St. Bartholemew, I believe, was skinned alive, so he is often depicted holding a knife in one hand and his own skin in the other. You can see a statue of him in Rome in San Giovanni in Laterno. St. Cecilia was executed by probably the most incompetent executor of all times! He tried to behead her, but her head stayed on, and she sang for the last 3 days of her life. Eventually, however,...well, she did indeed lose her head. St. Peter was crucified upside down. St. Andrew was crucified on a saltire, an x-shaped cross, in Greece.

BTW, the deal with Mary Magdalene was that she was possessed of demons, or back then, an illness, of which Jesus cured her. I do believe the "myth" that evolved is that she was saved from being stoned to death for adultery, which means someone in ancient Middle East must have been writing not just fiction, but bodice-ripping fiction.

My, this is cheerful. Takes me back to my 12 years in Catholic school....

BC

Bookchick. I spent 9 years in Catholic school but I am beginning to think I was out to lunch for a lot of it. Or maybe I am blocking it.
Anyway, Mary's head is the last dried relic I want to see for a long, long time.

indytraveler - got to love that book! I'd forgotten Ferreolus. Thanks for looking it up. I also found it interesting that so many early saints supposedly had cousins/siblings/parents etc who were also saints...

bookchick - another place to find a representation of St Bartholomew is in the Sistine Chapel on the Last Judgement above the altar. Michelangelo painted St Bartholomew's skin (hanging below and to the right of Christ) but put his (Michelangelo's face) on it.

I did 13 years too, BC, and never learnt as much about the Saints in all those years as I have in the minutes reading this thread.

I find this so fascinating too. I will be able to pick out saints now in painting and sculpture.

bookchick, you let off St Cecilia much too easily. :)\

First, they tried for 3 days to suffocate her in a steam bath, I think that's when she did the singing.
The beheading didn't work out well either, as you pointed out, but the executioner was only allowed three tries (3 strikes and he was out) so the poor woman had to linger for days after that, but I don't think she was still singing at that point.

Well, Elaine, I didn't want to get too "intimate" with the details on Cecilia, but if you're in for some hot gossip, she died a virgin, although she was a married woman. She was betrothed to a wealthy young man by arrangement, and prayed that she could "retain" uh..her chastity. Apparently her prayers were answered, as she converted her husband, Valerian, to Christianity on their wedding night in the bridal chamber.

BC

Wow, Cecelia must have been some woman! I guess her husband realized it firsthand.

I have seen pictures of that man with the sagging face and I didn't know that it was because he had been skinned.

You all know so many things, I am impressed, any more famous paintings I should see of saints in Italy? I'm on a roll now.

When we went to Venice, we visited a church that has a saint's foot. I don't remember the name of the church or its location (we were lost). Any thoughts?

It's St. Catherine's foot in the church of SS Giovanni e Paolo. (The church of Saints John and Paul.) There's an altar dedicated to St. Catherine there, and that's where her foot is.

BC

When you see these pieces of saints are they in glass cases? Or are they like mummies in tombs? If I see her foot can you tell it is a foot? Can you take pictures?

I'm hardly an expert with just two weeks in Italy, but what I found exciting is that I started to pick up the "language" of the paintings. I could tell immediately what scene was being portrayed, because I would see it over and over again. And I started being able to tell the saints based on what implements they had or were carrying or whatever.

In the Last Judgment, Michelangelo shows Saint Bartholomew's flayed skin, but puts his own portrait (not the same as the saint's) on the flayed skin. Somewhat odd, but interesting.

Peeky, in some cases there's been a lot of decomposition, in other cases virtually none. When Popes died, they were put on display with a "death mask" so one did not have to see a decaying skeleton. But the late Pope John XXIII has been on display in St. Peter's Basilica since the beatification process has begun for him (he's on the way to becoming a saint), and he looks pretty good, if I do say so.

BC

If you visit The Loreto convent in Prague, you will see fully-clothed skeletons, in vitrines, behind the altar in the chapel. They are wearing death masks, also.

I LOVED the Loreto in Prague.
There's a Santa Casa (reproduction of Mary's house) and a monstrance in the little museum with a gazillion diamonds--I think it was called the Sun of Prague.

It was the monstrance that had the diamonds, not the museum itself.

Bookchick-
Thanks! My DH and I have been arguing over which church it was. I was right! :)

Peeky-
When we saw it, we KNEW it was a foot. It wasn't just the skeleton- it was more mummified. The problem with taking pictures of artifacts is that many churches don't allow photography. That was the case with SS Giovanni e Paolo- there were some priests wandering around asking people to put away their cameras. I would have loved to sneak a picture of that, though!

I was just googling and I found this website devoted to the churches in Rome.
Not an official one, but seems to have good info on the churches and their saints.
http://roma.katolsk.no/index.htm

BC, I should have guessed this, but Saint Cecilia is the patron saint of singing and music, which I didn't know

I have to say that to a simple lapsed Anglican like yours truly, this thread is pretty damn creepy.

Ha, just wait until you see my trip pictures! There will be parts and pieces in LIVING color.