Please help/critic our Italy trip!
 

We are going on a family trip of 8 (I know.. CRAZY).

Here is our plan. Tickets and Rome hotel are booked. Trying to figure out if our plans for transport/locations are feasible. We are flying into ROME on May 3rd, and flying out of Florence on May 11th.

Our planned itinerary is as follows:

Sat- May 3rd: Rome. Sleep Rome.
Sun- May 4th: Rome. Sleep Rome.
Mon- May 5th: Rome/Vatican. Sleep Rome.
Tues- May 6th: Rome. Sleep Pompeii.
Wed- May 7th: Pompeii. Sleep Chianti (Greve?)
Thurs- May 8th: Chianti Sleep Chianti
Fri- May 9th: Pisa Sleep Chianti
Sat- May 10th: Florence Sleep Florence
Sun- May 11th: Fly out in AM

We are planning on renting a car, since we heard you really need a car in Tuscany. So our idea was to rent a car our last day in Rome and drive to Pompeii, then drive up to Chianti area and do day trips from a base in Greve. Van for 8 at around $650 for this time period (rent in ROME return in FLORENCE).

What do you think? A few questions:
-Is it too ambitious to drive from Rome to Pompeii, then up to Chianti? I heard driving in Naples is a nightmare. Is it possible to avoid Naples completely when driving to Pompeii?
-Do we need more time in Pompeii? Should we sleep in Sorrento instead?

Any and every thought is appreciated! Thanks!

I think you have the right number of days in Rome and Chianti. One night in Florence is too short, in my opinion. You should spend 2 nights in Florence minimum as the first day will involve travel to Florence and take time away from sight-seeing. We were told that driving a car in Southern Italy was crazy, so we rode the train from Rome to Pompeii and did a day trip with the help of a guide we hired in Pompeii. It was a fairly long day, but not strenuous. You may want to consider this. Have fun planning!

I agree with seeing Pompeii as a day trip, as opposed to driving there and staying the night. It is a pity you won't really have time to see much of Florence.

Greve is very close to Florence, so presumably you can arrive early enough to see a bit of the city, including the Duomo, the piazzas, the Ponte Vecchio, and maybe visit one of the famous churches which have world-class Renaissance art on display. Just don't attempt to visit the Uffizi in this short time. If you're not terribly interested in art museums, this amount of time may be enough; the city is small.

You can totally bypass Naples when driving to Pompeii by getting on the A30 heading in the direction of Salerno, instead of continuing on the A1 to Naples. The city of Pompeii is not of particular touristic interest apart from the archaeological site. There is a huge (and rather ugly) 19th church there dedicated to the Blessed Virgin of the Rosary. This is a pilgrimage site, with a painting considered miraculous, which attracts twice as many visitors in a year (4 million) than does ancient Pompeii (two million).

It's really faster to get to Pompeii by train than it is to drive, and it would take about the same time to get to Tuscany by train as by driving, so you might want to reconsider the decision to drive there, unless you have other things you want to see near Pompeii. You could take the train to Chiusi or to Orvieto and get the car there. However, these are small rental agencies, and you'll have to check their opening hours.

Are you going to rent two cars? Finding a van that would hold eight people and their luggage won't be easy.

All drivers will need an IDP (International Driver's Permit), along with their regular license. You can get them for a reasonable price at AAA even if you're not a member. If you take along your own photos (from a photo booth is fine) it costs less.

-Do we need more time in Pompeii? Should we sleep in Sorrento instead?>

Yes for sure - a nice watering hole just a few minutes by CircumVesuviana trains that go right to the entrance of the site. Pompeii the modern city is a few miles away and nothing special. Sorrento has tons of hotels and you can take a train there from Naples.

there is nothing right around the entrance to the ruins I believe.

If you decide to do your overnight in Pompeii over the years this hotel has popped-up a few times http://www.hotelforum.it/ita/
It has quadruple rooms and free parking and is just outside the ruins.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Rev..._Campania.html

Thank you all for your suggestions and keep them coming! I will look into the Pompeii day trip. That might be a good possibility and cut down on the number of different hotels.

A van for 8 won't hold luggage for 8 as well. How do you plan to manage that?

Hi Janisj. We are looking into at van for 9 with plenty of luggage space (plus we have all vowed to pack light!)
It's one of those full-sized vans (not a mini-van). So hopefully it can accommodate our bunch!

Some vans for 9 require a special driver's license; make sure you will be able to drive it with a normal license. Also, it will almost certainly have manual transmission, and it will be a pain on narrow roads and inside medieval town centers. Automatic transmission rentals cost considerably more than manuals, and they're not always available at small agencies. Even if they say you can get one, you might arrive and find that none are available.

It might be better, and maybe even cheaper, to get two cars when you get to Tuscany and forget about driving to Pompeii. However, then you should probably get the cars at Florence airport instead of small agencies like the ones in Orvieto or Chiusi. That is, unless some of you can drive manual transmission.

two cars would be immeasurably better than a behemoth like that. Getting a vehicle that size in/out of old Italian towns won't be pretty. Two reasonably sized cars will be cheaper to rent, take less fuel, and be much easier to drive/park. Plus 8 passengers + luggage for 8 will be awfully crowded in a van for 9. And I pity the poor folks stuck in the back.

I think staying in Pompeii is a huge mistake - why trek with all that stuff and 8 people down there only to turn around the next AM? Instead do a day trip from Rome. Take the earliest train you can that gets there after Pompeii opens (It will be very hot with no shade - spend 3 to 4 hours and then head back to Rome.) You can get a guide at the entrance if you want.

Agree not enough time in Florence - but you have what you have.

Not sure what type of vehicle you will need. 8 people plus luggage will not fit in an 8 or 9 person van. You may need a small bus with a driver. Do check on this now. Your other options is two (crowded) cars.

I have been in 9-person vans in Europe, and they will NOT hold 8 people unless each of them weights 100 lbs and is carrying nothing more than a small purse. Not only that, driving them on anything but the autostrade will be a nightmare. Parking? Even worse. You're going to have to have two cars or find other means of transportation.

Thanks for the pointers everyone! Manual is not a problem as 4 of our group can drive it... And they are used to the tiny bumpy crazy roads of Brazil!

BVLENCI, if we stick with just Tuscany, do you think driving the van to Pisa and around Chianti will be a problem then? Two cars is cheaper, but I think my group will not want to split up unless completely necessary... Brazilians make a party out of everything when everyone is together :)

Thanks again everyone!

>>Brazilians make a party out of everything when everyone is together<<

There won't be any partying going on in that van. You will all be squished and holding someone else's luggage on their laps.

>>And they are used to the tiny bumpy crazy roads of Brazil! <<

It isn't the open roads as much as it is the towns and villages (though many roads will be problems too). Yes, you have rural roads in Brazil - but not medieval towns.

Though I personally dislike long day trips, in your case, hauling people and luggage to Pompeii for an overnight with no other sightseeing in that area would be even less fun.

Just do Pompeii as a day trip by train from Rome.

There are three advantages to this:
No time checking out of and into another hotel.
You could all stop in Naples for dinner after visiting Pompeii.
The next day would be a lot easier, going from Rome to Chianti rather than all the way from Pompeii to Chianti.

AnaAP, I guess you're not hearing me. I HAVE BEEN in 9-person vans in Europe. I have been a tour guide for groups of 7 who would not fit in one of those things. You WILL NOT FIT unless you have virtually no luggage or everyone is willing to hold it on their laps!

But apparently you think you know better, so go right ahead.

AnaAP,

You won't have a problem parking a van in the places you are going. Some of the information you are getting in this thread is just bizarre.

This subject of van size has come up on Fodor's before. You can read this thread and see. Read to the bottom and you will see that some of the same posters who are trying to talk you out of this have tried to talk other people out of this. They failed, and when people came back from their trips they reported here that renting a van for 8 people wasn't a problem.

Look:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...in-n-italy.cfm

Here is another Fodor's thread where some people get hysterical about the mere thought of people renting a van in Italy and two people who have done report that they did and it wasn't a problem:

http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...r-7-people.cfm

What is totally bizarre is that in that thread, "St Cirq" was on the other side of the argument, telling the poster to "go for it!"

AnaAP, I hope Brazliians are more sober -- at least one they give travel advice.

Brand new member. First post ever. Doesn't mention any personal experience. Not exactly prime reliability source. And anyone who actually reads the link provided will see that my friend and tour guide GeoNev has encountered problems with renting 9-passenger vans. Pffff!!!!

sandralist: If you'll notice -- stCirq specifically posted on the thread you linked . . . that a <U>7 passenger</U> van is doable but that a NINE passenger van (which is what AnaAP is hoping to rent) is a whole different animal . . .

So maybe a little accuracy is in order . . .

was posting the same time as StCirq . . . ;)

oh - and sandralist, what are your other screen names????????

Here is more testimony from another website from people who rented vans and didn't have a problem fitting in luggage and parking the car or driving it.

http://slowtalk.com/groupee/forums/a...85/m/993101146

One tip is to ask all your passengers to bring luggage with soft-sides. It will fit better than hard sided luggage.

I don't have any other screen names. I just registered when I saw this post. I thought it was terrible information. What I also thought was bizarre is people kept switching numbers about how many times they had been in vans this big or that big. Sometimes it was one number and other times it was another number.

But the threads all have the same pattern, even the one from the other website. People post not to do it, but people who have actually done it say it isn't a problem. AnaAP can read that for herself.

What is wrong with me giving her that information? You people are being really nasty to her and me for no reason. I hope she has a nice trip.

sandralist: You obviously have some axe to grind - at least have the courage to use your 'real' screen name, not the new one you created half an hour ago . . .

Have you ever rented a 9-passenger van in Europe, "sandralist?" What's your direct experience? None, is my guess. Why are you even bothering with this thread if you have no direct experience? Why do you care? And for a first post on Fodors? Do you think you have any credibility whatsoever? Do you want the OP to get to Europe and not be able to transport his crew adequately?

sandralist: You obviously have some axe to grind - at least have the courage to use your 'real' screen name, not the new one you created half an hour ago . . .

sorry for the double post - we were posting at the same time and the site locked up.

Wow, you 2 are berserk! My name is Sandra List. I don't have an ax to grind. I am correcting the wrong information that is being given to somebody.

Here is what the Fodor's poster GeoNev wrote (I doubt that is anybody's real name but I believe the post is accurate:

"As for expecting a 9-seat van to hold 9 people, I have rented these vans perhaps 10 times in Italy and they've always been large enough for nine people. Same in France (maybe 30 times)."

St Cirq posted in that thread and didn't call him or her a liar.

Here is what the same poster wrote after the trip was successfully completed:

"Back from Italy, and all went well. ..For the doubters out there – we certainly did fit nine people, plus luggage, into a 9-pax van and got around quite well. It was baffling to me how many people thought this could not be done."

I am baffled too!

Here is what other people wrote on the Slow Travel site (where I frequently post)

"FOr 8 passengers (plus one driver), you will need one of the following vans:

* Fiat Scudo

* Opel Vivaro / Renault Trafic (They are the same van)

* Fiat Ducato

Of the three, the Fiat will have the best ride, but lacks in storage space and will be a little cramped for 8 people.

The Opel Vivaro or Renault Trafic will be much larger and still has a good ride. They have a long version and a short version. The long version will have more than enough room for everyone's luggage, too.

The Fiat Ducato is big and clunky. It rides like a truck with bad suspension. I would avoid it.

Most rental agencies have these vans, but you will need to get them out of a major city, and reserve WELL in advance.

PERSONAL EXPERIENCE: I have driven all of these and loaded them with our tour guests with our smaller tours. 2 years ago we decided to buy our own (we were spending $18,000 a year with a rental agency!), and we decided that the long version of the Opel Vivaro was best for us.

Hope this helps :-)


I hope it helps the poster who asked too. Isn't that all that matters?

aha - you own a tour company . . .


Thought there was something fishy going on.

Janis, I think Sandra was quoting a thread from slowtalk.com not saying SHE has a tour company.

Here's the post she is referencing.
http://slowtalk.com/groupee/forums/a...0346#389100346

OK -- then there is something even <i>fishier</i> going on . . . >)

I agree hit Pompeii as early in the day as possible because it gets very hot there and you need several hours there. No need for a guide there if you need to cut out a cost. It is easy to navigate on your own with a map or guide book.

<i>My name is Sandra List......Here is what the Fodor's poster GeoNev wrote (I doubt that is anybody's real name)</i>

Only a fool or someone with an ulterior motive would use their real name on a message board! Your pick, sandra.

>>>BVLENCI, if we stick with just Tuscany, do you think driving the van to Pisa and around Chianti will be a problem then? <<<

Driving the van to Pisa will be a problem as Pisa has ZTL.

As for 9 passenger vans, some are bigger than others and there is no predicting what you will get.

With your itinerary, you should do as others have suggested and visit Pompeii as a day trip. It's easier/simpler. It also eliminates a 5-6 hour drive (Pompeii to Chianti).

It actually would make more sense to stay in Rome 3,4,5,6 (with a day trip to Pompeii although you really don't have much time for one) and Florence the other nights (with day trip to Chianti/Pisa). If you are arriving Rome on an overnight flight, you will be too tired the first day to see much. You really only have 7 sightseeing days total.

Kybourbon makes sense. Also, Pisa is a very easy train trip from Florence. After being stuck in auto traffic one Spring afternoon leaving Pisa, returning to Florence, and a miserable traffic tie-up near Naples, we take the train when we can.

Some people do drive vans around. Hey, they even drive big buses - think huge tour buses. However, they are limited in where they can go and where they can park. They may have special permits that allow them to load and unload, then go to a parking area. On a tour I was on, the bus had to let us off several blocks from one hotel. There are some narrow streets where large vehicles simply will not fit, and many where you are not allowed to drive unless you live there. Only you can decide if having a van will work better for you than two cars or using public transportation. It depends on where you are going and what kind of van you can get.