Venice: police stopped tourist for unbuttoned shirt - scam?
 

Is this a scam? A friend’s son was in Piazza San Marco with his shirt unbuttoned, and was stopped by the Polizia Municipale and given a “ticket”. It was mailed to his house in California. they list his address and passport number, and the fine is 210 Euros.

I will attempt to write out what the citation says (if the auto-correct will let me - I’m going to capitalize the words to make it simpler):
“La Persona A Lato Generalizzata Circolata A Torso. Nudo Senza allieta in Piazza san Marco. Soto Le Porticata Della Procuratie Vecchie in Prossimità Dei Civicaza (?) del Sestiere De S. Marco (Caffe Quatri).

What’s up? Does he ignore it, never visit Italy again, pay it - what does this mean. I’d scan it but it’s all on pink paper and hard to read. It’s got an official stamp on it. Dated 25/8/17 - so it’s been a while.

Thanks!

I says he was walking around piazza San Marco with a nude torso. He did the crime, needs to pay the fine. Maybe he can think of it as an expensive course in cultural studies.

Venezia, tolleranza zero e multe salate per chi non rispetta le regole - Tiscali Notizie

There you go.

From Traveler_Nick's link: >>For example, € 200 will be sanctioned by those who walk around the city bare-chested (my emphasis), with 400 euros writers who smear the monuments, with 450 euros who swim in the canals and rii, with 400 euros street artists who sing or play without authorization, with 400 euros beggars that hinder the public street and, again, with 400 euros, who abandons waste around the city, both water and mainland.<<

So no -- not a scam at all.

I'd say that an unbuttoned shirt is still not exactly the same as a nude torso or walking around topless.
If he plans to visit Italy in the near future, I'd be leaning towards paying the fine.
You may also want to scan that "ticket" for any remarks that the fine will double if not paid within x days.
If it had been a traffic-related fine, the statute of limitations was five years. Not sure if it's also the case here.
You could ask the Italian embassy. Always better to get legal advice from legal experts.

Depends on how he was wearing it.

good advice to check with the Italian embassy, also possible that you did not get the full story on this. Cultural education for friend's son. Sue

>>I'd say that an unbuttoned shirt is still not exactly the same as a nude torso or walking around topless.<<

The OP is third hand. Son told parent his version; Friend told OP; OP told us. My guess is he took his shirt off, or had it wide open with his chest/stomach exposed . . . not merely 'unbuttoned'.

nick, I don’t read Italian. What does it say? I’m guessing something like, Venice will no longer tolerate those who do not respect their laws?

Thanks everyone one for your comments. The guy said he did have his shirt unbuttoned, and that it was hot ( see from the date, late August).

Never mind, I see the translation in Janis’ post. Thanks! Will pass it on.

Question: Would this mean that if he were to return to another Italian city - or Europe - that this would be on the record? Just curious, if you know. Thx.

I hope that there are signs posted around saying unbottomed shirts are a crime or else who would have thunk it was? I think a warning would have been appropriate for a foreing tourist. Sounds more like Vienna than Venice!

In general, with locals becoming fed up with mass tourism and the crudeness of visitors, more rules like the above will be put into effect. People are confusing venerable, stately cities with resorts. Venice is hot in August, yes, but it isn't the beach. Impossible to believe that one would need a warning to button up a shirt in Venice, or Paris, or London, or Rome or Barcelona. Even in Cannes signs warning about proper dress are everywhere.

Could the word "allieta" be perhaps "maglietta"? If so, it means he didn't have an undershirt, or, in other words, his chest was fully exposed. I suppose that in the name of gender equality, they fine both sexes for this.

I've seen plenty of tourist advice about not wearing shorts or athletic shoes in Italian cities. In fact, these are widely accepted and worn even by many Italians. However, walking around a large city bare-chested is really not considered acceptable.

Yes - it is “Maglietta” - you’re right.

He pays it. He broke the law and was fined. What sort of message does it give to a young person if you say oh forget it, it was a foreign country, you may never go back there again so it doesn't matter. It is no different to being fined for driving too fast or in a limited zone.
If he doesn't pay it they could use a local debt collection agency to collect it and that will cost him a whole lot more.

You’re right, hetismij! I wonder - is there anyone on the board who lives/ has been in Venice recently, and is this sign-posted? I agree that it’s up to the visitor to understand and respect local laws. It would be the same case if someone from an area where nude sunbathing is common and legal, to do so here and be arrested for indecent exposure.

Just asking! not defending. Thx.

Not very good news, Iwan2go. Here are 2 photos from Bologna (I know, not Venice) for your interest:

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...8f01358014.jpg

Students getting their degrees draw a picture and write their bios. They then recite.


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fod...e936e5cb03.jpg

If the person makes a mistake, a dousing of flour, wine, etc. ensues. Then a song that starts "Dottore, dottore..." As you can see, this young man couldn't remember what he wrote. To your problem, however, he was guilty of more than not buttoning his shirt!

We saw similar undress in Venice but didn't take photos. It hardly seems far to pick on a tourist. On the other hand, it is always smart to respect the rules of the places you visit. You have my permission to use these photos.

I guess this reveals my age, but never, ever was going bare torsoed outside of resort areas, particularly in major cities. in any way acceptable. No rules had to be shown. It was Just Not Done, period. Now we seem to have a group of tourists who have no sense as to what is Just Not Done. These same tourists are really riling the locals because the flaunting of these age old conventions is just plain disrespectful, period. Good taste and respect don't have to be codified, period

Instead of picking on young guys they should go after the shirtless who really deserve the tickets - older men. C'mon guys - I'm trying to enjoy the view.