..you can try by saying "j'ai un probleme " (i have a problem) and they will try to help you out. <BR>Remember that the French do not smile all the time. That does not mean that they are not friendly. When I arrived in the US, i was often asked why I looked so serious and did not smile. The French smile only when there is a reason to smile! <BR>Try to show some interest in the culture and the history. Do not go around asking how old everything is. <BR>Try not to travel in packs. People will be more receptive to you if you are traveling by yourself and not in a group. <BR>Americans are used to asking for substitutions in restaurants. This is not done frequently in France. It will make you look demanding. <BR>You may also keep in mind that many French people can't tell if you are American,British, Canadian or Australian. So, if you do encounter rudeness, please do not automatically think that it's because you are American. Bon Voyage! <BR>unquote <BR>

wow! ciao a tutti! <BR> <BR>thank you for all your responds. dear frank! i'm not english speaking, i'm not british, american, aussie or canadian. i'm swiss and i learned in school french (like everyone who live in switzerland in the german speaking part) and the thing was, that i didn't had to aks "do you speak english" because I speak french! that's the thing. well, i'm allways happy to hear, that someone else did have another impression and was treated good by french people. <BR> <BR>still i live here in italy, i'm actually even here a foregner. naturally i do speak italian but i work by myself with a lots of tourists and something around 90% from them are americans. i allways noticed, that if someone not italian who try to talk some words, is very welcome here in italy, people try immediately to help and they are proud, that someone try to talk there language. beleve me, i know i do still some errors in italian, but guess what, when i appologize that my italian is bad till today everyone told me: "ma dai! if i could speak only a bit from your language like you do in italian i would be very proud". <BR> <BR>we stayed in a nice b&b at the end of the world in france. very quiet and wild (from wilderness). the belgique people who were guests there, speak immediately english with us when they noticed, that talking french is a bit hard for us. the french people (including the owner) looked at us and when we started to talk in french to them, they just looked and they didn't neather help to find me the right words. at the last day the owner (who speak very very little english) told me ironicly "you speak very good french" and twinkeld to me. it was more this who made me sad then angry, because it is rude and he do have his website even in english...... <BR> <BR>well, nonostante we had some nice days and when i have unpacked my stuff and find the businesscards i will post some restaurants and nice places. <BR> <BR>tanti saluti <BR> <BR>christina

Funny, the French do not smile all the time. I definitely can agree with that one! I have French friends. Yes, the French can be quite rude at times, I found though that I got on quite well in France, even Paris, when I made an effort to speak French to them, although my French is so basic. I was surprised to find most of the younger generations were so eager to speak english to me, which is my mothertongue. I guess the lesson here is not to take the French so seriously, they're not all that bad.

I found the French to be pleasant, for the most part fairly friendly, and exceptionally courteous in Provence, the Dordogne and Paris (was only in Paris briefly) in 1998 and 2000. I generally tried speaking French first (with certain obvious exceptions, e.g., hotel receptionists who spoke English to me first, English-speaking tour guides). It's a struggle for me to speak long-ago learned and mostly forgotten French, and I am not fluent. However, French people guessing my nationality from my halting French usually guessed something other than USA because my accent, though somewhat "off" is not particularly "American." Some of the French people I met seemed to have a lot of respect and affection for Americans and Italians and British, though some in the Dordogne were sick of the British. The only group that I heard them make derogatory comments about often enough for me to really take note of it were the Germans. The elderly can never forget what they experienced during WW2, and I think many middle aged and young people grew up hearing about it. So... the point of all this rambling, Christina, is that maybe a lot of the French, detecting your Swiss-German accent, thought you were German and their prejudice showed through. That doesn't make it right, of course! But it might explain why you experienced more rudeness or coldness or haughtiness than many of us of other nationalities.

We lived near Paris for three years and by the time we were leaving I was very sorry to say goodbye, but for the first few months I found things very difficult. In the end, though, I decided there was as large a proportion of unfriendly French people as in any other nationality, but you do have to allow for cultural differences, as we expect them to do. <BR> <BR>We found their bureaucracy very difficult to deal with, mainly because it was so strange to us (and yes, threatening). My guess is that officials sometimes were unhelpful because it all seemed straightforward to them. For every one of that sort, you would meet many who would restore your faith in human nature. <BR> <BR>So, no blanket judgements please!

from my paris trip last year, i felt the parisians a bit standoffish to tourists but overall if you speak a bit of french (even if it's poor) in your earnest attempt to communicate, people will help..I think (& hope!) christina's experience may just be an isolated incident but there are always bad apples anywhere...just last year, a taxi driver refused to take us to the city from the airport; don't know what's with him but i'm not going to let a jerk ruin my vacation...imo, paris is just like nyc, in a big city, people are more guarded and lifestyle is more hectic; when i traveled to the south, i felt the people were so much courteous and the same goes for france...when i visited annecy and avignon, the people are charming and pleasant... <BR> <BR>are there any people here who have visited barcelona? is it me or people barely cracked a smile over there...it's not really rudeness i perceived but they are so serious!... <BR> <BR>

While I did experience the occasional rude Parisian on my last trip there--though hardly any more rude than the rude New Yorkers or DC-ers, etc., that I encounter in large cities here in the US--I also had an experience that restored my faith in humanity. <BR> <BR>While getting on the RER, I had my bag pickpocketed. We feel certain that the guy saw me getting cash out of the ATM a few minutes earlier, because he went unerringly for the right one of about five zipper pockets in my canvas bag. I felt something slide out, turned around and the guy had already melted into the crowd getting onto the train. As the lovely man at the American Express office later told me, "He's a professional. It's his job to rob people, and he's good at it." <BR> <BR>First the major lesson I learned, then the restore-faith-in-humanity item. Lesson: no, not "wear a money belt." Frankly, I probably would have still been fumbling with getting money into the darn thing and been pickpocketed anyway. This is the first time I've been robbed in ten years of overseas traveling, so I'm not too concerned about that. No, the lesson is: always carry American Express! My other credit card (Citibank) said they could get me a new card in about four or five days--by which time we'd be leaving Paris. AmEx, on the other hand, at their office on Blvd. de l'Opera, had me a replacement card and a few hundred dollars' worth of francs cash advanced within an hour of my showing up at their door. Without AmEx, I'd have had to rely on the kindness of my traveling companion in advancing me money--she would have, but I hate doing that to a friend. They saved my butt; I don't use the card much and their fee is higher than others, but I'll never get rid of it. <BR> <BR>Oops, getting off track here. The "restore my faith in humanity" experience comes with the next post.

Okay, so how can having my pocket picked on the RER convince me that people--and Parisians in particular--are decent and kind? Well, it starts with a phone call I received back at home in DC a couple of weeks ago. It's from a Parisian gentleman who found the mini-wallet I had been relieved on lying on the bank of the Seine, where the thief had obviously dropped it after yanking out the cash. Credit cards and frequent flyer card were still there, along with my business card (which is how the guy who called me got my number) and, inexplicably, about 30 francs. (Guess the guy was too lazy and rushed to pull it all out.) <BR> <BR>Anyway, this lovely Parisian gentleman wanted to ask about sending the wallet back to me, make sure I'd canceled my cards, and to reassure me that not all French people were like the thief! After a lovely chat, he invited me to have drinks with him and his wife the next time I'm in Paris so that they can make up for my bad experience. <BR> <BR>How lovely is *that*?

Me and my husband were in Paris last July. I speak a little French, but it wasn't enough, so we had to speak English. We were well understood, people were friendly, with only one exception (one person from the hotel staff)that doesn't count at all. From Paris we went to Berlim, and it was a nightmare, because no one even tried to understand us in English (we don't speak German). We almost lost our train because the person in the train station guiche just said that she didn't understand us and that she couldn't do anything. So, chauvinists are around all the world, even here in US, where a lot of people don't understand (???) me or don't want to just because I have a little Brazilian accent in my English and sometimes I don't know one word or the name of some object. Anyway, just because someone don't understand me or don't want to, I would never stop travelling. Just my thoughts... <BR> <BR>Débora

I am an American, and I have never run into any 'snobs' in France, city or south. Ok - maybe once, but that's it. No more than anywhere else that I've been in the world. <BR> <BR>I don't speak French, and have never felt uncomfortable attempting to speak basic French out of a book to a Parisian or countryperson. Most of the time, they are very sympathetic, and really have tried to help me. Being polite and courteous goes a long way. <BR>

I also do not speak French, and have gotten along fine in all parts of France. Everyone is so friendly and warm! In fact, the first time I tried to speak French (my 2nd trip), I was given the French equivalent of "Whut?" hahaha They thought I was pretty funny, and humored me. <BR> <BR>Either you had bad luck and encountered all the wrong people on your trip, or I had good luck and encountered all the nice people on my trips....but really, I think the French are really nice & hospitable.