someone like you should not even bother with Rome. All those "churches" and "Old Stones laying around" would be a drag. Stick with Paris after all they are sooooo welcoming to Americans!! I just hope you are not Jewish.

I would recommend that you skip Rome. Let's cross your fingers that you WILL fall in love with <i>Italy</i> (it's conceivable - - you might not. You might not like chocolate. Or fresh bread with creamery butter on it. Or air that contains oxygen).

Assuming that you do fall in love with Italy, then go give Rome a 2 or 3 day try. You msy think it is interesting. or better than that. But it is fairly fundamental to grasping Italian life in the past century or two (or twenty-five) to appreciate Rome.

Eventually.

Best wishes,

Rex

Awbaker: I appreciate the thought, but in all fairnesss, I have to point out that I didn't suggest &quot;As the Romans Do&quot;; Nonnafelice did. I plan to read it though! And the other one Nonnafelice suggested that I hope I can get my hands on is William Murray's &quot;City of the Soul.&quot; I loved his articles that used to appear in the New Yorker.

june...no need for that, as she said, she is exaggerating. lighten up.

don't assume she is american. and if you are, worry about your own racial problems rather than those of france.

Here's a thread - - http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34406329 - - that someoe else (cmt) &quot;topped&quot; for you, thinking its different perspectives might help you.

June, I agree you are out of line and an apology may help you when you post again.

I think you should spend the 5 nights in Rome and this is coming from someone who was not especially drawn to Rome. I was there for three nights, and wish I had been able to spend more time. You will be in awe of some of the sites. The history, the ancient buildings, there is even a section of the Appian Way left. It is just amazing. The five nights will give you an excellent taste of the city, time to explore, and then at that time you will either fall in love with it, or have spent enough time to satisfy you and if you aren't drawn to it, then with so many wonderful places all over the world to visit, you won't feel compelled to have to go back.

Awbaker, Friday is so near, so if I miss you posting again, have a wonderful time and I look forward to reading your impressions.

I think you need to watch a LOT of Italian movies! New ones too like Mr Ripley.
You can sit in a piazza at a cafe for hours, just people watching. Shopping! Eating!
For most Parisian neighborhoods and monuments, you will find something like it in Rome..gardens, wonderful buildings.
You will see, you will fall in love with Rome and want to go back asap!

Rex: I've already fallen in love with Italy! through books. Rome just didn't affect me the same way. After all this input, I'll be amazed if we don't fall in love with it, too.

Been to Rome once. It was interesting, but now that it's done, it's off my list. I'd love to return to Italy, but not necessarily to Rome. I found it dirty, noisy and the people rude. The Italians in the countryside were friendly and helpful, and actually courteous. Same thing in Paris, London, Amsterdam and Munich. The only exception I've found is Copenhagen. In short, big cities suck. Do as Rex suggests, see the countryside. Spend just 2-3 days in Rome to see the major sites. Then get the hell outta there!

To me, Rome is humbling and awe-inspiring. It made me feel a connection with the ancient past I've felt no place else. It's simply stunning.

Jeanne, Rome and Paris aren't the least bit alike. Think of our great American cities--Chicago, NYC, SF, among them--and think how wonderful and different they are. Each is special in their own way, and the deficiency in one is the superiority of the other. I don't think there's a good basis for comparison, really. Paris and Rome are like that. It's apples to oranges.

I'm crazy about both places, but since you're asking about Rome, I can tell you it's much more than churches and ruins! I would recommend that you pick up a book called &quot;City Secrets Rome&quot; which is edited by Robert Kahn and available on amazon.com. This small book will lead you to lesser-known venues in Rome that many tourists overlook. You might enjoy veering off the beaten path to see the real Rome. I'd also say that perhaps the small area of Rome known as Trastavere (on the other side of the Tiber) might suit you if you liked the Marais neighborhood in Paris. It's very authentic and lively. You'll hear far more Italian spoken than English. There's a good hotel there called Saint Maria of Trastavere (I think I've gotten the name straight but I'm sure someone can correct me if I haven't).

Rome has beautiful hills. Rome has open wide piazzas (such an extravagant use of space in a city!). Rome has winding ancient streets to get lost in. Rome has gelato. Rome has artwork in nearly every corner, it seems.

I could go on and on, but the gist of it is that if you focus on Rome in its own right, instead of comparing it to anything else, you will enjoy your five nights. In fact, they'll fly by.

Ack! Eloise, you are right! Sorry, nonnafelice! I read through so quickly, and you both always have such good suggestions...It is a pretty good book, by the way.

Thanks for the kind words, cigalechanta!

I'll let you know if Rome lives up to my expectations, Jeanne. I, too, am crazy about Paris.

Jeanne, about Venice:

You should definitely plan to go to Venice, but not necessarily on this trip. If you are anything like us, you will fall in love with Italy and want to keep going back. (We love France, too, and it's been too long since we've been to England, so we are never going to run out of trips!)

I am assuming from your itinerary that you plan to rent a car when you leave Rome and drop it in Florence? Adding Venice will complicate that scenario, and also add a good bit of travel time. I think Venice is worth a trip in itself, or perhaps combined with other parts of northern Italy. Anyway, I think your itinerary sounds great -- will give you a chance to explore some different aspects of Italy without cutting any of them too short. If you can possibly do it, I think it's much better, as you have planned, to spend at least 3 nights in each place you go.

Nonnafelice: Correct on all counts. The &quot;big picture&quot; of our trip was: time in Rome, at least a week in Tuscany and time to see Florence/maybe Venice. Add in the desire not to move around too much and Venice just didn't work.

Like other trips, I've developed preconceived notions. I'm all prepared to fall in love with Tucany and want to stay in siena, making Florence a day-trip. I'm not saying we'll do that. Just that travelling in the low season allows one to be flexible. We did that in France and were happy with the adjustments we made after we were there. Anyway, how can one go wrong? It's all Italy, after all!

I myself don't find Italy that appealing. That said, it is part of the Grand European Tour so take advantage of the 5 days you've scheduled and see/experience it. Venice can be left to another trip. I spent a couple of months in Italy in '65 and have no inclination to return. About a month ago there was a new version of The Roman Spring of Mrs. Stone with Helen Mirren on TV. Excellent production with good shots of Rome. Enough for me, thanks.

You have very sound advice here. Let me take a big picture approach. I often advise people to plan for 3 two week trips to Italy in advance--one north, one south, and one centro. Your focus this time seems to be centro. So, add the cinque terre to this trip and save Rome for a later trip--and add the Amalfi coast when you do. Then, do the Lakes, the Dolomites, and Venice your 3rd trip. I know that 3 trips may seem optimistic now, but I am amazed how often that becomes reality. We will be going back for our 13th trip to Italy hopefully in May.

Bob: Thanks for bringing CT into the picture. I still think we'll stay in Rome a few days. But, if the Feb. weather is good and we want to cut Rome short, CT would be an excellent option. We are keeping in mind that weather will definitely be a factor in these decisions.

I felt the same way about Rome before going to Italy as I planned and read about our first two week trip last year, but ended up after three nights longing for more of Rome. And NOT because of the churches(which are magnificent, but not all there is to Rome) I love Paris too, having spent time there when I was younger. As a more mature adult, I now prefer Italy (like Bobthenavigator so aptly describes...this year, we did a 2 week northern swing, hitting Milan and points north...including Venice...once Italy gets into your blood, you are hooked). Our next 2 week swing will include more Rome and the Amalfi Coast.

Its the fountains and piazzas and food and history and people! Nothing like it. I obsessively plan for our next trip and read others' trip reports.

I read and enjoyed &quot;the Agony and the Ecstacy&quot; by Irving Stone which is a fictionalized account of Michelangelo's life. It really made Rome and Florence come alive for me!