Thank you for your replies

Yes I have received excellent advice from this forum. I could not have planned my trip without everyones help.
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Re which Swiss pass to purchase. I have agonised over this question. I was leaning towards the 1st class saver for the "special" trips e.g.Bernina Express, Golden Pass.
I also considered the Flexi pass, but was unsure about the hassel of purchasing tickets for the days in between.

My main trips will be Tirano to Lucerne (day one), (day 2 perhaps a trip to Mt Titlis, or boat trip on the Lake, 1 day moving from Lucerne to Wengen (Golden pass line). We will have 4 nights in Wengen (not sure how much we will use the pass, depends on various day trips). We will then have a trip to Montreux (Golden pass line). Our last trip will involve a move into Germany. (of course this would be an easy "one off" purchase).

Here's the thing aussie and maybe it will help you decide. A rail pass while convenient, has a down side. There is always the tendency to 'get your money's worth' out of it. That means it tends to push you towards using it as much as you can.

A flexipass gets you free travel on any of the days in a 30(or 60, I forget) day period that you elect to use it as one of your number of days paid for, be it 3, 5, 7. On all other days in that 30 day period it gets you half price on trains/buses/ferries.

The most expensive trip you will do is up to Jungfraujoch if you happen to be in Wengen on a day when it is not in cloud up there (otherwise not much point in going up). I believe the flexipass or a full pass will only get you 25% discount either way. So there is no advantage to a full pass for that. You don't have to use one of your flexi days for the discount.

So a 3 day flexi could be used for Tirano to Lucerne, Lucerne to Wengen and finally Wengen to Montreux while still getting you half price for everything else. Perhaps equally as important, it won't 'push' you to use it every day. Instead, since you will only be getting 25 or 50% off you will be a bit more choosy about using it.

....but what's about this Montreux - Germany journey? If it's by plane from GVA or by bus from Lausanne I fully agree with Improviser. Otherwise we have to take account of the train fare from Montreux to Basle, Schaffhausen, Zurich bus terminal, Constance Doebeliplatz or St. Margrethen too

Ah yes, our last day will involve a train to Frieburg Germany where we will pick up our rental car for 17 days.

So I can buy separate tickets for that leg, or if purchasing an 8 day pass will be included.

So I have been doing some train schedule investigation and if we take a regional train from Tirano to Lucerne it will involve either 3 or 4 changes and a longer journey. DH is unimpressed and is still keen to do the Bernina Express as less changes and less travel time, especially as we will have luggage. Bearing in mind we will also have travelled from Bellagio via Varenna to Tirano that morning.

I was looking on the swiss railways site and the d bahn site. I could not see the Bernina Express listed. When I go on the Bernina express site there is a train listed to depart Tirano at 14.04.
Am I looking in the wrong area. Some weeks ago I thought I had seen a train schedule where it listed all the trains and if they had panorama carriages. I have been having difficult computer problems today and have only now been able to log on to the internet.

I must go through my notes tomorrow.

try www.bahn.de/en for schedules of any European train - it should note the official BE and those IME all have panoramic cars.

http://www.rhb.ch/Bernina-Express.1676.0.html?&L=4

All the trains on this schedule are I believe official Bernina Express trains and all should have panoramic cars I believe. Yes one departs Tirano at 14:04.

Once again (for Thursday 9/12):

Bernina Express 976:
Tirano dp 10.03 - St. Moritz ar 12.17
connecting ferry and trains:
T 152 Bellagio dp 6.20 - Varenna ar 6.55
R 2550 Varenna dp 7.24 - Tirano ar 8.50
RE 1144 St. Moritz dp 13.02 - Chur ar 15.03
IC 580 Chur dp 15.09 - Zurich ar 16.29

Bernina Express 950:
Tirano dp 14.04 - Chur ar 18.27
connecting ferry and trains:
T 160 Bellagio dp 10.45 - Varenna ar 11.00
R 2566 Varenna dp 11.24 - Tirano ar 12.50
IC 10790 Chur dp 18.39 - Zurich ar 19.53

The Bernina Express trains are fully airconditioned
At least 80 per cent of all wagons of the other Swiss trains are airconditioned.
For Italy, I don't know

Swiss Flexipass with 3 free days:
pay half fare for Lucerne - Wengen: CHF 22.50
use the last free day for Montreux - Basel Bad Bf (full fare would cost 71 CHF). A standard fare RE ticket Basel Bad - Freiburg costs CHF 15.50. If you are 3 or more people, buy a Baden-Wurttemberg ticket.

Thank you neckervd and palenQ for your help and excellent information.

Well we have spent the whole day searching timetables and reading reviews and ideas.

We have decided on doing the Bernina Express departing from Tirano at 14.04. Afterall this was the main reason for us flying in to Milan from Australia. Thank you neckervd for the trip breakdown from Bellagio, very helpful and we will indeed follow it. We even telephoned Switzerland tonight to make the seat reservation and ask some questions. I know I can book online but I had a few questions. Very helpful young lady. So decision done for that trip.

We also thoroughly researched the Golden Pass trip from Wengen to Montreux. We are looking at departing Wengen at 8.03 going via Zweisimmen to pick up the Panorama train. We were a little disappointed to find that the VIP panorama seats are not available on the train that departs Zweisimmen at 10.25. Those carriages are not until the 12.25 train. We also rang an operator to confirm this. We looked at taking that train but only one VIP seat was left and the train would also get into Montreux 2 hours later. So although we have not booked anything yet we think we will go with the earlier train. Looking at the panorama carriage on the Interlaken to Zweisimmen leg it seems to have a funny looking seating plan, with a seat that seems to face into the aisle and not out the window. Does this seat swivel? (this seat map was on the Golden pass site).

On our trip from Lucerne to Wengen we are considering catching a train to Brienz via the Brunig pass. Getting off in Brienz and catching the steamer boat departing at 12.40 to Interlaken and continuing on to Wengen from there. Another consideration was to send our baggage ahead for this trip. As it is also about the trip as well as getting to the final destination. I had thought I would like to take a boat trip on either Lake Brienz or Thun.
What do you think, is this a good idea?

MOB train with VIP seats:
Montreux dp 9.44 - Zweisimmen 11.32/12.25 - Montreux 14.13/15.44 - Zweismmen 17.32/18.25 - Montreux ar 20.13
Can be found in any Swiss timetable

VIP seats are at the front of the train by the driver but also at the rear of the train - I'd rather being looking forward than looking backward - not sure you can chose or not.

If you can't get on the Panorama cars I wonder if you could connect with the 'classic' which runs from Zweisimmen to Montreux? http://www.goldenpass.ch/goldenpass_..._zweisimmen_en

Looks like you would try for the 9.29 or 15.08 from Interlaken and catch the 11.05 or 16.25 from Zweisimmen.

If you can't have Panorama, why not go in Style?

We took a similar trip a few years ago. We stayed in Lugano, a lovely lake town, then took a bus to Tirano (I seem to recall the bus was part of the Bernina express package; in any event, it was an exciting ride on narrow roads beside lakes). We stayed in Chur, as it would have been a very long trip to get all the way to Luzern. From Chur we routed to Luzern via Andermatt, because of the superior scenery.

On our very first trip, we bought a pass, but I found it expensive and restrictive, unless you have a very specific itinerary and are able to do the research to find the right pass. On later trips, we just bought half fare cards, which saved money for the way we travel.

We rode the Bernina Express once, and have been over that route on regular trains a few times. The Bernina Express, unless you get an open car, is unsuited for taking pictures. The panoramic windows are panoramic in the sense that they curve up into the roof, but the scenery is all beside the train; and the panoramic windows are sealed, so if you try to take a picture through one, you have to deal with the reflections. They are good for looking at the clouds. I was much happier standing by an open window on a less expensive regular train, seeing the same scenery, and getting great pictures.

Our first Bernina Express ride was in Spring 2009, so things may have changed.

Yes Panoramic observation cars often sound much greater than they really are!

Thank you for everyones input. I value and research each suggestion.
We know that our Bernina express day will be a big travel day.
We will make the most of it and enjoy the ride.

To go Lugarno would mean an even earlier start so we will do the Varenna option.

Will look in to the "Classic" option on our way to Monteux, but I think it will be too early for us.
I do not like travelling backwards, so always like to pick a seat facing forward.

"To go from Bellgio Lugarno" in order to board a Tirano bound bus would be a maximation of nonsense. But nobody spoke about that AFAIK.

neckervd, I was just replying to clevelandbrown as they mentioned they did the Bernina express via the bus from Lugarno. But I did know previously that it was not an option for us.

ttt

The Bernina Express bus does go between Tirano and Lugano.

For others considering the Bernina Pass Railway and Lugano - well others but not the OP - anyway the Majola Pass bus a k a Palm Express I believe, is infinitely more scenic than the Bernina Expre3ss bus to Tirano.

The Majola Pass bus plies a sinuous Alpine hairpin-curving road once in Switzerland, corkscrewing up to St Moritz - and taking the Bernina Pass Railway as a day trip IMO is infinitely more better than doing it quickly non-stop - as a day trip you can get off the train at say Bernina Ospiz and hoof it around the lake to the tip of the glacier and walk to Alp Grum - a station a few kms from Bernina Ospiz for another train back to St Moritz - the highlights of the line being around the summit - the descent to Italy is nice but not as spectacular as the summit area so you can just do half the journey, get off fool around - perhaps have a beverage on the sun terrace cafes at the stations, etc. Make a sweet whole day out of it IMO.

http://www.fodors.com/world/europe/s...p_2471238.html

info on Switzerland's iconic postal buses and web site of bus company to make reservations, schedules, etc.