Colduphere, how do you know me? I'm unfamiliar with your screen name and don't believe we have met in person.

I even clicked on your name to see if we have contributed to the same threads. But your contributions are mostly to Lounge topics, eg.:

"What's the view from your house?" and
"Would you change anything about your wedding?"

...unless you count Europe posts such as "Netherlands hygiene"

None of these being QUITE my line of country, I'm wondering -- quite uncritically -- how we're acquainted. Esp. as I'm on Fodor's about 1/10th as much as I was 3-4-5 years ago.

SCENE:
Bank Street in downtown Ottawa
TODAY - Saturday afternoon, Feb 23, '08, 2:15 pm

I am walking home to the Glebe from my gym at the Clarica Centre on Bank Street. Bank Street north of the Queensway is a scene of mild, and occasionally profound, human misery.

I am passing a modest-looking middle-aged couple and overhear the woman say to her husband:

"Ottawa sure has changed. It used to be classy. Not anymore! Now it's...it's A DUMP!"

I burst out laughing.

"Don't EVER say that on Fodor's! You'll get stomped." I say to the surprised couple. We smile ruefully and continue on our ways.

In all seriousness, tedgale, I've never heard of Ottawa spoken of in such a derogatory way. My knowledge of the city is extremely limited, so unless the job's a no-go, I want to learn as much as I can about the city.

When I asked you why you thought it was a dump, it was with sincerity. I welcome all opinions/insight about Ottawa...including any negatives.

Bloom

ps- the scenario you recounted in your last post...that didn't <b>really</b> happen did it? :-?

1. Yes, it absolutely did happen this afternoon. Word of honour.

2. OK, it's not like this was a toxic waste dump peopled by mutant sex-killers. When I say &quot;dump&quot;, I don't mean it's unsafe here or that your health will suffer. Just that I find it -- as others evidently do not -- disappointing, smug, self-satisfied, banal and SO grim architecturally.

TG

Met at MSSD, both ran on canal, male, initials GB

OK now I'm intrigued. MSSD closed down 24 years ago!

Curiously enough, I ran in to my old MSSD boss Rick Van Loon, lately President of Carleton University, at the NAC last night.

I'll start working through my MSSD mental honour-roll for a name:
Gordon Smith
Bruce Rawson
Marilyn Watters
Barry Carin
Jean Pierre Kingsley
Scott Serson
Ron Doering
Jim Miller
Jim Martin
Richard Stursberg
Kathy O'Hara
Michael Sabia
Francine Bertrand
Merielle Bradford
Lynne Elliott-Sherwood
Laurette Goulet
Ray Protti
David Good
Ken Stein
Dann Michols
Brenda Lundman
Nate Laurie
Jane Heintzman
Cecil Rabinovitch
Paul Becker...(was that the name of that fat man who went to jail for fraud???)............

TG - I will call if you are in the book. I was over at your place with J Fil-- and R She--- but you are right. Long time ago. Maybe you have moved from the nice place in Sandy Hill. No use boring readers here anymore.

I'm not in the book but I am on facebook with a wide-open page that lists my email address, which I will give here too:
[email protected]

Coldupher, Tedgale,

We're all intrigued . . . please let us know &quot;the rest of the story.&quot; It's pretty cool when Fodorites know each other.

Inquiring minds want to know . . . I could probably think up a few more cliches if it would help.

Thanks,
Sandy (in Denton)

Sandy

Ted and I worked in the same Canadian government department for a few months in 1984. They closed the department and we scattered in different directions. But we both jogged along the Rideau Canal at lunch for years and would periodically give each other the joggers wave (joggers do that in a daze almost not knowing who they are waving at).

The coincidence is doubly remarkable:

I'm now retired, as I mentioned, and work out regularly -- well, obsessively -- at my gym, as mentioned above.

A couple of weeks ago, I was walking down the very street mentioned above, on my way home from the gym, when I recognized colduphere.

Hadn't seen him in years. I once was a marathoner but don't run much now (bad knee).

I did not speak, as I did not think he recognized or remembered me. And indeed he may not have recognized me -- time plays cruel tricks with one's appearance.

Next time I'll stop.

Col &amp; Ted,

Thanks for filling us in . . . isn't life interesting? This is another reason to always do good, you never know who is watching and will remember you!

Sandy (in Denton)

A few weeks ago on the news (either CTV or CBC) I was rather dismayed to see a story aboot Ottawa having the reputation of being the rudest city in Canada.

Due to fine Ottawan Fodorites like Colduphere and tedgale, I know that has to be wrong. ;)

That's pretty cool that you two know each other. Except that it's made me paranoid about having vented about people in here.

e.g. My Inconvenient Goof rant.

My landlord told me he used to teach computer courses. When he dropped by the other day (for the 385th time this week), he stood in front of my laptop for some time.

Guess what page I had open on my screen.

(:|

Bloom

I would be proud to be thought a Canadian. I loved Ottawa when we visited. And Toronto whem I lived in Buffalo. And Montreal when I was there.....I think, in general, the Canadians are more genteel and well-mannered (exception:hockey). Americans tend to be more brash and swagger more.....by the way, everyone knows the capital of USA is Philadelphia.

I guess I'm a city girl, but I have learned not to respond to anyone on the streets no matter where I am. I live near DC and do try to be helpful if I see someone obviously lost. Tried to help out a young woman recently whom I assumed spoke Spanish. she looked at me blankly when I tried my (very ) limited Spanish. A moment later I asked her homeotwn and she replied &quot;Haiti&quot; (french speaking)
She must have thought i was nuts. I could have simply been Canadian.

We just returned from a 10 day trip to Paris and had the ring scam done in front of us three times. The first time my husband was trying to be nice to help the woman, but the doorman came running when he saw what was going on. The same scam was attempted on a colleague three times. Add to that we witnessed a French woman mugged at 2:30 in the afternoon. She screamed when a young woman stole her purse and ran after her jumping on her back and taking her to the sidewalk. Nice area, busy street, people all around, broad daylight.

You're quite obviously American, that's why you're the victim of scamers. If you were Canadian, they would shy away from you, but better always wear that Canadian pin. If you're Québécois you just carry your baguette like everybody else...
May I say Welcome to this forum. :-)

Yawn... this thread is 3-4 years old!

Another newbie drags up an old thread. It's a good thing we have logos for comic relief!! :)

Oh, please..lots of threads are three or four years old including those "what to wear" ones...some questions and experiences just never EVER seem to get "outdated"

While the thread is three or four years old, Annie pointed out that this scam occurred weeks ago. It is relevant to travelers, just not you erudite posters. Don't open the link if it involves something as disdainful as something that you are aware of already. Or don't post. Either will help this site immensely.

You can be scammed in Paris, you can be scammed in Amsterdam, you can be scamnmed in London, you can be scammed in Barcelona, you can be scammed in Madrid, you can be scammed in Rome....about the only places I have not had this happen to me are Germany, Austria, Switzerland.

In Paris, my biggest culprit are those, I believe they are gypsies, who walk up to you in the street and say, "Speak English." Generally, I answer using my best German, you would be so proud of me Logos, nein, sprech zie deutsch? Usually they walk away. Other times, I yell to them, "Get the you know what away from me before I call the police." Why do they only try to pull this garbage on people who speak English?

This really confuses them if you're a westerner:

你会说普通话吗？

>sprech zie deutsch?
You usually answer "Sprechen Sie eine vernünftige Sprache"
("Do you speak a resonable language" i.e. a language humans usually speak)

So they know instantly that you're German and won't bother you again, that's easy. :-)

LOL logos.

We always just speak Spanish to people who ask us if we speak English. We aren't usually targetted by the "do you speak English?" people though - I think that they are looking for Americans and most people seem to have the impression that Americans are on the tall side - my husband and I are very short, so I think we fly below the radar a lot (pun intended).

I agree though that these sorts of threads are important. There are a lot of people who aren't as savvy about these scams and need the information.

As for why people try to pull these scams only on the Engligh-speaking, I think that it is probably because they are looking for Americans who have the reputation for being on the naive side and also for wanting to be helpful. Perfect combo for scammers. Also, a lot of Americans seem to have an obsession with meeting the locals - so when someone comes up to talk to them, they are quick to engage.

I'm not sure I agree....these scams seem to be aimed at anybody who speaks English (they don't ask are you American, they come up to you and say, Speak English)......it's simple...just say No comprendre or nein or whatever or no parlez......

I'm not sure where all this "they mainly look for Americans" comes from. I have a Japanese friend who says they mainly go for Japanese because they think the Japanese are more gullible and also rich and also more friendly. And actually when I've passed by what appears to be the ring or similar scam being pulled in Paris -- it does seem like the targets have often been Asians.

I think the bottom line is they go for anyone who is probably a tourist and therefore probably has money (in their mind). I would guess that if it is strictly Americans someone targets it's as likely to be because of the belief that all Americans are wealthy as it is anything else.

That scam is extraordinarily common in Paris right now. I've been subjected to it three times in the space of ten minutes in some cases. They target anyone who they think might be a tourist (I'm not a tourist, but they are too stupid to recognize that). Americans are not the wealthiest tourists in Paris these days, so it's not that.

They are not very good at it, as I easily see them bending down, pretending to find the ring that they drop from their hand, and then getting back up. But I know people who have fallen for it and have given them a few euro despite the fact that it's an obvious scam.

Paris is very much awash in scammers lately; it must be because of the depression. Most of them are gypsies.

There's still the "Do you speak English?" scam, which Americans routinely fall for, and the "Please sign this" scam, which provides a way of hiding their hands as they pick your pockets. And so on. Also, there's a new rash of shell-game con artists in the city, particularly around the Eiffel Tower and Pont d'Iéna, last time I saw. On one day, there were no less than eight shell-game scammers on one bridge. And they all appeared to have victims (although it's hard to tell who the victims are and who are just shills).

None of these crooks is dangerous, but they are very annoying. Be extremely wary of any interaction with any stranger if you are carrying any money or other valuable items. In the Métro, almost all the purse snatching currently is not actually purse snatching, but iPhone and smartphone snatching (50% of incidents), so beware about that, too.

Most of the scams involve no violence, but the iPhone snatchers are sometimes very aggressive, grabbing a phone and running off with it. In one recent case, the crook grabbed a woman's phone and she lost her balance and fell down a flight of stairs in the subway, and later died. The RATP (transit authority) has put up signs recommending that people not take out their iPhones and smartphones while riding the Métro.

Allthough it won't stop it, a few sting operations by the police to get these vermin off the streets might help somewhat. Surely the police can assign undercover officers to the tourist spots and the metro or is it tyhat they don't really care what happens to the tourists?

The assertion that the scammers who go around asking people if they speak English are looking for Americans specifically is just a theory - relax.

Many of the scams they run are not strictly illegal. There's nothing illegal about handing you an incredibly ugly ring and insisting you keep it, then asking you for money. It's just panhandling. Some of the things they do are illegal, such as pickpocketing, but there are a lot more crooks than there are police, and police also have to worry about more serious crimes.

Sometimes action is taken. One person who was running a ring of panhandling children, forcing them to beg during the day (instead of going to school) and beating them if they didn't produce enough revenue, was sent to prison for 30 years a few years ago. But successes like that are rare. (The scammers like to use children for their scams because they know that they won't be prosecuted or sent to jail.)

They target anyone who looks naive and appears to have something worth stealing. Americans aren't as common or as wealthy as they used to be, although they're still just as naive. Wealthy Chinese or Middle Eastern tourists are just as likely to be scammed these days (especially since they often carry a lot of their money in cash). The Chinese in particular, coming from a very different society and thus not knowing what to be careful about, are easy pickings for the crooks.

It's just goes to show you should learn to say, "Please" "Thank You" and "Go Away" in several langauges.

Old thread or not - I have read this with interest as I prepare for my first solo trip to Paris. And I have to say it has dampened my enthusiasm for the trip. I am a hobbyist photographer - but now fear taking my DSLR equipment. Heck, I am now even worried about stopping to take a picture using my little point and shoot camera. I don't mind firmly rebuffing (and loudly) any stranger who approaches me - and I travel with my passport and credit cards in a waist belt and try to be vigilant in crowds - but the thought of repeatedly having to deal with this as an older solo woman traveler isn't fun. What about inside the museums? I assume since there is a cost to get in, the career scam artists and pickpockets will only be outside?

No one has ever tried to approach me with such a scam nor have I ever had a problem in Paris. That's because I'm not receptive to such things and don't look it. A lot of tourists brings this on themselves, they are always doing stupid things. LIke the OP, for example, actually initiated a conversation about that ring with the person. And obviously in English, I would guess. Now how stupid can you be. I don't talk to riffraff on the streets nor strangers on bridges or paths picking up rings, etc., but a lot of tourists do and that's their problem.

I'm an older solo woman, it's because a lot of people ask for it. I never have to deal with it and I don't carry things in a waist best. It's really how you act and look and whether you do things like the OP.

Now I don't much look like a tourist, though, and there isn't much you can do about that if you carry cameras around. I don't, and I don't carry guidebooks or maps or things like that which people can see. I do carry a small local city mapbook in my purse, but lots of locals do that.

nancy: Don't let these things worry you, just use them as a reminder to be aware. Sounds like you're planning to take normal precautions. I've never had a problem in Paris, but certainly don't discount those that have. Just be aware, download your pics nightly to minimize the risk of true loss (a good pic is harder to replace than the camera that took it). You may feel a little "b*tchy", but just ignore people on the street that try to stop you and talk to you. If they're truly lost there is likely someone nearby much better than you to help them find their way.