As bad as Medicare and Social Security finances are, consider this factoid via the WSJ:
By 2024, fully half of the now 455 million + inhabitants of the EU will be TOTALLY dependent on GOVERNMENT PENSIONS for ALL of their income.
That's way more than scary.
M

BTilke, that doesn't sound too good. In 8 years of living near Antwerp, the only thing that has happened was that someone threw a brick through the car window at night. Nothing stolen, just vandalism. But I live outside the city. I do know a few people who have been car-jacked; forced to hand over their car at gunpoint. Burglaries too. Most of the gangs that operate here, come from Eastern Europe. There's a whole organisation behind some of those gangs.

Ira; is that number of 2.6 for Washington correct? That seems amazingly high. Perhaps there's more petty crime here, more murders in the USA?

To answer degas' question:

As ever, it's pointless generalising about "Europe": there's no more a common explanation for the alleged growth in crime than there are common practices around engagement rings.

"Alleged" is important. In Britain, many sensible, unbiased commentators claim there hasn't been an increase in crime recently - just an increase in police reporting crime (not least because the government's constant meddling is making the police a lot better at keeping records, rather than actually doing anything about the crime). The source many people depend on more - the National Crime Survey, which asks people about crimes they've suffered from - actually shows declines in many cases.

What these surveys seem to show is that while robberies are declining, seriously violent crime (traditionally utterly insignificant here) is rising slightly, as is a whole pile of things that are more violent loutishness than normal crime.

Unemployment obviously can't be a cause of whatever crime might be growing, since unemployment in Britain is declining. Only purblind bigots blame immigration: the yobs that make many people's lives a misery are very obviously white and from familes that've been here for many generations (even though second and third generation black and Pakistani-origin boys have exceptionally high crime rates, most other immigrant groups - and black and Pakistani-origin girls - have below-average offending rates).

Middle England has a clutch of explanations. First the media's worship of violence and the worst sort of pointless values. Second, the lethal cocktail of increasingly cheap and increasingly available booze combined with the criminalisation of drugs (no-one, even in today's insane world, kills or goes into prostitution to pay for a packet of cigarettes). Third, the last 20 years' changes in our economy have made life better for most people. But there's a clutch of poorly-educated boys who realise opportunities for them have got fewer just as they're getting physically capable of becoming a serious nuisance to the rest of us. And last, the conversion of what was once a people's constabulary into a rule-bound, CCTV-watching, report-writing, state militia.

Point is, though, these are mostly UK-specific. Most of continental Europe has fared worse economically in the past 20 years, but hasn't created Britain's yob culture in spite of much higher youth unemployment, for example.

"Crime" isn't just one thing that rises or falls in response to a few influences: it's a host of unpleasant activity that develops differently in differernt places.

Hi tulips,

>is that number of 2.6 for Washington correct? That seems amazingly high. <

I took that number from a US govt website, which of course I should have cited, and now can't retrieve. (I apologize)

>Perhaps there's more petty crime here, more murders in the USA? <

I think that the availability of guns in the US accounts for high homicide rates. However, violent crime has been steadily dropping as our baby-boomers and mini-baby-boomers have gotten older.

Hi crefloors

>Can anyone tell me the murder rate in Molvania?<

No. They don't keep records.

>I have my plane tickets and wonder how safe I will be.<

If you are flying Air Molvania, you would be safer in a gang of murderers.

Crefloors, You are going to Molvania!!!! How jealouse I am. I imagine you are counting the minutes.

A trip of a lifetime for sure.

Crefloors, on small favor, please. Would you mind to terribly picking me up on of those new stylish sandals the Movanians are all wearing now. Surely you know the ones I mean. Sole made out of old tires. Rope wrapped around sole and than brought over the foot and tied. Remember, another poster said she heard that they will be featured in the next Vogue magazine.

If you could dear one, I would be eternally grateful. And don't worry about size. If too big I can just have the local gas station or whoever cut them down to size.

Thanks in advance. And a good vacation to you. Don't forget to give us a report on your return. Well, assuming you do return! So in closing, safe journey dear one.

DC still remains the murder capital of the US. Though I've lived in the area (for a year in DC) most of my life and always feel safe, you just know to stay out of certain areas where there are gang/drug issues.

From yesterday's washigntonpost article: "Murders in Washington declined from 264 in 2002 to 248 in 2003, a decline of 6 percent. But there were slight increases in the numbers of rapes and robberies, the FBI said."

About 564,000 people live in DC, so the rate per 1,000 (if I'm doing math correctly?) is .44?

Ira: actually, as I understand it, one MUST BE a convicted criminal to be a pilot for Molvanian Airlines..

LoveItaly: I will be so pleased to bring your rubber shoes for you. Will be going down to Cotati to see my brother soon so will be goin right through Vacaville...will be happy to drop them off to you...I'll fling them out of the car on my way by.

crefloors, you a such a good friend. I do not know how to thank you! But, um, throwing them out of the car on 1-80, may I ask and please don't take offense. Where should I stand along 1-80 to catch them. I mean, um, what if "someone" thinks they are just rubbish...in fact thinking about this...I don't want you to get a ticket for littering.

Problems, problems, problems! Could we meet at some "secret" place, you know, the kind of place noone in Vacaville goes to. A McDonald's maybe??

Anxiously awaiting your reply. And again, you take good care!

holy moley! so much crime! here in northern california's wine country I leave my car unlocked with my cell phone in it and occasionaly my purse. The front door gets locked at night but almost never during the day. The worst thing that's happened to me is that someone stole the basket I leave on the sidewalk filled with surplus garden veggies for the neighbors.
We talk about moving to somewhere more afforable but everywhere else is sounding kinda scary.

LoveItaly: I know...the Nut Tree!!!!! That's a perfect place to meet for all things Molvania, since it isn't there anymore...well, the building is but...

crefloors,isn't that just like you! The NutTree that isn't there anymore.

Honestly, what can I say? But there is a Denny's down the road from the old Nut Tree. I know that would be "upscale" compared to the restaurants in Molvania, but hey friend, I am game if you are!

Our crime experiences all happened when we lived in the Ixelles area of Brussels and then close to the Place Louise, in what is technically St. Gilles (St. Gilles has some very nice bits and some very NOT nice bits). However, once we moved over to the green and serene Woluwes, we had no further crime problems (although I stll felt safer during the six months we lived in a residential suburb of a medium sized German town). So actually, all our crime encounters occurred during our first three years in Brussels.
Stardust, re the British car break-ins, these happened mostly to empty parked cars, not while people were driving.

We're about to say goodbye to Belgium...I just became "street legal" in the UK, having received my indefinite leave residency visa yesterday. So I guess we'll see what kind of criminals we'll encounter in Berkshire...none, I hope!

Good luck with your move BTilke!

BTIlke, after your dramas in Belgium, I think you'll find Maidenhead rather dull!

I read your comment about British cars being broken into - do you think the right hand drive just makes them look like tourists' cars? As we all know, there's nothing a thief likes better than a tourist, and tourist cars potentially full of luggage and expensive cameras...

BTilke, I'm curious if a tourist would ever have cause to visit Ixelles or Place Louise. I'm suitably warned in any event!

As for Rome road safety and that of other Italian cities, I heard a while ago that Italy was the only EU country in which traffic death rates were increasing; I don't know if that is still the case. Many posts here have praised the skill of Italian drivers - obviously skill cannot compensate for the laws of physics.

I thought this article about traffic safety in Europe in general was interesting:
http://www.who.dk/eprise/main/WHO/Me...intView=1&
I suspect traffic accidents are probably the number one cause of death and injury among tourists to Europe, far exceeding murder or assault certainly, but does anyone have a statistic for that?

Off thread story.

nytraveler : "...drug dealers down on the corner at 3AM...I have always found them to be perfectly polite."

OH, Man, is that ever true! We once asked for a jump-start on our rental car (after leaving the lights on) and the nice young man who helped us start the car asked if we wanted to buy any [slang word for crack cocaine - I had to ask for a translation].

We laughed and then wondered if we should be in fear, instead.

We had seen him standing around when we parked, but thought little of it. He had been there >3 hours during our dinner.
Apparently, sales were a little slow at that time of night - and he was "just working his way through college". Maybe law school?

Okay, back to sadistics...