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Which country you would NOT want to visit?

Which country you would NOT want to visit?

Old Aug 9th, 2001, 09:41 PM
  #21  
April
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Interesting what people are saying about Zanzibar. Has it changed that much in just over a decade? I and another woman walked the alleyways and all around day and night and didn't feel unsafe. There was a mix of people so I would not feel naked in an ankle length skirt, but in town is not the place to wear shorts and sleeveless tops. I found the people to be quite hospitable, and some positioned themselves in front of my camera even when I didn't want them there! I'd go back there in a second.

But Greece? I could have lived without that experience.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 12:15 AM
  #22  
Kavey
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Natalie...

I went to Kenya about 15 years ago so please be aware that it may have changed.

At that time there was a lot of "tension" between the black population and the ethnic Indian population. I am not too aware of how there came to be such a large Indian population within Kenya, but I do recall a large volume of Indian Kenyans leaving their home to escape the violence they encountered.

By the time we went, the main difficulties were over but I guess the prejudices remained.

We went with an organised tour group, I cant recall which one.

When we arrived, and tried to go through passport control we had our first problems.

My sister and I were born in London. Our British passports are identical to those carried by any other British people. My parents took British nationality before we were born, their passports are also like any other British passport. We had checked before travelling with the Kenyan embassy in London that British needed no visas to travel to Kenya.

My sister and I were held up and forced to buy visas - they refused to let us through to join the group otherwise. We decided to just do it and sort it out with the embassy in UK on getting home.

Another passenger in our group was a young lady with Indian father and English mother. Her surname was Indian (I recall it to this day) and her features less so. She was reduced to tears as the local airport officials accused her of plastic surgery to hide her Indian-ness, of pretending she was a different religion to what she was (Christian) and all sorts.

We also met some friendly people in Kenya but this was not the only time I felt our family were treated less than fairly in this country.

In contrast as soon as we crossed into Tanzania for the rest of the tour, we experienced no further problems.

Kavey

I am fully prepared to listen to any information about how things have changed, but I personally will not return to that country.

Had such a great time in Tanzania, and then this year in Namibia and Botswana, that I can get my fill of Africa elsewhere.

I believe in this particular case, racism against white visitors was non existent...
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 07:38 AM
  #23  
Proud
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gana: I think it is Ok to bring to our attention that some Islamic countries are doing bad things to women.
However, I do not think it is OK to condemn an entire section of the population because of their religion.
I am a woman and my religion is Islam.

My husband and I came to this country several years ago. I am happy with my religion and I was brought up that way. When we arrive to this country we decided to follow the ways of our parents, and live the way we lived before. I do not work, take care of the children, and I cover my head and neck and face in public. I am happy to tend to my husband since he provides for my family.
I would feel naked if I did not cover my head and neck and face in public. The same way any woman here would feel if they did not put a shirt and a brassiere on and went to buy groceries. Only my husband should be able to see my hair, neck, just as women here show their rest of the body only to their husbands.

My whole family travels everywhere in the world on vacation, and I am happy with my life. I have been several times to Spain, England, France and Italy.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 07:57 AM
  #24  
Reg
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Texas! It's bigger than most countries and the people there act like they're not part of the USA.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:05 AM
  #25  
Kavey
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Proud

I did not read gana's post to condemn all followers of Islam, I think like me, he/ she expressed concern about the situation in CERTAIN islamic countries in the middle east.

She (or I) did not speak out against an entire religion. I have been to countries where Muslims are the dominant religious group and have no issues with that at all.

My issue (and I think gana's too) is only with those countries where there is a more fundamental approach which permeates everyday life and restricts people from living their lives in freedom and as they see fit.

You have chosen to live your life as you do, which is as it should be.

I would not be so pleased to visit a country which forced any person, man or woman to live a life they did not choose.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:19 AM
  #26  
ooo
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ABOUT ISLAMIC COUNTRIES: I donīt live in an islamic countrie, but where I live, islamic culture prevailed for several centuries, and that period ended several centuries ago ( can you guess wich countrie is this ? )
Iīve visited several islamic countries, in the past, and next september...here I go, to another one.
I think itīs totally unfair, to consider all islamic countries as a place not to visit. One thing iīve learned, is that mueslims are people like me, and like you that is reading this lines. In fact, for a european like me, and a travel addict, visiting islamic countries is fundamental, mainly because the diference between this two realities is amazing.
Other things Iīve learned, with islamics is to respect and give a right value to certain things, for example, nature. Did you know that while we in the so called civilized world only in the last part of the XX century started to develop nature respect, while they have been doing it for centuries ?
One other thing. I understand that for women, the use of a tchadoori can be very oppressive. It is oppressive both for a european, as it is for a arab, but thereīs a culture that must be respected, and we, must respect.
Last note, and still about women. Do you know which is the largest mueslim countrie in the world ? itīs Indonesia, and the president is a women.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:27 AM
  #27  
Kavey's
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Are there posts in this thread which are invisible to me or are people reading something extra into posts that arent intended.

The last poster says:

"I think itīs totally unfair, to consider all islamic countries as a place not to visit."

I have read all the above posts again and cant find anyone who ahs said they will not go to any islamic countries.

Myself, and others too I think, are saying that we do not prefer to visit SOME (and only SOME not all) islamic countries where there are more fundamental governments in place. I would certainly be more than happy to visit other islamic countries, and have indeed done so on more than one occasion.

Please dont let religion blind you to reading what people are actually writing...
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:31 AM
  #28  
ooo
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Iīm sorry to dissapoint you, but Iīm a catholic
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:40 AM
  #29  
Don'tcomplain
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Eva,
We have way too many Polish people here already in the U.S., especially in Chicago. By the way, earning 20 times the average Polish salary is very little for an American. So we won't miss you, since we already have enough babysitters, so we don't need any more Polish women.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 08:50 AM
  #30  
EG
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Please do not start bashing entire countries or religions. Keep this a travel thread.

I think it is hard for some people to visit a place where people are being treated so cruelly. I could not do myself. I like to enjoy myself when traveling, I do not want to see suffering. I do not know how can you do that Natalie, I guess you are more adventurous than I am.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 09:51 AM
  #31  
heretheycomeagain
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These people are always bashing others. Yes they will only travel to Europe because they feel secure there, it is familiar and close to home. After all even though it is different than the US, it is still a westernized continent, and not much different than the USA compared to Africa or other Muslim areas.

God forbid somebody wants to travel to a place where everything is completely different like an Islamic conutry, where people do not speak English or French and you cannot exchange hair, make-up and clothing tips!
Or where there is no public transportation, or no transportation for that matter, where the food is something you will never experience at home, where people do not drink, and you look completely different than anyone else, and no matter what you do you will never be able to fit in.

They like to travel to "confort zones" where they can sip their wine and feel they are better than the people at home who do not understand French, and where they can complaint about anything and everybody.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 10:09 AM
  #32  
Capo
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To: Proud, Re: "I would feel naked if I did not cover my head and neck and face in public."

If that's your choice, I have no problem with that. But the key word is CHOICE.

What I'm strenously opposed to, and find highly offensive, are men in power making RULES for women, refusing to give them a choice, based on their interpretation of scriptures or any other reason. (Likewise, if women were in power making rules for men.)

If a woman chooses to wear a chador, chooses to not go topless on a beach, or chooses not to run for political office, or chooses not become a Catholic priest, fine. But why should a woman be forced to wear a chador, or forced to wear a top on a beach, or be banned from running for political office, or be banned from becoming a Catholic priest?

The issue is choice.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 10:16 AM
  #33  
xx
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Saudi Arabia- I'm female and for me thats a good enough reason not to go there. Yes it's good to experience other cultures- but public floggings and hangings are just not my thing!
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 10:42 AM
  #34  
ok
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WHAT ABOUT INDONESIA !!! THEIR PRESIDENT IS A WOMAN !!!
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 10:44 AM
  #35  
leo
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Stay away from Santo Domingo. I spend once 3 days there, and I hated every minute there. People are extremely nasty, unfriendly and rude. Plus every one is lookingto rip you off -taxi,waiter, hotel staff,etc. Better go to any other place but that shithole.
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 11:06 AM
  #36  
xx
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What about Indonesia?!!! I don't see any negative posts about Indonesia-and I don't understand what relevance the gender of their president is!!!!
 
Old Aug 10th, 2001, 12:40 PM
  #37  
Mike
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xx - Indonesia is predominantly muslim. I make this observation without prejudice, merely to enlighten. Having reluctantly entered the debate, I withdraw ...
 
Old Aug 11th, 2001, 05:52 AM
  #38  
Kavey
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Yes Indonesia has a female leading the country.

And yes, Mike, it is a predominantly mulsim country.

But what several (illiterate?) posters are failing to notice is that people here are NOT slamming all islamic countries.

Many of us are stating our preference not to visit ONLY the few islamic countries which ARE more fundamentalist, which ARE forcing the decisions they make onto the population and which ARE denying their population freedom of choice.

Since Indonesia doesnt fall into that category I fail to see the relevance of the sex of the president.

It isnt an issue of not being to drink or wear make up (how facile) but a personal refusal not to support those governments which dont give their population choices.

Many Islamic countries DO give their population freedom and choices and these countries I would be happy to visit anytime.

I do appreciate religion is a touchy topic but when it stops people from being able tor ead what is written without jumping to completely illogical conclusions it is not a good thing.
 
Old Aug 11th, 2001, 06:21 AM
  #39  
let freedom ring
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To Proud, your Koran does not tell the Muslim woman to cover head, face, hair, body, it asks that a woman be modest. You are following the tradition of the men who have interpreted this for you. I notice you do not deny the horror inflicted upon the muslim woman. Your prohphet mohamad was a warrior which of course you are aware of. Remember the story in the bible, when Jesus was presented with the "fallen" woman. Jesus said "he who cast the first stone be with out sin" Of course I did not quote this directly. The woman was spared. In the Koran, Mohammad is presented also with a fallen woman, he he orders her stoned to death. I have read some of the Koran and would not choose to follow a prohpet who had to take up arms and force it down the throats of the people of the time. People did not pick up and follow him like Jesus, they were made to follow him. Capo is right, it is about choices. be female or male we all deserve choices. No woman is superior to me because he has a penis, nor am I as a woman superior to anybody, including my poor suffering muslim sisters trapped in a world of incest,slavery,and control.
 
Old Aug 11th, 2001, 08:46 AM
  #40  
xx
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Well said!! The fact that Indonesia has a female president simply proves that women in other countries that are being oppressed are being done so under the facade of religion. The Korans words can be taken to different extremes to suit the reader-just like the Bible.
 

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