Please, please help with our May itinerary!
 

With the help of this wonderful forum, I booked our air tickets last weekend. Up to last month, I was so sure we were going with a group tour to Italy for our 1st ever trip to Europe. So now I'm scrambling to gather info, book hotels, and plan our 2 1/2 weeks itinerary. I have a couple of guidebooks and this forum is INVALUABLE to read and plan so I pretty much know what we want to see once we're there. My problem is where do we go outside of Venice and Rome?

I've read lots of threads on this forum but am still a little overwhelmed and was tearing my hair out last night. So I told my husband that I will seek help on this wonderful forum.

For hotels, I've found in the last week that most if not all of my initial list of favorite hotels in Venice and Rome are booked up for the period that we'll be there (May 10-26). I'm now trying to find alternate hotels, something less than $150 to $200 a night that are atmospheric, quaint, central, clean, friendly, close to restaurants and shops, and in a safe neighborhood. I've found many recommendations from here and have emailed those hotels. I would welcome any suggestions you may have for the above criteria for all cities Venice, Florence, Rome. Please keep in mind that the popular ones on TripAdvisor which meet my criteria are booked up - I hate for you to waste your time letting me know. :]

In addition to trying to find us decent hotels, I'm trying to map out our itinerary. I only know Venice since that's where we'll fly in from LA and Rome where we'll depart from. I know we want to be in Florence, but DESPERATELY NEED your help with the itinerary.

Just a little background on us so you can help us. We're active, love to walk, wander around exploring, bike if possible in small towns (cruising sightseeing type, not mountain biking :), photography, culture, good local food or small restaurants, markets, the outdoors, being sociable, not into clubbing/bars, like museums and churches but can't do it all day.

Re:Florence/Tuscany, should we should Florence as a base then do day trips? We love to stay someplace where we can walk to restaurants and shops in the evenings and walk around with lots of people at night. We prefer not to drive if possible. So here's our itinerary so far. We would like to maximize our trip as far as seeing as much of Italy as possible, but also have plenty of downtime to simply wander and soak in the sights, sounds, and smells of Italy.

May:
10 - Venice
11 - Venice
12 - Venice
13 - Venice
14 -
15 -
16 -
17 -
18 -
19 -
20 -
21 -
22 - Rome
23 - Rome
24 - Rome
25 - Rome
26 - Go home

I apologize for the long beginning but wanted to give you all our info possible. Thank you SO VERY MUCH!!

<i>Re:Florence/Tuscany, should we should Florence as a base then do day trips?</i>

I'd say no.

The donut hole in your itinerary is absolutely screaming out for a Tuscan villa rental, with daytrips from there.

You already have big cities on either end of your stay. I think you need to get out into the beautiful surrounding areas and stretch your legs.

Others will surely offer individual suggestions, but if you wish to investigate the variety of accommodations in Venice, take a look at this site:

http://www.turismovenezia.it/eng/dynalay.asp?PAGINA=437

I totally understand your reluctance to rent a car. If you really feel strongly about avoiding a car rental, I think the most economical option to see the Tuscan countryside and hill towns without renting a car is to stay in Siena, which has the best bus connections in the region and is worthwhile place to visit itself. You could spend 14-16 in Florence and then 17-21 in Siena with daytrips to hill towns in between Siena sightseeing. From Siena you might even splurge on a day with driver/guide Luca Garappa of hillsandroads.com to get to more out of the way locations.

I agree that Tuscany (or some time in the countryside somwehere) would be lovely - but you would need a car.

You could do a couple days in Florence, and then a week in the country at a lovely villa.

Or if you wanted to use only trains/public transport you could do a few days in Florence and a few days somewhere else - some ideas: Lake Como/Milan, Bologna, Cinque Terre - trying to think of places en route to Rome from Venice.

I would say whatever you decide to try to spend at least 2-3 (preferably 3) in each place to get a real feel and relax.

As for hotels in Venice try www.hotelgalleria.it or http://www.aitagliapietra.com/ we have stayed at both. They are basic, but in good locations and good value we thought.

Enjoy the planning!

haha mr_go, I agree with you, that big donut hole is screaming for something out in the country. I totally agree with everyone's suggestion. We have enough city at both ends, and need to have a change of scenery.

Michael - thank you for the link, I'll check it out.

ellenem, it's good to hear from you! Is Siena a town with a busy evening life, lots of shops and restaurans to go to at night? I have my Rick Steves book but this forum's knowledge is way better. There are just two of us and we don't want to be out in the country somewhere at night all alone. Though we love being in the country during the day and hear the birds sing and the trees whispering and feel the warm Tuscan sun...Re:Mocenigo, I filled out an online booking form, sent them my credit info, then absolute silence since. I was a little disappointed and worried to say the least since they were so responsive before.

jamikins, I love to visit Lake Como and Cinque Terre! Do you suggest staying a night or two in there areas? Are they easily doable from Florence with public transportation? I don't know Bologna, will read up on it. Milan, is it worth going to? I know it's the fashion capital of the worth but will be out of reach shopping wise I'm sure. Anyone has any small hotel or b&b recommendations for these Como and CQ?

I've contacted Hotel Galleria, I hope to hear from them soon.

I'm feeling so much better already. You guys are SO AWESOME! Thank you.

There are direct train lines from Milan to Cinque Terre. I believe the line also goes through Pisa - so there must be some connections to Florence so maybe it would fit in after or before Florence. Its quite a trek to get to on the trains so I would plan to spend at least 3 nights there to make it worth it.

We stayed here: http://www.arpaiu.com/english.html and highly recommend it!

I havent stayed in Lake Como area yet - its on my list! Perhaps others can shed light.

ellenem, I also like your suggestion of staying in Florence for a few nights, then stay in Siena then take day trips. Will Siena and day trips give us the feeling of being in the Tuscan? Full of sunshine, and olive groves, and birds and bicyles...like it's been portrayed in the movies. Just sounds so lovely.

Or we can stay put someplace and rent a car just to drive around and explore the small hill towns like mr_go suggested. So many options! I like them all unfortunately.

Do we need to reduce the 4 nights in Venice? Is this too much. So we can use it for the "donut hole" part?

I dont think you should reduce Venice. You will likely be tempted to go to all the places suggested - which will lead you to a whirlwind trip, changing hotels every few days - which eats of time and money. I highly recommend choosing fewer places and actually spending time enjoying them and the pace of life. In the countryside the stores all close up tight from 12-2ish every day for lunch so you can only really see them in the morning and afternoon, enjoying a lovely long lunch in between. Thats the beauty of Italy. If you try to go too many places you will just rush around and not experience that!

what about after Venice doing 3 nights in FLorence, and then heading out into the country for 5 nights in Tuscany doing day trips with a car and then dropping hte car somewhere like Orvieto and taking the train in to ROme. Sounds ideal to me!

Driving in the country is not hard at all. Get a good sat nav and you are good to go. Villages usually have big parking lots outside the main centre so you dont have to (or want to) travel into the tiny streets. Avoid driving in Florence as there are lots of restricted zones you can get tickets. Pick up the car at the airport or a village outside Florence and head out.

Sorry - meant to say the stores all close up tight (with unsightly metal shutters) so you cant really enjoy the village atmposphere during that time. So it limits the amount you want to do everyday so you max your enjoyment :)

Why do you want to go to Florence? Are you big fans of Renaissance art and architecture? If not, consider staying in Siena and daytripping to Florence. (There's an easy bus from the center of Siena to the main Florence train station.) Siena quiets down a night but restaurants are open and busy. In fact, it's really great to be in Siena at night; it gets all dark and mediaeval-ly, and you feel transported back in time.

Or, if you stay in Florence, do daytrips: by train to Lucca (rent bicycles and ride around the top of the walls), Pisa, and maybe smaller towns like Pistoia or Prato. And, of course, the bus to Siena. Plus take the local bus up to Fiesole, which has a great view of Florence in the distance. There are some hikes you can do from there.

I've thought and thought about the different options and I think we'll save the lakes for another trip. We'll split the donut hole between 2 nights CT, 3 nights Florence, then 3 nights Siena. Is this too much changing hotels? There are some good threads here re:taking local day tours from Siena and Florence so I'll do more reading on that. Just one question, how is Florence vs Siena at night, is Florence more lively? We like walking around at night, think the main street in Honolulu at night, just without all the craziness.

Also, logistically, someone mentioned that they took a train from Venice to CT, stayed 2 nights, then trained to Florence. Is this doable? On the subject of trains, do we purchase one pass for the whole 2 1/2 weeks in Italy, or buy different passes for different cities? I need to read up on this too. I've assigned my husband this task since he hasn't contributed to the trip planning yet and there's still so much to plan.

Mimar, we like art enough but are not art buffs. We're more outdoorsy people, camping, skiing, fishing, riding bikes. We love riding bikes, we've done it in Bali, VN, China even! We try to rent bikes whereever we can on our travels. That was the highlight of our China trip in '03. We got there 4 days before the tour group and one of the days went to Beihai(?) park, rented some bikes and rode around for 1/2 day, had lunch there, watched the local men fish in the lake, it was just wonderful.

Hi there! I am just done with our itinerary so I know how much work it is for this! Believe me!
We will be in Venice May 8-11, Rome from 11-15, and Sorrento from 15 to 18.
We found the Palazzo Abagnole in Sorrento was such a great price! I should have stayed outside the main cities for the two others. But a trade off is convenience to the sights I suppose. We are going for convenience and location.
Where are you in Venice? If you are interested in meeting up, let me know! Tina

I suggested Siena precisely because it is a beautifully-set hilltown, but a larger one than many so it would have more of a nightlife of many restaurant choices and places to walk. And also for the bus connections. You are really going to have to decide if you want/need a caar if you consider Tuscany.

Florence would be much more lively than Siena. It a larger city with many many tourists as well as university students to keep evenings lively.

Whether you need a train pass is a constant debate. I suspect you will just need to purchase point-to-point tickets for your train trips. You are not planning to travel great distances. You can research ticket prices and schedules here.

http://www.ferroviedellostato.it/homepage_en.html

Paige,

You can take the train from Venice to CT, but you will have to transfer in Florence or Milan. I checked for May 14th, and you're looking at 5 to 6 hours of traveling (depending on what time you leave).

It may be better to train from Venice to Florence (2 hours), stay 3 nights, then train to CT (2.5 - 3.5 hours) and stay 2 nights. If you decide to get a car for the countryside, from CT you can train to Pisa, pick up a car and drive to Siena for 3 nights. Then drop the car off in Orvieto on your way to Rome.

BTW, I can relate to your husband not contributing to the planning. I keep assigning DH things to do, but then I don't have the patience to wait until he gets around to doing them :)

Anyway, DH and I will be just a couple days behind you, and are following the same itinerary Venice, Florence, CT, Siena, Rome. I've priced out the trains and the passes are not worthwhile. DH and I will have an addition leg (Milan to Venice) and the passes are still not worth it.

As an aside, you mentioned that you enjoy the outdoors and bicycling. I know that the agritourismo I'm staying at outside Siena offers bikes for their guests to ride around the countryside. I can't imaging they're the only place offer that, so it may be something you want to look for when booking. Even if they don't, maybe they can recommend a bike tour for you. I imagine cycling around the Tuscan countryside would be quite a memorable experience!

I like CT better than Florence, but for two nights I don't think it is worth it since it is so far from the rest of your selected locations-- too much train travel, too much hotel changing for just one full day on CT. I was there for 4 nights last May and could have stayed even longer. I would probably pick some place in Tuscany (like Siena) and do some day trips. Also consider adding a day to Rome.

Jamikins, I'm leaving Venice as is, 4 nights. :]

Tina, we'll be at Al Ponte Monicego. We'll arrive 5/10 and will be there for 4 nights. We can meet up somewhere.

Ellen, I finally heard from Monicego. They said that my emails had gone to another email address but it seems to be the same exact spelling when I checked again. It's a relief to finally secure a place in Venice. There are so many hotels and I've spend days and days just reading reviews or contacting them. I will take your suggestion of splitting that donut hole between Florence and Siena.

I found somewhere on this forum really inexpensive government day tours in Florence but now can't seem to locate the link in my spreadsheet. We'll most likely save CT for another trip but will check out abenedek's route suggestions just out of curiosity, thank you for the detailed explanation! That's just what I need for a Europe newbie like me.

My husband said "no problem, I can drive in Siena" so that's a possibility. How much are rental cars, similar to our rates for much more?

Thank you everyone for taking the time to help me!

Forgot to say, we'll add another day to Rome!

Glad you have been able to confirm at Al Ponte Mocenigo. There are a number of good, reasonably-priced restaurants nearby if you are too tired to explore for dinner.

If you decide to rent a car for your entire visit in Siena, you might find it helpful to choose a hotel outside the center at the base of the hill for easier parking and driving to other locations.

From what I understand, car rentals cost about the same until you factor in the high costs of gasoline and the fact that in Italy you will probably be required to purchase the CDW.

I suspect the Florence info you recall may be found at this website:
http://www.firenzeturismo.it/itinera...-florence.html

Yes, that's the link! Thank you Ellen!

Re:Mocenigo, many times I was so tempted to change from this hotel to something closer to St. Mark's Square but after reading tons of positive reviews on TripAdvisor about it's location, and your comments in this forum, we're sticking with it.

Ellen, if we stay 3 nights in Siena, can we do it without a car? We'd be very happy with just relaxing and doing day trips somewher.

True, the location of Al Ponte Mocenigo would not be everyone's choice. But based on your interest is strolling and having quiet times in the midst of your vacation, I think you will enjoy the location and not be troubled by its distance from San Marco. You will definitely appreciate the less expensive restaurants and closeness to the San Stae vaporetto stop.

I'm sure you could find much to do without having a car, between the town of Siena itself and a bus ride to other spots. (I try to be helpful and realistic about the usefulness of cars in various locations in Italy. However, I don't drive and therefore have never rented one.)

Meanwhile, with your hiking interest in mind, I discovered this listing at the Firenze Turismo site.

http://www.firenzeturismo.it/en/terr...ance-ring.html

It is a listing of a 178 km hiking/biking itinerary around Florence. If you click on the "description" ink at the bottom, you will find detailed instructions broken into manageable walks with good details ("length of route: 17.5km; Time required: 3hours; difficulties: none" and so forth), including how to reach the area of the walking by public transport. Unfortunately, to get a prepared map of the routes described, you must get it from the tourism office. It is not included in the description. I suppose one could attempt to plot the route on a good map.

Ellen, you're just a wealth of knowledge. Thanks for taking the time to look up the hiking info for me.

I'd like to get your help on choosing a hotel for Rome. I remember you mentioned Dalphne Inn. I've read reviews on the Trevi one but would like to know if you know of any in the Piazza Navona/Campo de' Fiori/Pantheon? It seems to be popular if one wants to be close to everything with restaurants and shops nearby. I was looking at Palarmento. Would you know of any small hotels in the area that are $200/night or less? I love to get anyone else's suggestions please!

Also, please recommend hotels for Florence/Siena. We're trying to find hotels that are around $150-200 in all the major cities but it hasn't been possible. We figure we save money on lodging so we could spend it elsewhere.

Thank you!

I actually looked over the hiking itineraries for myself (I'll be in Florence after Venice in early April). One of the shortest hiking itineraries is a really great route and easy to reach from Florence. The hike "La Certosa-Firenze" begins at a spot reachable by bus #37 from the center of town and takes you over a route back to Florence, finishing at the famous Piazzale Michelangelo. Since I hope to visit the Certosa del Galluzzo where this walk begins during my visit, I may take this walk to get back to the city.

Sorry, aside from the Daphne Inn, my most recent stays in Rome were at places outside your budget. In Florence I'll be staying with a friend.

Have you tired using venere.com to widen your search for hotels? You can sort by price and then come back for info on your new choices.

What type of accommodations are you looking for? Are you looking for a traditional hotel? It may be difficult to find a traditional hotel within your price range in the major cities during May.

If you are open to B&Bs, check Flamini Domus Charming Suites. Its right near Campo de Fiori. We're checking in the day you leave and paying 120 euro/night.

The rate is about the same for Alloro B&B in Florence.

Regarding rental car rates, we paid just under $145 for a 3 day rental through AutoEurope, and that includes the CDW with zero excess (no deductible), liability, etc. Just search around for the best rate and see if AutoEurope will match it. They matched that rate for me and threw in the zero excess. If you are patient and friendly with the rep I usually find they will go the extra mile for you :)

Good luck with your planning.

In Rome, we've stayed several times at Residenza Canali ai Coronari. I love its location, about one block from Piazza Navona on a quiet side street filled with antique stores. The rates vary depending on the number of nights, and we always got a discount paying cash, so it would be in your price range. The rooms are nice, though not luxurious, and the staff is very helpful. The Residenza is kind of like a B&B, but there's staff onsite 24 hours. They provide breakfast, but we usually skip theirs and instead have cappuccino and cornetti at a bar on Piazza Navona.

In Florence, on our most recent trip we stayed at a B&B, Casa dai Tintori. The owners are SO friendly and helpful, and the rooms are beautiful. We were there with our daughter, and once Valeria learned she liked chocolate, my daughter received all sorts of special treats each morning at breakfast. The location is also good (that's important to us), about a 10-minute walk to Piazza Repubblica, and closer to some very good gelaterias.

For a hiking idea, outside of San Gimignano (which I assume you'll visit as a day trip from Siena) are the remains of a middle ages fortified village, called Castelvecchio (google the name for pictures). It's located outside San Gimignano to the southwest (though more south than west). To get to it, we drove south on the road from San Gimignano to Volterra, about 3 km, and parked in San Donato, a tiny hamlet. We then walked south about .1 mile on the road to a sign marked Cammogio; the sign also says it’s the path to Castelvecchio. The walk was pretty and remote; it took 35 minutes back, and a bit longer to get there, as it was mostly uphill (we're relatively fast walkers). The route was up and down, and some parts were steep with loose rocks, though the beginning was on a rough (four-wheel drive) road. But to arrive at the ruins, in the middle of the forest, was magical and just a bit creepy. The fortress at the front, and the church at the rear, are the most put-together (reconstructed by volunteers, I'm guessing), with walls and bits of walls for many buildings.

Also, there's a path that circles San Gimignano entirely on the outside of the town walls, with (of course) gorgeous views of the countryside.

In Florence, consider walking up to Piazzale Michelangelo. I'm a runner, and ran up to there several mornings, just as the sun rose. Not many others there at that time of day, and the views of the city below in the morning mist were fabulous.

On the car rental, we use AutoEurope, as do a number of other Fodorites. We've always gotten great service from them; they're easy to contact from Europe if there's a problem or you need to change anything. And the one time when a competitors prices were better, AutoEurope met those prices.

On trains and passes, usually the passes are not cost-effective, but I'm not a train pass expert, so I can't tell you more than that. For the train trips you'll be taking (i.e., Venice to Florence, Orvieto to Rome), you can just buy point-to-point tickets at the train station. I don't think you'd need to make reservations for those common routes.

Ellen, www.verene.com is a good site, I've heard about it, haven't tried it but I will. Thanks for the hiking info.

Thank you abenedek and Lexma90, just great info on those B&Bs (I love them by the way) and car rental.

I'm truly touched by all the time and concern everyone has taken to help me. This is the best forum ever! I'm sure I'll be able to find just the hotels we need and everything will work out just great.

abenedek, Flamini Domus Charming Suites is lovely but not available for the nights we need, though their other property is.

Lexma90, I love Residenza Canali ai Coronari! It's central, clean and so cheap compared to what I've seen so far! How do you find these places??? I'm checking out your other recommendations.

Paige,

Just to be clear, the site is venere.com. (You transposed the n and the r in your message.)

Glad you are getting good recommendations from other Fodorites.

Oh, I just found that that E94/night is per person, not per room, at Flamini Domus, so that's $264/room.

I meant per night.

Hi,

I travelled to Italy last year (in May) and would suggest that you definitely visit Florence. That city is absolutely beautiful! We could only stay for two days and believe me, that wasn't long enough.

We were told that it would be quite expensive but prices were reasonable.

Sorry to hear that Flamini Domus isn't available, I'm not familiar with their other property.

Unfortunately, Residenza Canali is also E94 per person per night, so that may also be out of your price range.

I suggest you do a search for hotels in Rome on trip advisor. You can filter the results by property type (hotels, B&Bs, specialty, etc.), price range and location.

Most properties have a substantial number of reviews. However, my rule of thumb is to disregard the best and worst reviews if there aren't too many. I've always had good luck with the properties I've chosen this way.

Also, I always try to book directly with the hotel, either through their website or email. Since they save on commissions, they may offer you a discount, especially when you stay more then 3 nights.

When you've narrowed your choices down a bit, you can do a search of the Fodor's forums to see if its been mentioned in a thread or trip report.

Good luck :)

<Oh, I just found that that E94/night is per person, not per room, at Flamini Domus, so that's $264/room.>

No, that's not correct - I just checked on their site and a room for two people in May is E120.

hazel,

You are certainly correct, because as I previously mentioned I'm staying there at the end of May.

I think paige meant their other property, as Flamini Domus isn't available for her dates. Or maybe there was some confusion because Residenza Canali is E94 per person per night...

paigeTN - I have stayed at the Hotel Parlamento in Rome for 7 nights in 2007. It was recommended by a friend and it was great! The location is perfect and the staff was very helpful and fun. I would definitely recommend it.

Wow! My head is spinning from reading all of your questions and the many helpful replies! This really is a great site. Planning a trip on your own is probably a wonderful idea - and one we struggled with for quite awhile. We finally decided to go with the guided tour for our first time in Europe (we'll be in Venice, Florence, and Rome with side trips to Sienna & Pisa). I know that Italy in July will be hot & an escorted tour will be somewhat limiting....but this is our comfort level. We hope to return for an independently planned trip sometime in the future! Seeing how much you have to consider in planning your trip - I think we made the right choice for us! To each his own.

I've missed this forum! We were away on a ski trip.

Doggma, thank you for the hotel suggestion. It is one on my FAV list. :]

Barbara, yes, that was how I felt. It got really overwhelming after a while but I couldn't tear myself away from the trip planning. There was just SO many details to plan for! I don't blame you for doing a tour trip at all! We've finally opted to do most of the trip on our own, but book day tours, airport pickup, train passes, etc. with a tour company. I know we have to pay a little more but it relieves my stress level, especially since there are only a couple of months to go, and we still have other trips to do before then.

Tour companies have sampler packages which allow you to see many countries in a short time, which is a nice introduction to the major cities of Europe, then you'll know which one is your favorite, and you can return on your own the next time!