Please comment on my itinerary for Rome/Florence/Venice
 

I would appreciate comments on my itinerary for our family trip to Italy this February. We have our flights and our hotels already. We are traveling with our 2 kids (ages 12, 15). I should add that the kids have been to both London and Paris and they are great travelers and lovers of art and history. We are all aware that this is an ambitious plan and the family seems up for it! Here goes:<BR><BR>Arrive Rome about noon on a Thursday - check into hotel (Santa Chiara) and see Pantheon and Piazza Navona<BR><BR>Friday - Vatican Museum, St. Peter's and evening &quot;Rick Steves&quot; stroll from Pantheon to Trevi Fountain and then to Spanish Steps.<BR><BR>Saturday - Collosseum, Roman Forum and St. Peter in Chains (to see Moses statute).<BR><BR>I still need to figure out how to fit in Borghese Gallery - any suggestions?<BR><BR>Sunday - very early morning train from Rome to Florence. Drop bags at hotel (Casci) and off to Uffizi, Santa Croce, Ponte Vecchio.<BR><BR>Monday - Duomo and Museo dell' Opera del Duomo, the Bargello, and ending with the Science Museum.<BR><BR>Tuesday - early morning at the Accademia (when it opens) and then Medici Chapels. Then take train to Venice. Take grand canal cruise to hotel (Ala)and wander in the evening.<BR><BR>Wednesday - Baslilica di San Marco and museums included, then Palazzo Ducale and finally, San Giorio Maggiore.<BR><BR>Thursday - Grand Canal Cruise from train station to Galleria dell' Academia, back to grand canal cruise to Museo Storico Navale (my husband is a naval history fanatic!), and fit in Scuola Grande di san Rocco.<BR><BR>I would also like to get in the Correr Museum if possible!<BR><BR>Friday - early flight home and to bed to sleep afte this trip!<BR><BR>I know this sounds like a lot, but we are a higly charged group and the kids are eager to see as much as possible. However, I would like comments on this and any advice on what might be discarded or added! Thanks! Susan.

Susan, It is a bit tight but you know that. You have done your homework and it looks good to me. I like you choice of hotels--the Ala is a great location for Venice. I would try to include the Frari church when you see the Scoula San Rocco--it is next door and more impressive to me. The Borghese is a must to me and is only a 2 hour deal. Find a way! We did the naval museum in oct. and liked it. We had done the ones in Barcelona and Lisbon before and just had to hit the one in Venice.<BR>Good luck--you have done a great job.

Sounds like an excellent plan. <BR><BR>I would suggest that you double check the opening and closing times and days closed for the museums and churches, especially since this is off-season. Every time we tried to get to see Moses in March, the church was closed.<BR><BR>Have a great time.

Bob - Yes, I have spent a lot of time on planning out this trip. I think I will try to fit the Borghese in on our Roman Forum day. It would probably be too much after the Vatican. Maybe I can move St. Peter in Chains to our first day....<BR><BR>Carol - I am concerned about opening times because I have found conflicting information in different guide books. So far I have checked Rick Steves and Fodors and they are not always the same. And you are right, off season, I may just find things are closed when I arrive! I will double check and then we will just have to wing it! <BR><BR>

PART 1 OF 3)<BR>Susan,<BR><BR>Here is what I think.<BR><BR>Good thing you are doing Vatican Museum and St. Peter's as one whole day. That is the least amount of time they deserve. I believe the Basilica closes at 7pm. Therefore, if you spend the entire day in the Vatican museum, you can leave at about 5pm and meander down the hill to Piazza San Pietro and into the Basilica and get a nice late afternoon visit in. My usual trick is to get to the museum, book right to the Sistine Chapel via the Raphael Rooms since both are so far away, and then retrace steps back to the Pinacoteca (I'm an avid art history buff). That way you will have seen the Sistine Chapel first and gotten that under your belt.<BR><BR>Saturday: I would get off at Vittorio Emmanelle II monument. Walk up to the Capitoline. Take it in. Walk down. Then go up to the staircase leading to Santa Maria in Aracoeli (making sure the sign at the very top says &quot;Aperto&quot; before climbing - that way the church is open). It's a wonderful church, frescoes by Pinturicchio and the famous wooden healing baby Christ statue. Then walk through Roman forum off of via dei Fori Imperiali to get to the Colosseum. I'd not go inside the Colosseum. It's not that terribly interesting inside (my opinion) because it's all ruins. A stroll around it was always enough for me.<BR><BR>Then you walk over to San Pietro in Vincoli and see Michelangelo's Moses. However, make sure the church will not be closed during lunch time!<BR>

PART 2 OF 3<BR><BR>Then, I'd go to the Galeria Borghese after that. You must make a reservation for this in advance, however. You are taken to the top floor first (paintings) and then go to the first floor (working your way down). When I was there, we were consistently reminded we had 30 minutes in the gallery. That was it. So I rushed and rushed around and before I knew it, it was over an hour since I was in there and the guards didn't notice. The Borghese Gallery is BREATHTAKING: the sheer quality and number of the paintings: 5 Caravaggios, a Raphael and many other great works! Truly exceptional collection and building. Wait until you see the Bellini's!<BR><BR>If you are not too tired on Saturday, I'd suggest dinner in Trastevere close to Santa Maria in Trastevere church for the atmosphere. If not, Campo de'Fiori is lively.<BR><BR>Monday in Florence you might be able to fit in the Galleria Palatina in the Pitti Palace (in my opinion, a must if you are going to the Uffizi as the Galeria Palatina collection is worldclass) and Santa Maria del Carmine (Brancacci Chapel). I'm sure you want to climb the Duomo. However, I'll say this: the Duomo is not very interesting inside. It is quite bare. For a better view, I prefer the Campanile. Why? Because you get a view of the Duomo and the view from the Bell Tower is just as good! You could skip the enormous line to get into the Duomo (my comments above) and go up the Campanile instead.<BR>

PART 3 OF 3<BR><BR>Tuesday: Medici Chapels will not take you long. You cannot take flash photos inside. I think if you time it right with your train and leave for Venice around 3pm or so - if there is a train - you'll have no choice but to do the Accademia fairly quickly (because of your time constraints), Medici Chapels and then 5 more minutes go to San Marco where Fra Angelico painted the monks' cells. It's truly lovely. <BR><BR>However, you may want to consider dropping the Bargello in favor of San Marco and the Piazza della Santissima Annunziata and Santissima Annunziata church (fresco by Andrea del Sarto: beautiful) next door. Very picturesque. You could even fit in San Marco on Sunday when you arrive, after the Uffizi and before Ponte Vecchio (check times) - just make sure it's open when you want to visit it. It's never that crowded. There's a lovely museum next to San Marco (included in price) with superb paintings from the convent's collection.<BR><BR>Re VENICE<BR>I second Bob's suggestion to go into the Frari. In my opinion there are 3 important churches in Venice that shouldn't be missed apart from San Marco: Frari (entrace charge) / Santi Giovanni e Paolo (&quot;San Zanipolo&quot;)(free) / San Zaccaria (free)(ask the custodian to show you the waterlogged 8th century crypt. Trust me.<BR><BR>Celebrate your vacation with an early evening drink at either Florian or Quadri in Piazza San Marco or watch the sunset atop the Danieli (better dress up a bit) or the Gritti Palace (ditto). After all, you're only in Venice a few times in your life so live it up! The view is unforgettable and very special.<BR><BR>Naturally, this all depends on you and your stamina! Have a wonderful trip! If you have questions, just ask! I love talking travel.<BR>

Susan: sound like a good plan. Just a couple of suggestions. Last entrance in the Bourghese is 5pm, we were there in november and made reservation but we could of gone in without. Off season i guess. also the Vatican Museum closes early I believe, last entrance was 1pm. can't remember closing time. I would find it hard to beleive you can keep 12 and 15 year olds in the museum more than 2-3 hours. We went to the basilica first and found tour guides giving free tours to sell museum tours, took about 25 minites and was great. <BR><BR>Eye spy has got to be kidding to not go into the Colesseum. Your kids will think it is the highlight of their trip to Rome and I bet they have seen Gladiator, it is voilent, but you can't miss the Colesseum.<BR>

I visited the Colosseum as well and found it a bit of a let down. You can see it (very impressive) from many vantage points but inside, there were overgrown vines and it's been so pillaged through the ages. Sure it was cool to go inside, but for the time spent inside and admission fee, it wasn't all that worth it. My Eyewitness Travel Guide has a photograph that gave me the same impression. Susan also mentioned her kids were up for visiting all the museums.

Susan, Sounds like a wonderful trip. Italy is our fav place. I just want to congratulate you for taking your children traveling...what a terrific education for them and a very special family time! Happy travels!

Eye Spy - Thank you for the in depth comments. I will have to go back to my guide books to check up on some of the places you mention. Some I did decide to pass and I will now check back to reconsider. Here are some comments and questions:<BR><BR>Rome - Unfortunately the Vatican Museum closes at 1:30 in February, so cannot spend the day there. (We did spend a day at the Louvre last year, and my kids have been known to spend the better parts of days at the MET in NYC.) Maybe we should add St. Peter in Chains to this afternoon as we are forced out early. I know my kids will want to go into the Collosseum, so that cannot be skipped. I like the idea of adding the Borghese to our plan for Saturday. Unless you think it might be better to start the day at the Borghese - with a timed entry and exit we can have the rest of the day free for the Forum and Collosseum, and your suggestions for Capitoline.<BR><BR>Florence - I will have to review the information on Gallaria Palatina. We have a full day in Florence on Sunday, so we should be able to fit more in. As for climbing the Duomo, that is for my daughter. She loves to climb up and look around - the more narrow and confining the stairs the better! She was the only one of us to get to the top of St. Paul's in London! But I think that the Campanile should satisfy her. Do you think we will have long lines in February? I had decided to skip San Marco, but I will reconsider. I don't think it will fit in on Tuesday because I have planned on leaving Florence on a 1:35 train. I did not want to arrive late in Venice, but I can reconsider that decision as well.<BR><BR>Venice - I had originally tried to fit in the Frari and San Zaccaria, but I didn't think I could. Never having visited these places before, it is hard to decide what the distances are and what we can fit into a short visit. Where do you suggest I &quot;fit&quot; these two churches in my plan?<BR><BR>And, finally, yes, my husband and I do plan on fitting in some time sitting with a drink and just soaking up the scene - so I appreciate the suggestions for places to do just that!<BR><BR>Thanks so much for the help/advice - Susan.

Sounds like a great plan. It takes longer to get from place to place in Rome than in Florence and Venice but you should be able to fit everything in. I second (or third) the suggestion to visit the Frari, it is wonderful. You should be able to squeeze it in between the Academia and the Scola Grande di San Rocco. They are all very close. In fact, my personal preference is the Frari, San Rocco and the Academia in that order. You will be very happy with the Ala and with your itinerary. I am envious! Have a wonderful time.

A couple of comments on Florence: on the last morning, visit the Museo San Marco before the Accademia (S. Marco opens early - 8:15 or so?); and try to work in the 4pm daily chants in the cloisters of San Miniato (take coins to light up the apse &amp; the views are spectacular). Both would be interesting for children of that age who enjoy art. Also, they might really enjoy the Boboli Gardens. While I second climbing the Campanile instead of the Duomo, I wouldn't eliminate the Bargello ... it's history is especially interesting and the structure itself is almost as amazing as the artwork. I just returned from a little more than a week in Florence if you're interested in suggestions for good, inexpensive restaurants or updates on what is &quot;under restoration&quot;, just drop me an email.<BR><BR>Looks like you don't have much time to add anything, but the Scuola di San Rocco would be my recommendation over the Accademia in Venice if you find yourself short on time (or if you or your kids are tiring of museums). February might not be the best time for lagoon islands, but you might add a quick trip to S. Michele and looking for the famous inhabitants.

Excellent planning!<BR>Two suggestions:<BR>1. I think you can best fit the Borghese Gallery in on Saturday.<BR>2. Try to build in some daylight &quot;getting lost&quot; time during your Venice stay, i.e., just wandering around the small canals, little streets and narrow alleys. That is truly one of the great experiences there.

Hi<BR>I'm going to put in a plug for the Scala Reale small group tour of the Forum and the Colosseum. It is 4 hours, but worth the time and the money.<BR>Their guides are art or history students or teachers, but the presentation (at least by my guide, Gregory)is both informative and entertaining, and he can tailor it to include some of your kids' interests.<BR>For example, to my group of 6 Gregory offered a discussion of the true and false elements of the movie &quot;Gladiator&quot;. A good guide can make the Forum come alive, and can show you what happened where. Otherwise, quite frankly it is just looking at rocks and column fragments. The Scala Reale organization is well-organized, and responsive to special requests.<BR><BR>Other good suggestions above. I will add, that while you are having your drink or coffee at Florian's in Venice, don't forget to order gelato. It is high-priced, but outstanding. Even if you dare sure you don't like hazelnut, someone in your group must order the hazelnut gelato. Trust me on this.

Hi<BR>I'm going to put in a plug for the Scala Reale small group tour of the Forum and the Colosseum. It is 4 hours, but worth the time and the money.<BR>Their guides are art or history students or teachers, but the presentation (at least by my guide, Gregory)is both informative and entertaining, and he can tailor it to include some of your kids' interests.<BR>For example, to my group of 6 Gregory offered a discussion of the true and false elements of the movie &quot;Gladiator&quot;. A good guide can make the Forum come alive, and can show you what happened where. Otherwise, quite frankly it is just looking at rocks and column fragments. The Scala Reale organization is well-organized, and responsive to special requests.<BR><BR>Other good suggestions above. I will add, that while you are having your drink or coffee at Florian's in Venice, don't forget to order gelato. It is high-priced, but outstanding. Even if you dare sure you don't like hazelnut, someone in your group must order the hazelnut gelato. Trust me on this.

Susan <BR><BR>I notice you plan to visit the Bargello on a Monday. I seem to recall that museum is only open every other Monday, and is closed on the 2nd and 4th Monday of the month. Even when it is open, it closes early - 14:00. Admittedly my information may be out of date by now, but you seem so well organized, I'm sure you've already checked out this potential conflict.<BR><BR>My experience has been that the flesh may be willing, but the brain may balk at more than two 'serious' sights in a day. Don't worry about fitting in everything - the cities themselves are often their own best 'sights.'<BR><BR>Have a great time.

the guided tour i took at the colosseum was one of my best tourist experiences in rome. assuming the guides are all as excellent as the one i had, your kids will love it.

ttt

This Web site might be helpful for museum openings, closings, etc. It contains all Italy's museums by region or subject matter:<BR><BR>http://www.museionline.it/eng/default.htm

Susan,<BR>Your itinerary sounds great! <BR><BR>Since you've done a lot of research you might know this already, but just in case....<BR><BR>The lines to get in the Uffizi Gallery and the Accademia are incredibly long. It is well worth it to make reservations for these galleries. Then, you just cruise to the front of the line and in you go. We used the web site below to make reservations and were very glad we did!<BR><BR>www.weekendafirenze.com<BR><BR>Have a great trip.

Too bad you have no time for Siena and Assisi. Fantastic places. The Lake Como district and the countryside outside of Florence are also wonderfully beautiful. You will just have to come back again! Kelly

Wow--Eye Spy you are good !<BR>You must be that guy from the DC area with the Georgetown affiliation.<BR>Good stuff--take heed !

Thanks Bob! I'm always listening to you too by taking notes on your Tuscany/Umbria/Como advice you post for everyone so I'll have it handy for my next trip. If I have any pre-departure questions, I'll be sure to email you from my haunt at Georgetown. Let's hope Susan has a great trip with her family; I am so jealous but happy for her! Happy New Year everybody.

Hey, Bob and Eye Spy, - I still need some help fitting your suggestions into my itinerary. Do you think it is a good idea for me to see the Borhese first thing in the morning and then head to the Forum and Collosseum? How should I best fit in the sites you mention in Venice? And Florence? More advice please! Also, Eye Spy, I attended Georgetown Law in the early 80's! I love D.C. and visit frequently. Happy New Year!<BR>Susan

Sharon. Small world! Go Hoyas!<BR><BR>Galleria Borghese: http://www.galleriaborghese.it/tickets.htm<BR><BR>You are right on about Villa Borghese. Go see that first thing in the morning. Depending on where you are staying, you can easily take the bus by the Excelsior Hotel on via Veneto. It's about a 7 minute ride or so if that (via Veneto goes uphill so if it's cold, I'd take one of the ATAC buses). It drops you right across the street from the Gardens and the Villa is right there. I think 2 hours will be enough time to see everything, i.e. the Picture Gallery on the top floor and then the Bernini and other sculptures on the lower floors. You can then proceed back to the bus stop or simply hail a cab to the Colosseum.<BR><BR>Now let me caveat this as well. If, for example, you are done with Villa Borghese around noon, you probably will have missed San Pietro in Vincoli before it closes for lunch and reopens around 4pm. It may be closed for lunch but then again, it may not. My advice would be to go directly via cab or bus to San Pietro in Vincoli. If open, great. If not, no big deal. Have some lunch in the neighborhood, then walk to the Colosseum - 10- minutes walk at most. After the Colosseum and lunch, you can go back to San Pietro in Vincoli and get in Moses. Then, you can walk back to the Forum (that's 5 minutes) to via dei Fori Imperiali. Then you can proceed to Santa Maria in Aracoeli, then the Campidoglio (as I mentioned above).<BR><BR>So literally you are doing the itinerary I recommended previously in reverse. I think this is better.<BR><BR>I'll post comments for Florence and Venice shortly.

Susan, my apologies for Sharon! Do excuse me.

My 2 cents regarding Venice<BR>On Thursday, walk from the Accademia Museum to the Frari Church and San Rocco. Have lunch in Campo Santa Margherita. End up at the Salute Church<BR>(a landmark) and from there I believe there is a vaporetto that goes to San Giorgio.<BR><BR>The same day you see the Basilica and the Palazzo, you can walk to the Arsenale and go or return via the San Zanipolo and/or San Zaccaria churches, plus you will be exploring a different part of Venice.<BR><BR>The Correr Museum is delightful and is right at one end of Piazza San Marco. You can easily work it in at some point, it is a small museum. There is a combination ticket that includes the Palazzo Ducale and the Correr Museum.

Venice<BR><BR>Susan, you should have no problems fitting in the following.<BR><BR>Since the Museo Storico Navale closes at 1:30pm, you could follow this plan and get it in along with the Accademia on the same day.<BR><BR>You can start at Rialto, walk to San Zanipolo (Castello), then down to San Zaccaria (Castello) and then onward from over Riva degli Schiavoni, over the bridge onto Riva di Ca' di Dio, then over bridge to Riva San Biagio and then left onto Fondamento dell'Arsenale to the Museo Storico Navale (Castello). My sources confirm the Museo Storico Navale (Castello 2148 / Campo San Biagio) is open: 8:45am-1:30pm, M-F; 8:45-1pm, Sat.<BR><BR>This walk will give you memorable views from the Riva degli Schiavoni to San Giorgio Maggiore, the Giudecca and Santa Maria della Salute.<BR><BR>Venice is not that large so walking is a real pleasure and goes very quickly. But it'll take all of you longer with all the views from the bridges you'll have and amidst your &quot;oooo's&quot; and &quot;aaaaahs.&quot;<BR><BR>On the days the Accademia is open later, you could visit it in the afternoon following Museo Storico Navale (that closes at 1:30pm depending). Just retrace your steps to San Marco or hop on the vaporetto up to Accademia or choose one that stops on the Zattere (Dorsoduro) and then walk through the back streets to the Accademia before entrance. The Zattere is very nice at sunset - there are nice caff&egrave;s and you have a great view onto the Giudecca and Il Redentore church.<BR><BR>So do that or have lunch somewhere, stroll around San Marco, take the Vaporetto to Accademia or simply walk over the Accademia bridge and you're there.<BR><BR>Accademia (Dorsoduro 1050, campo Carit&agrave; (Tel: 041 522 2247). Open: 8:15am-2pm, Monday; 8:15am-7pm, Tue-Sun.)<BR><BR>From Accademia, you could then walk through Dorsoduro, through Campo San Barnaba (remember when Katherine Hepburn falls into the canal in &quot;Summertime&quot;?). That's Campo San Barnaba! And onward to the Frari (in San Polo). The Frari does not close during the day so you won't have to worry about that. Depending on your stamina and your husband and kids, you can see Scuola Grande di San Rocco but that may be pushing it but it is, nevertheless, very close to the Frari. You are then not that far from Rialto where it all begin and you will have done one huge &quot;loop.&quot;<BR><BR>The day may be &quot;charged&quot; but all in all, you could do this. However, I doubt you'll have the stamina to visit Museo Correr after all this!<BR><BR>Have you been able to follow this plan on a map of Venice? Let me know. I'll post Florence comments shortly.<BR>

FLORENCE<BR><BR>Susan,<BR><BR>This is what comes to mind. Of course, there are tons of ways to get everything in. The more you acquaint yourself with the maps of the cities you are visiting, the easier it'll be to orient yourself once you are there and estimate because you'll have memorized the general lay of the land in your head.<BR><BR>My sources indicate:<BR>Bargello: Tues-Sun. 8:15am-1:50pm / plus same hours 1st, 3rd and 5th Monday.<BR>Gli Uffizi: Tues-Sun. 8:15am-6:50pm<BR>Galeria Palatina: Tues-Sun. 8:15-6:50pm. CLOSED MONDAY<BR><BR>You are arriving on Sunday. After hotel, you can go to Uffizi (which you will have reserved in advance hopefully). Then, you could meander over to Santa Croce (check times it's open. Email your hotel now and find out; they'll know). Bring some coins for the light boxes to the Bardi Chapel by Giotto to the right of the main altar. Also, wander into the Sacristy further down past the Bardi Chapel. After Santa Croce, you could stroll around the streets, through Piazza della Signoria, hit the Ponte Vecchio or visit other churches like Santa Maria Novella (Tornabuoni chapel with &quot;Cycle of Life of the Virgin&quot; by Ghirlandaio is very famous. Admission Charge).<BR><BR>Monday, you could take in the Duomo, Campanile and Museo dell'Opera del Duomo (Museum open Mon-Sat. 930am-6:30pm, Sun. 8:30am-2pm). This would take up your morning. Then have lunch and hit the Medici Chapels at San Lorenzo (but check to make sure it's open on Monday because I am not positive). You could then stroll down via dei Calzaiuoli, over Ponte Vecchio, into the Oltrarno section and to the Galeria Palatina mid afternoon. Afterwards, you could stroll to Santo Spirito church (check times but it should be open around 4pm if it's closed for lunch) and on to Capella Brancacci (Santa Maria delle Carmine). That is open: Mon, Wed.-Sat. 10am-5pm, Sun. 1-5pm. It wouldn't take long to see the Brancacci Chapel if there is not a long wait. It was cleaned about 6 years ago and the colors are quite vivid. You can then stroll over the Ponte Santa Trinit&agrave;, onto via dei Tornabuoni and go into a church many people overlook but that is charming and peaceful: Santa Trinit&agrave; (across from Ferragamo). There is a beautiful fresco cycle here too by Ghirlandaio in the Strozzi Chapel to the left of the main altar. Bring some coins for the light box. I love to visit this quiet church; not many people visit it. Then you can stroll the fashionable streets of via de'Tornabuoni, via della Vigna Nuova and others. By that time, it's a day!<BR><BR>Tuesday: Accademia (8:15am-6:50pm) – you will have reserved this as well at the same time as the Uffizi. Afterwards, you can take your train to Venice, or go to San Lorenzo/Medici chapels if they were closed the first time. Now would be your chance to see them. If you have already visited San Lorenzo, you can squeeze in Piazza della Santissima Annunziata / view the Ospedale degli Innocenti with the roundels by della Robbia and briefly go into San Marco. If not, you'll have to come back to Florence some other time.<BR><BR>I am just throwing some ideas at you and I've tried to take into account stops, lunch, shopping, etc. I sincerely believe if you take a train to Venice (Eurostar) that leaves Florence around 3pm, you will arrive in Venice, still have the evening to explore before/after dinner. And then hit Venice fully charge the next day. You will have technically had one-half day in Florence and another one-half (more or less) in Venice.<BR><BR>I'm sure other posters will have great tips too!<BR>

OK, Susan I have goofed and apologize. Both the Uffizi and Galeria Palatina are closed on Monday. Therefore, you may have to do the Uffizi on Sunday as suggested. It's a toss up for the Accademia or Galeria Palatina on Monday. I'm sure the Accademia is your first choice.

Again! What is wrong with my typing. Toss up on Tuesday for Accademia or Galeria Palatina. Whew. I'll never get it right!