Please tell me about your experience with tours.
 

I am starting to plan my first trip to Italy with a girlfriend I have known for years. Looks like it will just be the 2 of us.

My friend wants to use a tour company because she thinks it will be easier to have them do the planning and arranging reservations.... We will be going to Venice, Florence and Rome (first trip for both of us). I do understand in many ways how it would be easier (especially since I do not speak Italian) and we will be on the move, will need tickets to certain things and want to see a lot of places. But a part of me feels like it will not be totally MY preference, and being a true fodorite and an admitted hotel snob - I like to plan things myself.

What are your experiences with this? Is it best for a first timer to use a tour company? Are their any that can get me tickets to the Vatican without having to wait in very long lines? What are good ones for hotel snobs like me? I am thinking less than 20 people. I don't want to spend thousands a night by any means, but I am thinking of a $8-10,000 budget for about 10 days, including air fare. I realize this is not a lot of time for 3 cities, but we are not retired yet. Thanks as always!

/bankbabe

Are there (not their). My apologies to my English teacher. ;)

Venice/Florence/Rome Could <i>not</i> be easier on your own. Fly in to Venice, train to Florence, train to Rome, fly home from Rome . . . easy peasy.

The main problem w/ most commercial tours (though not all) is they are VERY fast paced, start out early every morning, and lots of bus time.

I agree that Venice/Florence/Rome would be pretty easy to plan for yourself. But, my ex and his wife have taken Rick Steves tours and love love love them. They wouldn't dream of planning it on their own if they can get Rick's team to do it. Plus they love spending time with the other people on their tours.

I agree with Janis, and said so on your Lounge thread. Since you say you like to plan, then make the air, train and hotel reservations. And look into city day tours, they will make the arrangements for admission to those places with long lines. That would be a good compromise to your friend wanting a tour I think, and you will be spared bus rides in the early am, and hotels out in inconvenient places.

On your other thread you mention your friend is high maintenance. If that's the case, you'd have to take a very high end tour.

No, No and No! No tour company. Even on your first visit there, and speaking no Italian, Venice, Florence and Rome are extremely easy on your own. Go where you want, when you want. Do not be at the mercy of a tour schedule!

Your budget would be truly luxurious for me, and it will go even further by planning it yourself.

You can book tours of the Vatican in Rome, the Doges' Palace in Venice, etc. on your own and they will procure tickets for you. You can book tickets to the Uffizi, the Borghese, etc. ahead to save lines.

You can do a day trip to Siena or Pisa and Lucca easily, on your own.

Trains, are fast, cheap and very, very convenient. They go city center to city center. With your budget, just grab a taxi at the train station to your hotel.

Seriously, you should choose your own hotel, your own restaurants, your own sightseeing tours.

Thanks Janis and Belinda. that's what I am thinking - how hard can it be? I did the trains in Scotland and Ireland...

Rick Steves seems to be the popular tour company, but somehow it would seem too manufactured for me. If possible, I wanted a smaller more personalized company. Just the fact that I am considering a tour instead of planning my own, says I am willing to give in a little.

Thank you everyone!! :D Sassafrass and socaltraveler, I should print out this thread and show it to her, but I have already said she is high maintenance. LOL - Like me, she does hair and make up every day too but I think I can be convinced to keep it all in a 22" suitcase with rollers. Some of these tours make it seem like you are lugging your own bags up several slights of stairs. That is where I think it would be best if I picked the hotels because no elevator just wouldn't work for us.

You can always book day tours IN the various cities to get you in to places your friend thinks are too complicated to book yourselves.

So - an independently planned trip with some guidance along the way.

Maybe you could get some references from people who have been on the tours. I see on your other thread there is a regular poster who likes the RS tours. See if you can chat with her offline.

Easy trip to plan on your own if you are willing to do a little research. We flew into Venice, train to Florence (day trip to Sienna by bus), train to Rome (day trip to Ostia Antcia.) Booked all trains on Trentalia, booked all admissions (Uffizi, Academia, Vatican, Colosseum and Forum, on line or by phone with no problems. Hired private guides for Vatican (highly recommend) and the Jewish area.

Oh, for reference, I have done several tours. They were not high end, so your experience would be somewhat different. However, basic structure and negatives are the same.

If you were going to a less safe place or place that was difficult geographically, or with sights spread far apart, a tour would be fine, perhaps better.

You, however, are going to world centers of art and architecture, history, culture and food, all with great transportation and lots to see in one small location. Venice and Florence are actually very, very small. You can walk absolutely everywhere in only a few minutes. Even the center of Rome is not huge. We walk nearly everywhere there too.

The idea of a tour will never be popular here, but a friend of mine just did the Venice-Florence Rome trip with a small group tour and loved it.
http://www.discovermyitaly.com
I have no personal experience with it, but she was very pleased, and, based on her Instagram, the accommodations looked lovely. The group was composed entirely of women over 50--don't know if that was planned or accidental! My friend said the pace was fine.

The big drawback to self-planning this trip that I see is that bankbabe's friend says she'd prefer a tour. If bankbabe does all the planning, would she be the one hearing complaints if something is not ideal?

I second what NewbE just said as far as if you do not do a tour, your HM friend may be giving you alot of flak. If you do not do a tour, you will need to do quite a bit of planning and making arrangements for entrances to the venues you want to see.

Take a look at Rick Steves' My Way Tour of Italy.

Sass, once more.
You did Ireland on your own. Italy will be a breeze. The only difference is schedules in Italian and all you need to know are names of days. LOL.

Don't worry about keeping your suitcase to 22". I am small and still do 24" sometimes. I would rather have a 24" with space to put my tote inside when I land, and not have two things to bother with. There are always discussions about checking and carryon. I don't want the hassle of dealing with luggage on flights, or pulling it through the airport, so I check it in and relax. Then, except for the train, size does not matter. If you can lift it onto the train and put it on a rack, you will be fine. You only have to do that a couple of times anyway. You can always buy a new piece of very light, inexpensive luggage just for this trip. I saw a new 24" last week that is only 5 lbs. Probably silly to some, but I have no problem paying $60 or $70 for something extra to make an expensive trip easier or more fun.

Your friend is lucky to be going with you.

I am very much in the plan-it-yourself camp. That said, based on accounts from friends who've travelled with friends of longstanding (and experienced previously unknown sides of those friends), I'd proceed with caution. There can be definite downsides e.g. winding up feeling resentful for doing all the planning, differences in temperament (more/less adventurous) that impact enjoyment. With a tour there would be minimal back-and-forth re schedules, money, where to go for dinner, etc.

My sister who who was a first time traveler to Italy, went with a friend, is a fussy eater, likes touristy things, liked their Gate 1 tour with an identical agenda.

This is a trivial end of DYI tours of Italy. However, if you book expensive non-refundable items, such as air, without making sure the rest can be aligned to them, you can obliviously throw away 10% of your time in Italy. Many first timers do this. This would put avoidable time pressure into your itinerary which probably does not go well with your high maintenance friend :-)

>>> she thinks it will be easier to have them do the planning and arranging reservations

may I add "in their favor" to this statement. If your friend is picky in addition to high maintenance, incompatible tour is a bad match. Also, I don't know your age group, but tours tend to cater to "older" people. If you plan your own, you decide what to add and subtract depending on how the trip is going. With tour, someone else makes this decision - taking out what you care and adding things you rather not spend time on.

>>> Are their any that can get me tickets to the Vatican without having to wait in very long lines?

There are many parts of Vatican requiring different strategy.

The St. Peters Basilica itself requires no ticket. However, what bogs you down is the security check. If you only have a passing interest, the simplest way to avoid crowd is to enter well before 9am, preferably even earlier, when the first wave of mass tour groups arrive. The Basilica is generally open from 7am, however, there are many events modifying the schedule. Be sure to check their official site to make sure it is open to the public unless you are there to worship. Also, special events can change the visiting hours with a short notice. If you want to climb the Dome, it opens at 8am. It is very very popular and requires a separate ticket. The elevator only takes you up half-way. The remainder of more than 300 steps to the top requires walking up claustrophobic and sometimes steep stairs.

The Vatican Museum, from which you access the Sistine Chapel, requires reserved time slot. You can do this online. Otherwise you wait and wait or rely on hawkers who claim to get you in without wait with major cost adder.

There are numerous tours combining visits to different part of the Vatican.

NewbE, that is a great point... if bankbabe's friend only wants a tour, then if anything goes wrong (and it will... it always does), will she be on the hot seat?

Those are all super easy places to manage on your own. After having traveled with family - and doing the planning myself - there is a difference between 100% independent. For example, I like private walking tours because we go at our pace and can change it as needed. If we have no tours planned, you miss some of the really interesting historic stuff.

Group tours in a big city will include a bus trip around the city - looking at stuff. I would rather get out and walk it.

A few advantages of a group tour:
- if you don't know the travel style of your friend: departure times are set and she has to meet the group. If she is someone prone to being late or likes a late start and you like an early start, this is the compromise - bus leaves and so do you.
- expenses. You don't have to make any decisions and second guess yourself. The tour price is set.
- eating and food. Depending on the style of the tour, there may be a lot of food included or virtually none. But certainly takes the guesswork and negotiation out of meals when traveling with someone new.
- skip the lines.
- lots of information and historical context.

Disadvantages?
- overall loss of flexibility and ability to make changes on the fly.
- group tour. "if this is Tuesday, it must be Belgium". fast pace.
- meals. Loss of choice here.
- hotels. they decide.
- have to plan more in advance to avoid lines.
- requires much more planning on your part.


Personally, I would come up with a budget for hotels with her - maybe even give her a list of 3 or 4 in each city and let her make the final choice. Then find private tour guides for the things you are interested in. Build one 'activity' each day and then have a list of other things to do near the primary activity.

good luck!

This is a very easy itinerary to do on your own. If you are nervous about parts of it, make it easy on yourself and book car services to & form the stations. Or take a taxi. Stay in hotels with a good concierge. Then you will be fine.

Newbe makes an interesting point, though, re: snags and snafus. Will you be on the hook for fixing everything?

By the way, I was just in Venice and Rome among other places, not my first visit, but happened to stay at places that would be very likely to help newbies--if and when you need recs. The hotel in Rome even offered complimentary smart phones with maps and other info loaded into them. I have been to Rome a lot so didn't try them out.

>>ome of these tours make it seem like you are lugging your own bags up several slights of stairs. <<

Actually - most on tours you never touch your luggage (except to place it in the hallway very early in the AM - like 7:00 or 7:30. But don't even consider RS -- because he does expect people to handle their own bags.

<<The main problem w/ most commercial tours (though not all) is they are VERY fast paced, start out early every morning, and lots of bus time.>>

I don't know that that is true at all, I'd have to survey all the various kinds of tours available. First, many tours don't uses buses much anyway, the ones I took did not. I think the presumption here is that people are traveling long distances by bus, many tours aren't like that at all.

I took a couple tours and really liked them. One was to an area where I really would not go on my own, even today (well, I wouldn't go today) and that was Egypt. The other was supposedly an "easy" place (Ireland and Scotland and England) but I had never traveled hardly at all before then, this was when I started traveling. I did not come from a family where people traveled abroad, not did most people in the small Midwestern town I grew up in. And of course, that was pre-internet days when it really was a lot more difficult to plan things on your own.

I deliberately took tours that stayed in only a couple major cities for about 3 days each at a time and you had a lot of free time, including most meals. So you could do your own thing, but in a few cases where we were in the middle of nowhere, it was nice to have some people do have dinner with or go to the theater with, as a singleton. Now if you are with someone anyway, those issues aren't even there. The tour I was on had a general introductory tour in the city, and then a few excursions you could or could not sign up for, it was up to you. I did sign up for them in Egypt and Greece, those were the things you would sign up for if you had gone there on your own, anyway (local day tours). There were a lot of really nice and fun people on these tours I took (it was a budget tour, I thin you get a different kind of person on those). Wee did not take long bus rides except once between Edinburgh and down to London, stopped in the Lake Country for an overnight. That was really nice, though, as I couldn't have gotten to that area on my own, the bus was comfortable. IN Egypt, we took the train once, and flew another time (between Cairo and Athens). We only did bus trips for the local day trips, like anyone would. It actually was really nice to have someone handle all the transportation plans AND the luggage.

I don't see the reason you'd have to take a 22 inch luggage, unless you want to. I'm not high maintenance, but that's pretty small for me if you have various activities and possible weather scenarios. The whole point of tours is they handle stuff for you, not sure I get why you think you'd have to handle it yourself. Well, I travel on my own a lot now and still handle it myself and use a bigger bag than that (24 inch), so to each his own.

The tour company I took doesn't exist any more, it was through TWA Getaway tours, they were really good.

So I don't know what to tell you but it is true traveling is a heck of a lot easier now with the internet than when I took tours, but it also presumes you have some travel experience. As I said, I did not AT ALL, so taking a tour helped me get my feet wet, and was a great idea for me. It also is NOT true that tours are all fast paced, as some say. You can choose the type of tour you want. The ones I took were no more fast paced than when I travel on my own. I don't know Italy tours, but I'm sure there must be some that spend about 3 days in several major cities, which isn't my idea of fast paced.

Tours can sometimes get you in places more easily you couldn't on your own, or at least not without preplanning, that's true.

I'm not high maintenance and not remotely a hotel snob, though, so if you are, you either need a more expensive tour or maybe do not to book on your own.

Your trip doesn't sound that difficult to me that you'd need a tour, though, if you have some travel experience under your belt.

My SO did one or two of those stereotypical, overnight bus ride, one day in each major city tours when he was young and stationed in Europe. He was new to travel and they were cheap enough for him to afford and he appreciated them for what they were.

Higher end tours are NOTHING like that. Don't know why so many here think all tours are "fast paced" and feature bad food and crummy accommodation.

Perhaps I digress.

But as long as I'm digressing, why does Rick Steves insist on having people haul their own luggage??

Your requirements and your friend's desire for a tour has an upscale Tauck Tour solution.

Tauck has a 8 day (7 night) Venice(2), Florence(3), Rome(2) tour. Tauck also has arrive early and stay later so you could add a day to Venice and add a day or 2 to Rome.

http://www.tauck.com/tours/europe-to...bPage=Overview

http://www.tauck.com/tours/europe-to...Page=Itinerary

http://www.tauck.com/tours/europe-to...Accommodations

Tauck also has a 10 Day Tour which adds Lake Como which you might like.

http://www.tauck.com/tours/europe-to...bPage=Overview

you can do this on your own, especially if you two don't want to be with a stack of other people.

saying this, I have done Overseas Adventure Tours, with my mom, and they are small groups and very well done.

but these cities are very doable. get a good book, Rick Steves is fine, and figure it out. I often do VRBO's or Airbnb, but take your pick. hotels will generally be more expensive.

it is a fun adventure...you will learn a lot about each other!

save the tour for another alphabet (i.e. China, etc) and someplace that is a real headache to plan. this is breezy!

ok, just saw, a girl friend, not girlfriend. same suggestion tho

Mr. Wonderful and I booked a Trafalgar tour to Rome, Florence and Venice in 2014 and enjoyed it. We usually travel on our own and I do all the planning but due to work commitments did not have the time to plan so we took a chance. We chose the particular Trafalgar itinerary because transport between the 3 cities was by train--I would never put Mr. W on a bus for that long, we had a lot of time on our own and it fit into when I could take off work. I would have preferred a smaller group but that was a trade-off. Trip report is here if you are interested. http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...alian-tour.cfm

As suggested above we added 2 nights in Rome and one in Venice. Hotels were well-located, rooms were comfortable; at the hotel in Venice we were given our own little villa on a courtyard. We rolled our luggage between train station and hotels in Florence and Venice but tour mates helped those with big suitcases. We converted to 22" some years ago after having to lift our big bags onto the luggage racks on trains.

I would never dream of booking a tour in Europe, a safe and easy continent to navigate. But your high maintenance friend wants a tour. And traveling with a friend sometimes leads to compromise.

I have use two tours in Africa. The first was in Egypt in 2012. I was called Memphis tours, a local Egyptian agency. There were amazing especially considering how cheap it was despite including 4 stars hotel, a train down the Nile, a cruise, transport to Abu Simbel etc...

The second one is called Abercrombie and Kent. I used it in Tanzania for my honeymoon but they also have itineraries in Europe. It is luxurious traveling. Check out Abercrombie and Kent, it might be what you and your friend are looking for.

Hotel snob and high maintenance woman and would prefer a maximum group of 20: higher end tour or plan it yourself.

If you ask me (and you haven't really) I would eliminate Trafalgar, Rick Steves and Gate1 right off the bat.

Tauck, maybe.

If she is high maintenance you can definitely forget RS. I have enjoyed a few of his tours, but I prefer to take my (22 inch) bag to my room instead of waiting for it to arrive, or having to put it out in the corridor (where it could be stolen) early in the morning. You are also expected to be on time, all the time, or the tour will leave without you.

But I am wondering whether this trip is a good idea in the first place. Have you traveled with this friend before? Does she expect you to plan everything, and if so, why? Will she expect you to spend all your time with her? To conform to her schedule (if not constrained by a tour)?

Wanting a small group is likely to prove expensive.

I just glanced at the thread in the Lounge, and it's... just, wow. People who say they have never been on a tour, would never, etc. then go on to say "You sit on a bus all day and only see things through the window and never spend more than a day in any city."

What nonsense! I sincerely hope the OP takes what is said there with a grain of salt, a big one.

There ARE nice tours. Maybe OP will decide against one, maybe they're too expensive, whatever, but they do exist.

Thank you all for your great comments. I am digesting them all. I looked into Tauck and e-mailed her the itinerary for late May 2018. Also said there is RS (which makes you carry your own luggage) and I will look for another one, so she can see what it is all about.

From all the comments I am getting here and in the Lounge, I really am at the point of telling her it will be cheaper to plan ourselves. I have traveled a bunch, but mostly in the USA and Caribbean. I have only been to Europe once before and that was to Scotland and Ireland with DH and we managed just fine with our own hotel bookings (with the help of Am Ex platinum). No problem with train from Edinburgh to St. Andrews, and driving around Ireland on the Left side of the road.... It was fun.

Since we first began talking about this trip, she went ahead and bought another condo - and THEN said she thought a tour would be less expensive. So, there may be more going on that I truly know about.

Check out Monograms Vacations. I think they do a Rome, Florence and Venice package tour. They provide hotels, transportation from city to city and a local tour and you are on your own the rest of the time.

Ok a DIY trip but:

"But a part of me feels like it will not be totally MY preference, and being a true fodorite and an admitted hotel snob - I like to plan things myself."

"That is where I think it would be best if I picked the hotels because no elevator just wouldn't work for us."

Too many "my's and "I's". As others have mentioned, I would make this her trip as much as yours. You know when posters say "get the kids involved" ... well get her involved. Let her make a few choices.

Dammit if she can get mad at you then at least you'll be able to get mad at her.

OK -- It sounds like budget is an issue - explain to her that the less expensive tours (Globus/Trafalgar/Gate1/etc) ARE mostly fast paced and and you DO spend much of each day either on a bus (city sightseeing or long distance drives between stopovers) or in canned 'craft' demos which are really shopping opportunities.

Slower paced/higher end/more 'culturally based' tours can be great but are very expensive.

If you need to stick to a budget -- then planning your own trip will save $$$/€€€

I can't weigh in on price specifics, but wanted to make a point that is perhaps obvious: when looking at a tour total, divide by the number of days (I know, duh!), and then consider how much you might spend each day on hotel, food, transportation and tickets to stuff if you were on your own. The total can look outrageous because it's paid all at once, and not in dribs and drabs during the course of a trip.

Whatever you decide, good luck!

Along with janisj's points about the cheaper tours, they also often stay outside the city centers making it difficult to get anywhere on your own. Your "Florence" hotel could be a half-hour from Florence in another town. In Rome, you could end up out on the ring-road. Venice you could be stuck in Mestre or on the Lido.

It's not like there is that much to book on this trip since you only have 10 days (is that in Italy or including to and from US?).

Book flight to Venice, return from Rome. A water taxi to hotel doesn't need to be booked in advance nor does a taxi to the airport in Rome (taxis are set fees to the airport). Book 3 hotels, 2 trains. You only have time for a couple of sites in each city so you would each have to pick which are most important to you in each (they may not be the same and you might need to part ways at times).

Are you planning to share a room with this person? This can be a bigger problem if one is a morning person and the other isn't, etc. (BTDT) and you don't really know someone until you travel with them outside their comfort zone. I made the mistake of traveling with someone once (she had begged to go to Italy with me for years) that wanted to go to bed at 8:00 every night which is dinner time in Italy. I also discovered how paranoid this person was and insecure (did not want to be left alone and was suspicious of everything and everyone). She really felt out of her element when she wasn't in the US and wanted to stay on her phone talking to family all the time. Additionally, it turned out she had all kinds of phobias I was unaware of (heights, enclosed spaces). I had booked the Scavi tour under St. Peter's and I thought she was going to have a panic attack (it's really not tight quarters at all, just humid). She didn't want to climb up anything either because of issues with heights.