David Trexler

My wife and I will arrive at Victoria station <BR>around 9:00 A.M. in October. What is the best way <BR>to get to our hotel located in S. Kensington <BR>across from the Victoria and Albert Museum on <BR>Cromwell Road? We will have two large suitcases <BR>plus two small carryon bags.

jenny

hi david, <BR> <BR>take the circle line on the tube. but with the amount of luggage you'll have, take a cab. it'll cost about £10~$17 (at most, tip included) but it'll get you there fast. the tube is awful if you have luggage...trying to go through the turnstiles bit is hell. not to mention...if you have luggage with wheels, it's not easy getting around the uk. the pavement is uneven so it ends up flipping all over the place, making you wish you took a cab! taking the tube would cost you around £5 for both of you. for an extra £5, less grief!

David

Jenny, thanks for the good advice re: tube travel <BR>in London, and the Scottish day trips. For sightseeing etc. in London would you advise the <BR>tube or busses? <BR>

wes fowler

The upper level at the front of a double decker bus is an excellent way to see London. The numbers 11,15 and 38 busses all pass most of the major tourist sites. With a travel pass, good for both the tubes and the busses, you can get on and off at your liesure. Beats paying for a tour bus.

D. Trexler

Wes, thanks for the tip on the bus and travel <BR>passes. We're going to try to do our own thing <BR>in London w/o formal tours. We're planning to get <BR>Britrail Passes for travel to Bath, Oxford, etc. <BR>Any ideas on the best day trips by train, and the <BR>ones to avoid?

wes fowler

Regarding day trips, there are two resources. "Day Trips in Britain" an Earl Steinbicker guide describes a number of day trips from London. Britrail publishes a brochure of day trips available from the British Tourist Authority. It indicates times of departure, point of departure, length of journey for over two dozen trips. You mentioned Bath and Oxford, two excellent choices; consider the Botanic Gardens in Kew, less than half an hour from London. You might consider Salisbury with its half timbered houses and spectacular cathedral, as well. It's accessible in less than an hour and a half. I wouldn't recommend Stratford. There is no direct train service, you must connect with a bus. Has a tendency to be overrun with tourists, although October may lessen the crowds. By the way, when purchasing tickets, ask for "Cheap Day Return" which is the daily round trip ticket. the "AwayBreak" ticket allows for an overnight stay up to four nights and costs about 20% more.

jenny

hi again david, <BR> <BR>for sightseeing, i tended to mark a place in my book and just go there rather than checking out sights on the way. i never liked buses, never knew where to get off and in london, you pay by zone, you it gets troublesome have to know how much you have to pay and not knowing where to get off...but then, i'm the type of person who does not like unpredictables! so basically i took the tube although guidebooks often tell you what the best bus routes are for scenic journeys. <BR> <BR>for day trips, i generally took the train. trips by car are not quite as scenic or relaxing. i've gone to canterbury and bath (although by car). i agree with wes in that you ought to check out kew gardens. a thames river boat leaves westminster every few hours and you can get there in about 3 1/2 hours via the thames. you see a lot from the thames that you wouldn't see on other tours. hampton court is also on the route but i advise you train out for that one. it's farther than kew and providing the water level, a 5 hour journey could turn into 7 1/2 (like it did for me!) hampton court gardens are lovely and features a garden maze. i never made my way through it but everyone else i know has! other trips, like wes said cambridge and oxford. i liked cambridge more. you can take punt rides down the river and the punt driver usually knows some history about the university which is right on the banks. if there's anything else please let me know. i'll be in the uk for another couple weeks so i'll be able to check out whatever for ya if needed! if not, bon voyage!

jenny

oh, just read my message again and realized you might think i'm illiterate but i hope you can get the gist of it.

wes fowler

David, <BR>Just wanted to add a suggestion and comment on Jenny's concerns about bus touring. Pick up a copy of "The A to Z Visitor's London Atlas and Guide" at any tourist office, bookstore or most news stands. It's about the size of a postcard, so it's convenient to carry with you. It lists all of the major attractions in and around London, opening and closing times in most instances; nearest Underground station, etc. It's comprehensive large scale map shows and identifies every major building. Each street is marked with the routes of busses. Underground stations are also indicated. It's an invaluable and convenient guide. Jenny made a comment about tube and bus passes and the confusion regarding zones and multiple fares. Almost all of the major tourist attractions are within Zone 1. You can pick up zone maps for the underground and the bus system at any underground station. Jenny also mentioned a boat trip to Kew; it's accessible by train as well.

Roger

For day trips you might want to consider one or more of the following. Cardiff Wales with a side trip to Caerphilly. Great castles in both places. It is only a 1 3/4 hour trip from Paddington station. Also a day trip to York, 2 hours from King Cross station. Another trip, but one that takes a transfer is to go to Lemmington Spa and then transfer to the local line to Warrick. One of the best castles in Europe. This train also goes to Strafford if your so inclined. Makes for a fun day.

David

Thanks Jenny, Wes and Roger for your London and <BR>daytrip tips. I was planning to get 4 day Britrail <BR>passes (unlimited train travel for any 4 days out <BR>of 30). Two of those will be London-Edinburgh and return, leaving us with two days. Does this make <BR>sense, or should we buy tickets at time of travel?

Roger

David, The Britrail flex pass makes sense provided you don't waste it on near by train trips. Some make the mistake of using a days value on a trip that would be more economical if you were to purchase a "cheap day return" ticket. As an example, I would not waste a day of the pass to take the train to Greenwich, rather only use the pass on the longer trips.

jenny

david, <BR> <BR>oh, no no no! the flexipass is a couple hundred dollars, isn't it? anyway, what you can do is this...for your london-edinburgh trip, virgin trains has a 'deal' where you can take a return journey (round trip) for £30~$55. however, you must book in advance. if you know when you're going and returning, it would help to book at least 7 days in advance. i'm not sure if they'll mail them to you. but you can certainly pick them up at the train station with a confirmation number and ID. you can call 44 345 222 333. sure it's long distance, but you can save a couple hundred dollars. <BR> <BR>most day return tickets do not require advance purchase. but some are a little too far to be considered day return tickets. keep that in mind. ask the sales rep for advice to be sure. there's also the website http://www.virgintrains.com be patient, it takes a while to load. the special savings and 'packages' are indicated on the page but regular fares aren't. you have to call them for that info. <BR> <BR>in short, ditch the flexipass unless you plan on doing a lot of distance traveling...it'll pay off to check this out!

David

Jenny, thanks for your tip about Virgin Trains <BR>from London to Edinburgh. I tried virgintrains.com <BR>but no luck. Could there be another address?

jenny

hi again david! <BR> <BR>that address should be right. for all the money the 'virgin' guy has, he doesn't invest much in his web site. www.virgintrains.com should work. if not, try the link to the older site, which should be the same www.virgintrains.co.uk london to edinburgh, i don't think is listed but it's the same distance as london to glasgow and runs just as often. so most of the time, the fares to either of these cities are the same. if not, the vary only by a couple of pounds. <BR> <BR>oh, and i don't know when you're traveling, but be sure to check these fares out soon. usually, they're only specials. best bet is to call them and check. <BR> <BR>if there's anything else...

Ben Haines

Dear Mr Trexler, <BR>.............................................. .......... <BR>I wonder whether you're to arrive in London from Gatwick. If so, you might prefer to use a trainjourney which has stairs only at South Kensington tube station. There's no Sunday service. <BR>.............................................. ................... <BR>Leave Gatwick Monday to Friday at 0556, 0655, or 0842: arrive Kensington Olympia 0655, 0730, or 0920. Cross the platform (no stairs) to District line train, which is standing waiting. One station to Earls Court. Leaveb the train, wait on the same platform, take a District line train eastbound for two stations. You are at South Kensington. Don't take the pedestrian tjnnel, but go up to street klevel, ask the way to the Victoria and Albert, and your hotel is two hundred yards away. You should see how you feel If you don't want to walk there are taxis, and since they have a minimum charge of about two pounds they are likely to be ready to take you. Arrival from Gatwick at Victoria involves a five minute walk through the station, under the forecourt, and to the District line. At Victoria, Kensington Olympia, South Ken, and indeded at any place with turnstiles there's a gate for people like you with pushchairs ior with heavy luggage. You just look for the staff member, hold up your ticket where it can be seen, and smile at him or her. I do it all th time with a bike. <BR>.............................................. ........................... <BR>If you are ready to leave Gatwick a bit before 0842, then you should leave at 0722, go to the next station, East Croydon, and you'll have 13 minutes to change to a train that leaves East Croydon at 0731 and arrives at Kensington Olympia at 0823. <BR>.............................................. ............................. <BR>There are similar trains from Gatwick to Kensington Olympia on Saturdays. <BR>.............................................. ............................ <BR>If you're to take three or more rail day trips to places in the home counties, such as Hampton Court, Oxford, Cambridge, and Canterbury, then you would do well to buy at Gatwick railway station a Network Rail Card, price about twenty pounds, which covers tqwo adults (and four children), and takes a third off cheap day return prices for trains from London after 0930 Mondays to Fridays, and any time at weekends and bank holidays. I write assuming that you're going to omit the expensive rail pass, as you have been wisely advised. To buy the railcard I think you'll need a passport photo at Gatwick station. <BR>.............................................. .......................... <BR>York, Warwick and Bath are beyond the Network card area, but cheap day returns are still a fair buy. There are through trains, with refreshment trolleys, from Paddington Mondays to Saturdays at 0918 and at 1118 that arrive at Warwick at 1104 and at 1302, and arrive at Stratford 23 minutes later. The most scenic line is the one from Marylebone with departures at 0940 or 1040, that run through the Cotswolds, and reach Warwick at 1121 or 1221. On Sundays you've just the Cotswold line. Anyway, no need to change at Leamington Spa, nor to take a bus. <BR>.............................................. ......................... <BR>I'm just back from a couple of days in Edinburgh. I did both trips by night, with a sleeper. If you phone the Great North Eastern Railway reservations office now on 0044 345 55 00 33, holding a credit card, you may be able to get the Apex return, 85 pounds a person, sleeper supplement included. You can sit in the special lounge with free coffee at Euston from 1900 hours (not that I'd arrive that early myself), board at 2230, and stay on board at Edinburgh until 0800. Again there's a lounge at Edinburgh, you can board from 2320, and you can stay on board at Euston until 0800. The fare includes morning tea or coffee, but I generally decline, and ask to be woken not before 0740. That lets me sleep as long as may be. At Euston you can ignore the "Way Out" signs, walk up the motor ramp, turn left at the top, and on the main road, next to the church, will find a stop for busses headed via Holborn and Waterloo to the Elephant. But before that, a little to the left of the church, there's a decent cafe, with full English breakfast at two pounds sixty. It opens at seven. <BR>.............................................. .......................... <BR>Your two-zone London travelcard costs seventeen pounds a person a week, and has no limits of time (from Mondays to Fridays the daily travel pass starts validity only at 0930): you need a passport photo to get one. The card covers tube, bus and local rail (for example the trains to Greenwich). So if you get at South Kensington tube ticket office the all-London bus map (not the tourist version, which I find over-selective) you can learn to hop on and off busses, and to ride in front on the top. You wouldn't do this for more than a few miles, and not at all in the rush hour, but used judiciously the busses do give you a better idea of London than the tubes do. <BR>.............................................. ........................... <BR>Please write again if I can help further. Welcome to Britain. <BR>.............................................. ............................. <BR>Ben Haines, London <BR> <BR> <BR>

David

This is in reply to the extensive information provided by Ben Haines. Sorry if you get this message twice. <BR> <BR>You obviously have a good understanding of travel in London and the UK, and your comment did raise a few more questions. <BR>We are considering switching our Hotel to Hospitality Inn on Bayswater Road overlooking Kensington Gardens. Any opinion of the Hotel or location? We want a decent place with easy access to the rest of London, near restaurants, and access to trains out of town. <BR>If we switch to Hospitality Inn, what is the most convenient train arrangement from Gatwick? Our original plan was to take the Gatwick Express to Victoria Station, and then a cab to the hotel. However, if there is an easy way <BR>to get to Lancaster Gate station or Queensway station by train, we would try that. <BR>Our flight arrives Gatwick at 8:00 A.M. <BR>Would this allow enough time to make the 8:42 train (or would we be looking for a different train to Lancaster Gate/Queensway? <BR>We are planning a trip to Edinburgh and return, plus a day trip to Bath, and at least one more day trip to either Cambridge or Oxford. Since Bath and Edinburgh are beyond the Network Card area, what is the best rail arrangement for these trips? Since we won't be using the sleeper, do you still feel the Great North Eastern Railway is the best way to travel to Edinburgh? We thought the Britrail Flexipass would pay for itself with three substantial round trips. <BR>We appreciate your comments regarding the two zone London Travel Card, which sounds like the most flexible way to see the City. <BR>

Ed Ennis

<BR>Jenny thanks also for your input on train to Edinburgh. I amin the states leaving Oct 13 for London and debating the Britrail Pass. It seems too exoensive for basically one long r/t. Where does the Virgin train leave from. I plan to leave london on the 19th and find an Easyjet plane from Stansted is also reasonable. Would a Virgin train bookin on arrival the 13th be too late for an economy tx to Edin.? thanks Ed

Sheila

Small answer to big question. I think GNER is easily the best train company on the east coast route.

Lori

By all means take a taxi from whatever train station you come in from to your hotel. With 2 large suitcases and carryons I would say it is impossible to navigate the underground. For sheer comfort (and consideration of others in the tube who may be coming/going from work) grab a cab. The price won't be that steep and the comfort level is certainly worth it overall.