Joe18

My wife and I were planning to go to St. Petersburg and Moscow on our own next July. However, we've put our plans on hold after talking with my wife's brother; who has been there several times, last in '92; and a travel agent, who was there this summer. Both said that travel is still difficult and dangerous. We've traveled through most of Western Europe and some beyond (Prague, Germany, Scandinavia, Mexico)on our own. However, English and French are our only languages. Since I don't like tours, we're thinking of canceling the trip and would like advice/information from people who have traveled in Russia.

CiaoLeone

I think you've overreacted, and need to reassess why you're concelling. Is it possible neither of you was that keen on going. Our plans are still a GO for next April. Look at how others are planning their trips and emulate their moves, and you should be just fine.

Eloise

I've traveled as a woman alone in the Middle East (admittedly before 9/11), in Hungary and the former Czechoslovakia (pre-1989) as well as in India, Burma and Indonesia.

I would not travel to St. Petersburg or Moscow.

Joe18

Eloise, Why do you say that? Because of what you've heard from others who have been there, what you've read, or . . . ?

kopp

My DH and I have traveled to both St. Petersburg and Moscow, the last time 2 summers ago. We travel independently, no tours. In both cities, we felt very comfortable riding the subways all over the place, and in Moscow we even took the local commuter train from the airport to the city center.

I never felt "unsafe" at all, no purse-snatching episodes, no sicknesses from bad food, and no muggings. Is this what you're speaking of as being unsafe and difficult?

The language, now that's different. I went cross-eyed trying to figure it out, but DH does a better job so he could read signs.

I would suggest, however, when you buy maps, make sure they have the actual Russian letters on your map. If it's in English, you won't have any idea where you're going because it's all in Russian once you're there.

I'd go back in a second. Love the history, museums, the churches are being rebuilt in grand style, and the palaces are spectacular. The Hermitage, Kremlin, etc. etc. - wow!

Eloise

From what I've read I gather - rightly or wrongly - that corruption and petty crime are rampant in Russia.

I'd rather not have to deal with it, particularly since I can neither speak nor read Russian. Obviously, I can neither speak nor read Czech, Hindu, Urdu, Arabic, Burmese or Bahasa Indonesia either, but the times when I went to the countries involved were safer times than they are today. I would not return to Egypt or Jordan today; I would hesitate before returning to Indonesia, although I loved it when I was there.

As it happens, I do speak German and Hungarian. I loved Prague; I've been there three times, and when I was there, many of the older generation still spoke German. Today, I suppose much of the younger generation speaks English. But when I read that the <b>mayor of Prague</b> was grossly overcharged when he took a taxi from the airport to downtown Prague, I hesitate about going back.

bardo1

topping to see if anyone who has actually been recently (besides Kopp) chimes in...

321go

Haven't been in several years (2002), but would go back in a second - in fact, am trying to plan something for next summer. I heard the same things (crime, corruption, bad food) from lots of people - none of whom had ever been to Russia - before I went. I'm glad I didn't listen to them; I had a wonderful trip.

It's helpful to learn the cyrillic alphabet before you go - there are many Russian words that sound like their English counterparts if you can decipher the alphabet.

321go

Another thought: read through a few back issues of the St. Petersburg Times http://www.times.spb.ru/index.php?ac...;i_number=1215
to get a feel for what goes on.

Tuni01

My husband and I traveled on our on in May 2003. I agree with Kopp and 321 on everything. We found SP a beautiful city with tons of sights. I look forward to returning. We rented an apt in SP and hired a guide for our first day. That helped us feel comfortable with the city and she showed us how to ride Metro. I'd recommend this approach. We also hired same guide and driver a few days later to take us to palaces outside the city. go, you'll love it.

nytraveler

We have done independent travel in Russia and I wouldn;t be that concerned about danger - but it is more difficult than western or central europe.

Prague, Budapest etc have good solid tourist infrastructures that make vacationing really no different than western europe. English is spoken everywhere, the service ethic is strong and there are manyy good hotels and restaurants in every price range.

In Russia the infrastructure is still incomplete, the idea of customer service has not yet taken full hold and results can be uneven. If you have the money to spend for a deluxe hotel, travel by cab and to buy tours to outlying places you should be fine. Food is still an issue - can be great - or awful.

So - if you have the funds and can roll with the punches defiitely go for a great experience - but expect it to be somewhat more difficult to get exactly what you want at times.

Grcxx3

Well, let's see, I let my 13 year old son go on a school trip to Moscow last May. And some friends of our just came back from Moscow (with kids) and loved it. And our family is planning a trip to both SP and Moscow in the spring.

Granted, my husband speaks some Russian and that will be a big help. I understand that it is not as easy there as in Europe, and we might hire a guide to take us around, but I really have no concerns (other than the weather!).

Eloise - I am sorry to hear that you are so hesitant to travel to such great places. Having lived in Egypt - I would go back there in a heartbeat and Jordan is still on the list of places to go. And where we currently live is one of the most corrupt countries around (won't mention where!), but we spent a weekend out in the mountains and the countryside and saw the most spectacular scenery. Would't have missed it.

Besides - if petty crime and corruption are enough to keep you away from great places and new experiences.....don't go to New Orleans! (my home, BTW, and I LOVE it!)

Garfield

I have been to Russia a number of times, my travels took me to many places in Russia as well as St. Petersburg and Moscow. The sucess of your trip will be dependent upon the amount of pre-trip planning that you are willing to do, use the internet. Look at maps, including city and metros. Plan your days before you go, decide what you want to see and plan on how to get their. I used local transportation or my feet for most of my travels in the cities. Between cities it was bus or train.

However I would say that I am a well travelled, having among my travels, been to Syria, Iran, Pakistan, India, Nepal, Turkey, Mongolia as well as many other countries.

SusanEva

Hi Joe,

My husband and I traveled to StP and Moscow on our own in 2002 and 2005.I agree with others that have enjoyed their travels and didn't feel that it was dangerous or difficult.

The answer to your question depends on a few things. NYtraveler is exactly right - the travel and planning is more challenging because you must think ahead about arranging for things that you might take for granted in some of the other places you've traveled.

For example:

a) do you only want to travel to these two cities? How will you get from StP to Moscow?

b) are you willing/able to pay higher prices for hotels or restaurants that have English speaking staff?

c) are you comfortable/willing to use English speaking guides to get to and/or tour locations like the Kremlin/Armoury, Peterhof, Catharine's Place?

d) do you enjoy communicating with people when you don't have a common language by smiles, pointing, gestures and a dictionary/language aid or does that make you feel too vulnerable to be comfortable in shops, buying tickets, ordering food, etc.

We chose to rent an apartment in StP operated by a hotel/restaurant that had at least some English speaking staff. We used their staff to make arrangements for a car and driver to meet us at the airport. We flew on Aeroflot between the two cities, as we weren't overly confident about training on our own. We obtained a good rate on the Metropol hotel in Moscow - right next to the Kremlin/Red Square and used taxis to and from the airport in Moscow without difficulty.

Neither of us speak Russian. I didn't memorize Cyrillic, but I did study a bit on the plane. It was pretty easy to recognize the signs that you need, like restaurant, cafe, metro, etc. If you do take the time, I'm sure it would be even easier.

The hotels helped us arrange guides and drivers to see the places mentioned above. We wouldn't have been able to negotiate getting there, buying tickets or even fully understanding what we were seeing without the guides/drivers.

It sounds like you and your wife are up to the task. You could also consider just tackling one city to simplify the planning.

Mark Miller has been very helpful to many here planning travels in Russia through his posts on this forum. You could do a search on his name and find a number of specific suggestions.

Most importantly, both StP and Moscow are beautiful cities with a rich history and culture. We were fascinated and delighted with our experiences and returned with wonderful memories. Hope and expect that you will experience the same!

petitepois

First of all, Russia has changed A LOT since 1992. I visited Moscow and St. Petersburg in May of this year and I loved it so much I hope to move there. You can click on my name to find my trip report. I found both cities as safe (or unsafe, depending on your perspective) as any large city, including New York, London, Los Angeles or Tokyo. Granted, my husband is a Russian speaker, but when alone I didn't find Russia to be any more confusing, dangerous or threatening than say, Japan. My advice: have a wonderful trip. But only if you decide you're comfortable going - if not, you won't have a good time.

There is a poster called katya_ny who travels regularly to Russia and always offers great advice - try doing a search for some of her old posts.

katya_NY

hmm... I have to admit that my jaw clenched a bit at the title &quot;St. Petersburg &amp; Moscow--Difficult? Dangerous?&quot;.

To me, the description of
Russia as corrupt could easily be applied to the US... we just have corruption with big botox smiles.

I feel myself rushing to the defense of my favorite places in the world- again- but I realize that it is 6:30am and I really need not do that. Moscow and Saint Petersburg are world treasures.

If you, as a traveler, feel uncomfortable traveling somewhere, then you have to decide that for yourself. There are places I wouldn't go. But I would make an educated decision before choosing not to.

Please feel free to click on my name and read about my experiences bringing students to Russia. I feel comfortable bringing 16-17 year olds, and they have a blast.

Off to teach... If you have questions, please let me know!

Rich

. . corruption and petty crime are rampant in Russia. &quot;

I lived in Moscow for three years, visited St Petersburg on business many times, During that time, I had two instances when I was the victim of an attempted crime . . . Once on holiday in Paris, and once during a business trip to Rome.

Russia ( particularly Moscow and St Petersburg ) has lots of organized crime. . . I will take &quot;organized crime&quot; any time over &quot;disorganized crime&quot;, which is fairly rare in Russia.

The organized crime does not affect visitors or ExPats, unless they start doing things they should not . .

My experience was that there was less of the &quot;sneak and grab&quot; type crime than most cities ( including major cities in the US )

Rich

WallyKringen

What is it with all the scare-mongering? What is &quot;difficult and dangerous&quot; supposed to mean? Difficult maybe for those too lazy to learn the alphabet, as in many other parts of the world where our &quot;Roman&quot; ABC is not what they use.

I walked all over St. Petersburg by myself for a week this last Spring, day and night, took back alleys for shortcuts on weary legs, saw maybe three drunks all week.

Traffic across the few strategic bridges is at a stand-still even in the middle of the day - tourists who rely on drivers get stuck and pay for idling.

Public transport is just fine, the metro works very well, but the stations are spaced far apart, nothing like Paris for example, and the descent into the depth takes longer than a ride, so buses and trams are in order for shorter hops.

Nothing scary about the place - if you bother to learn the alphabet so ou can read signs and find your way around with a map, and learn some phrases, have a phrase book/dictionary with you and are patient and well-mannered, you will have many very pleasant person-to-person experiences.

Russians don't have the overly smiley way about them that Americans do, and they don't have the tradition of giving much &quot;personal space&quot; and of &quot;serving&quot; each other, so they may seem brusque to those who are culturally not sensitive. But not nearly as bad as the Japanese who treat train riders like sardines, for example.

Leave your fears and, like in any big city, your jewelry behind and go - it is a beautiful city full of life and history and optimism - but as most cities, it has lots of people who have very difficult lives, and also a great many who have successfully taken to the &quot;western&quot; ways.

It's not like home, but it is definitely not &quot;difficult and dangerous&quot; - whoever says that is not doing us travelers any favours.

katya_NY

by the way- thank you to petitepois for the kind words. I do love Russia and I would advocate anyone to travel there. As many posters have mentioned- the &quot;hard part&quot; about Russia is the Cyrillic alphabet. My seventh graders will tell you that it's easy by this point of the year- they began in September and now confidently read and write in Russian.

So take a few weeks, really learn the alphabet- and have a great time.

Odin

I lived in Russia for a year on my own in a poor city 100km south of Moscow whilst working. I've brought my teenager over couple of times plus family/friends who visited. Last visit was this past New Year, my other half has been couple times, once on a conference and managed to see St Petersburg alone and negotiate taxis without a word of Russian. I think in total I have been there over 20 times since 1986.