Please critique my Swiss/Paris itinerary
 

My husband and I are planning this trip for late May/early June next year, and will have approximately 10 nights. We were considering a Germany/Switzerland trip but the itinerary wouldn't work so we decided against it, and came up with this itinerary instead. Please critique it and let me know what you think. We have never been to these areas before and would love any suggestions.

Day 1 - fly from St. Louis to Milan
Day 2 - Train from Milan to Lugano
Day 3 - Lugano
Day 4 - Pick up car, drive to Lauterbrunnun, stay in Wengen
Day 5 - Wengen
Day 6 - Wengen
Day 7 - Drive to Montreux
Day 8 - Montreux
Day 9 - Drop car, train to Paris
Day 10 - Paris
Day 11 - Paris
Day 12 - Fly home from Paris

If it helps, we are in our mid-20's and enjoy small towns, hiking, sightseeing, food and wine, and beautiful scenery. We aren't really art lovers. Is this itinerary too rushed or would it work?

Thanks!
Tracy

Hi Tracy,

the itinerary sounds excellent to me. What I don't understand is why you want to rent a car? The Swiss public transportation network is very sufficient and during your stay in Wengen the car is very little useful.

Ingo

Hi Tracy. I am wrestling with the idea of renting a car in Interlaken as I write. As Ingo said, Wengen is not a place where your car will be useful.
(It is car free.)

You will park your car in Lauterbrunnen and, if you want it, you will have to ride the train down the mountainside.

The Lauterbrunnen Valley is a deadend for vehicles, and the villages of Wengen and Mürren are up on the side of the valley. About the only place you can go south from Lauterbrunnen is Stechelberg! And believe me, you don't go very far east or west without going steeply up hill!!

If you go north, Interlaken is the only way out. You can drive to Grindelwald, but it too is something of a cul de sac. Private cars usually leave Grindelwald the same way they came in.

There is no exit north or south. There is a bus route to the west via Grosse Scheidegg, but I am not sure private cars are allowed on the road.

Considering the fact that if you rent a car for 6 days, you will be paying over $300 for it, or about $60 or more per day.

For more than 2 of those days, the car will be sitting "deadhead" in a parking garage at additional cost.

So even though I will be there 8 or 9 days, I am not sure if I want the convenience versus the expense when the bus, train, and cable lift systems are so efficient and available.

The only advantage I can see is that you might be able to cut your travel time by an hour or so by driving.

Hi tcreath,

To echo what Ingo said, a car is really not necessary; in fact it'll sit in a carpark in Lauterbrunnen for three days while you're in Wengen. Then, the train trip from Wengen to Montreux is one of the scenic train routes, so I can't think why you'd want a car for that trip either. Again,while in Montreux, you'll probably be using a comgination of ferries and trains to get around the lake, so a car would be a disadvantage.

Can you tell us what kind of activities & excursions you imagined for Wengen & Montreux that made you think you'd need a car? We may be able to see it better from your point of view then -- but for most stuff, a car wouldn't be any great advantage.

I think I'd either cut Lugano or Montreux from the itinerary -- you don't have enough time in Lugano to make that much of a detour worthwhile, imo. Go back another time when you can really explore the Ticino & Italian Lakes.

Let me know if I can help further.

s

Thank you all for your replies! The biggest reason behind renting the car was the seamingly long train travel times between several places on my itinerary. The train between Lugano and Interlaken is about 6:00 hours I think, and the train between Interlaken and Montreux is over 3 hours and I was hoping to go to Gruyeres along the way. I did a comparison of the miles on viamichelin.com and it seems as though the drive times may be shorter. But your right; I priced a car and its about $300. I used Rail Europe to figure out the point-to-point travel times. Is what I found correct?

We weren't planning on using the car in Wengen; just basically using it as a shorter mode of transportation to get between Lugano and Wengen.

Thanks for all your help!
Tracy

Hi tcreath,

Yes, your train times are good -- but just for the sake of comparison, price out the train point-point tickets at www.rail.ch to see if the train would be cheaper for these trips. Did you know there's a train station right downstairs in the Zurich airport? It's so very conveninet to travel that way, and you just buy some cheese, bread, yogurt, & chocolate and enjoy the scenery!!

Yes, the Lugano-Interlaken is a long one, and that's why I though you may consider saving it for another time -- it's a lot of travel for just one day. So I'd suggest you do Wengen-Montreux-Paris or Lugano-Wengen Paris.

Hope this helps --

s

Thank you very much for your advice. As much as I (and my husband) want to go to both places, I think we need to choose between Lugano and Montreux. Wengen and Paris are both musts. I have never been to either place and both look so beautiful! I would love advice on which one may be the better option.

Thanks again,
Tracy

The car doesn't save you much time. The train ride Lugano - Wengen is a little more than 6 hours (best via Luzern). By car you need at least 4 hours to Lauterbrunnen plus another half hour up to Wengen. So it saves you max. 2 hours.

And the train ride is much cheaper. I am sure you will have a Swiss Half Fare Card or a different sort of rail pass, so the fare Lugano - Wengen is only 35 USD per person.

I personally would skip Lugano and go to Montreux, but IMO it is not really necessary to skip one of those. As I said, the itinerary sounds excellent to me. Sure, one day in each Montreux and Lugano is not much, but you get a first impression and will want to come back, that's for sure ;)

Hi again,

Well I guess Ingo and I have to disagree sometime . . .

But sorry I can't help you decide which one to skip (IF you decide to skip one). I'm partial to Montreux, but that's because of some personal ties. I'm also more comfortable in French culture than in Italian.

Maybe go to www.webshots.com and do a search for photos of both places -- see which ones make you swoon.

Hope this helps!

s

Hello,
I agree with the notion of taking trains rather than cars.
As for the rest of your itinerary, here are my thoughts. Having been to both Montreux and Luzern, I'd choose Luzern hands down any day. I find the scenery more beautiful, the food better (I'm partial to the german/swiss cuisine) and the area more interesting. Not all agree, of course, which is what makes this forum fun. Hope this helps.

I am doing a similar itineray next month. Except I am staying one less night and going one less place. Going to Zermatt (3 nights), Montreux/Vevey (2 nights), Paris (4 nights).

Did a similar cost-benefit analysis of car and rail and opted for the train. Switzerland has an automatic fee to use the road I believe (40CHF), plus gas (which is expensive) and parking made it significantly more costly then the train.

My main reason for replying however was to keep your post topped.

Thank you all for your replies. We have now decided to take the train and are still trying to decide if we should choose between Lugano and Montreux or if doing both would work. We also just realized that if we go in May or early June, the trails around Wengen may still be snow covered. Is this usual and should it be expected?

tcreath,

I think your plan is fine. We did a similar trip. I would make one observation, though.

It's not clear if you're staying in Milan upon arrival. To me, it's obvious that you should just train directly from Milan to Lugano (an hour)and stay there for your first three nights.

We enjoyed Lugano and Montreux more than Luzern. To each his own.

You should definitely train the entire trip. You don't have enough time to pause along the way. And six hours on the Swiss trains will be more relaxing and enjoyable than a nonstop car jog, especially for the would-be driver.

Hi again Tracy,

I guess you arrive Milano-Malpensa, right? This airport is quite a distance outside Milan and the direct bus to Lugano is almost as quick as the transfer to Milan. So I think you should NOT skip Lugano.

I also think that - even in late May, early June - you MUST see Montreux and Lake Geneva. It is one of the best times of the year (flowers in bloom and snow capped mountains in the background). By the way, you'll probably take the TGV from Lausanne to Paris, and Montreux is the logical base between Wengen and Lausanne.

You are right that end May/early June the trails above Wengen can still be snow covered. I'd say it depends. This year they were - but it was a winter with lots of snow and a lousy and cold spring. Usually you can hike in the Wengen area end of May. The Maennlichen cable car e.g. opens the last weekend of May and so does the gondola Grindelwald - Maennlichen. The cog-railways are open all year.

Ingo

Based on my experience, you should go as late in the spring as you can.
The snow starts to melt rapidly in mid to late May, and in addition to the trails being snow covered, the danger of avalanches is a factor in the early spring.

In the summer from Lauterbrunnen, when all the snow has gone from the sides of the Männlichen, the snow fences to control avalanches are easily visible.

High above Lauterbrunnen, high above Mürren even, there is an equally sophisticated network of snow fences and barriers. But even that is not sufficient at times to prevent problems.

I know you are talking Switzerland, but there is a well known saying about the Canadian Rockies, "When it's spring time in the Rockies, stay away."

So how are we doing with the itinerary, tcreath? Now that I can only check in to my favorite forum on weekends, I am likely to contribute with incomplete background and be quite useless. Still, I can't resist, because you're planning to visit some of the best places on earth. If the outline remains 2 nights Lugano, 2 Wengen, 2 Montreux/Vevey, 2 Paris, that's still a knockout wonderful trip. Keep them all and travel by train. You won't regret it. J.

I think your itinerary is doable, especially with some of the advice here regarding busses and trains.

If you decide to choose between Lugano and Montreux, I would suggest you ask yourselves how much variety you want. Lugano is very much like an Italian experience; Montreux is very much like a French experience, which might help you prepare for your time in Paris, but I would try to do both. Remember, when you train, you can dine on board, which will save you some time.