Northern Italy Fall 2022
 

My husband and I, both retired, are planning a trip to Northern Italy in September- and hope to do a "slow travel" kind of journey over 4-6 weeks (or more?). I was thinking of flying into Milan and beginning our trip on or near Lakes Garda or Como to stay for a week and from where we can take day trips. Venice, Bologna, and other smaller towns are on my list. Then Florence for at least a week (I haven't been there since I was a student in the 70s) and Lucca, where we'd like to stay for several days. The second part of our trip will be in Paris, so we could always go north on the Italian coast through Cinque Terre, Genoa and Liguria into southern France. I know I'll have to edit this itinerary somewhat, but I'd, most of all, appreciate suggestions for places to stay when we want to relax and explore the area and go on day trips. We're open to boutique hotels or vacation rentals, and hope to use the train as much as possible, but know that we will need to rent a car to get around. I've read some great trip reports and that has already helped me with my research. Thanks!

I think you need to get more focused on a realistic itinerary before asking for suggestions/ideas/lodging. Four to six weeks (or more?) feels like a long time, but you've mentioned 9-10 (or more?) places which, if traveling mostly by train, will mean lots of time spent in transit. It sounds like you want to spend at least 3 of the weeks at one of the lakes and in Florence and Lucca. Then there's Venice, Bologna, Paris... How much time is left for smaller towns, the Med coast, etc.?

If you rent a car, don't plan on picking it up in Italy and dropping it in France which would trigger an expensive one-way surcharge.

As you want to end in France, I would fly into Venice.... or land in Milan and plan to fly from Venice (or Florence/Pisa) to Paris. Or add more time to your trip.

Another thing to consider is where you will park a rental car if you have it while visiting places that have a ZLT (restricted driving zone). For example, me and my spouse (he just retired, I will work remotely) are just starting to plan a month-long trip to Italy. We're planning to fly into Milan (no car), then take the train to Venice. Pick up the car as we leave Venice to visit smaller cities that we haven't decided on (at least Modena, probably also Lucca and Siena), then end up in Rome for a week, where we will drop the car upon arrival. In the smaller cities, in our experience, it's easier to park on the edge of the city/town, walk into the city to our hotel etc., and walk out to the parking for any day trips we're taking. BTW, I love Bologna, good choice if you're thinking of staying there.

And I agree with Jean, 4-6 weeks is a long time, but you have a lot of places. Get an old-fashioned piece of paper with a calendar of your travel dates, then start penciling in possible destinations.

Adding to Lexma90... As you calendar the days, make note of the travel times (whatever mode) required to get from point to point. If driving and using maps.google.com for drive times, add 15-20% to all google estimates as they are based on speed limits and not reality. If taking trains, add some minutes at each end of a journey to account for getting to/from the stations. Unless you're staying within walking distance of the train stations, you'll want to use taxis which have to get through traffic.

In a trip of that length with that many destinations, I'd want to set aside a couple/few days with no plans to allow for unexpected disruptions/delays, bad weather, travel fatigue or, best case, hearing last minute about something you really want to do/see.

We love Lake Como and been there four times, once for two weeks. The only day trips we ever did were by ferry to other towns around the lake such as Lenno to visit Villa Balbienello. It is easier driving around Lake Garda on our way to and from the beautiful Dolomites.
We like slow travel but it still needs to make sense.
Combine Liguria,Lucca, the Piedmonte, Lakes Maggiore, Como and/ or Garda, Dolomites, Bologna. Add Venice. Fly in and out of Milan MXP. Or Lucca, Piemonte and do on.

Jean, Of course you are right. It's easy to be too ambitious when you have such a big bucket list. We'll be trimming the itinerary, for sure. I was just looking for an enthusiastic suggestion for a special place to stay for our 20th wedding anniversary in northern italy. I'm still working on a plan, but know we'll be starting in Milan and ending in Paris. Most likely in September. I've rented cars in Europe, and have learned the hard way about parking issues and drop off fees. We plan to rely on the train as much as possible!

Thank you Happy Trvlr! I love these ideas. It's what I had in mind.

Lexma90 - thanks for your suggestions about the car rental. I've heard good things about Bologna from other travelers and hope to include it on our itinerary. I know it's a train stop between Milan and Florence. How long did you stay there?

I'd plan for a couple of airbnb days where you do your washing, chill etc which allows you to reduce the amount of stuff you have to cart about.

Yes! Absolutely plan to do that. thanks Bilboburgler.

If you haven't been to Florence since the 70s, you'll find it very changed. The number of visitors has exploded, and September is one of the busiest months.

Bvlenci - yes, I have heard that. I'm thinking of October instead. Still warm-ish but a bit less crowded, I hope.

For many places, October isn't less crowded, esp. if the weather is good. Our preferred travel month is October, and every time we re-visit anywhere in Italy it's more and more crowded. I expect the crowds in the immediate post-Covid year or two to be bad... at least in the more popular destinations.

If your trip begins to drift into October, be aware that ferries on the lakes historically revert to off-season frequency sometime at/before mid-October. There is still service, but it isn't frequent enough to allow for ambitious daily excursions. Pick your lodging base carefully and study the ferry timetables.

FWIW, we spent our 25th (or was it 30th?) anniversary in late October at Lake Como. We'd been to the lake a couple of time before, so the episodes of rain and cool temps didn't impact our plans. If it had been our first visit, I would have been disappointed by the inability to see/do everything on my list.

We have visited Bologna several times, each time only for two or three nights. At some point we'll stay longer! There are a number of excellent smaller museums, as I recall there's a walk to a church (or something?) above the city, which we have not yet done. It's also a good location from which to take the train to places like Ferrera or Ravenna, which has incomparable mosaics. I've visited Ravenna several times because the mosaics (to me) are so amazing.

October is one of the most popular months to visit Florence, and all of Tuscany. I'm not sure why. Maybe because it's not so hot?

The owner of the hotel we frequent in Rome told us that after 9/11, October became her busiest month. Her theory is that a lot of people who had cancelled their September reservations re-booked a month later and found (at that time, 20+ years ago) that it was less crowded, fewer school groups, the weather was still good, etc. The word spread, lots of people changed their travel habits, and now October is more popular.

Yes, that makes sense. People who are not tied to their own or their children's school schedules find crowds, but a more adult crowd in autumn. Also, wine, olive oil, and truffles. And no heat waves. October is often rather rainy, though.

Thank you all for your recommendations. I am abbreviating our itinerary to make it more manageable and flexible for a 3 -4 week trip. As soon as it is more "baked", I am going to come back for more feedback. Your comments are so helpful.

Where we stayed on Lake Como:

https://www.ilperlo.com/en

almost the same picture as on their web site:

https://flic.kr/p/7phnd5

Beautiful! Thanks for the link.

Hello Michael- thank you for this recommendation. II checked the website - t seems to be very popular with cycle enthusiasts. An e-bike tour is very appealing to us. Did you participate in any of these activities? Also, how far a walk is it to the lake. It's hard to judge from the photos. thank you.

It's a long walk to the town, downhill going there and all uphill coming back.

From my trip report:

Our Italian driving was generally not scenic. We took the autostrada as far as we could from Bologna to Bellagio, did not trust the mappy directions and therefore found ourselves going around Milano, losing quite a bit of time. We wanted to get to Bellagio fairly quickly so that we could tour the gardens of the Villa Melzi. They are very nice, with beautiful vistas over the lake, but not overwhelming (I recall the garden of Apremont sur Allier as more impressive, and most definitely Vasterival in Normandy). We stayed at Il Perlo Panorama above Bellagio, and I highly recommend the place. Ours was not a room fronting the peninsula but still gave us a view of the lake. It had a little balcony with two chairs and a tiny table, but the better view was on the veranda in front of the hotel. Drinks are reasonable (2 euros for a glass of white wine) and we sat there inhaling the scenery. Cost for one night: 85 euros, including a buffet breakfast. Our evening meal was at Silvio. We ordered from every course and were not disappointed. The pasta came with a fish egg sauce that was a little too strong, but the waiter had warned us and we decided that we had to try it anyway. All the fish dishes are based on fish caught in the lake and delivered directly to them. There are essentially two kinds of fish: a type of trout and a type of sardine or smelt. When it came to pay, they told us that the credit card machine was broken and that we had to pay cash. Fortunately I happen to have it on me; around 110 euros if I remember correctly. The next day we left for Switzerland, stopping by to see the gardens of the Villa Carlotta. They are much more impressive than the previous day's, and would have been even more had we been there earlier in the spring. The terraced gardens are lined with azaleas and rhododendrons as hedges and must be absolutely spectacular when in bloom. Not to be missed in the right season.

Thanks. I look forward to reading your trip report in full...

Wendy

If you're interested in cycling, I highly recommend the area that includes the Park of the Ticino and the Grande Naviglio. We took a three-day cycling tour in this area once. The Grande Naviglio is a canal that was the main "highway" in this part of Italy for centuries. Wealthy families in Milan built villas along the canal, especially in the 19th century. Some can be visited. We didn't find any open, but at one villa, the owner saw us and invited us in. It turned out she was a good friend of a cousin of my husband!

https://www.in-lombardia.it/en/cycling-along-navigli
Cycling along the canal paths is very easy, with no traffic, bar other cyclists. There are also many cycling routes in the Park of the Ticino, and some of these are more challenging. Here is one of several websites about cycling in this area.

https://italy-cycling-guide.info/tra...cino-cycleway/

We stayed in Abbiategrasso, at an agriturismo that catered to cyclists. They also had a shop that sold local organic products. It's been about 10 years since this vacation so I can't offer any recent advice. There were lots of good restaurants in the area. This is the place where we stayed.

https://www.leprotti.com/it/

There are lots of interesting places to visit in the area. If you are interested, I can dig out more information.

The area around Como is very hilly, so I would think you should have a high level of conditioning to cycle there.

BVLenci- You are very kind to provide me with this info - I wasn't aware of the websites you pointed me to. We aren't serious cyclists, but have found cycling day trips - more recently using e-bikes- to be the highlight of our travels. I'll do some further research to see what we can include in our plans. Thank you again.

As others have said 4 weeks or so sounds like a long time but it can soon be eaten up with logistical problems if you aren't careful. One of those problems is whether you want a car or not, and if so for how long? You wouldn't want one for Milan, Venice or Bologna, let alone Florence so one way round it would be to put all the cities at one end of the trip and then the driving, or to see a couple of cities, then hire a car for the middle, and return it to end your trip in a couple of cities again.

You asked about Bologna and IMO it is very worth visiting for at least a week, though I appreciate you may not want to spend so much time there. As well as having a great deal to see there are also innumerable places that you can visit, including https://www.santuariodisanluca.it [mentioned by someone here] which you can reach by tourist train from the main square in the middle of Bologna. Venice also makes a surprisingly good base for day trips to places like Padua and Vicenza.

good luck with your planning. As ever deciding what to leave out will be the hardest thing.

Thank you annhig. I have no intention of renting a car. It seems that the trains are going to be convenient and easy for us. And we will be traveling for closer to 6 weeks, not 4. So far my itinerary after flying into Milan is to go to Venice (4-5 days), then to Florence (6 days) and Lucca (4-5 days). Then we will go to Cinque Terre and Genoa continuing on the train along the Ligurian coast to Nice, where we will meet up with friends. We will end our trip in Paris for a week - 10 days (my home away from home). I'm debating whether to add a few days in Bologna (and Ravenna) before Florence. I've been told by several travelers - including you - how much they liked Bologna. As long as I can find reasonably priced accommodations, I can extend our trip. All TBD. Thank you for your advice.

One suggestion to get you back to September is the Asti Palio--this year on Sept. 6. Activities last the entire week before. We loved it. Oldest continuous Palio in Italy. And Piemonte is a delight.

ooh - thanks for that reminder. I'm going to check that out. I keep adding stops to my itinerary - I may have to add another week or two!

If you're not serious cyclists, I think the cycling tour along the canal paths, or some of the easier itineraries in the Ticino park, would be best. Abbiategrasso is only 15 minutes from Milan (S. Cristofero station) by train. You might even be able to do it as a day trip from Milan, but it probably would be more fun to stay in a B&B or agriturismo in Abbiategrasso, and maybe do two cycling days. Also, it would give you a local resource for tour itineraries and bike hire.

We didn't bring our own bikes to Abbiategrasso; we were a group of six or seven and we went in a van belonging to one of the group, and had no room for the bikes. There are plenty of bike rental places in the area. I think the place you stay could probably help you with all the logistics. As I said, I hesitate to recommend specific places, because this trip wasn't recent, but we really did like the place where we stayed (link in my precious post). I'm not sure how good they are with English, because I only see an Italian version of their website. I think most lodgings now have someone on staff who speaks English.

Thank you. Great information.

Your original trip posting sounds like what I am doing in November. I now always travel November and March/April. Trip was originally set for Nov 2019, then 2020 and now this Nov with 5-6 days in each city.
Milan with side trips to Pavia, Lodi, Cremona and Montova.
Turin with side trips to Avigliana, Pinerolo
Genoa going to Camogli or maybe Portofino
Bologna with trips to Ravenna and Parma

Although I almost never do RT, will go back to MIlan as from my time in Bologna and to Milan, the Christmas Markets will have started and I am a huge fan.