baymtnman

Good Day,

After reading this site considerably, I have designed a 23 night, ten-city itinerary for my 83 year old mother and me for our Germany trip this year. She is mobile, but not particularly agile. Our interests in Bavaria will mostly be history and the scenery (though one day will be for Oktoberfest). The remainder of the trip will be castles and scenery. Any suggestions would be helpful.

Depart Cleveland September 12th and arrive Munich September 13 at 8AM. Depart Berlin October 7 at 8:30AM.

Transportation will be mostly by train (do not know why, but still a little hesitant to drive in Europe).

Munich Five nights
Salzburg Two nights
Innsbruck/Hall Two nights
Reutte Two nights
Fuessen Two nights. Pick up car
Romantic Road/
Rothenberg Two nights
Baden Baden Two nights
Bacharach Two nights
Frankfurt Two nights
Berlin Five nights

I have to drop two nights from somewhere, and was thinking the Bavaria/Tirol area may be too saturated.


Is this too many cities, am I duplicating experiences by choice of towns?

I intend to get a German Flexipass Saver ($135)for each of us to cover the Baden-Baden, Bacharach, Franfurt, Berlin portion of the trip.

Pick up a car in Fuessen and drop in Rothenberg.

Bus from Reutte to Fuessen.

all others would be point-to-point train.

Thanks for any insights.

How much walking is required for the Zugsplitze?

rex

I agree with yiur assessment as to where to take out the two nights... Two nights Reutte and teo nights Fussen are two more than necessary. Reutte works best for seeing Schloss Linderhof on your way "in"; on the other hand, Fussen is the logical "base" for seeing Neuschwanstein and moving onward to the Romatic Road, I think. Either will work. Booking both seems a liitle bit duplicative.

Best wishes,

Rex

treplow

Let me preface my comments with that I am 79, in good shape and have lived for 26 years in Bavaria and visit there still almost every year, so I know the area well as well as the limitations on travel imposed by "senior status", aka old age.

Now to your plan: I think it is much too ambitious.

I would knock out Reutte and Innsbruck as stayovers. Add a day to Munich for a day trip - by train - to Prien to vist King Ludwig's Herrenchiemsee Palace on an island in the Chiemsee.

Although my suggested itinerary after Munich will take you almost back to Prien, it is a bit much to do in one day if you want to drive from Munich on my suggested route. The train ride to Munich - Prien is about 1 hour. (for schedules, see http://bahn.de)

Get you car at the end of your stay in Munich. Drive from Munich to Salzburg
via the scenic Alpenstrasse (Alpine Highway).For it, take the Bernau exit on the Munich-Salzburg autobahn (A-8 ) and follow the B-305 federal highway to Grassau, Reit im Winkel, Berchtesgaden, Hallein, Salzburg.

Add a couple of days to Salzburg and take day trips to Zell am See and Hallstatt and more time in Berchtesgaden.

Then return to Fuessen by way of the A-8/A-12 Autobahns (Salzburg - Inntal - Innsbruck - Zirl, and the B-177/B-2 to Garmisch, via Mittenwald. Stay about three days in Garmisch, and visit the Zugspitze. Does not involve much walking; you can park right at the Zugspitzbahn Bahnhof (station). But be sure your mother can handle over 9,000ft elevation.

On your way to Fuessen, take the Autobahn A-2 as far as Oberau and take the B-23 road to Kloster Ettal, Oberammergau, (with a 22 km r/trip detour to Linderhof) and north on to the turnoff to Steingaden, at Echelsbach.Between the turnoff and Steingaden, visit the Wieskirche church. From Steingaden head south to Fuessen.

Allow yourself some time to get up to Neuschwanstein, if you want to take the tour. Your mother will appreciate that. It's steep up; you can take a buggy.

From Fuessen take the A-7 Autobahn to Rothenburg, or thje Dinkelbuehl exit. While the romatische Strasse starts at Fuessen, the prettirst part is between Dinkelsbuehl (southeast of Rothenburg) and Bad Mergentheim.

I would skip Baden-Baden.. It takes you far out of the way, you won't see much of the Black Forest on your schedule and also skip the overnights in Frankfurt. It's the most americanized city in Germany.

Instead head from Bad Mergentheim (north of Rothenburg) to Wuerzburg and take the A-3 toward the Rhein and Mosel, bypassing Frankfurt. Spend a few days in Koblenz or in Cochem.The prettiest part of the Rhein is south between Koblenz and Bingen, about a 4o miles stretch. You can take a boat from Koblenz to south any any of the towns along the Rhein and then return by train to Koblenz.

The whole Mosel valley is pretty.

Drop off your car in Koblenz, and take the train from there to Koeln (Cologne) and Berlin.. You don't need a car in Berlin, and you want to avoid the spaghetti junctions in and around Cologne, Duesseldorf, Ruhr etc. There is no drop-off charge as long as you pick up and drop your car off in Germany

If all this makes sense, let me know and I'll give you a bit more precise itinerary, incl. the day trips.

kfusto

For treplow: I read your post with great interest.

I am taking my 73 YO mother to Germany in December for the Christmas markets. There are 4 of us travelling; three are in our 40s.

I speak the language fairly well and have travelled to Germany previously. I was an exchange student in Salzburg many years ago and have wonderful memories!

My mom is quite active but does suffer from arthritis so I am trying to organize an itinerary that is interesting but not too demanding.

We are staying at Le Meridian Munich for the first 4 nights. I want to do the local markets and musuems for two days and then take a train to Dachau. I am looking for one other day trip that would be interesting. Any suggestions are appreciated.

Then we plan to move onto Salzburg for 2 nights and are booked into the Stadtkrug. I have a Sound of Music tour booked for mom one morning as I want to go back to the salt mines and I believe this is too much for her. The rest of the time we shall wander the city.

We have one night in St. Gilgen to take in some true alpine scenery and then it is back to Munich for an overnight prior to departure.

I chose the hotels for convenience and amenities. If mom needs to rest dring the day, I can easily walk her back to the hotels and then head back out on my own.

Any suggestions at all?
thank you.

SAnParis

I have to agree w/treplow & I'll also admit that I am not a big fan of Berlin either (so I would cut that out). Personally I am partial to the Mosel and could (literally) spend a week just wandering up, stopping frequently, visiting Burg Eltz, etc. Garmisch is another place I would try to fit in & of course you can easily day trip from Munich. My last trip (10 days) we split time between Munich & Rottenburg and also visited Wurzburg & Garmisch as well as Salzburg. That was plenty for me & we were dealing w/a small child who is very travel oriented. I would look at the DB site & figure out how many of the 23 days you will spend on a train, & perhaps you will reconsider. (?)

caroline_edinburgh

Strange, we just came back from 5 days in Berlin & we loved it . We didn't think 5 days was long enough & we can't wait to go back. (In fact I'd now rather go back there than Paris.) But we are city people, I suppose, and it was still quite tiring.

baymtnman

to treplow: Give me a two days to absorb the tremendously valuable insights. I have been trying to avoid a car rental (I did a quick back of hte envelope calculation and with gas it would add about $300 USD to the trip,without any parking fees).

treplow

This is a message for Kufsto

Couple of thoughts as I read your itinerary.

Dachau is not a full day excursion. It's a short S-Bahn ride from Munich.

I would not classify St. Gilgen as true Alpine scenery. The Salzkammegut is nice, but - with the exception of Hallstatt - not alpine.

Here are a couple of options: Take the train for a 1-day trip to Garmisch. If it hasn't snowed too much by December and you have a clear day, take the train up to the Zugspitze. Be flexible on the weather bit as to which day you want to go. In Garmisch, it is not a long walk from the Bundesbahn station to the Zugspitzbahn station.

Or, add a day to Salzburg and take the bus to Berchtesgaden. While the Kehlsteinhaus (Eagle's Nest) will be closed, you can take a bus toward the Koenigsee, and near the village is a gondola lift (enclosed!) up the Jenner. It affords you a great view of the alps.

Another option, although you would have to check on the Austrian RR website how long the train from Salzburg takes, would be Zell am See. Again, a nice town, with a cable car up to the top of the Schmittenhoehe, with great views of the Austrian and Italian alps.

Obviously, all these trips depend very much on the weather.

Finally, Hallstatt is also doable by train from Salzburg. It involves a boat ride from the station to the village across the lake.

Another day trip I have been "pushing" is a visit to the Herrenchiemsee Palace of King Ludwig outside of Prien. But it's a bit "iffy" in December.

treplow

Baytman, I suspect that the costs of trains for the two of you and a car will be close to a wash. But it would be probably much more comfortable and less hectic for your mother. Changing trains in Germany often -although not always - is a bit tight in terms of time, and can involve "schlepping" (schleppen is also a German word and has the same connotation!) your luggage down a flight of stairs and up another to change from one platform to another. You can get a sense of it, by checking http://bahn.de on which Gleis (track) the trains come in and leave. Chances are that if you have two even numbered , or two odd numbered ones, you will have to change platforms. Although they might have an elevator hidsden somewhere, German stations don't make it is easy to find them.

baymtnman

treplow: I like your recommendations the more I research. I have decided to drop Frankfurt, sniffle a little over losing Baden Baden, but like the tightness of the itinerary. I am thinking of combining a German Flexipass Saver ($135 each) for four days on the rail (only $18 for each additional day!!) with a car for about a week to cover from Munich to Salzburg to Garmish/Fuessen and then onto Rothenburg-give about a week for that portion of the trip.

baymtnman

Okay, getting more clarity into my planning phase.

I am thinking of adjusting the schedule as follows:

Munich - five nights train to Chimesse then to....
Salzburg - three nights take train to get car in Freilassing. Drive to...
Garmisch Partenkirchen for one night.
Fuessen for one night.
Rothenburg for two nights
Wurzburg for two nights. Drop car. Take train to Bingen. Take boat up to..
Bacharach or St. Goar for two nights. Boat up to Koblenz. Maybe spend the night. Train up to...
Cologne for two nights. Train to
Kassel to see Wilhelmshohe for one night then train to Berlin for the final four nights.

Questions:
1. Is the drive from Freilassing to GP better along the Austrian Route to Lemoos or through Germany?
2. Which town along the Rhine would be the best base (St. Goar, Bacharach, or Boppard). I have heard Koblenz is a little too industrialized.
3. Where would I travel with the car while based in Wurzburg?

Thanks,

Keith