Southern England Itinerary Help
 

Hello Fellow Travels,
I am asking this travel community to help us narrow down our Southern England trip. My husband and I along with a dear friend will be traveling in late May and have 11 nights in England. This will be my first time to this country but hubby and friend have already visited. We are interested in spending 4 nights in London and 7 nights in the countryside. We love art, gardens, history and castles. Looking for unique experiences and trying as best we can to avoid the crowded overly touristy places. We will be renting a car in London. These are the places that are on the Bucket list- Sissinghurst gardens, Dover castle/Cliffs walk ( Hubby is a big WW2 history buff and wants to visit Dover Castle for Dunkirk operations tour ) and Oxford.
I know that time is limited and visiting these two places puts us in opposite directions, but here is what we are thinking:
Arrive London and rent car- drive to a small village in the Cotswolds to use as a base for 3 nights
1-3 Nights: Cotswold village ( Burford, Bourton on the water, Chipping Campden , or any other you recommend)
Want to visit Oxford, Bath, Hidcote Manor. Or would it be better to base ourselves in Bath?
4th Night: Drive from the Costwolds toward Portsmouth and overnight - thinking it would be interesting to see the Mary Rose but not committed to this. We are just trying to find a place to break our trip from the Costwolds to Dover/Sissinghusrt area.
5-7 Nights: Considering staying on the grounds at Sissinghurst Castle Farmhouse 2 nights and then maybe somewhere in Dover? Or stay in between these two places for 3 nights and drive to each area.
8-11 Nights : Drive back to London and return car. Stay 4 nights in London
I understand it may be a wide area to cover so we are flexible and are willing to perhaps take away a night in London to add to the driving trip.
Your input and time is much appreciated.
Look forward to hearing back!

Please do not drive after a long flight. You will be tired and driving while jet-lagged is the same as driving while drunk.
Not sure why you want a break between Cotswolds and Sissinghurst unless you are desperate to visit Portsmouth. It is only a 2 and half hour drive from Burford, assuming the M25 is running OK. Even if it is a bit clogged it wont add much time to your journey. That is about the same time as getting there from Portsmouth.
Likewise why transfer to Dover? It is about an hour's drive from Sissinghurst.
Others will chip in with more and better suggestions on where to stay and what to see.

Like Heti says, please don't drive the first day, catch a bus to Windsor or Oxford. Windsor has a castle if you want to see one, Oxford has a few old buildings and some art. Either hire your car from Oxford or catch the bus back to Heathrow to pick one up.

Then I get a bit confused, "Looking for unique experiences and trying as best we can to avoid the crowded overly touristy places." and yet you are going to the Cotswolds. Not really sure how to advise as the Cotswolds are what they are, very touristy though May may be a good time slot (but I doubt it). Are you planning to be there at the weekend as they fill up even more then.

Portsmouth has the Mary Rose, HMS Victory and King Henry's castle, as such it is a good place to overnight https://www.visitportsmouth.co.uk/th...castle-p221301, there are a fair few small hotels in Southsea (sort of part of Portsmouth) down towards the castle and a street of restaurants one row back. Do you need to overnight here, I don't know.

I have just skimmed so far and don't have time to address specifics until later today, but just two quick comments based on the other two posts . . . 1) 100% (100000%) do not drive on arrival, Depending on flight times and other variables, one option is doing London car-less first and finish up either in the Cotswolds or in Kent . . . and 2) I'll need to read more but if you are just going from the Cotswolds to the Sissinghurst area there is no need to break the journey

Thank you for your responses. I do understand that with their AONB designation the Cotswolds' will be on everyone's must see list. What I did see however, is that it's a large area and was hoping to get some input on least visited villages that can still be used as a base since we have a car. We do know that we are tourists ourselves and will be flexible and adjust to circumstances as we go. In reference to Portsmouth, is there a reason why we should not stay there? It will be difficult it seems to me to see the sights and still have time to drive in and out from another destination. Am I understanding from your responses that we should have just two locations as a base and travel to sights from there?
Thank you again

Also, taking your recommendations for not driving immediately upon arrival, I have researched taking the train to Oxford and spend one night visiting this city and picking up car on the next day to drive to Cotswolds/Bath area. There is a cost difference due to a fee for dropping off in a different location. Other option is taking train to Bath and just use this as our base.
Thoughts?

I still haven't read all of the above (been out most of the day) But -- there is no train from LHR to either Oxford or Bath. You would need to take a train in to London Paddington and then from there take another train to either city. Not a deal breaker -- but if is much easier to just take the Express coach from LHR straight to Oxford or Bath.

But really - depending on what time you land -- a better option might be to stay the first night in Windsor. It is only 7 miles from LHR, has the castle, is a great place to explore and that way you wouldn't have to pay a drop off fee.

Nothing wrong with Portsmouth, if you like Navy stuff it can be a great visit.

If you get the bus to say Bath and pick up the car there on your second day then fine go to Portsmouth if you are really into navy stuff.

If you stay the first night in Windsor then I would skip Portsmouth as it cuts a night from elsewhere, though you could make a long day of it - drive 2 hours to Portsmouth, visit what you want to see then drive 2 hours to Sissinghurst. You really don't need a whole day and a night in Portsmouth.

First, thank you everyone for your responses- it allowed me to continue my research and narrow down our itinerary . I am now considering the following:
1 night- Arrive London and take bus to Oxford, overnight
2 nights- Pick up car and drive to Cotswolds- considering staying in Burford 2 nights at the Lambs Inn , also could decide to splurge and stay at Cowley Manor( anyone has input on this place?)
2 nights- Drive to Salisbury - visit Stonehenge on the way and visit Portsmouth Museums
3 nights-Drive to Sissinghurst (maybe Sissinghurst Castle B&B) or stay in Dover-visit both the gardens and Dover castle, cliffs
3 nights- Drive from Sissinghurst or Dover and return car in London, stay 3 nights
Appreciate all input- Thank you!

My usual warning about the "white" cliffs at Dover. They are not all that white anymore and are also very difficult to see unless you get out on to the water, which isn't easy. Dover castle though is worth seeing.

For white cliffs it's much better if you go to Beachy Head and the Seven Sisters to the west of Eastbourne. You should be able to fit them in en route.

Ok John - thank you for your advise. We would love to do this Seven Sisters walk- I read about it but wasn't sure if it was the same thing as what we would see at Dover cliffs. If we go to Beachy Head do we do it leaving Salisbury on the way to Sissinghurst / Dover. How long should we allow to do this? I am nervous of how long these stops will take even though the drives from one to the other are only a few hours.

Only had lunch at Cowley Manor and didn't stay but it certainly is impressive! So much so that if you did stay there I think you would be very tempted to stay put rather than do any sightseeing! Certainly a place to push the boat out. My wife likes Burford and often goes there for lunch at the Lambs Inn. I am not so keen- pretty but a little twee and heaving with tourists in the summer.

A few comments on your plan. I see a lot of people on this forum planning to visit Oxford and pick up a car to head for the Cotswolds (we live 5 miles from Oxford at least for part of the year). The reality is that Oxford, wonderful city though it is, is not car friendly. This is compounded by the fact that there are major engineering works going on at present to a bridge next to the railway station. Most of the car rental places(hertz Avis, Europcar) are in Osney Island , the other side of the works from the station and the city. This means either a walk with cases through the building works to the rental places or a 20 min taxi ride around the diversions. Also there is major bridge repair on the Botley Road /A34 which is on the way out to the Cotswolds and often causes us significant delays driving to or from London which we do regularly. Best to be aware of these things when planning.

I have never been to Sissinghurst but given the traffic on our roads, it does seem a very long drive. If you are set on going there then fine but don't pay much heed to google maps estimates!

If you are up for other suggestions , I would take a look at the New Forest.

I'd double check re the Oxford car hire / construction mess near the station -- it is quite likely the rental company would pick you up at the station. Before booking I'd ring them up and ask. I know that Hertz often does and Enterprise almost always will. Though the Enterprise locations in Oxford a some distance from the station so maybe not??

Crellston, Thank you for the heads up, we also considered taking the train to Bath and overnighting there- maybe a better solution? We would still love to visit Oxford but it could be done
on our way to Burford or is this too much backtracking? Just trying to see how to fit it in or just omit for now (something has to give ?)
As far as Sissinghurst, it is on my bucket list ( I am a retired landscape architect and absolutely love all the English gardens).
Janis, I will ring the car rentals and see if they can pick us up at the hotel on the day we leave- we would not need the car on the first day but will just pick it up the day after our arrival as we head to the Cotswolds.
I also read your trip report about your visit to Sissinghurst and Chelsea flower show. We can reverse our tour so that we can begin in London and attend the show, but just saw so many reviews as to how crowded and uncomfortable it is- and difficult to see the displays. We did not want to fight the crowds in this case but did love the fact so many stores decorate with flowers at the entrances- looked lovely! Your thoughts...
Can't thank you guys enough!

One last thing, if driving around these parts is crowded and full of traffic, is it better to just stay put in the place where we want to visit most? For example, if we want to see the museums in Portsmouth just stay there and not in Salisbury. If we want to visit Dover castle then stay in Dover and not try to go from Sissinghurst to Dover?
Am I interpreting this correctly?

Logically Beachy Head would come between Portsmouth and Sissinghurst but driving from Salisbury to Sissinghurst will take over 4 hours at the best of times, maybe longer. So you can't really fit a decent stop at Portsmouth and a walk at Beachy Head into the same day. Building in an overnight somewhere between Portsmouth and Beachy Head would work, except that means a one night stop and you may well not want to do that. I don't know then south coast well enough to suggest somewhere but I'm sure others will.

I can’t post much right now- having lunch with a couple of friends- but re Chelsea- you simply cannot avoid crowds. Things do thin out just a bit later in the afternoon. If you join the RHS you can attend on members days which are slightly less crowded. Late afternoon early evening the crowds are definitely more manageable. Is Chelsea very crowded - yes. But I wouldn’t miss it if you can possibly fit it in.

Thank you John- we were going to do Portsmouth as a full day when staying in Salisbury, and then on our travel day to Sissinghurst we were considering stopping at Beachy Head to see the cliffs as you suggested. I used google map and the time shown was 2 hrs. and 40 minutes, but I guess not taking into account traffic. I had chosen Salisbury as our base while in this area because of what it has to offer but maybe staying in Portsmouth is better. Then on our travel day from Portsmouth to Sissinghurst we can stop a t Beachy Head to walk the cliffs- google map says total travel time via Beachy head is 3 hrs. 20 minutes, add traffic time?

Janis- thank you for your input on Chelsea flower show :tu:

Last year I completed a 10-11 day road trip over a similar circuit to what you are planning, also in late May. There were a few one night stop-overs which I had very nervously planned as I have always typically sworn by and done the 3-4 night base from which to explore. But it turned out absolutely fine once prepared with the mindset that is how it is going to be.

A few tips come to mind.

Having spent time in London first, I picked up a car at LHR and stayed in Oxford driving in off the A40 from the north onto Branbury Road. As I stayed in accommodation a 6 minute walk from the centre of Oxford I had no issues with traffic or car parking. I left the same way and it was easy. This same road is also on a bus route into the city, and so you could choose to park the car in this residential area (use JustPark app) and explore without staying overnight. Burford is very close by and a gorgeous choice.

The app JustPark is fantastic for finding someone's driveway to rent for a few hours. The only time I could squeeze in a visit to Bourton-on-the the-Water was to arrive around lunchtime and it was during the Spring half-term school holiday.. would you believe? I knew it was going to be very very busy, not ideal, and parking a real problem. JustPark came to the rescue and I was able to quietly slip into a lovely lady's driveway a 3 minute walk into the town centre.

The focus of my trip was to visit many of the great gardens and not to feel rushed. I stayed in Chipping Campden, a 5 minute drive from Hidcote and Kiftsgate gardens, and Snowshill Manor. Mottisfont Rose Gardens and Hinton Ampner (both National Trust) are worth a visit, en route from Salisbury and close to Winchester. East Sussex is a goldmine of great English gardens, do consider visiting Great Dixter and RHS Wisley if you have time.

The Seven Sisters was an absolute highlight. I stopped at 3 different locations to view these magnificant cliffs to get a variety of perspectives. If you were to break your journey between Salisbury and Sissinghurst you could stay in the small medieval village of Alfriston (a delight in itself). From there it is a short drive to Seven Sisters Country Park where you park the car and then walk to Cuckmere Haven (the best outlook to the East). Then onto Birling Gap for another view, and then to Beachy Head with stunning views to the West. Perhaps add Battle to the drive for some famous history.

Do go to the Chelsea Flower Show, it is mind blowing!

You are going to have a wonderful time!

Now we've moved on to apres lunch shopping (we hear Nordstrom calling ;) ) but a follow on to KathNZ's excellent post . . . absolutely 100% try to fit in RHS Wisley. It is right off the M25 and a wonder. If one is only minimally interested in gardens it is a 2.5-3 hour stop but for garden fans plan on most of a day. It is enormous.

KathNZ- Oh my , how wonderful to hear you did a similar trip and it worked out great. I am going to look at all the places you mentioned and see how I can set it up. One question, so you moved around within the Cotswolds ? I see you mentioned Burford and Chipping Campden - did you stay in both places?
Janisj, looks like I will now convince my group to go to the Chelsea flower show which puts us in London first- so I can then drive easily to wherever:)

I did visit Burford but based in Chipping Campden to cover the northern part of the Cotswolds and then again nearer to Bath to cover the southern end. Painswick is worth visiting with the Painswick Rococo Garden close by and also the Garden at Miserden. Painswick is more or less off the main tourist track but popular on the Cotswolds Way for walkers. A local lady I met walking her dogs told me I should continue my drive south along the ridge on Slad Road for views and to stop for a refreshment at the very old Woolpack Inn frequented by English poet and author Laurie Lee, which I duly did.
I spent one night in a pub called 'The Fox Goes Free'... love the name... located close to West Dean Gardens near Chichester (and not too far from Portsmouth). The Weald and Downland Living Museum is also located there where they film The Repair Shop.

I would not split between Chipping Campden and Burford -- they are only about 20 miles / a 30-35 minute drive apart and packing / moving wouldn't make a lot of sense.

Painswick on the other hand is a lovely village village with some quite steep/narrow roads, and is a slow 30 miles from both Chipping Campden and Burford - it easily takes an hour to drive from either to Painswick (an old time Fodorite lives there and I've visited her home)

Depending on how long in total you plan on staying in the Cotswolds it might or might not make sense to move accommodations. I tend not to anywhere in the area, but have done so once or twice.

Having just seen a reference to it in another internet post reminded me to suggest Great Dixter to you. It is another absolutely splendid garden not very far from Sissinghurst - some would say it's better.

It's about 30 minutes from Sissinghurst but looking at the map reminded me that Rye would be the outstanding place to stay in the area. a beautiful old town close to the coast and close enough to commute to the two gardens and to Dover for the castle, although not all three in a day.

Thank you, thank you, thank you- this input is exactly what I needed! Well, I have changed my trip around so that we visit London first and now I can attend the Chelsea Flower Show- so excited!!!
KathNZ- and Janissj- thanks for your replies, I will only be staying in one village in the Costwolds- Burford. It has a good location for visiting Oxford, Hidcote, Blenheim Palace. We do want to tour Bath however, it is further south ( about 1 hr but longer with traffic maybe ?) I could cut a day short in Burford and move, but not liking overnight stays, I think we just commute for the day and return to Burford- thoughts?
John- love the idea of staying in Rye- what a lovely little town. This will certainly allow me to see Sissinghurst, Dover and of course with everyone's recommendation- Great Dixter. I wish I could add all the wonderful gardens you all have mentioned but with a limited time frame and so not to overwhelm my fellow non-gardening companions, I am limiting my choices :)
I have narrowed down to the following itinerary- the glitch is that I may need to eliminate something unless we decide to add a night to our trip (I'm waiting to hear from my group if we can add) Thinking if I eliminate anything it could be Salisbury ?
Day 1- Arrive London
Day 2- Tour London
Day 3- Chelsea Flower Show
Day 4- Tour London
Day 5- Rent car and drive to Burford- (overnight). Visit Oxford on the way (use JustPark APP for parking)
Day 6- Burford (overnight)- Visit Blenheim palace and Hidcote ( if time allows)
Day 7- Burford (overnight)- Drive to Bath and tour (or move and overnight in Bath?)
Day 8- Drive to Salisbury (overnight)- on the way to Salisbury visit Stonehenge, tour Salisbury (Cathedral, Magna Carter ) in the afternoon after our arrival
Day 9- Drive to Alfriston (2 hr total time -overnight)- on the way to Alfriston stop and visit Portsmouth Museum ( using Alfriston as a base for seven sisters walk )
Day 10-Drive to Rye (overnight)- on the way to Rye stop and do the Seven Sisters Walk ( is this doable in this allotted time?)
Day 11Rye (overnight)- Visit Sissinghurst and Great Dixter
Day 12- Rye (overnight) - visit Dover
day 13- Return to London and take train to Paris for family reunion
Thoughts...

What I might do for Days 7, 8, 9. and 10

Day 7- Burford (overnight)

Day 8- Drive to Salisbury (overnight there). Visit Bath and Stonehenge en route. Leave Burford early AM and arrive at Bath by 9:30 or 10 AM. Leave Bath by 2:30 PM, Drive to Stonehenge, arriving about 3:30 PM. Spend 1.5 to 2 hrs at Stonehenge arriving at Salisbury at 5:30-ish. Maybe go to Evensong. Total drive time for the day would be about 3 hours.

Day 9- Visit Salisbury Cathedral in the morning Drive to Alfriston via Portsmouth. Overnight Alfriston . Do Seven Sisters walk that evening. It will be daylight until well after 9 PM so you can easily do the walk before dinner.

Day 10-Drive to Rye (overnight)-

I think you have a great itinerary, and not too rushed or crammed at all. The trip back to Burford from Bath seems to be back tracking a bit, as the A36 exit from Bath to Salisbury is very quick and straighforward. On the other hand, returning to Burford from Bath in the late afternoon gives you additional opportunity to pass through/explore some more gorgeous cotswold villages.

I do suggest you arrive in Bath as early as possible in the morning. By lunchtime the historic centre where the Roman Baths are located is jammed packed with day tourists, possibly off the tour coaches. I had a timed ticket for the baths for 10.30am, but at 10am they just waved me in as very few people were around. There are several Park and Ride carparks. I entered the Lansdown P&R from the North (to avoid driving through Bath) where a shuttle bus comes and goes every 15 minutes to take you straight into the historic centre. I did leave driving through Bath but let the google map voice do the thinking.

I am so pleased that Rye was suggested for you. It is a wonderful town with a fascinating history. I've visited a few times, and stayed 2 nights on my road trip last year at Jeakes House B&B. It is a truely lovely place right in the most historic part of Rye and 2 steps across the road from the Mermaid Inn

Alfriston is really not too far from Rye and you will have ample time to do any choice of walk at the Seven Sisters. I managed this as well as fitting in a two hour stop over in Eastbourne for lunch, a tour of Battle Abbey on the way, and still ariving in Rye around 4pm.

I missed Janisj's post while writing, and fully endorse her suggestion for Day 7 and 8. In fact the Day 8 suggestion is exactly what I did... although instead of Evensong I went to Mottisfont Rose Garden taking advantage of the extended daylight hours. The Day 7 suggestion also gives you an additional day to explore the Cotswolds.

Glad I have been able to help a little Jenny. I might see you at Chelsea?! I'll be there on Tuesday, Wednesday and late on Thursday.

Yes JohnEW, your input is very helpful for sure! Where will you be in Chelsea- at a display or just visiting?
I think we are set now and could not have developed such an exciting itinerary without everyone's assistance -we are very thankful for your time and expertise.
Off to book accommodations and I see KathNZ has suggested a place in Rye :)
Thank you once again!

Jenny - I will be volunteering at the WaterAid garden, which will be highlighting rainwater harvesting. WaterAid is a charity I have been involved with for 42 years. My wife and I will be there explaining the garden to visitors on shifts on the Tuesday and Wednesday and back late on Thursday for an after show reception.

John, rainwater harvesting is such an important topic- hope I can get a chance to stop by and say HI :)

We are doing part of this trip in the end April, but I am so envious you are going to the Chelsea flower show, going in May didn't work for us!
We are staying in Oxford, Burford,( thanks, janisj!) and Bath, visiting Stonehenge and Salisbury and finishing in London.

Chellston, thanks about the warning about Oxford. We were planning on taking a cab to Enterprise car rental upon leaving Oxford but it sounds like we should allow for delays.
Enjoy!

Enterprise will pick you up

sure its crowded but Id go again in a heart beat -so worth it.
just to add another venue for WW11 Blexley. I dalways wantedt o go to Sissinghurst and it took me 30 years afte rmy first visit to london to get there. .A dream realized

Just noted this
Magna Carter would be a larger man who runs a cart
Magna Carta would be a very large document (which is what it is)
wonderful image :-)

Salisbury cathedral is normally approached from within the town. If you have time, walk in (or out and in) from the water meadows. I think the cathedral is sublime but rising out of the the grass with the town behind it gives an idea of what the builders would have seen.

Look out for the new infinity font and how well it fits into this ancient building.