VAT Questions
 

Can you help me figure out a couple of things? I'm looking at prices for attractions and restaurants and I think it is saying on many instances that the prices are inclusive of VAT. Is it common for prices, particularly at restaurants, to be inclusive of VAT? Or is it 50/50? So when I look at a menu, is the price pretty much straight up (plus service), or should I expect to have to look closely to determine if VAT is included or not. Same for ticket prices. If it's 12 pounds to ride the Eye, do they add 17.5% to that? Or are things like that mostly VAT-inclusive?

And when something like Zagat says "cost of a meal, one drink and service", does service = tip or does that = tip AND VAT? I guess, what do they mean over there when they say "service"? Strictly tip or tip + VAT?

AND, it appears tipping is more in the 10-15% range and not 15-20%. Am I safe with 12%?

And finally, are these prix fixe menus generally inclusive of VAT? Some say so specifically, but others don't.

In several years of European travel, months at a time, I can't recall a single thing that added the VAT. It is always included in Europe, unlike the US and Canada.

It is an offence for a trader in the UK to advertise to the general public a price that does not include VAT. My understanding is that the same rule applies throughout the EU. But it certainly applies to EVERYTHING here. And there's no ifs and buts about it -which is why we get so annoyed at US traders' deceitful habit of adding tax to the declared price.

How British hoteliers get away with quoting foreign visitors rates that exclude VAT is beyond me. But this is virtually the only exception.

It does frequently happen that deals quoted by restaurants do not include service.

Tip if you want to: we rarely do. Service is almost always added to the bill. But it is depressingly common for restaurateurs, having charged service on the bill, to leave the "tip" line blank on thhe credit card slip. It even happens that waiters will lie when asked. You shouuld always check before asking for the bill.

If this happens, and you feel like livening up an evening, refuse to pay the service charge

Regarding that "lie" about service in restaurants, I'll say the same thing I often say about Paris. If you ask if "service" is included, they'll usually say yes because it is. But if you ask if "a tip is included", they'll usually say no because it isn't. There is a difference between service and a tip -- think about it -- and you'll realize that most of those waiters aren't telling a lie at all!!

I assume this question is about England, since you refer to the London Eye, so, yes, VAT is always included except for places where they do not charge you VAT at all(i.e. items for children,like clothing, I believe is something that is not taxed).

Service is almost always included, but it's good practice to leave something extra especially where the service is very good.

I greatly appreciate all responses and I apologize for not indicating that I was referring to the UK and London. I selected UK to post under and then forgot to reference that in my question header.

So I guess the general rule is that VAT is included unless it's a hotel and they specifically say that tax is not included.

The only legitimate time you can advertise prices without VAT included is if your are genuinely pitching your sales at a business where they will be likely to reclaim the VAT and not the general person in the street consumer - hence you will occaisionally see advertisements for stuff like business-orientated computers with the prices ex VAT.

It's not deceitful that taxes aren't included in prices in the USA. It's just the way we do it--I like it that people are made aware of what the taxes are costing them in addition to the price of whatever they are buyin.

Of course it's deceitful.

If a sign says 10 cents and the thing costs 12 cents the sign's deceitful. Americans may connive at that deceit - or even - for there's no accounting for tastes - like it.

But it doesn't stop it from being deceitful. All you're saying is that you've grown desensitised to lies.

I agree with rufus. It's not deceitful, it's just the way things are done in the US. The world is different and one must be open-minded to differences in countries. You just need to remember when traveling: tax is included in prices in Europe and not included in prices in the US. Very simple!

Once in a restaurant in Italy, I was told straight out by the waiter that servizio was not included in the total (he only presented us with a credit slip with a blank tip space). When I then asked for an itemized bill, both servizio and coperto had been included in the total! I don't like to be lied to...THIS is an instance of deceitfulness.

Also is it me or are Rome and Venice the only cities in Italy where restaurants charge both a coperto and servizio??

Hi amy,

Actually, coperto is no longer permitted, but in many places they bring you some bread and charge you for it, whether you eat it or not.

Regarding Service charge and tips:

The Service Charge is the owner's way to pay the help. A tip is an additional payment to the staff for above average service.

In the UK and, I think in the EU, if you add a tip to the charge slip the money belongs to the owner. If you leave something on the table, it belongs to the server.

Ira, I don't understand what you mean by "coperto is no longer permitted." I pay coperto all time here at all restaurants (sit-down types). Ranges from 1.50 euro to 3.00 euro per person usually. Is this one of those new Italian laws where it is written but never followed? ;) Like the new smoking "laws" that came into effect last year in Italy?

I never tip in Italy. It is not expected in restaurants here, except for restaurants in high tourist areas like florence, rome, venice, etc. And then it is only expected from foreigners, not Italians.

I have only encountered servizio added on extra to the bill in restaurants in Venice and Rome. Anyway, I am accustomed to paying a coperto, but not a coperto AND servizio.

And at that restaurant I referred to earlier where the waiter lied to me, there was no confusion because I specifically asked him if "servizio" was included already and he told me no.

FINZ, I apologize for posting things that are not helping you with your question about London.

flanneruk--Of course it isn't deceitful--I think it's deceitful of the government to hide the cost of taxes in the price.

The item costs what it costs--that is the price the merchant is charging. What the government adds on is extra.

Hi amy,

My info re coperto comes from a news article and posts here; none of which I can cite.

I do think that it is a law that is not enforced.

Your experience was out and out fraud.

flanneruk--It appears that it's the Europeans who have become desensitized to the lie that the VAT is an unavoidable cost of manufacturing and distribution just like the cost of labor and materials.

Fraud....or trying to take advantage of foreigners in Florence, Rome, Venice, etc.

And my boyfriend here wonders why I always want him to do the talking when we go into restaurants and shops in the tourist areas of the big cities here. After one word of Italian comes out of my mouth, they immediately know that I am American. My bf just likes to here me speak Italian, says it's cute when I speak Italian (in reality, it's terrible to hear me speak Italian!) :)

The only people who have any genuine interest in seeing that VAT and other taxes are included in the price on display in the UK is the Government.

Because, if the VAT and other taxes were seperated out a) we would be horified what we pay on a day by day basis for household necessities b) there would be a riot when we realised how much the government is taking off us when we buy a litre of fuel, a pack of cigarettes, or a pint of beer! Hide it away in the bill and, yes, people know they are paying the exchequer, but they're not sure how much.

The only people who are desensitised is we british who happily pay the bill without wondering where the money is going.