Travel Writing and Photography Website
 

Attention Travelers! <BR> <BR>I'm in the process of developing a travel website for writers, artists, photographers, etc. who want a place to post their works <BR>about travel. While I'm still in somewhat early stages of the site, I'm already needing submissions. There's a lot to know about the <BR>site, so if you are interested in submitting work or simply learning more about the idea behind this travel site, please email me at <BR>[email protected] . If you have friends who might be interested, pass this info along to them. I'm pretty excited about the site--we have a basic design, title, and categories developed already, plus many people have begun to show interest in contributing writing or photography. <BR> <BR>I look forward to hearing from you soon! <BR> <BR>Thanks, <BR>Jackie Goyette <BR>

Sort of interesting, although a lot of people who really do this a lot have their own web sites or places to publish. Have you worked out legal issues? I presume you aren't asking people to turn over publishing rights or copyright to you? As most online web sites do that if you read the fine print. I know of one site very similar to what you are describing, they tried to solicit writing from people on public forums like this one--this web site went belly up a few months ago like many others. Do you intend to make money from this web site by publishing other peoples' work? There are some travel sites already that are similar, perhaps you copied their ideas, but I think they've had trouble staying solvent without lots of advertising (and not even then). Anyway, just hope you have good legal advice and backers and that you've read the restrictions against advertising on this site. Domain names are cheap, if you are serious and have any web design/programming capabilities, you should have a web site up already with at least some limited information on it instead of asking people to email you (which looks suspicous to me, as well as your requesting work from people before you have a web site). For what it's worth, your request does not seem very professional to me.

Excellent point anon. Moving to the top to see the answers to your questions.

Jackie, <BR> <BR>Sorry to see you get an anonymous flame reply - - I rather DO agree that your request is a bit un"professional" (as in, you are not some new "dot-com" travel site creator looking to scavenge up content for nothing - - just another amateur - - like a lot of other web site creators). <BR> <BR>Anyhow, others with a memory of this forum will recall that you have been here before, and an invitation to sample some of your writing - - as mentioned on the thread <BR> <BR>"Best out of the way, hidden European City you have visited?" <BR> <BR>http://www.fodors.com/forums/crossro...messagesframe& <BR> <BR>(I will top for you) <BR> <BR>... didn't seem to upset anyone. <BR> <BR>I'm not sure why you didn't cite it this time around: <BR> <BR>http://www.geocities.com/j_goyette/t.html - - seems like a cute enough, and certainly innocuous example of what you aspire to build and/or assemble. <BR> <BR>I do NOT think you have given anyone much REASON why another web site with a potpourri of Europe travel writing is needed or why your new ideas for a site will be something others want to help you put together. <BR> <BR>But maybe you will. <BR> <BR>Best wishes, <BR> <BR>Rex <BR>www.rexbickers.italy.com <BR>

Topping, this morning... curious to see if you'll be back again today... <BR>

Thanks for your responses so far. You are correct in assuming I'm somewhat new at this. I have thought of some of the legal issues, and I'm not really out there to make money for this site. I'm sorry I did not post any links to sites I have designed (yes, I am a web designer and have background in designing numerous websites--but since I am still in the process of creating the travel site, I did not want to create a link to it just yet). If you had emailed me, I could've given you much more info about the site, but I wanted to wait until people asked for info like that before I sent it to them (and I would much rather send it via email than post it all on a message board). <BR> <BR>To answer another question: Yes, I plan to allow writers to keep their copyrights to their work. This is not a site only for European writing--it is for all kinds of different genres of travel writing. I want it to be all-encompassing. This is really a haven for writers and photographers, as well as other artists who might have something to submit. I am looking for quality work, and so far, I've succeeded in finding some. <BR> <BR>I hope you will excuse the fact that my initial post may seem unprofessional. Honestly, I'm a writer myself, and I've wanted to create a site where I could write, and where others could feel like they could write, and get a foot into the travel writing business. I have a passion for travel, especially, so I felt this would be the perfect project. <BR> <BR>I look forward to learning more about it as I go, but so far, since I'm allowing myself a lot of time to create this site, I feel pretty confident that the site will be successful. I know that sites like these take a lot of effort, but I'm willing to put in that effort. <BR> <BR>Thank you for your comments. Again, if you are interested in submitting work or simply finding out more about the site, my email address is [email protected]. <BR> <BR>Thanks! <BR>Jackie

Touche! Maybe there are some issues that Jackie still needs to address and work out, but like she said, the site is still in the design phase and not ready to go live. Since it is in this early stage when much preparation work is typically completed, she has simply posted a message in a very appropriate arena to see if there are readers of this forum who might have an interest in becoming a part of this new travel writing/photography website. It sounds like she is trying to gauge others' response and interest before continuing to devote time and extensive effort on the development of a comprehensive travel writing page. Her purpose--a writer herself--sounds honest, and her invitation to any interested body is quite harmless. She has not boggled any of us with boring details or pitches; rather, a brief summary was provided with a means of contact for further inquiry. <BR> <BR>As far as a reason for another travel website, how about a passion for writing? I think that is the most solid answer anyone could provide. Other individuals who also share the same love of this medium would have an opportunity to submit pieces of their work, if nothing more than to just share some experiences and observations. Best wishes to Jackie on this endeavor! Let's all hope to see her site soon and possibly submit a story and/or photo ourselves! <BR> <BR>Russ

Thank you Russ, for your enthusiasm about the site! I appreciate it!

Okay, instead of being (slightly) critical, perhaps this thread can be re-focused on a "review" of what websites Do provide the kinds of volunteer-submitted writing and photography that Jackie wants to attract - - and tell whether you think it has good stuff or not. And then maybe Jackie can tell us how her site will be different (or similar). <BR> <BR>www.bootsnall.com is an interesting site on which i am "technically" listed as an "expert" (I am very, VERY inactive there, and hardly ever receive any questions from there); has a somewhat Australia/NZ orientation (and as a result covers the whole world, definitely not ust Europe). I have been invited to submite travel writing there, but I am either too lazy or too intimidated (or both) to submit anything. Actually, I am not entirely sure I am that big a fan of "amateur" travel writing - - maybe I get jaded by such really good professional writers like you find on www.nytimes.com or www.latimes.com - - I will admit that sometimes I read stuff in both newspapers that makes me think "I could write something that good" - - and similarly, I am SURE that there are contributors here on this forum whose writing is as good as the middle of the pack in both newspapers. <BR> <BR>www.globetrotters.co.uk is another worthwhile site (slightly more oriented to exploring parts of the world other than Europe, since it does have origins in Britain). <BR> <BR>and www.twenj.com provides for other volunteer submissions - - might be worthwhile, Jackie, to see if Ed and Julie would want to include any of what you have written. <BR> <BR>Others have thoughts about other such sites? <BR>

Rex: <BR> <BR>I think your idea of comparing the site I am creating with other sites already on the web is a good one. I looked at the sites you had mentioned (I'm also familiar with Boots N All--it is a great site for the traveler--and the last site you mentioned, although I don't think I'd seen the Globetrotters site), and the one PRIMARY difference (which I will address before addressing minor differences) is this: <BR> <BR>My site is more focused on WRITING. These sites that you posted are really more for travelers looking for information, and while they do take submissions and have a lot of writing on their site, they are basically tools that the traveler should use before going on a trip, etc. My site is more of a literary ezine with a focus on travel writing and photography. Like I've said before on this thread, if you want more info on WHAT can be submitted, please email me ([email protected]), but to give you an idea, we accept all sorts of writing--from tour guide types to personal journals to poetry and fiction! Our focus is the writing--the artistic process of reflecting on travels. <BR> <BR>Now for minor differences: <BR> <BR>Besides BootsNAll.com which is designed rather well, the other sites you posted aren't really outstanding examples of good web design. Since our site is focused on the artistic aspects of travel (writing, photography, etc.), our site reflects this through an artistic, careful design. This isn't a site that has just been thrown together--it's more serious, and that is obvious in the look of the site. I think the web needs a site like this. <BR> <BR>The focus of the site is to promote TALENTED WRITERS AND PHOTOGRAPHERS. While experience is important, it is not the major focus, and unexperienced writers who are talented writers are going to be able to find a place to write on our site. <BR> <BR>So I hope that clears up some confusion about this new site. Like I said, it's more geared toward writing than the others you mentioned. It is, as I mentioned before, more of a literary magazine for travelers. <BR> <BR>Thanks, <BR>Jackie Goyette

Having corresponded with Jackie through e-mail, I must agree that her up-and-coming travel writing site is organized extremely well and creatively thought out. Many cheers to you, Jackie, for having the courage to introduce a new forum for lovers of travel to share and learn! Despite some opinions, not everyone becomes a professional travel writer overnight. Those with sincere interest and lively creativity - whether at the amateur or professional level - applaud you and anxiously await your site's unveiling. <BR> <BR>As you stated in a previous posting, it was also my impression that the emphasis of your site will be on creative work. As a common theme, submissions will focus on traveling, but the point is the art, not the tourist information. So as to why another site like yours might be of interest, I might pose this arguement: Once a person has visited the Metropolitan Museum of Art, does it mean that he or she should ignore a promising exhibition at another art gallery? <BR> <BR>Bravo, Jackie! Don't let pessimists or anon get you down! The rest of us are happily looking forward to visiting and submitting to your site!

Piccola, <BR> <BR>I have not sneered at Jackie's writing, nor have I meant to suggest that she should not proceed. And whatever she gets up and running, I would never suggest that people should not go and see it - - in the "who needs another museum" context you implied. <BR> <BR>I'm talking about the difference between being a VISITOR (which I would gladly be) and a CONTRIBUTOR (which I might not be worthy of being). Just like a publisher has to justify to contributors (and backers and advertisers) - - why does the world need another such magazine, the same exists for Jackie's efforts. <BR> <BR>And she seems prepared to make such a distinction. <BR> <BR>Who knows, maybe I will try writinga poem for her site with my next trip (upcoming in only 33 days! whoohoo!) <BR>

Thanks to everyone's responses thus far about the Travel Website/literary travel ezine. I hope that I have done a decent job articulating what the site will be like. Piccola, thank you for the museum analogy. Also, thank you for your enthusiasm about the site! It is very much appreciated! <BR> <BR>Rex, your comments are important to me, and I think that you have done a good job steering us away from the initial Anon post, and giving some feedback that I will need while further pursuing this website. Actually, your comments also helped me evaluate my goals for the travel writing/photography website. I hope that you DO submit some poetry to the site, if you are so inclined! If you want, email me at [email protected], and I will give you some more information about what kind of writing we are looking for, etc. <BR> <BR>Please let me know if there are any more questions or comments that will help to clarify this website. I think we DO need a site like this--a literary magazine for travelers. I hope to hear from people regarding this site, and I'm grateful so far to all who have written me to ask about the site. Your inquiries are appreciated! Thanks to all. <BR> <BR>Jackie Goyette <BR>[email protected]

The problem with Jackie's concept is that no one who is a serious writer would ever entertain the notion of posting there. Those of us who actually get paid to publish will never bother with such a site - even if we wanted to, we'd withhold the submissions because other people hold rights to our work. Jackie is therefore left with the wannabes, a few of whom may prove to be promising writers, but the vast majority of whom won't know a subject from a verb. You can see the kind of drivel these folks who, because of the internet suddenly consider themselves "writers," produce at sites like Epinions.com and AllExperts.com. <BR>I applaud Jackie's effort, but I find it highly unrealistic as a business plan. Jackie hasn't demonstrated a knowledge of the publishing world in her posts, although she has been honest and straightforward. I think she has a whole lot of education to acquire about publishing if this is to become anything other than another website with mediocre travel ramblings from one-time travelers and ill-informed wannabes. Serious writers, by which I mean people who know what they are talking about and can describe it in terms that capture the reader, will never post at such a site. They are commanding a dollar a word or more writing for people who pay for their expertise. <BR>So, you say, who cares about serious writers? Well, given the choice between reading the works of people who know what they're talking about and people who might just be blathering about a first family trip to Italy, which will the average person choose? <BR>Sorry, as a business person I applaud Jackie's entrepreneurship, but as a business person I also see that this is an endeavor doomed to failure and mediocrity. You can bill it as "just a fun site for people to post on," but how will you weed out the inevitable unpublishable content, and how will you attract good stuff? People who can write well SELL their work; they don't give it away. It's that simple.

Thank you for your message, Won'[email protected]. While I appreciate your straightforwardness about my hopes to produce a travel writer's web site (a literary magazine for travelers), I don't fully agree with your comments. First of all, I think you underestimate the talents of amateur writers. There are many writers out there who may not want to write seriously for a living, but they still are good at writing. Your comment is somewhat foolish because it assumes that people who can write well will ONLY do so as a profession, suggesting that everyone who writes well is a professional writer. This is not the case. Many people who write well may like to do so only as a hobby, like traveling, and therefore writing for a site like mine would be a perfect outlet for their creative energy. Then, there are many of us who hope to write someday professionally, but currently are trying to get our feet wet. Travel writing is a hard business to get into. Many young people who want to write don't know where to start, and they have a hard time placing their works on sites that pay money, since often times those sites ask them for previous writing experience. My site gives those people an opportunity to gain much needed writing experience, and to do so in a community of many good writers. Also, because our site plans to edit and sort through content before posting anything, we can definitely weed out the articles that don't meet our standards. Also, we are lucky enough to have as one of our editors someone who has previous publishing experience and has worked with other literary magazines. The process of starting this website is exciting, because, contrary to your comments about serious writers not wanting to apply, we have received samples from many serious writers and photographers, looking for a serious site on which to post their work. People are looking for a site like this. I know, because I'm one of them. <BR> <BR>Jackie Goyette <BR> <BR>If you are interested in contributing writing or photography to our site, or you simply want to know more about it, please email me at [email protected]. <BR> <BR>Thanks.

To aspiring writers: One word of advice. Jackie notes that you would retain your copyrights on your work. The advice is to make sure you HAVE a copyright on anything you submit and that the copyright information is included along with any of your work that gets published on Jackie's site or anywhere. <BR> <BR>About four years ago I wrote a not particularly spectacular article that was published on a paying Web site. For some reason this single piece of work has received more attention than anything, and perhaps everything, else I've ever published. At last check, a Google search for the title of this article came up with 381 entries. Some of these sites are affiliates of the site that purchased the article and used it with permission. I haven't the faintest idea who some of the others are, nor does my editor, and since this piece first ran in the wild wild west days of the WWW, trying to unravel the mess would be a hopeless endeavor. By contrast, I recently was paid 3/5ths of my original fee for another article when iVillage wanted to run an updated version of it. <BR> <BR>Whether you're a professional or not, you will want to protect your intellectual property. Copyright it!

Thanks to everyone who has responded so far about our 'literary magazine for travelers', both on this message post and by sending me emails about contributing. Our site is set to launch December 1st, and I'm pretty excited about it. If you want your work to appear in our launch date 'issue' (although it's not really an issue, since we will be making changes fairly frequently by uploading new articles, etc.), please get your articles to me (1000 words or less--photo journals are 12 photos or less) by October 16th. If you have any questions or want to send in submissions, you can email me at [email protected]. <BR> <BR>Again, thanks! <BR>Happy Travels to all! <BR> <BR>Jackie Goyette

Jackie, don't forget to forward the information when you go "live". I followed the link that Rex posted and found out that you, too, are a DPU grad. Interesting coincidence (I'm Class of '90). <BR> <BR>Best of luck & I can't wait to see the site!

Just found this old post and thought I would update about the site: The Long Trip Home. We have now been up for just a few days less than a year, and the site has been pretty well received. Take a look:<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com<BR><BR>We are currently planning for our December issue (I took a break these past few months to, of all things, move to Italy, and only recently have I gotten my internet access up here in bella Italia), with a spotlight of London. If you are interested in submitting, send in articles to my email address by November 29th. Check out our guideline info:<BR><BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/Guidelines.html<BR><BR>and our FAQ:<BR><BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/FreqAskQues.html<BR><BR>for more information. Also, to see what we've been writing, here are a few articles specifically about European travel:<BR><BR>Vienna: Land of the Overpriced<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/articleslc5.html<BR><BR>Zuppi Santi (Soggy Saints)<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/articlestj4.html<BR><BR>From Umbria to Le Marche<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/archives5dec01.html<BR><BR>Elinore's Room<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/archives7spot1201.html<BR><BR>Annie in Amsterdam<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/articlesS3.html<BR><BR>Celtic Camera<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome.com/articlesS11.html<BR><BR>Thanks and enjoy!<BR>Jackie<BR>http://www.thelongtriphome<BR>........................... ...<BR>Oh must we dream our dreams <BR>and have them, too? <BR>And have we room <BR>for one more folded sunset, still quite warm? <BR><BR>-from Questions of Travel by Elizabeth Bishop <BR>

An interesting discussion. Do keep on, and in the meantime, I'll print what you've said so far and give it a good read. Many thanks for the stimulating ideas, Jackie and all. A bit out of the oridinary here.