Trip Report - Athens, Naxos, Santorini & Rhodes Sept 2008
Nov 1st, 2008, 06:29 PM
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Trip Report - Athens, Naxos, Santorini & Rhodes Sept 2008
Kalimara Everyone!
This won't be a day by day trip report as many others have posted - some of you must be travel writers, as you do such a good job!
What it will be is a series of personal observations and hopefully will be helpful to someone else planning their Greek holiday.
Many people on this Forum were helpful to me in planning my trip, in particular, thanks to Jan, Brotherleelove, Stanbr, and others that I'm probably forgetting. Thank you everyone.
About us: My husband I and typically take one 3 week trip each year which I've cleverly named
"Big Trip ____ (fill in year).
We've fallen into a pattern of doing Europe one year and Australia or New Zealand (hence, the screen name). We like history, nature, walking, ruins, and are "foodies" and "winos".
We're from the San Francisco Bay Area, and both self employed. I have a travel agency, and while I specialize in Italy, France, Spain and Australia and New Zealand, this was my first time to Greece.
We left San Francisco on September 12, on United, using Business Class miles, then connecting into London Heathrow and then onto Athens via British Air.
We were meeting my friend Pamela coming from Stanstead Airport in the UK and she was joining us for part of the trip.
Upon arrival in Athens we got a cab to the Hotel Attlos, which is a basic, moderate hotel with a good location. The taxi to the hotel was $41E for 3 of us, including the $1E charge per bag (we're light packers - 3 bags only between the three of us).
It was late by the time we got to the hotel, so we threw the bags in the room and proceed onto our first Greek dinner. There are alot of restaurants in the area between Mitropoleos St. My husband, Sam had Gyros (pork*) on top of pita bread (no way to wrap them up); I had a salad and the best tadziki I've ever had, which everyone shared, Pamela had a salad and we split a liter of wine - $30E total.
* the pork thing -- here, gyros is something different...it's gotton Americanized or something - a Greek we spoke to said it's always pork, but somehow in the US it seems to be mostly lamb or a combo of beef and lamb
The next day we had the hotel buffet breakfast - nothing to write home about; and then headed up the hill to the Acropolis. It was a slog up the hill and getting hot very fast although it was still early -- we spied the "Happy Train" and decided that was a good bet - $6E each. This may be the best money I've ever spent, as the temperature got up to 100 degrees.
Once there, we hired a guide, Maria, at one of the kiosks near the ticket stand - $100E for the 3 of us and again, money well spent.
We got a different tour bus on the way down who let us off near "restaurant row", lunch and then onto the Bernaki Museum. This has to be an "undiscovered treasure" because no one knows how to find it including the military who are almost directly across from it! By the time we got there we were tired, hot and cranky and they were closing in 30 minutes! They took pity on us and charged us half price and we toured the Museum backwards, in order of the rooms that were closing, instead of starting at the bottom floor, which houses the oldest pieces.
Up early the next day, the hotel called a taxi for us which arrived in about 5 minutes and we headed down to the pier for our ferry to Naxos.
IMPORTANT: I had an internet confirmation for the ferry and we were about the first 50 people in line, but when we got to the check in point, we were told we needed an actual ticket. I left Sam and Pamela there with the bags while I power walked back to the ticket counter. That cost us some time. I know, you may be thinking "why do you care, you're on vacation?"
Which brings me to a major consideration and one that I would feel obligated to mention to clients in the future. SMOKING.
I've been monitoring this board off & on for almost a year, and no one's really mentioned Greeks & smoking. Or at least I've never seen a thread about it.
Because of that delay, we missed getting into the tiny non-smoking area inside the ferry (the one directly across from the smoking area).
At this point I should 'fess up and say that I'm a part time smoker.
Yes, I like to have a cigarette with a cocktail or glass of wine.
So, when I'm in Europe, I get to be naughty and indulge. I may smoke 1/2 pack of ciggies a day while on vacation..maybe...that's about my level. So you might think I'd "embrace" the Greeks and their smoking, but frankly, it was shocking.
Keep in mind, I'm also from California where you rarely see anyone smoking, and even outside resturants and bars,there's a rule that no smoking is allowed with 20'.
I've been to Italy, France, the UK, Spain, but this was the worst. In those countries, a high majority of the men smoke, but it's rare to see women smoking - in Greece, it's everyone!
Women from 16 - 60 are chain smoking. The shocking part I referred to is seeing mothers holding a baby, puffing away, with the kid's head engulfed in a cloud of smoke.
I'm jumping ahead here, but when we took a day trip to Symi, there was a kind of throw away, day paper in English (lots of Brit expats have homes there) and there was an article how the mayor was trying to get the locals to stop throwing their cigarette butts onto the streets because when the rains come, it washes them, and the chemicals in the filters into their harbor, affecting the fishing industry.
It went on further and stated that no other country in the WORLD smokes more than the Greeks! Did you know that? I didn't!
Back to the ferry....we got seating outside and you'd think that would be fine - you're moving, air is blowing - but Pamela was having a hard time. Everyone around her was smoking and it was all blowing around her (and me) and there was just no escape from it - it was everywhere.
The trip on the ferry was long and fairly boring. We arrived at Naxos and the owner of our hotel, Antony Studios - $45E/night, picked us up. Our rooms (studio) were wonderful and we had a nice balcony as well. Clean, great price - I love this place.
The first night for dinner we went to "Mezze" - I don't recommend it. The food was "just ok" and Pamela, who's a vegetarian, had some major problems with the waiter...who turned out to be the owner as well.
Another Fodor's poster (also vegetarian) had mentioned having problems here.
He was clearly frustruated with Pamela (and vice versa), giving us the "eye roll", etc and honestly, her requests were very basic.
The first waiter who came over to the table felt very bad (this is how we came to find out the guy who waited on us was the owner), so his hands were tied. Pamela ended up having nothing; I had a cuke and tomato salad and tadziki and Sam had a Seafood Risotto, which he said was very good, but the whole experience was not pleasant.
I'm not really a breakfast person, but Sam is, so he went out the next morning and had a waffle at Paritoli - $8.50E. Good waffle - bad service.
For lunch, we ate at a little hole in the wall, I think the name was "Eoita" on Old Post Street - fabulous gyros - at only $1.90E - Sam had a beer and I'd just finished a Diet Coke so I didn't need anythihng - total $5.80.
Took naps. For dinner we went to To Kastro - highly recommended on this board - I had Pork Soulvaki, Sam had Veal with Roquerfort, and Pamela had a vegetable casserole (which was actually an appetizer). Two 1/2 liters of wine - $51.80E. Since we didn't want ouzo, the waiter brought us another liter of wine.
The next morning our internal clock was still messed up and we went out early - Naxos (and Greece) doesn't really DO early mornings! At 7AM everything's closed.
By 9AM and he found a restaurant near the fountain, "Soulatso" - he
had a cheese, ham, bacon, mushroom crepe with a cappacino = $7.50E, with very good service.
For lunch we went to Cafe Lotto; since I just had a salad for dinner the night before, I was pretty hungry and ordered a combo plate of
chicken soulvaki, fries, tadzaki and pita; the tadzaki and pita were great, but the chicken (as was my pork the other night) was overdone - 2 for 2 - no more soulvakai for me. Sam had a large Heiken & helped me with my food - $19.20E
($6.50 of which was Pamela's for a coffee drink and water).
Dinner @ Susanna Italian Rstaurant. Sam had a combination pizza, Pamela and I both had cheese pizzas, two half liters of wine and a soda - $32.20. Great food
and service; and apparantly word's out, because they were very crowded.
The next day Sam tried the place down by the waterfront again - Cafe PERTEOLI; since the service was so bad, he decided to go inside, figuring that might help. The
waitress came up in front of him not saying anything, so he said "breakfast" and she tossed him a menu and walked away. He waited and waited; he saw her filling water glasses and putting them on a tray. Finally, he gave up and left.
He went back to the place by the fountain, had a waffle, fresh fruit, Greek yogurt, coffee - $5. Sam's first experience with Greek yogurt, and he really likes it!
Pamela's off wandering around town and we decided to take the bus to Chalki - that's the spelling on the bus schedule. If you're looking at the MAP, it's spelled Halkio, and the bus driver pronounced it as HALL KEY. Someone told us the
center of town was "up that way" and so we slogged up the hill, past the school and ran outta town! So, we went back. We didn't go visit the Byzantine church (which may be the only thing IN town), but the guidebook mentioned "Venetian
architecture - can't prove it by us - didn't find anything like that.
We needed a snack and had lots of time before the bus came, so we stopped in a small restaurant. Sam ordred a spinach pie and I had a tomato and cucumber salad with tadzaki - both were very good - $15E with Sam's beer. Got the bus
back, but wouldn't recommend this as an excursion.
That night we went to a restaurant that's just below To Kastro - the name ends in three w's. We had a
bad meal with very bad service. We kept trying to get attention from SOMEONE/ANYONE to get our check. Now I've travelled enough in Europe to know they are not as interested in turning over tables as they are in the US, and I adjust accordingly.
BUT, after 40 minutes we gave up - and walked out, and no one noticed!
The next day I went to Sam's restaurant by the fountain. Sam had his waffle w/yogurt, honey and fresh fruit. I had eggs, bacon and fresh orange juice - the juice was excellent!! Mine was $6.50E. Very good place!
Went down, caught the ferry, which was 40 min late. Arrived in Santorini. It's a mass of transportion at the pier - taxis, motorcoaches, etc - all going to FIRA! A driver finally explained
that you wouild need to take a bus to Fira and then change to another bus to Oia. By the time all this was sorted out most of the transport was gone. We met 2 sisters who did not want to take a bus, and we decided to share a cab (5 people in one cab - one sister volunteered to sit on the other one's lap).
ok, I'm tired..next installment tomorrow
Melodie
This won't be a day by day trip report as many others have posted - some of you must be travel writers, as you do such a good job!
What it will be is a series of personal observations and hopefully will be helpful to someone else planning their Greek holiday.
Many people on this Forum were helpful to me in planning my trip, in particular, thanks to Jan, Brotherleelove, Stanbr, and others that I'm probably forgetting. Thank you everyone.
About us: My husband I and typically take one 3 week trip each year which I've cleverly named
"Big Trip ____ (fill in year).
We've fallen into a pattern of doing Europe one year and Australia or New Zealand (hence, the screen name). We like history, nature, walking, ruins, and are "foodies" and "winos".
We're from the San Francisco Bay Area, and both self employed. I have a travel agency, and while I specialize in Italy, France, Spain and Australia and New Zealand, this was my first time to Greece.
We left San Francisco on September 12, on United, using Business Class miles, then connecting into London Heathrow and then onto Athens via British Air.
We were meeting my friend Pamela coming from Stanstead Airport in the UK and she was joining us for part of the trip.
Upon arrival in Athens we got a cab to the Hotel Attlos, which is a basic, moderate hotel with a good location. The taxi to the hotel was $41E for 3 of us, including the $1E charge per bag (we're light packers - 3 bags only between the three of us).
It was late by the time we got to the hotel, so we threw the bags in the room and proceed onto our first Greek dinner. There are alot of restaurants in the area between Mitropoleos St. My husband, Sam had Gyros (pork*) on top of pita bread (no way to wrap them up); I had a salad and the best tadziki I've ever had, which everyone shared, Pamela had a salad and we split a liter of wine - $30E total.
* the pork thing -- here, gyros is something different...it's gotton Americanized or something - a Greek we spoke to said it's always pork, but somehow in the US it seems to be mostly lamb or a combo of beef and lamb
The next day we had the hotel buffet breakfast - nothing to write home about; and then headed up the hill to the Acropolis. It was a slog up the hill and getting hot very fast although it was still early -- we spied the "Happy Train" and decided that was a good bet - $6E each. This may be the best money I've ever spent, as the temperature got up to 100 degrees.
Once there, we hired a guide, Maria, at one of the kiosks near the ticket stand - $100E for the 3 of us and again, money well spent.
We got a different tour bus on the way down who let us off near "restaurant row", lunch and then onto the Bernaki Museum. This has to be an "undiscovered treasure" because no one knows how to find it including the military who are almost directly across from it! By the time we got there we were tired, hot and cranky and they were closing in 30 minutes! They took pity on us and charged us half price and we toured the Museum backwards, in order of the rooms that were closing, instead of starting at the bottom floor, which houses the oldest pieces.
Up early the next day, the hotel called a taxi for us which arrived in about 5 minutes and we headed down to the pier for our ferry to Naxos.
IMPORTANT: I had an internet confirmation for the ferry and we were about the first 50 people in line, but when we got to the check in point, we were told we needed an actual ticket. I left Sam and Pamela there with the bags while I power walked back to the ticket counter. That cost us some time. I know, you may be thinking "why do you care, you're on vacation?"
Which brings me to a major consideration and one that I would feel obligated to mention to clients in the future. SMOKING.
I've been monitoring this board off & on for almost a year, and no one's really mentioned Greeks & smoking. Or at least I've never seen a thread about it.
Because of that delay, we missed getting into the tiny non-smoking area inside the ferry (the one directly across from the smoking area).
At this point I should 'fess up and say that I'm a part time smoker.
Yes, I like to have a cigarette with a cocktail or glass of wine.
So, when I'm in Europe, I get to be naughty and indulge. I may smoke 1/2 pack of ciggies a day while on vacation..maybe...that's about my level. So you might think I'd "embrace" the Greeks and their smoking, but frankly, it was shocking.
Keep in mind, I'm also from California where you rarely see anyone smoking, and even outside resturants and bars,there's a rule that no smoking is allowed with 20'.
I've been to Italy, France, the UK, Spain, but this was the worst. In those countries, a high majority of the men smoke, but it's rare to see women smoking - in Greece, it's everyone!
Women from 16 - 60 are chain smoking. The shocking part I referred to is seeing mothers holding a baby, puffing away, with the kid's head engulfed in a cloud of smoke.
I'm jumping ahead here, but when we took a day trip to Symi, there was a kind of throw away, day paper in English (lots of Brit expats have homes there) and there was an article how the mayor was trying to get the locals to stop throwing their cigarette butts onto the streets because when the rains come, it washes them, and the chemicals in the filters into their harbor, affecting the fishing industry.
It went on further and stated that no other country in the WORLD smokes more than the Greeks! Did you know that? I didn't!
Back to the ferry....we got seating outside and you'd think that would be fine - you're moving, air is blowing - but Pamela was having a hard time. Everyone around her was smoking and it was all blowing around her (and me) and there was just no escape from it - it was everywhere.
The trip on the ferry was long and fairly boring. We arrived at Naxos and the owner of our hotel, Antony Studios - $45E/night, picked us up. Our rooms (studio) were wonderful and we had a nice balcony as well. Clean, great price - I love this place.
The first night for dinner we went to "Mezze" - I don't recommend it. The food was "just ok" and Pamela, who's a vegetarian, had some major problems with the waiter...who turned out to be the owner as well.
Another Fodor's poster (also vegetarian) had mentioned having problems here.
He was clearly frustruated with Pamela (and vice versa), giving us the "eye roll", etc and honestly, her requests were very basic.
The first waiter who came over to the table felt very bad (this is how we came to find out the guy who waited on us was the owner), so his hands were tied. Pamela ended up having nothing; I had a cuke and tomato salad and tadziki and Sam had a Seafood Risotto, which he said was very good, but the whole experience was not pleasant.
I'm not really a breakfast person, but Sam is, so he went out the next morning and had a waffle at Paritoli - $8.50E. Good waffle - bad service.
For lunch, we ate at a little hole in the wall, I think the name was "Eoita" on Old Post Street - fabulous gyros - at only $1.90E - Sam had a beer and I'd just finished a Diet Coke so I didn't need anythihng - total $5.80.
Took naps. For dinner we went to To Kastro - highly recommended on this board - I had Pork Soulvaki, Sam had Veal with Roquerfort, and Pamela had a vegetable casserole (which was actually an appetizer). Two 1/2 liters of wine - $51.80E. Since we didn't want ouzo, the waiter brought us another liter of wine.
The next morning our internal clock was still messed up and we went out early - Naxos (and Greece) doesn't really DO early mornings! At 7AM everything's closed.
By 9AM and he found a restaurant near the fountain, "Soulatso" - he
had a cheese, ham, bacon, mushroom crepe with a cappacino = $7.50E, with very good service.
For lunch we went to Cafe Lotto; since I just had a salad for dinner the night before, I was pretty hungry and ordered a combo plate of
chicken soulvaki, fries, tadzaki and pita; the tadzaki and pita were great, but the chicken (as was my pork the other night) was overdone - 2 for 2 - no more soulvakai for me. Sam had a large Heiken & helped me with my food - $19.20E
($6.50 of which was Pamela's for a coffee drink and water).
Dinner @ Susanna Italian Rstaurant. Sam had a combination pizza, Pamela and I both had cheese pizzas, two half liters of wine and a soda - $32.20. Great food
and service; and apparantly word's out, because they were very crowded.
The next day Sam tried the place down by the waterfront again - Cafe PERTEOLI; since the service was so bad, he decided to go inside, figuring that might help. The
waitress came up in front of him not saying anything, so he said "breakfast" and she tossed him a menu and walked away. He waited and waited; he saw her filling water glasses and putting them on a tray. Finally, he gave up and left.
He went back to the place by the fountain, had a waffle, fresh fruit, Greek yogurt, coffee - $5. Sam's first experience with Greek yogurt, and he really likes it!
Pamela's off wandering around town and we decided to take the bus to Chalki - that's the spelling on the bus schedule. If you're looking at the MAP, it's spelled Halkio, and the bus driver pronounced it as HALL KEY. Someone told us the
center of town was "up that way" and so we slogged up the hill, past the school and ran outta town! So, we went back. We didn't go visit the Byzantine church (which may be the only thing IN town), but the guidebook mentioned "Venetian
architecture - can't prove it by us - didn't find anything like that.
We needed a snack and had lots of time before the bus came, so we stopped in a small restaurant. Sam ordred a spinach pie and I had a tomato and cucumber salad with tadzaki - both were very good - $15E with Sam's beer. Got the bus
back, but wouldn't recommend this as an excursion.
That night we went to a restaurant that's just below To Kastro - the name ends in three w's. We had a
bad meal with very bad service. We kept trying to get attention from SOMEONE/ANYONE to get our check. Now I've travelled enough in Europe to know they are not as interested in turning over tables as they are in the US, and I adjust accordingly.
BUT, after 40 minutes we gave up - and walked out, and no one noticed!
The next day I went to Sam's restaurant by the fountain. Sam had his waffle w/yogurt, honey and fresh fruit. I had eggs, bacon and fresh orange juice - the juice was excellent!! Mine was $6.50E. Very good place!
Went down, caught the ferry, which was 40 min late. Arrived in Santorini. It's a mass of transportion at the pier - taxis, motorcoaches, etc - all going to FIRA! A driver finally explained
that you wouild need to take a bus to Fira and then change to another bus to Oia. By the time all this was sorted out most of the transport was gone. We met 2 sisters who did not want to take a bus, and we decided to share a cab (5 people in one cab - one sister volunteered to sit on the other one's lap).
ok, I'm tired..next installment tomorrow
Melodie
Nov 1st, 2008, 06:50 PM
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I know this. When we were in Roma it seemed like most of the women smoked. Chain smoking, makeup wearing, killer high heeled, scooter driving beautiful women and they smoked non-stop. JMHO.
That turns me off on going to Greece now. I hate smoke. Especially when I see someone smoking around children.
That turns me off on going to Greece now. I hate smoke. Especially when I see someone smoking around children.
Nov 2nd, 2008, 03:31 AM
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We were in Athens, Crete and Santorini this fall as well. We are also not used to smoke, but actually didn't notice it as much as we had expected. Yes, more people smoked than here in New England, but it just didn't seem to be bad. The entire ferry from Iraklion to Santorini seemed to be non-smoking. However, I was a bit shocked by people dropping cigarette butts in places that I would feel are kind of sacred: the Arkadi Monastery and Knossos on Crete, at the Acropolis, etc. It just seemed so rude!
Nov 2nd, 2008, 03:45 AM
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Mamaw: I know those Roman women too! Except you forgot the part about having the dyed red hair, in a color not known to nature! When we see someone with that color hair now my husband and I say "look a European hair fashion victim".
Sorry to have turned you off going to Greece, but it is a significant factor - I have a friend who couldn't wait to hear all about our trip as Greece was on her travel list. There's no WAY she could go -she's actually ALLERGIC to smoke, so she'd be miserable.
CindyJ I think that's the other side of the coin as well - the Greeks are not what you would call "considerate smokers". They're just so used to it being part of their every day life and something that's acceptable, they never consider that maybe someone else doesn't want their smoke blowing across their dinner table while they're eating!
We were eating outside at a Taverna one night, and that's exactly what was killing poor Pamela - yes, it was outside, but the tables are only 2' apart and each couple at every table around us was smoking.
Melodie
Sorry to have turned you off going to Greece, but it is a significant factor - I have a friend who couldn't wait to hear all about our trip as Greece was on her travel list. There's no WAY she could go -she's actually ALLERGIC to smoke, so she'd be miserable.
CindyJ I think that's the other side of the coin as well - the Greeks are not what you would call "considerate smokers". They're just so used to it being part of their every day life and something that's acceptable, they never consider that maybe someone else doesn't want their smoke blowing across their dinner table while they're eating!
We were eating outside at a Taverna one night, and that's exactly what was killing poor Pamela - yes, it was outside, but the tables are only 2' apart and each couple at every table around us was smoking.
Melodie
Nov 2nd, 2008, 07:53 AM
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Isabel: thank you!
Luvtravel: if that's a factor for you, I think that's wise until Greece catches up with other countries in that respect.
I forgot something (and it probably won't be the last, I'm sure I've overlooked some other important tidbit)!
LANGUAGE
We knew Greek was going to be beyond us for the most part (and it's already been posted lots of times about the different spelling of the written word), but I'd never go anywhere without attempting the basics -- I took a "Cheat Sheet" I made up (and how put phonetic pronounciations).
Yes NEH
No OH SHE
Good Morning KALI MARA
Good Evening KALI ISH PERA
Please PALA KALOW
Thank you ISH KA RISH TOE
We felt that the Greeks appreciated the fact that we'd taken the time to learn please and thank you, and when we said it, invariably there was a slight smile when they responded.
Nov 2nd, 2008, 08:55 AM
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Wlzmatilida-
Respectfully, your phonetic interpretations leave a lot to be desired. I am not fluent in Greek but I know enough to venture some more accurate suggestions:
Yes NEH (correct)
No OH SHE (there is no 'Sh' sound. A gutteral breathy H is the correct sound to make. OH-khee with an almost silent 'k' is correct.)
Good Morning KALI MARA (If you say this the chances are good that someone will think you are calling them a squid!
Kal-ee-MEH-ruh is correct.)
Good Evening KALI ISH PERA (There is no SH sound. Kal-ee-SPEH-ruh.)
Please PALA KALOW (There is no L sound. Par-ah-kah-LOW.)
Thank you ISH KA RISH TOE (There is no ISH or RISH sound. eff-hah-rees-TOE.)
Respectfully, your phonetic interpretations leave a lot to be desired. I am not fluent in Greek but I know enough to venture some more accurate suggestions:
Yes NEH (correct)
No OH SHE (there is no 'Sh' sound. A gutteral breathy H is the correct sound to make. OH-khee with an almost silent 'k' is correct.)
Good Morning KALI MARA (If you say this the chances are good that someone will think you are calling them a squid!
Kal-ee-MEH-ruh is correct.)Good Evening KALI ISH PERA (There is no SH sound. Kal-ee-SPEH-ruh.)
Please PALA KALOW (There is no L sound. Par-ah-kah-LOW.)
Thank you ISH KA RISH TOE (There is no ISH or RISH sound. eff-hah-rees-TOE.)
Nov 2nd, 2008, 04:22 PM
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Hey, regarding language ---
I simply MUST share the IDEAL on line source for easily pronounced basic words -- and It took me 6 years of seeking to find it!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/languages/greek/
At the top of the page, click the box "Talk Greek New Look -- a gentle introduction to basic Greek." And it's SO usable.
•10 "Screens" each with about ten words/phrases for various situations: printed and VOCALIZED. Don't skip any of the 10, because the KEY words are sprinkled around... like "Please" doesn't come until #3. THere is also a useful short paragraph about when this word/phrase is appropriate.
•BEST PART - each Page has a box "useful phrases". Click & there is a list of all that unit's words, in PHONETIC style, showing correct syllable to accent. Brilliant! Print out these 10 pp and THROW AWAY the stupid phrasebooks.
Try it! You'll love it.
I simply MUST share the IDEAL on line source for easily pronounced basic words -- and It took me 6 years of seeking to find it!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/languages/greek/
At the top of the page, click the box "Talk Greek New Look -- a gentle introduction to basic Greek." And it's SO usable.
•10 "Screens" each with about ten words/phrases for various situations: printed and VOCALIZED. Don't skip any of the 10, because the KEY words are sprinkled around... like "Please" doesn't come until #3. THere is also a useful short paragraph about when this word/phrase is appropriate.
•BEST PART - each Page has a box "useful phrases". Click & there is a list of all that unit's words, in PHONETIC style, showing correct syllable to accent. Brilliant! Print out these 10 pp and THROW AWAY the stupid phrasebooks.
Try it! You'll love it.
Nov 2nd, 2008, 04:55 PM
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Thank you for writing your report. It is helpful to hear of other peoples experiences.
Your comments on smoking are important so that visitors planning a trip will understand what they should expect.
However after 7 trips to Greece I can agree with you that practically everyone smokes. We always joke that a Greek's breakfast is a cup of coffee and a pack of cigarettes.
Having said that I can honestly say that the smoking has not been a bother at all, which is why I suspect most of the regular Greece posters have not mentioned it. We simply do not notice it.
My wife and I put our heads together an we can only recall two times where a smoker was a nuisance at a taverna. Most of them tend to blow the smoke up into the air so it has not bothered us.
The two times we recall there was a breeze and it blew the smoke over to our table. Annoying for sure but it was over in a few minutes and we were able to ignore it and embrace where we were and enjoy our dinner and the ambiance. Mind you neither of us have an allergy.
I am dissapointed that you had such poor service in Naxos. It is our favorite Island and we recommend it to any who are interested.
I can however admit to being pleased that that you had a good experience at Taverna to Kastro. I am sure it was I who recommended it to you.
I can honestly say that other than having to wait a long time for a bill (which is universal in Greece) the service has always been friendly.
I see you were there in September. We have always travelled in May and June. I have heard that the Greeks lose their wonderful sense of hospitality late in the tourist season. When we travel they have not had any cash flow for 6 months and they are ready to please. At the end of the season I have heard that some of them are simply fed up and are sick of being at work 24/7 for 6 months. Not an excuse for poor service but perhaps an explanation.
By the way the Venetian presence in Chalki is the tower house right on the main street. It is not open to the public so it is just a walk by experience. Chalki has one of the Kitron Distillaries and is worth a visit for the free samples and a tour and then a stroll through the town.
It can be done in a half hour as a quick stop on a drive through the countryside. As a destination probably a disappointment.
Your comments on smoking are important so that visitors planning a trip will understand what they should expect.
However after 7 trips to Greece I can agree with you that practically everyone smokes. We always joke that a Greek's breakfast is a cup of coffee and a pack of cigarettes.
Having said that I can honestly say that the smoking has not been a bother at all, which is why I suspect most of the regular Greece posters have not mentioned it. We simply do not notice it.
My wife and I put our heads together an we can only recall two times where a smoker was a nuisance at a taverna. Most of them tend to blow the smoke up into the air so it has not bothered us.
The two times we recall there was a breeze and it blew the smoke over to our table. Annoying for sure but it was over in a few minutes and we were able to ignore it and embrace where we were and enjoy our dinner and the ambiance. Mind you neither of us have an allergy.
I am dissapointed that you had such poor service in Naxos. It is our favorite Island and we recommend it to any who are interested.
I can however admit to being pleased that that you had a good experience at Taverna to Kastro. I am sure it was I who recommended it to you.
I can honestly say that other than having to wait a long time for a bill (which is universal in Greece) the service has always been friendly.
I see you were there in September. We have always travelled in May and June. I have heard that the Greeks lose their wonderful sense of hospitality late in the tourist season. When we travel they have not had any cash flow for 6 months and they are ready to please. At the end of the season I have heard that some of them are simply fed up and are sick of being at work 24/7 for 6 months. Not an excuse for poor service but perhaps an explanation.
By the way the Venetian presence in Chalki is the tower house right on the main street. It is not open to the public so it is just a walk by experience. Chalki has one of the Kitron Distillaries and is worth a visit for the free samples and a tour and then a stroll through the town.
It can be done in a half hour as a quick stop on a drive through the countryside. As a destination probably a disappointment.
Nov 3rd, 2008, 06:23 AM
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Hi Stanbr,
re: smoking in Greece - I did feel it was important and I was surprised that I'd never seen it mentioned before on this Board.
I think it may also depend on where you come from as well. In California, we've had a non-smoking ban (inside and outside) for so long now -- last year I went back to my hometown in Pennslyvania to my favorite bar/steamed clams joint, and was surprised that you could still smoke in a bar!
I think you're right about "a Greek's breakfast" -- as evidenced by the paper I saw in Symi where they said that "no where in the world do people smoke more than the Greeks".
You and your wife have been lucky in your smoking/tavera experience - we saw none of that the entire trip.
re: your timing of the trip & their attitude -- I think you've hit the nail right on the head -- please read the second half of the report, posted with "con't" at the end.
Poor service (in spots) or not, Naxos would be my favorite island of the trip as well, and yes, you were a pivitol part of my decision to travel there, and I'm glad we did.
Best,
Melodie
re: smoking in Greece - I did feel it was important and I was surprised that I'd never seen it mentioned before on this Board.
I think it may also depend on where you come from as well. In California, we've had a non-smoking ban (inside and outside) for so long now -- last year I went back to my hometown in Pennslyvania to my favorite bar/steamed clams joint, and was surprised that you could still smoke in a bar!
I think you're right about "a Greek's breakfast" -- as evidenced by the paper I saw in Symi where they said that "no where in the world do people smoke more than the Greeks".
You and your wife have been lucky in your smoking/tavera experience - we saw none of that the entire trip.
re: your timing of the trip & their attitude -- I think you've hit the nail right on the head -- please read the second half of the report, posted with "con't" at the end.
Poor service (in spots) or not, Naxos would be my favorite island of the trip as well, and yes, you were a pivitol part of my decision to travel there, and I'm glad we did.
Best,
Melodie
Nov 3rd, 2008, 09:33 AM
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Enjoying the trip report so far. I'm a little confused at all your $ symbols, though -- do you mean dollars or Euros? (I'm assuming you mean euros, but the dollar sign means dollars.)
We also went to Susanna's in Naxos town and it was pretty crowded when we were there also. It was a nice change to eat pizza as a break from the regular Greek food (not that we were getting tired of it, but still - there is only so much tzadziki one can eat!).
I think the phrase you were using for "thank you" must be different from the one in my phrasebook, because your phonetic spelling is not even remotely similar to "efharisto," the phrase we were using.
One of my guidebooks said the pronunciation was similar to the man's name "F. Harry Stowe" and that seemed reasonably close to me. There is no "sh" sound at all. (Which BLL covered above.)
We also went to Susanna's in Naxos town and it was pretty crowded when we were there also. It was a nice change to eat pizza as a break from the regular Greek food (not that we were getting tired of it, but still - there is only so much tzadziki one can eat!).
I think the phrase you were using for "thank you" must be different from the one in my phrasebook, because your phonetic spelling is not even remotely similar to "efharisto," the phrase we were using.
One of my guidebooks said the pronunciation was similar to the man's name "F. Harry Stowe" and that seemed reasonably close to me. There is no "sh" sound at all. (Which BLL covered above.)
Nov 3rd, 2008, 09:56 AM
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I have been to Greece many times, usually eat outdoors since I go in May or September, and I have to agree with Stanbr that the smoking has never bothered me -- and I am an ex-smoker who broke the habit aftr 25+ years! Wiz, how did you manage in the years before smoking bans became so common? And do you have quite a number of other allergies? I find that this is often the case when people speak of supersensitivity to smoke.
As for the 'September/October attitude' I think one must think about the contrasting experience when doing Christmas shopping in a dept store in earlly Nov -- vs. shopping on Dec. 26 or 27!! Burnout burnout.
As for the 'September/October attitude' I think one must think about the contrasting experience when doing Christmas shopping in a dept store in earlly Nov -- vs. shopping on Dec. 26 or 27!! Burnout burnout.
Nov 3rd, 2008, 11:26 AM
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Hi --
re: my phonetic spellings - this wasn't meant as a guide for anyone else, it's just what we used, we had a Greek friend look it over, and with our pronounciation (which doesn't come through in a post), people understood us and seemed they were glad we at least tried (or who knows, maybe we were a source of amusement!)
Cheryl - sorry for any confusion - all rates listed are in Euros.
TravelerJan - when we still had smoking & non-smoking areas in California, I was smoking more.
Except for a few times, I wasn't bothered by the smoke, per se, for me, it was more jarring to see mother's smoking with a baby on their lap; the Customs guy in a plexiglass booth with smoke swirling around at 7AM (gag)and being mindful not to get burned when walking in crowds! I related more to what Cindy & Mawmaw said -dropping dropping cigarette butts and smoking around children.
It was our friend Pamela who was really bothered by it. She's not allergic (that's my friend Mary), she was just very sensitive to it, as I know many people would be.
Melodie
Nov 7th, 2008, 02:56 PM
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Hi Melodie,
Your trip report showed up just as I am getting ready to post our own; similar time and route. A few comments:
- in Naxos we were less interested in rating the various hotels and restaurants; instead tried to get away from the tourist areas to collect more traditional Greek experiences
- after a delicious dinner at To Kastro, in full view of the setting sun, we went to a great concert of traditional Greek music, just a few minutes walk to the castle
- after a day of heavy walking we broke down and rented a car to tour the back country; one of our chance discoveries was the Temple of Demeter; out in the fields, away from the city, the goddess of grain allegedly celebrating a bountiful harvest (http://www.sacred-destinations.com/g...of-demeter.htm)
- for an experience different from Naxos town, we went to the twisted alleys of Apiranthos (up in the mountains) and Appolonas (fishing village at the far north end).
Your trip report showed up just as I am getting ready to post our own; similar time and route. A few comments:
- in Naxos we were less interested in rating the various hotels and restaurants; instead tried to get away from the tourist areas to collect more traditional Greek experiences
- after a delicious dinner at To Kastro, in full view of the setting sun, we went to a great concert of traditional Greek music, just a few minutes walk to the castle
- after a day of heavy walking we broke down and rented a car to tour the back country; one of our chance discoveries was the Temple of Demeter; out in the fields, away from the city, the goddess of grain allegedly celebrating a bountiful harvest (http://www.sacred-destinations.com/g...of-demeter.htm)
- for an experience different from Naxos town, we went to the twisted alleys of Apiranthos (up in the mountains) and Appolonas (fishing village at the far north end).
Nov 7th, 2008, 06:40 PM
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HEy, Tableronde --
As I remember you were set on sticking to busses on Naxos, but I see from your post that you "broke down" and rented a car -- GOOD! As I recall you can get a small car for 30€ or so -- and you really can cover the whole island!
Glad to see you found Demeter's temple and Apiranthos -- if you'd said before that you might use a car, I have a whole circular drive thing, including also the other Kouros in a Melanes orchard, a ruined monastery, the old Kitron distillery in Chalki, the teensy-weensy 500 ad church of Panagia Drossiana -- and a marble- cutting factory! But I'm sure you filled your day nonetheless!
Give us a report when u have time.
As I remember you were set on sticking to busses on Naxos, but I see from your post that you "broke down" and rented a car -- GOOD! As I recall you can get a small car for 30€ or so -- and you really can cover the whole island!
Glad to see you found Demeter's temple and Apiranthos -- if you'd said before that you might use a car, I have a whole circular drive thing, including also the other Kouros in a Melanes orchard, a ruined monastery, the old Kitron distillery in Chalki, the teensy-weensy 500 ad church of Panagia Drossiana -- and a marble- cutting factory! But I'm sure you filled your day nonetheless!
Give us a report when u have time.
Nov 8th, 2008, 06:49 PM
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Hi Travelerjan,
Thanks for reminding me of these extra dimensions on Naxos. Yes, we experienced some of them: churches and chapels, marble quarries and Kouros, vegetarian specialties.
As an experiment in trying to cross-connect two threads on Fodor's forum, let me point to my own trip report http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=35166201 , where I'll collect my impressions.
Thanks for reminding me of these extra dimensions on Naxos. Yes, we experienced some of them: churches and chapels, marble quarries and Kouros, vegetarian specialties.
As an experiment in trying to cross-connect two threads on Fodor's forum, let me point to my own trip report http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=35166201 , where I'll collect my impressions.
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