Verona, Venice, Bologna, etc.
 

Where would be the best place to locate for a week to see Parma, Bologna, Verona, Padova, Modena? Will probably have a rental car. Can we do some of this on a train w/o spending a lot of time in transit? Any help is very much appreciated.

I would think that Bologna would be a good base, and I would add Varenna to the towns to be visited. My trip report might be of some intetest:

http://www.fodors.com/forums/pgMessa...p;tid=34607146

Given your itinerary, you don't really need a rental car at all, and I don't imagine it's a lot of fun to drive one in Verona, Padova or Bologna.

I would simply stay in Bologna.

If you are going to add anything to your trip, and you are at all interested in art and history, make it Ravenna.

If my post wasn't clear, I'm suggesting you stay in Bologna and take trains to the places you want to go.

Bologna can be a difficult place to get a hotel room. Book early, and if you are staying for a week, consider renting an apartment (even if you have no plans to use the kitchen).

Dont miss a trip to Boltsano (don't think I've spelt that right), but it's where you can see Utsi (The Iceman). Verona is only worth a short visit. THAT balcony and the amphi-theatre. And a trip to the Dolomites is well worth doing.

That would be "Bolxano."

For people interested in art and architecture, plus good restaurants and Italian history, Verona is a very rewarding place to spend time beyond a short visit.

Along with the wonderfully preserved Roman arena, Verona has one of the loveliest museums (and Europe) in a renovated castle with a fine, small collection of art. The Duomo, the church of San Zeno, several unique piazzas plus the city walls and bridges of pink stone make it a particularly pleasant small Italian city in which to relax, eat well and stroll.

I've never been to the fake Juliet balcony (it's just there for tourists) but the many other balconies of Verona and the winding streets of historic architecture make for an unusually pretty northern Italian town.

Sorry! Hit the wrong key.

BolZano

I agree about basing in Bologna and taking the train. Verona is lovely! I would guess that the Dolomites are way too far to include on this trip. Look forward to some great great food!

I meant Ravenna.

I was just in Bologna at the beginning of November - did day trips to Moden, Parma and Ravenna by train. Bologna is a great place to be based. Great city to come back to after day tripping.

Much as I love Bologna, I think I'd that with Marycang's plans, I'd rather prefer Mantova - it's simply better located to see all of these towns/cities (i.e. much nearer to Padova and Verona), and it's so much smaller than Bologna: you're losing less time for going in and out of town when daytripping. And as far as beauty, sights, atmosphere and (!) food, Mantova is certainly Bologna's equal (a very different equal, please get me right, but on an equal level). Mantova is one of the best, most beautiful, most charming, and most interesting examples of small town Italy. Bologna is a large university city with a fascinating intellectual flair and excellent monuments, as well. Both cuisines (VERY different) are among Italy's best...

Franco - now you've got me all curious about Mantova. Time to do some research......

...me, too. Are the cuisines THAT different? Very enticing...

Yesss. Mantova has a very special local cuisine (in a very small area) that always reminds me of the ancient Roman cooking (the famous cookbook of Apicius). The ancient Romans combined sweet and salty flavours in almost each recipe, hardly any was only salty or only sweet; and one of their most important ingredients were syrups made of grape juice, in various concentrations: caroenum, the least concentrated of them; sapa, a midway variant; and defritum, with the highest concentration. Well, and the cuisine of Mantova actually uses defritum still today, they name it "vin cot" there, vino cotto, boiled wine (but it's actually sweet grape juice, not wine, notwithstanding the name). Btw, this is not Italy's only local cuisine that still uses grape syrups, and in Sardegna, they still name it "sapa"... but in Bologna, they'd rather bite off a piece of their own tongue than combine salty ingredients with grape syrup!!
Vin cot is not the only resemblance of modern Mantovan with ancient cuisine: the most famous recipe of Mantova, tortelli di zucca, i.e. ravioli with pumpkin stuffing, is being made without vin cot, but is fully in the ancient spirit: a perfect balance between salty (parmesan cheese) and sweet - you could not tell if you are eating a salty or a sweet dish, it's simply both at once. Ingenious!! (The sweet ingredient, other than the sweet components of the pumpkin itself, of course, is another preparation of ancient Roman spirit: mostarda Mantovana, literally mustard of Mantova, but actually apple slices cooked in apple syrup, with only a dash of - very hot - ground mustard seed).

Btw - if someone gets my last post twice, I apologize; yesterday, the server broke down while I sent it, so I resent it, and it appeared only once, as it should; today, I've already seen it twice, and now, it's there just once... mysteries of the www...

I stayed in Milano a couple years back and took trains to Bologna, Verona, etc and found it made a good base for day trips to those cities. I was without a car and found staying in a larger place useful with good train connections. I particularly loved Verona, it is a very charming place! Buon viaggio!

Marycang-definitely Ravenna needs to be on your list, and Bologna would be a great city to base in-but as far as Verona-I've said a number of times on this board, I don't care for it, -it's blah in all respects, a place mainly for trade fairs/businessmen.

I strongly disagree with the above comment that Verona is mainly for businessmen and fairs. There is LOTS to see and do in this beautiful small city; and fabulous food! Bologna hosts lots and lots of fairs and is more of a business center than Verona but it remains a wonderful place to visit. Just my opinion..

Ravenna was about an hour and half, Parma an hour and Modena, 30 minutes (maybe even 20) - tickets were 3E to 8E each way. The information office in Bologna's train station gave me print outs of departures from each place - couldn't have been easier. One rec - do not stay at a hotel near the train station in Bologna. Get a hotel near the piazza Maggiore - it's about a 10 -15 minute walk from the piazza to the train station.

As far as Verona, I think that your impression depends largely on the season when you're going, and in summer, on your knowledge of German. Verona "itself", i.e. off-season and undisturbed by tourist crowds, is a great place, and if you despise it, you've obviously never seen San Zeno Maggiore with the Mantegna altarpiece, or you must be thoroughly indifferent to Romanesque architecture and Renaissance painting. Verona is also one of the rare places in Italy where excellent modern architecture is to be found: two of the main works of Carlo Scarpa, the Banca Popolare behind the Arena, and the interior of the Castelvecchio museum, both astonishing. The Piazza delle Erbe & Piazza dei Signori ensemble, finally, is one of the masterpieces of medieval and early Renaissance urbanism, so for anybody not totally indifferent to Italian art, this is a delightful place.
BUT: it IS true that Verona in the summer season can be hard to stand, not because of "businessmen" but because of tourist hordes attending the Opera Festival at the Arena - Verona is a German/Austrian town in these weeks, and you'll hardly hear anybody speaking Italian. This is all the more depressing if you happen to understand German... not the most pleasant kind of tourists, there.
And I fully agree with ek, the food is gorgeous in Verona. Special recommendation: the joy of visiting S. Zeno Maggiore can even be increased if you take a gelato or, even better, a granita at the small gelateria just across the street...

Uh, sorry, I've been to all those places, and Verona STILL leaves me utterly cold-a short day trip will do just fine, or skip it alltogether-a trade fair area, more than an art city, acknowledged as such by many who live in the Veneto.

I would far recommend Trieste and its surrounds, with its gorgeous seaside location, so like southern California in many ways, its lovely little resorts and villages accessible by a short boat ride, the beautiful Hapsburg-built Villa Miramare, with its astounding views of the sea, the Duino castle, and the magnificent Aquileia, nearby, an ancient Roman site filled with wondrous frescoes, which the Italian culture minister, Francesco Rutelli, just today proclaimed second to Pompeii in terms of historical signficance in Italy.

Not to mention the beautiful 13th century frescos to be found in the church of San Nicolo, by Tommaso di Modena, in the elegant town of Treviso, just outside Venice, its Duomo, and 12th century Piazza Rinaldi, and the elegant Palladian villas of Vicenza-all of these towns/cities merit a visit that to my mind give far more an "esthetic pay-off" not to mention are just plain more interesting, than that of Verona.

Carlo Scarpa is a god.

Carta_Pisana, that's what I feel.
I fully agree that Vicenza is missing from Marycang's list (and yes, I, too, prefer Vicenza over Verona, Palladio being another god, and three of his very best works being there). Trieste, however, seems far out of Marycang's way, and Miramare is just horrible kitsch: Hapsburg architecture of the worst 19th-century kind (cf. the City Hall or the New Hofburg of Vienna, or all those Fellner & Helmer theatres everywhere from Lwów to Graz). Aquileia is one of Italy's greatest sights, that's true, but as well out of Marycang's way, and btw: there are no frescoes in Aquileia - these are mosaics.

Oh my gosh! Thank you all for your advice and ideas. I hit a bump in the road and wasn't able to check back to this forum until today. What a nice treat to see all the help I received. Our current plan is to fly into Milan (FF miles already booked) and rent a car (my husband has to have a car, control??) Then we will drive to Parma, Modena, Bologna, Ferrara, Padova?, Verona, Bolzano via Piacenza. We have 11 days before we have to be in Regensburg to get on a river cruise. We will be taking the train from Bolzano to Munich for 1-2 days in Munich.
Now my question is does anyone have a suggestion for a B&B or Apt. rental in the Parma to Bologna area in a small town. that would be easy to jump on The A1 Rd? So much to see, to eat, so little time. Thank you everyone!

I'd also recommend Mantova (Mantua). We just happened on it in our drive from Venice to Parma and stayed for lunch (English Pub, across from the castle moat)and it looked charming. If we had only known more about it during our first trip to Italy, we would have planned to stay longer. As an advocate for "get off the autostrada, explore along the way", we drove the secondary roads - S10 from Venice to Mantova and then S420 down to Parma. Easy travel, with little traffic, passing some lovely finds along the way - like Mantova Montagnana, our first walled city! Wow!

Good morning from Italy

If you like listen the sound of the motors, don't forget to visit Maranello (Ferrari), Sant'Agata Bolognese (Lamborghini) Modena (Maserati) Bologna (Ducati)

Buon Viaggio!!!
Gianni